General News about Frederik, Mary and Family Part 19: September 2023 -

[Granada]

Duke of Marmalade, I completely agree with your post.
I certainly believe Mary and Frederik will weather this, and not split up. But their fairy tale narrative, is blown. Gone.

The whole situation that unfolded is so ridiculous and was so unnecessary. I honestly don't believe it would have had ANY traction, except for reckless and wildly insensitive Frederik decision to spend the night at Genoveva's.

I think, in the long run, perception wise, that will cost him. His judgement there was abysmal.

 

[Prinsara]

The whole situation that unfolded is so ridiculous and was so unnecessary. I honestly don't believe it would have had ANY traction, except for reckless and wildly insensitive Frederik decision to spend the night at Genoveva's.

I think, in the long run, perception wise, that will cost him. His judgement there was abysmal.

The problem (one of them) is that I don't think Fred's judgment otherwise has been so weighty and sterling that this isn't enough to make many people think "what else has he not cared enough about?" and "what else will he screw up on?"

 

[Muhler]

Do you really think that when Frederik and Mary posed for Vogue magazine and showed their love and their wonderful family that it wasn't a business relationship? They (I think) did not make money for it, but the report served to sell their image, and the magazine made money from it.

The Danish Royal Family often gives interviews to the media, so they are also part of that game. They do it because they are interested in projecting an image and having related media to take care of them. But do they treat all media equally? Or are there private media outlets that are constantly favored by the Royal Family over others?

Lecturas magazine was not the owner of the images, the owner of the images is the GTRES press agency, and they put those photos on the market that have been purchased by Lecturas magazine and other foreign media. The price of the photos is set by the market, the importance of the news and the number of international media that may be interested.

Important people and famous people remove photos from the market when they are interested, they only need two things: friendly journalists to inform them of the existence of those photographs and money to pay for it.

You are making this story crazy and inventing an extortion that has never existed, simply because NO ONE has offered the photographs to the Danish Royal House... but from the first moment it was said that Genoveva asked the friend who informed her of the existence of the photos, what was the price of the photos.

The conclusion of the Spanish press, knowing how the business works, is that if the Danish Royal House had had any interest, they would have had the possibility of avoiding this scandal.

Paparazzi take photos, press agencies market them and magazines buy them. If you are a public figure and you are unlucky or irresponsible enough to be caught by a paparazzi in a situation that is damaging to your image, you have two options: try to negotiate with them so that these images are not published or endure the scandal. And many, if they have the financial means to do so, prefer to remove the photos.

Call me a cynic, but if I'm to sum up your post it will be: Victim blaming.

What scandal?
The sleep inducing photos of Frederik with a woman? The eye-witness narrative of the extortionists... sorry, I mean photographers? The unsubstantiated claims and hints in the Spanish press?
There are Nigerian princes who offer to pay me 50.000 $ if I only give them the details about my bank account, that I find more credible.

You have tried to explain this away a couple of times now. But you persist in claiming that the DRF could just have "bought" the photos and avoided the Spanish media to... shall we say... freely interpret the available and selected photos.
In other words: For the right price or the right favor, the whole story would never have been printed.
- How is that different from what blackmailers say?!?

And silly little me thought the main purpose of the press is to bring news, also about scandals, not suppress them - "for the right favor." - You yourself has claimed that to be normal practice in Spain. In my naive eyes, that's corruption.
Guess I was wrong.

And some here in this thread, claimed that there are no tabloids in Spain. That Spanish journalists have a high degree of integrity and that the extor..., sorry, photographers are highly respected.
The quotes are right here in this thread for everybody to see.

Some, including you, Lula, were also quite willing to believe Frederik was unfaithful. He was tried and sentenced from pretty much from the very beginning. And in a couple of cases I was left with the distinct impression that the glee/schadenfreude was barely concealed.
To me these past couple of week have been a very ugly experience.

- So the next time a royal is being hung out as being an adulterer, I suggest we remain a little more skeptical and also question the motives and reputation and methods of those who come up with the story, before jumping to a finite conclusion.

 

[Prinsara]

- So the next time a royal is being hung out as being an adulterer, I suggest we remain a little more skeptical and also question the motives and reputation and methods of those who come up with the story, before jumping to a finite conclusion.

There is not enough to exonerate Frederik from whatever he was doing, either.

Where is the leaked counterpressure campaign that it was all perfectly innocent? Where is the good explanation not concocted on here, either?

The problem with the situation is not suspicious minds around here; it's a Crown Prince with an alarmingly blasé and entitled judgment call who caused the situation to begin with.

 

[Muhler]

There is not enough to exonerate Frederik from whatever he was doing, either.

Where is the leaked counterpressure campaign that it was all perfectly innocent? Where is the good explanation not concocted on here, either?

The problem with the situation is not suspicious minds around here; it's a Crown Prince with an alarmingly blasé and entitled judgment call who caused the situation to begin with.

Innocent until proven guilty.

Stupidity, carelessness, thoughtlessness, being naive whatever - is not a crime.

Giving people the benefit of doubt.

- I think these are sound principles.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

There is not enough to exonerate Frederik from whatever he was doing, either.

Where is the leaked counterpressure campaign that it was all perfectly innocent? Where is the good explanation not concocted on here, either?

The problem with the situation is not suspicious minds around here; it's a Crown Prince with an alarmingly blasé and entitled judgment call who caused the situation to begin with.

This!! I am in the camp I have no idea if Frederik was unfaithful or not but what I do know is that this is a future monarch who behaved recklessly without any care about his wife, family or institution, as if to say nobody can touch me anyway.
I find this mindset far more alarming than adultery.

 

[Granada]

Muhler, the problem IS though that in a future King, in THESE increasingly dangerous and unstable times, a mindset of constancy, sound judgement, prudent discretion and wise decision making is a welcome and needed virtue.

"Stupidity, carelessness, thoughtlessness, being naive whatever, is not a crime". True, enough, BUT those are not qualities or traits that make a successful Monarch, Politician or Leader either.

Frederik simply screwed up BIG TIME. Hopefully he learns, and doesn't repeat his error in judgement.

 

[Erin9]

Muhler, the problem IS though that in a future King, in THESE increasingly dangerous and unstable times, a mindset of constancy, sound judgement, prudent discretion and wise decision making is a welcome and needed virtue.

"Stupidity, carelessness, thoughtlessness, being naive whatever, is not a crime". True, enough, BUT those are not qualities or traits that make a successful Monarch, Politician or Leader either.

Frederik simply screwed up BIG TIME. Hopefully he learns, and doesn't repeat his error in judgement.

I think that is a good sum up.

At best he showed exceedingly poor judgment. Whether he cheated or not, he absolutely messed up. Hopefully he learns from this.

 

[BriarRose]

I know we all have favorite royals. But objectively, Fred is not some young sheltered prince who is new to the ways of the press. I don't think he and Mary will divorce over this; I don't think his mother will remove him from the succession; I don't even assume he did in fact have an affair; but I also can't feel sorry for him that people will be whispering about this for a while. I feel sorry for his family.

I would like to posit that Fred's woes really are entirely self-inflicted, even if he is innocent. All Fred had to do was stay at a hotel. Something that he does all the time. Something that he undoubtedly has the financial means to do. Something that he himself would tell his own son to do in similar circumstances.

Fred wasn't sexually assaulted while wearing a mini-skirt. Fred wasn't drunk and photographed without his consent. Those are instances of shameful victim blaming by society. Victim blaming also implies that he is a victim. A victim of what? His own choices on a public street? I did not see him there under duress. He didn't need to go to a 3-hour flamenco show in Madrid to financially support his family. No one held a gun to his head and forced him to enter a woman's house for several hours.

Fair or not, democratic societies are not interested in giving massive amounts of privilege and wealth to royals without transparency about their behavior, even if only for titillation and gossip. No European democracy is going to enact Thailand's lese-majeste law. I do feel terribly bad for royal children and young adults, but Fred is 55 years old. And he's never had to experience the misogynistic internet trolling that Royal girls and women do every day. I personally don't see a victim.

 

[polyesco]

...
You are making this story crazy and inventing an extortion that has never existed, simply because NO ONE has offered the photographs to the Danish Royal House... but from the first moment it was said that Genoveva asked the friend who informed her of the existence of the photos, what was the price of the photos.
...

But IT's written in the Spanish Press, one that another member brought here as a "reliable" source. If some believed the stories that were written before why not this one?
https://informalia-eleconomista-es....uto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp

The Queen did not buy the pictures because she is not happy with either son as her successors. Then they wrote about the title change to Joachim's kids to also be an indicator that this was true. Nevermind that counts or princes, they are still in the line of succession.
I mean its written right there by the Spanish press. And some were believing what was written in the press before...
Some I fear are taking everything that is written as truth. The pictures are there but the many interpretations are sometimes laughable.

And for those that say that Frederik is not criticized at home before. They do, all the time. Whether its justified is another topic. I am constantly following Frederik's calendar and constantly being a newsdigger on Frederik, as the DRF calendar doesn't always published some of his work visits. Right now he is being criticized for using a government helicopter for a work event. In no way do they shy away from being critical of him.

And no I don't buy that Frederik and Mary try so hard to sell the fairy time image. If so, they would be better color coordination lol. Frederik would have better posture, his hair would be combed to perfection, his clothes would be much better. I think they share with us some pictures, the kids aren't hidden. More than a fairytale, I see a lovely united normal family. Look at the Royal Runs, we see exhausted kids but happy and united ones. Kids naturally interacting with each other and their parents.

The photos in Madrid show Frederik spending time with someone he knows. That is all. All the narratives that have been presented are not necessary facts.

 

[polyesco]

...

I would like to posit that Fred's woes really are entirely self-inflicted, even if he is innocent. All Fred had to do was stay at a hotel. Something that he does all the time. Something that he undoubtedly has the financial means to do. Something that he himself would tell his own son to do in similar circumstances.

...

If he had stayed at a hotel, but we still had pictures of him and a "pretty blonde" heading to a museum, a restaurant and a show; you don't think the press would still try to spin it in unfavorable night?
he stays at a hotel but does he get visitors? how do we know he doesn't have someone waiting for him in his hotel room?
Hotel or not the press would have found the scandalous story angle because that is what sells.

 

[lula]

But IT's written in the Spanish Press, one that another member brought here as a "reliable" source. If some believed the stories that were written before why not this one?
https://informalia-eleconomista-es....uto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp

I said the opposite, that I didn't think that source was especially reliable. As an example, this website this week published a news story with photos of Marie saying that she was Mary.

Based on facts that may be objective, and that is that if the Royal House had wanted it could have prevented the sale of the photos... they ramble, invent and give meaningless explanations.

The Spanish press has little knowledge of what is happening in Denmark or how its royal house works, and therefore they speculate, as the Danish press is speculating with information from the Spanish.

And no I don't buy that Frederik and Mary try so hard to sell the fairy time image. If so, they would be better color coordination lol. Frederik would have better posture, his hair would be combed to perfection, his clothes would be much better. I think they share with us some pictures, the kids aren't hidden. More than a fairytale, I see a lovely united normal family. Look at the Royal Runs, we see exhausted kids but happy and united ones. Kids naturally interacting with each other and their parents.

I really don't understand what Frederik's physical appearance or the clothes he wears have to do with selling a "fairy tale." The excessive posing in magazines, the declarations of love in interviews and speeches,... has much more to do with the idea of selling a "fairy tale." Of the crown prince couples of their generation, they are the ones who have exploited this type of thing the most.

 

[Muhler]

Victim blaming because not only Frederik being the victim. But also QMII and indirectly Mary and their children.

Frederik was believed to be an adulterer, by some here, from the very beginning. All based on circumstantial evidence. There were no hard evidence of adultery.
He was not given the benefit of doubt and he was assumed guilty until proven innocent. That makes him a victim.

The miniskirt comparison is unfortunately apt.
What was she doing in Madrid?
Why was she associating a man of ill repute?
Why was she seen in public with such a man?
Why did she dine behind a curtain with an unmarried man?
Why did she go with him home to his apartment?
Why did she spend the night there?
- She really should have been more careful.
- She really should have been more mindful about her reputation.
- She really shouldn't have put herself in that position.
- She really ought to have worn a longer skirt...

I think we can all agree that the best way to avoid ending up becoming a victim is to avoid situations where you are at risk of becoming a victim. - But you are still a victim if something does happen.

But Mary and their children are also victims.
Let's turn it around again: If only your wife had... (see list above).
If only your mother had... (See list above).

And now we learn that it could all have been avoided - for a price.
A: For 1.000 we will publish some of the more innocent pics and make it a nice little story.
B: For 10.000 there will be no story. The pics will vanish. They have never existed. - Well, that is, we still have them in our archive...
C: For an exclusive the pics will not only vanish but we will also give you are very positive coverage.
- And here QMII is blamed for not accepting these "offers". - That's not victim blaming?

Finally: What if it was you?
You may not be royal or even particularly important, but you may have a position in your local community or a career that could suffer from a similar - I dare say framing or angling, if you prefer.
Only to be told: Well, you should have been more careful.

To err is to be human and royals are just humans.
That includes Frederik who sure has his flaws, one of which is that he is sometimes thoughtless.

But what do we prefer? A royal with flaws whom we can relate to and sometimes wish to hit on the head with a shovel?
Or a perfect royal who is always on guard, lest...?

 

[BriarRose]

If he had stayed at a hotel, but we still had pictures of him and a "pretty blonde" heading to a museum, a restaurant and a show; you don't think the press would still try to spin it in unfavorable night?
he stays at a hotel but does he get visitors? how do we know he doesn't have someone waiting for him in his hotel room?
Hotel or not the press would have found the scandalous story angle because that is what sells.

Yes! The photos entering her house and leaving the next day are what make the story!!!!! Journalism 101 - the Press led with those photos for a reason. The flamenco show would have raised an eyebrow, but the "my friend was sick" excuse would have provided cover in the legitimate press and spared his family most of the situation; however, the photos coming and going from a single woman's house shout a narrative to anyone with eyeballs and a marriage. Occam's razor most definitely, so I don't blame people for jumping to conclusions.

Fred could have had an orgy waiting in his hotel room, but with NDAs no one would have been the wiser. That's what makes this so absolutely stupid on his part. And he has been accused of cheating before, so he absolutely knows he has to keep questionable actions out of the public eye.

 

[BriarRose]

Victim blaming because not only Frederik being the victim. But also QMII and indirectly Mary and their children.

Come now. No one has blamed Mary, or the kids, or the Queen. That is very disingenuous. It's a poorly constructed straw man's argument at best; at worst it's an attempt to invoke sexism that has not been on this thread in this issue.

 

[Muhler]

Come now. No one has blamed Mary, or the kids, or the Queen. That is very disingenuous. It's a poorly constructed straw man's argument at best; at worst it's an attempt to invoke sexism that has not been on this thread in this issue.

That's not what I said.
I said Frederik, Mary, their children and QMII were victims.

Frederik has been blamed and QMII has been blamed here in this thread.
That's victim blaming.

 

[Prinsara]

Innocent until proven guilty.

Stupidity, carelessness, thoughtlessness, being naive whatever - is not a crime.

Giving people the benefit of doubt.

- I think these are sound principles.

Since it isn't an alleged crime, innocent until proven guilty doesn't apply.

Giving people the benefit of the doubt is something one does normally. Not when very questionable actions are publicized with no explanation or counter-narrative.

Since he is a public figure with imminent and immense future trust in him, he needs to behave according to public standards. He doesn't get the benefit of the doubt you give people because you know them better. We don't know him better, we know an image.

And being on a secretive holiday with some random woman is not a great job at living up to public trust.

 

[victor1319]

Hmm, what I do not get here in the thread are insinuations about a possible abdication of Frederik as a Crown Prince and future Monarch!

If - and we only know, what we did read in the press, which formost wants to sell its content to make some money - so, if Frederik had/has an affair... So what?

Royalty would have become extinct long ago, if this were an issue! Would it be unfortunate and disappointing to all Mary fans? Sure! But that's it!

 

[Adda]

Frederik is NOT a victim. He's a reckless, thoughtless 55 year old man who clearly doesn't know better.

One does have to feel sorry for HMTQ, Mary and the teenage kids.

 

[Prinsara]

Hmm, what I do not get here in the thread are insinuations about a possible abdication of Frederik as a Crown Prince and future Monarch!

A 55 year-old man who has spent his entire life with media and public scrutiny and behaves this way:
— is either incredibly stupid, careless, blasé, entitled, whatever...
— or is so self-damaging that I start doubting whether he wants and is really at ease with the next job (there's historical precedent, unfortunately)

"Didn't think he'd get caught" and DGAF cover both. There's not much of a palatable alternative, unfortunately.

 

[BriarRose]

Finally: What if it was you?
You may not be royal or even particularly important, but you may have a position in your local community or a career that could suffer from a similar - I dare say framing or angling, if you prefer.
Only to be told: Well, you should have been more careful.

To err is to be human and royals are just humans.
That includes Frederik who sure has his flaws, one of which is that he is sometimes thoughtless.

But what do we prefer? A royal with flaws whom we can relate to and sometimes wish to hit on the head with a shovel?
Or a perfect royal who is always on guard, lest...?

(I actually do have a career with a reputation and behavior clause in my contract. But I've never had to worry about it. I would choose to live a moral and ethical life regardless. It really hasn't been hard.)

And I don't ask any public figure more of themselves than I would of myself. In fact, I frequently have defended royal women and girls on this board by saying that I could see myself doing the same thing, making the same mistake, or wearing the same clothes. I feel I have been one of the most equitable commentators here when it comes to this very issue. I don't ask for perfection. But I won't treat a 55 year old man with a past reputation for cheating as an innocent victim when there was an easy and perfectly legal way to prevent such a story.

So I say this very seriously: unless someone has evidence that Fred has a seriously low intellect, I expect his actions in public, regardless of what country he is in, to show respect for the title and privilege he has been given in life. I expect Fred and other married royals to reasonably keep any affairs, or situations that could reasonably be misinterpreted as such, out of the public's purview for the sake of their young children. And if Fred doesn't want this minimal scrutiny, I expect him to publicly state that he will abdicate when his time comes. And then I will not have any expectations for him whatsoever. He can frolick naked down the streets of Madrid, and I would defend him as a private citizen.

His actions affected a state occasion with another country. There is nothing Princely in that. His own niece and nephews lost titles in a very public way for far, far less problematic behavior, at a far younger age, with much more international press scrutiny than this situation.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

Frederik is lucky that he is the Danish CP, a small country that is very well off and doesnt invent vile stories about their royals.
Imagine this in other monarchies that have to fight for their survival, like Belgium or Spain, they would have kicked out a 55 year old man child who doesnt think of any consequences when acting in public a long time ago.

 

[Prinsara]

Frederik is lucky that he is the Danish CP, a small country that is very well off and doesnt invent vile stories about their royals.
Imagine this in other monarchies that have to fight for their survival, like Belgium or Spain, they would have kicked out a 55 year old man child who doesnt think of any consequences when acting in public a long time ago.

Uh....Belgium has Laurent. Who is fortunately not the heir.

His own niece and nephews lost titles in a very public way for far, far less problematic behavior, at a far younger age, with much more international press scrutiny than this situation.

His niece and nephews lost their titles for nothing except their grandmother's poorly-explained whims, but the adult ones and the parents have had to suffer plenty of victim blaming, both internationally and on here.

 

[Izzie]

Wow! Talk about jumping on the salacious bandwagon. Let's just admit that some in this thread are gleefully rubbing their hands together at the demise of the "fairytale"! That Frederik is a horrible person and you're probably salivating with anticipation over the thought of photos of a distraught Mary.

And yes, innocent until proven guilty applies here. More like he's guilty until proven innocent. This phrase is not exclusive to crimes. He is most certainly being tried, judged and sentenced in this thread with what in most courtrooms would be considered circumstantial evidence that does not meet the required burden of proof (beyond a reasonable doubt).

And when have M&F stated or acted like they are some perfect couple? Or used the media to project such an image of perfection? Doing a feature in a magazine does not rise to that, sorry. They've never claimed to be perfect. They've never claimed to have the perfect little royal robot children. They've never claimed that they don't' have their ups and downs like any couple. They allow their kids to act like kids and always have. So excuse me for not seeing the calculated and deliberate optics of the perfect family that never puts a foot wrong....you can look elsewhere for those machinations.

I also don't see any type of quid pro quo with the Danish media either. Frederik is not and has never been immune to criticism. Neither has Mary for that matter. They are not treated with kid gloves by the Danish press in exchange for oh I don't know information on other royals, etc.

The absolute bile I am seeing towards Frederik and the rush to throw him into a pit of fire tells me some never thought much of him in the first place. So, why care about this at all?

No matter what Frederik, Mary or M&F do now, some are just going to find fault with it, side-eye it or figure out a way for it to fit their narrative that Frederik is some heathen that must be publicly shamed by the towns' people in Amalienborg Plaza!

 

[BriarRose]

Frederik is lucky that he is the Danish CP, a small country that is very well off and doesnt invent vile stories about their royals.
Imagine this in other monarchies that have to fight for their survival, like Belgium or Spain, they would have kicked out a 55 year old man child who doesnt think of any consequences when acting in public a long time ago.

I think that may cover why there is such a passionate divide on this issue. Those of us who mainly follow Royal families in countries that are more hostile to monarchies are baffled why Fred could make just an obvious public mistake. To us, "of course the press is going to publish such photos! Of course people will think the worst! Why put yourself in such a position? That's what the press does!" We are realists for how the press-royalty-gossip cycle flows. We're used to "our" royals taking a bruising for relatively minor transgressions, or dealing with much deeper political quicksand.

But those who follow popular and uncontested monarchies are perhaps more idealistic about how the world should be.

 

[Muhler]

Since it isn't an alleged crime, innocent until proven guilty doesn't apply.

Giving people the benefit of the doubt is something one does normally. Not when very questionable actions are publicized with no explanation or counter-narrative.

Since he is a public figure with imminent and immense future trust in him, he needs to behave according to public standards. He doesn't get the benefit of the doubt you give people because you know them better. We don't know him better, we know an image.

And being on a secretive holiday with some random woman is not a great job at living up to public trust.

Only when it's a crime?
So, if someone starts to question how faithful you are to your spouse, a concrete proof of you being unfaithful is not needed, because it's not a crime?
And you can be "judged" stupid, reckless, irresponsible etc. based on someone else's moral standards?
And that's perfectly okay?
I will not agree to that.

(I actually do have a career with a reputation and behavior clause in my contract. But I've never had to worry about it. I would choose to live a moral and ethical life regardless. It really hasn't been hard.)

And I don't ask any public figure more of themselves than I would of myself. In fact, I frequently have defended royal women and girls on this board by saying that I could see myself doing the same thing, making the same mistake, or wearing the same clothes. I feel I have been one of the most equitable commentators here when it comes to this very issue. I don't ask for perfection. But I won't treat a 55 year old man with a past reputation for cheating as an innocent victim when there was an easy and perfectly legal way to prevent such a story.

So I say this very seriously: unless someone has evidence that Fred has a seriously low intellect, I expect his actions in public, regardless of what country he is in, to show respect for the title and privilege he has been given in life. I expect Fred and other married royals to reasonably keep any affairs, or situations that could reasonably be misinterpreted as such, out of the public's purview for the sake of their young children. And if Fred doesn't want this minimal scrutiny, I expect him to publicly state that he will abdicate when his time comes. And then I will not have any expectations for him whatsoever. He can frolick naked down the streets of Madrid, and I would defend him as a private citizen.

His actions affected a state occasion with another country. There is nothing Princely in that. His own niece and nephews lost titles in a very public way for far, far less problematic behavior, at a far younger age, with much more international press scrutiny than this situation.

To be cynical:
In that case you either really do live up to your own moral standards - or you haven't been caught yet.
It can't be both, right?

Anyway, yes we all have expectations of those in high positions, be they royals or otherwise.
One of the moral standards I try and live up to is: Don't judge people too soon and when you do, be sure!
- Admittedly, I don't always succeed. Because I'm very much a human. But I try. And that's all I ask. Try.

A reputation for cheating...
That's not the first time you mention that IIRC.
The only example I can think of, outside certain fora, is the incident at a nightclub (in connection with christening of the twins, I think) where Frederik was chatting with a young woman. - That made headline news here in DK. It was quickly refuted though. Not least because it happened in public and Mary's brother was present.
I assume being very careful about not throwing allegations around is a part of your moral codex?

 

[Prinsara]

But those who follow popular and uncontested monarchies are perhaps more idealistic about how the world should be.

Is there such a place? The Norwegian monarchy is even more popular than the Danish one, but Märtha Louise has proven how easy it is for an individual to generate (or degenerate...) all the controversy she or he wants.

Spain was quite idealistic and relatively uncontested to the point JC found himself entitled to shoot an elephant with his mistress in the midst of a major recession...because he'd gotten away with murder up till then. So much for that.

I think the Frederik loyalists have re-emerged after days of silence because he hasn't been crucified yet. So of course that means the whole thing was made up by nasty press and anti-fans, and Fred bears no responsibility at all. It's personal, not national.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

A reputation for cheating...
That's not the first time you mention that IIRC.
The only example I can think of, outside certain fora, is the incident at a nightclub (in connection with christening of the twins, I think) where Frederik was chatting with a young woman. - That made headline news here in DK. It was quickly refuted though. Not least because it happened in public and Mary's brother was present.
I assume being very careful about not throwing allegations around is a part of your moral codex?

Yes there have been rumours about cheating, that Fred was still involved with Bettina Odum (I think as he has had a lot of girlfriends before M) while starting a relationship with Mary. Then the incident with the twins and then I recall that Frederik was on a boat in Australia with a friend of Mary touching her bottom.
Again, a possible cheating is not my issue. My issue is reckless behaviour in public that leads to specualtion and rumours.

 

[BriarRose]

To be cynical:
In that case you either really do live up to your own moral standards - or you haven't been caught yet.
It can't be both, right?

Muhler let me be plain in case there is a language barrier. I find your attack insulting and clearly out of line. I was just trying to engage in a back-and-forth with respect. Your comments have now crossed a line. If you can only defend someone by attacking others, then you should question why it's so hard to defend that person.

To be clear, I'm NOT being "cynical." I don't hide behind fake intentions and false nuances.

Anyway, yes we all have expectations of those in high positions, be they royals or otherwise.
One of the moral standards I try and live up to is: Don't judge people too soon and when you do, be sure!
- Admittedly, I don't always succeed. Because I'm very much a human. But I try. And that's all I ask. Try.

A reputation for cheating...
That's not the first time you mention that IIRC.
The only example I can think of, outside certain fora, is the incident at a nightclub (in connection with christening of the twins, I think) where Frederik was chatting with a young woman. - That made headline news here in DK. It was quickly refuted though. Not least because it happened in public and Mary's brother was present.
I assume being very careful about not throwing allegations around is a part of your moral codex?

If you are so unaware of what has been printed for years in the press, that is not my burden in life.

 

[Muhler]

Yes there have been rumours about cheating, that Fred was still involved with Bettina Odum (I think as he has had a lot of girlfriends before M) while starting a relationship with Mary. Then the incident with the twins and then I recall that Frederik was on a boat in Australia with a friend of Mary touching her bottom.
Again, a possible cheating is not my issue. My issue is reckless behaviour in public that leads to specualtion and rumours.

He wasn't married to Bettina Ødum and someone has to break up a relationship. I personally don't know the circumstances.
And I don't think he had that many girlfriends. In fact I happen to know one of them - and her family. While and after they were in a relationship. DK is a small country.

Muhler let me be plain in case there is a language barrier. I find your attack insulting and clearly out of line. I was just trying to engage in a back-and-forth with respect. Your comments have now crossed a line. If you can only defend someone by attacking others, then you should question why it's so hard to defend that person.

To be clear, I'm NOT being "cynical." I don't hide behind fake intentions and false nuances.




If you are so unaware of what has been printed for years in the press, that is not my burden in life.

You had few qualms about accusing me of having various motives a few posts ago...
But you are right. It is very unpleasant to have one's personal integrity questioned in public, isn't it?

The Danish press?

And allow me to repeat myself once again: Frederik would be crucified by the public if he was cheating on Mary. Including by me.