Service of Thanksgiving for the Duke of Edinburgh; 29 March 2022

[Vicky7]

Unfortunatelly the British press has always been like that. I remember a few years ago when King Harald and Queen Sonja paid a state visit to the Uk the newspapers had king and queen without capitals when mentioning the royal couple, but every time they wrote about the British royals it was Queen and Prince. When I asked a journalist about this he told me that they were instructed to do so because foriegn royals were not regarded as being "real royalty." Most foreign royal events never get a mention in the British press, presumambly because they think the British aren't interested in any royalty except the Windsors.

Wait so they think Queen Margarethe or Queen Sofia of Spain is not "real royalty"? What about the Emperor of Japan? Thats so disrespectful.

 

[Viv]

Unfortunatelly the British press has always been like that. I remember a few years ago when King Harald and Queen Sonja paid a state visit to the Uk the newspapers had king and queen without capitals when mentioning the royal couple, but every time they wrote about the British royals it was Queen and Prince. When I asked a journalist about this he told me that they were instructed to do so because foriegn royals were not regarded as being "real royalty." Most foreign royal events never get a mention in the British press, presumambly because they think the British aren't interested in any royalty except the Windsors.

The foreign royals are no doubt aware of this! Queen Margrethe mentioned it many years ago ( I’ve forgotten in which context!).
I didn’t
watch the service as it wasn’t broadcast in Denmark ( as far as I know), however if it played out as described, I’m wondering why they were invited in the first place! - Someone mentioned, that the foreign royals didn’t read
the exit instructions of the service. No, they probably didn’t! Don’t expect senior royals to read the “ small print” in these programmes. They are used to everything being operated according to precedence and rank, they are used to being “ handled with care”. What the foreign royals experienced in the abbey yesterday was below par according to the normal BRF standards!

 

[Lady Daly]

After reading comments about lack of organization I thought perhaps the 2 year interruption of Covid may have played a part. When was the last time the BRF hosted a large gathering of royals or for that matter, any large gathering. Seasoned well trained staff may have left. Who is actually in charge of a large affair like this? Hopefully whoever it is recognized how clumsy and disorganized things flowed and will remedy, train, or whatever one does to prevent something like this from happening in the future. All I could think of is poor Queen Margarethe of Denmark left standing! When the question came up where did the King and Queen of Belgium go after getting out of the chapel ahead of the crowd since the bus wasn't available yet. I thought... perhaps they caught a cab.

 

[kalnel]

Imagine the surprise of the King and Queen of Belgium when the boarded the bus, the conductor asked them for the fare, and they found out they'd gotten on a bus headed to Waterloo!

 

[kalnel]

Did any of the Hesse relatives attend the service? I read today on Royal Musings that Karl of Hesse, Philip's nephew, died the other day. Maybe that made the event extra poignant for his aunt, the Queen.

BTW, he looks a lot like Prince William in the top picture
Royal Musings: Prince Karl of Hesse (1937-2022)

 

[Iluvbertie]

Imagine the surprise of the King and Queen of Belgium when the boarded the bus, the conductor asked them for the fare, and they found out they'd gotten on a bus headed to Waterloo!

They would need an Oyster card or be able to pay using a credit card so no conductor to ask them anything. All electronic in London these days.

 

[VictoriaB]

Did any of the Hesse relatives attend the service? I read today on Royal Musings that Karl of Hesse, Philip's nephew, died the other day. Maybe that made the event extra poignant for his aunt, the Queen.

BTW, he looks a lot like Prince William in the top picture
Royal Musings: Prince Karl of Hesse (1937-2022)

According to the Daily Mail 51 of Philip's German Relatives attended including the Landgrave of Hesse although they only seemed to know the identity of the three who also attended his funeral last year.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/...r-Abbey-Duke-Edinburghs-memorial-service.html

 

[Alisa]

How embarrassing all of this was. This wasn't a last minute service but a thoroughly planned out event. The organizers at the court need to do better.

 

[Alison H]

I'm afraid that no-one can control city centre traffic, short of closing all the roads around Westminster Abbey, which would have caused huge disruption and attracted a lot of nasty remarks from the left wing Mayor of London. This is why I always use the Underground when travelling in London! They all seemed to see the funny side of it, anyway.

 

[Hallo girl]

Anybody trying to get to their work in the morning will sympathise with the royals waiting for their bus. It was one of those things. Nothing to get worked up about.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

Anybody trying to get to their work in the morning will sympathise with the royals waiting for their bus. It was one of those things. Nothing to get worked up about.

Well it is what one expects. The British usually do this to the point. It was a remembrance/thanksgiving honouring a recordbreaking Consort of a recordbreaking Queen and this sloppy handling was surprising because not what one expects from the British Court.

 

[suztav]

According to the Daily Mail 51 of Philip's German Relatives attended including the Landgrave of Hesse although they only seemed to know the identity of the three who also attended his funeral last year.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/...r-Abbey-Duke-Edinburghs-memorial-service.html

This article also misidentifies Countess Mountbatten of Burma as the "widow" of the Earl Mountbatten (Norton Knatchbull). If I'm not mistaken the Earl is still alive, but hasn't participated in any royal events in years following his "midlife crisis" when he left his wife and took up with another woman. Am I correct about that last detail?

 

[An Ard Ri]

The current Lord Mountbatten is very much alive

 

[iceflower]

Beatrice and Edoardo, Eugenie and Jack, Zara and Mike went out for lunch together after the Service of Thanksgiving:


** dm article: A right royal catch up! Elegant Beatrice and Eugenie joined..**

 

[Mbruno]

Anybody trying to get to their work in the morning will sympathise with the royals waiting for their bus. It was one of those things. Nothing to get worked up about.

The problem was not the coach being late, which is an unpredictable event due to traffic. The actual problem was the ushers signaling the foreign royals to stand up and queue at the Abbey's door before all BRF members (e.g. the Phillips and the Tindalls, the Kents, and the Gloucesters had left), and before their coach was confirmed to have arrived. They should have been simply held on their seats. The high point of the confusion was when King Philippe and Queen Mathilde left before the junior British royals.


But,as you said, there is no reason to blow it out of proportion. I don't think any of the foreign guests took it as an offense. The fact, however, that the Royal Household is no longer the Swiss clockwork it used to be might signal the difficulties of the transition from the Philip/Elizabeth era to the new Charles era.

 

[TLLK]

I'm afraid that no-one can control city centre traffic, short of closing all the roads around Westminster Abbey, which would have caused huge disruption and attracted a lot of nasty remarks from the left wing Mayor of London. This is why I always use the Underground when travelling in London! They all seemed to see the funny side of it, anyway.

I agree. No there is not control over traffic on a busy weekday morning. Unlike other large scale events from recent years this was not a holiday, so traffic is going to impact the timing and organization.

 

[Claire]

I think Philippe and Mathilde jumped into the van with Edward. He had space , he could have taken Queen Margarethe and Queen Beatrice as well. To be honest there was space in Anne's van as well.

I spoke to the protocol officer and, joking aside, there was sever issues with traffic and road closures and yes, where the vehicles were allowed to stand and not to stand. It was not just one thing it was several things. But lessons were learned and I suppose that they will iron them out for the Jubilee church event. Hopefully

 

[TLLK]

I think Philippe and Mathilde jumped into the van with Edward. He had space , he could have taken Queen Margarethe and Queen Beatrice as well. To be honest there was space in Anne's van as well.

I spoke to the protocol officer and, joking aside, there was sever issues with traffic and road closures and yes, where the vehicles were allowed to stand and not to stand. It was not just one thing it was several things. But lessons were learned and I suppose that they will iron them out for the Jubilee church event. Hopefully

Thank you for the information Claire. Traffic in a major metropolitan area is always going to be an issue but as you mentioned lessons were learned.

 

[Marengo]

I do not know how long they were standing there but it seems that Philippe and Mathilde were waiting on the street, in the company of an officer:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1509273210570870785

If I understand posters description of the situation correctly, normal traffic was passing by while the King and Queen were waiting on the pavement?

 

[Mbruno]

I do not know how long they were standing there but it seems that Philippe and Mathilde were waiting on the street, in the company of an officer:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1509273210570870785

If I understand posters description of the situation correctly, normal traffic was passing by while the King and Queen were waiting on the pavement?

Off-topic, but just to avoid confusion, saying that the King and Queen were "waiting on the pavement" actually means in North America that they were waiting on the paved surface of the road (i.e. on the asphalt). What the Brits call "pavement" is called "sidewalk" in the United States and, I think, also in Canada.

 

[MonacoRoyalFan]

Beatrice and Edoardo, Eugenie and Jack, Zara and Mike went out for lunch together after the Service of Thanksgiving:





** dm article: A right royal catch up! Elegant Beatrice and Eugenie joined..**

I imagine William and Catherine did not join because of the foreign royals and Clarence House. While the rest of the adult cousins said let’s have a little fun! Very relatable.

 

[muriel]

I imagine William and Catherine did not join because of the foreign royals and Clarence House. While the rest of the adult cousins said let’s have a little fun! Very relatable.

I think that is right, I think W&C would have probably have sent George & Charlotte home and gone to the reception at Clarence House.

 

[Hans-Rickard]

Traffic jam happens... It’s sometimes unavoidable even for the world champions in protocol (=The British Royal Court)

Wasn’t it at The Queen’s 90:th Birthday Service when she and Prince Philip arrived 11:15 and the service was about to have started at 11:00 ?
TV-pictures showed people in the fully seated St Paul’s getting a bit worried , while helicopter pictures at last found The Queen’s car crossing Blackfriars Brifge after having had to take another route than planned ?

These things happen ?

 

[victor1319]

The Vassal King...

I suppose we can forgive the King of Spain for not realising that Timothy Vesterberg and such are supposed to go ahead of him.

Yeah! I mean, if you think about it - in the days gone it would have been unthinkable and a reason for feud and war, if somebody would have walked out of a church like this Vesterberg dude here - before a King and letting the King wait thereby! An ordinary Prince or somebody - Impossibe to imagine!

A King is (was) a ruler with a God given right! And if a King would have tolerated such behaviour he would have lost name and face!

But King Felipe here: He is in the Order of the Garter, right? And the Monarch of England is the Boss of this Order, right?

So, if King Felipe acts like a vassal, he gets treated like a vassal - there has not much changed since way back...

Besides: It was very unpolite of the Windsors, to let their guests wait and to not treat them preferably! An remarkable and unusual behavior - but their guests took it like good Gentleman and Gentlewoman - With a mild smile and contenance...

 

[maria-olivia]

Prince Michel of Greece said he was so sad he could not represent Greece at Prince Philip Funerals instead of a husband of the Queen's Niece.
I don't think he attends now ?

 

[Mbruno]

But King Felipe here: He is in the Order of the Garter, right? And the Monarch of England is the Boss of this Order, right?

So, if King Felipe acts like a vassal, he gets treated like a vassal - there has not much changed since way back.

Queen Elizabeth II is a member of the Order of the Golden Fleece. Does that make her also King Felipe VI's "vassal" per your logic?


Changing subjects, I wonder what criteria are used to invite non-reigning RFs. Why are invitations extended to the RFs of Greece, Romania and Serbia, but not of, let's say, Austria-Hungary, Italy, or Portugal? I would understand an exception for King Constantine since he is a living former King, but what about the others? Was the criterion being related to Prince Philip?

 

[Alison H]

Prince Philip was closely related to the royal families of both Romania and Serbia, due to Greek princesses marrying into both houses, so, yes, I'd assume so.

 

[Stefan]

Changing subjects, I wonder what criteria are used to invite non-reigning RFs. Why are invitations extended to the RFs of Greece, Romania and Serbia, but not of, let's say, Austria-Hungary, Italy, or Portugal? I would understand an exception for King Constantine since he is a living former King, but what about the others? Was the criterion being related to Prince Philip?

My guess is Greece, Romania, Serbia and Builgaria are invited because the are close to the Queen and Philipp and also to Charles and also related (only Bulgaria ismore distant related) which is not the case for the Habsburgs, Savoys, the Orleans etc. and the Habsburgs etc. have never been invited to british Royal Events. At last not that i can remember.

 

[Osipi]

Queen Elizabeth II is a member of the Order of the Golden Fleece. Does that make her also King Felipe VI's "vassal" per your logic?


Changing subjects, I wonder what criteria are used to invite non-reigning RFs. Why are invitations extended to the RFs of Greece, Romania and Serbia, but not of, let's say, Austria-Hungary, Italy, or Portugal? I would understand an exception for King Constantine since he is a living former King, but what about the others? Was the criterion being related to Prince Philip?

Here's my thoughts on this. Philip's service of thanksgiving was not a state event as if my memory (which has decided to take a flight of fancy elsewhere) is trying to tell me that one of Philip's wishes was no state funeral/memorial.

With it not being a state event, what mattered was not the status and standings of foreign royals but what was taken into consideration the most was their relationships with Philip over his very long lifetime. Invitations to Greece is a no brainer as there are family ties. Queen Margrethe was also a no brainer as Margrethe and Elizabeth have had a very long standing personal friendship. Same with the Germanic relatives.

The Duke of Edinburgh had a very long and fruitful lifetime and he touched and affected so very many people over the years. Imagine the crowd if anyone and everyone that had some kind of a bond to Philip was invited? ?

OH... as an after thought, it helps to remember too that it wasn't *that* long ago that Queen Victoria was known as "The Grandmother of Europe". Those family bonds have also remained strong.

 

[Prinsara]

Part of being good royalty and noblesse oblige is being patient and tolerant. Aside from that, considering how much both the Queen and DoE are and were said to long for things to go wrong during their events (just for variety, I suppose), aside from unfortunate Margrethe (and maybe even her), perhaps the other royals have a similar attitude to things not going as planned.

Perhaps Philip did it on purpose. It would be characteristic of his service, anyway.