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  #81  
Old 05-28-2012, 01:05 AM
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Originally Posted by VictoriaB

I have read many times that the Prince is aware that once he becomes King he will be curtailed in expressing an opinion by his constitutional position.

Charles is too intelligent not to recognise the difference between what he is able to do and say as Prince of Wales and what he will be able to do as king.
He has been meddling for years and he is in his 60s and set in his ways. when he becomes king I highly doubt he will stop "suggesting things" to ministers in government.
which is could very easily cause a crisis and damage the support and popularity of the monarchy
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  #82  
Old 05-28-2012, 01:33 AM
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Now I think this is support; although minor.
A tea room in Stanhope, England plays the national anthem every day at 3pm. When three customers did not stand up, they were thrown out.
The tea room only opens to coincide with the Jubilee and will close in August but business has been booming since the 'incident'. The room is decked out in memorabilia and it's a true show of support.
This is a lovely gesture, and shows a great deal of patriotism. As for those who refused to stand up for the national anthem, I'm in agreement with the owner; if you don't want to respect the nation, please get out. This tea room appears to be all about patriotism and support for the monarchy, and the national anthem is not named 'God Save the Queen' for the heck of it.

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Hear, hear! I'm glad to see the Prince of Wales get the respect and recognition he deserves. He's a very intelligent man, who has ideas that at one point were ahead of the times, but are now proving to be quite effective. With the help of The Prince's Trust, people that would not have been able to achieve their goals are able to do so. It takes a man with a very big heart and a ton of compassion (not to mention determination and self-awareness) to go down this path, even when the majority of the public choose to mock him.

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Originally Posted by XeniaCasaraghi View Post
It's about freakin time! Charles deserves so much more respect than he is given. He is so intelligent that I would willingly take a college course that he was teaching.
You and me both. He appears to be a very cultured, and intelligent individual, who is a big supporter of the arts. I heard him recite a poem by Robert Burns (the link was posted by The British Monarchy page on facebook in January), and I was impressed with his ability to read poetry. The man definitely knows how to deliver speeches (and believe me, reading poetry is one of the hardest things)

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Not so. The man is extremely intelligent, well spoken and insightful, with a fairly in-depth and comprehensive life experience in many areas. I'm not sure what your definition of genius is, but Charles has proved to be a cutting-edge thinker, able to synthesize varying points of view and implement advanced ideas in all his business ventures. He is a wealthy man in his own right because of his savvy, because of his intelligence. Anyone having anything to do with any of his Prince's Trust initiatives quickly respects Charles' foresight and diligence.

As for architecture - he is despised (if he is) by those who found their money-making plans stymied. His points regarding a community having a right to have input rather than just monied interests making the decisions was a courageous stand to take - and needed to be said. He's far from an armchair quarterback as his Poundbury - and other planned communities - in the Duchy of Cornwall illustrate.

Charles is an individual that the more you learn about him the more you respect him. He is a man who has really done something with his life - when because of his position he could have easily have had a far less rigorous private life of work.

I agree with XeniaCasaraghi - I have thought that Charles (and Camilla) would be fascinating dinner partners for an afternoon and I would definitely come to any seminar he would teach - especially one that would expand on his book 'Harmony'. In fact, is there any reason that Charles could not teach at - say - Cambridge - as the heir, or even as the King? That would be cutting edge!
Tyger, thank you so much for giving such details on His Highness's work and ideas. He'd be one heck of a professor and dinner host (his wife as well, though I'd like to see her teach a reading class to little ones, since she's so passionate about literacy). I think a dinner or tea with both of them would be a treat for anyone who enjoys intelligent conversation.
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  #83  
Old 05-28-2012, 02:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doric44

He has been meddling for years and he is in his 60s and set in his ways. when he becomes king I highly doubt he will stop "suggesting things" to ministers in government.
which is could very easily cause a crisis and damage the support and popularity of the monarchy
Well we'll have to see what happens when he does become King because regardless of opinion polls, provided Charles outlives the Queen he will become King. Personally, I can't see any reason why he won't make a very good one nor Camilla a very good Queen Consort.

I suspect the majority of those who don't want him to become King are basing their opinions less on any perceived meddling and more on other factors.
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  #84  
Old 05-28-2012, 02:54 AM
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He has been meddling for years and he is in his 60s and set in his ways. when he becomes king I highly doubt he will stop "suggesting things" to ministers in government.
which is could very easily cause a crisis and damage the support and popularity of the monarchy
None of this so called meddling can actually be proven and most articles on the subject come out of the Daily Mail where sources speak to sources who in the end have no connection to royalty and just want to be paid for their fifteen minutes in the a newspaper.

I don't see how this "rumour" could lead the monarchy into crisis and damage support, because according to you he's been doing it for 60 years and the approval ratings have gone up.
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  #85  
Old 05-28-2012, 03:38 AM
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Personally, when Charles becomes king, I hope his influence and meddling continue ever more forcefully - goodness knows the people of this country need someone at a high level with some common sense.
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  #86  
Old 05-28-2012, 06:39 AM
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Whatever anyone thinks of Charles personally, he has improved the lives of hundreds of thousands if not millions of his fellow countrymen and women. The Prince's Trust alone has been hugely successful in helping disadvantaged young people get into employment, education or training. He's probably the most accomplished Prince of Wales ever.
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  #87  
Old 05-28-2012, 06:42 AM
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Whatever anyone thinks of Charles personally, he has improved the lives of hundreds of thousands if not millions of his fellow countrymen and women. The Prince's Trust alone has been hugely successful in helping disadvantaged young people get into employment, education or training. He's probably the most accomplished Prince of Wales ever.
Amen to that.

Isn't the Prince's Trust one of the most successful charities in the United Kingdom? And if I'm not mistaken, Prince Charles donates quite a large chunk of his income (and I mean private income) to charities every year. He has done a great deal and I fully agree that Prince Charles is quite possibly the most accomplished Prince of Wales in history; in fact, he more or less re-defined the position.
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  #88  
Old 05-28-2012, 07:06 AM
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It is a very successful charity. It's for this reason that some of the accusations of Charles's 'interference' in the political sphere have come up. The PT is doing what the state pretty much fails to do. It has a much higher success rate in terms of getting unemployed young people, or people who have been in trouble with the law, into a job or on a training course which helps them get a job, or helping them set up in business etc. etc. Charles keeps in contact with the relevant ministers because he feels that the PT could help the government tackle this problem if they work together.

He believes that the lessons the PT has learned could be used by the relevant state bodies to tackle this enormous problem in a much more effective and efficient way. The difficulty is that the government machine is so cumbersome that any and every change takes such a long time. Also, in the middle of it all the minister involved will get into some scandal or another and lose their job and the whole process has to start again.

Charles's charities raise well over £100 million for charity every year. The overall group of Charles's charities - The Prince's Charities - is the biggest of its kind in the UK.
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  #89  
Old 05-28-2012, 12:19 PM
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Thanks for the information.
I feel that Prince Charles is right; if his charity succeeds where official government plans do not, then surely it's a common sense for them to learn a lesson or two?

Edit- Looks like the Government may actually benefit from The Prince's Trust example after all. Today, David Cameron visited the Prince's Trust headquarters, talking to the staff and those who have benefited from the Trust. The visit was part of the government's launch of StartUp loans initiative and publication of Lord Young's report on enterprise. Under the new scheme, people aged between 18 and 24, who show that they have a strong business plan, will be able to gain loans worth on average 2,500 GBP.
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  #90  
Old 05-28-2012, 12:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
None of this so called meddling can actually be proven and most articles on the subject come out of the Daily Mail where sources speak to sources who in the end have no connection to royalty and just want to be paid for their fifteen minutes in the a newspaper.

I don't see how this "rumour" could lead the monarchy into crisis and damage support, because according to you he's been doing it for 60 years and the approval ratings have gone up.

sorry but i don't think you know what you're talking about its not "rumor" its fact . numerous papers detailing through the freedom of information act his meddling in politics even Channel 4 documentary on YouTube detailing his attempts at influencing policy called the "meddling prince"

Prince Charles faces fresh meddling claim over letters to ministers | UK news | The Guardian
Prince Charles's 'meddling': a royal right, or a privilege too far? | UK news | The Guardian
Prince Charles accused of ‘meddling in government affairs’ - Telegraph
Prince Charles accused of meddling after summoning 7 senior Ministers to Clarence House in 10 months | Mail Online

i dont care how much good Charles's charities do. what concerns me as someone who supports the monarchy and the Commonwealth that he is overstepping his bounds. and that it will continue when he becomes king and could hurt the monarchy and damage its popularity even create a political crisis
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  #91  
Old 05-28-2012, 12:46 PM
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How is he overstepping his bonds? All the links you posted detail private correspondence, private conversations and private pieces of advice Prince Charles gave, taking into consideration the welfare of his country and people, as he sees it.

As the Prince of Wales he is not constitutionally bound not to "meddle". Now, when he becomes Monarch, he will be bound to remain neutral, and I'm sure he knows it. But until that day, he presumably has the same right to free speech as any other human being.
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  #92  
Old 05-28-2012, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Artemisia View Post

How is he overstepping his bonds? All the links you posted detail private correspondence, private conversations and private pieces of advice Prince Charles gave, taking into consideration the welfare of his country and people, as he sees it.

As the Prince of Wales he is not constitutionally bound not to "meddle". Now, when he becomes Monarch, he will be bound to remain neutral, and I'm sure he knows it. But until that day, he presumably has the same right to free speech as any other human being.
I think he has raised some eyebrows, but I do agree that I prefer to assume that when he becomes monarch, he will remain neutral. He's not a dumb man. And most of his meddling has done quite a bit of good.

I'd rather a Prince of Wales meddle for the common good than one who behaved like Edward VII and VIII.
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  #93  
Old 05-28-2012, 01:49 PM
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The press loves to have a good kick at Charles, even when he has had more of a positive impact on this nation that any other royal in the last 100 years.

As Artemisia says, there is no constitutional requirement for the Prince of Wales not to put his views to politicians. There is no constitutional blueprint for the role of Prince of Wales at all. Charles has essentially made it up as he's gone along, but to admirable effect.

When Charles visited Tottenham last summer after the riots and took it upon himself to try and help the people involved, you could say he's getting involved in the political sphere and he should leave it alone. At the heart of the riots were issues of poverty, family breakdown, unemployment, crime, drugs, gang culture among other things. All of these issues are overtly political; these are the issues that MPs argue about in the House of Commons. So, should Charles not touch it? Should he just turn to those people who lost everything and say, this is not my problem? I'm not allowed to help? I'm sure the people of Tottenham would've loved that.

With Charles, everything he does is a result of his passion and deep concern for the people of this country and the Commonwealth. He's decided to stick his head above the parapet and actually try to use his position to really make a difference. He knew he'd take a kicking from certain quarters for trying to do more than simply cut ribbons and shake hands. As long as he stays out of party politics, I'm personally quite happy for him to continue to do so. Charles will have plans in place for what happens when he inherits, to ensure that his charities' work continues.
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  #94  
Old 05-28-2012, 03:32 PM
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do any of you think when Charles is king people will like him
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Old 05-28-2012, 03:40 PM
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do any of you think when Charles is king people will like him
I think so. I think they already do - in spite of the really odd press he gets. I think so many people have been touched in a positive way by his work that the press will begin to reflect the reality rather than the flawed narrative.

In fact, I think in the future, Charles will be so respected, and seen as so unique (in a good way) as a monarch, that William may suffer in comparison. He will have a lot to live up to to fill his father's shoes IMO.
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Old 05-29-2012, 03:35 AM
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sorry but i don't think you know what you're talking about its not "rumor" its fact . numerous papers detailing through the freedom of information act his meddling in politics even Channel 4 documentary on YouTube detailing his attempts at influencing policy called the "meddling prince"
It's not fact because nobody can actually prove that Prince Charles has meddling in anything. A channel 4 documentary means nothing, they're just repeating the news stories that appear every year when the press have nothing to write.

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i dont care how much good Charles's charities do. what concerns me as someone who supports the monarchy and the Commonwealth that he is overstepping his bounds. and that it will continue when he becomes king and could hurt the monarchy and damage its popularity even create a political crisis
Well you're worrying about the wrong things then, Charles' work he's done and doing for charities far outweighs any rumours you listen to. He's an excellent man, a wonderful Prince and will make a fine King when he gets the chance. Can you give me one solid reason where or when he has overstepped his "bounds" and perhaps what exactly are his bounds?

You cannot predict what will happen when Charles becomes King, but if his meddling has gone on for 60 years and we have had no political crisis and the monarchy has not fallen nor has its popularity dropped, and it seems that some good has come out of this rumoured meddling. What's the issue?

Charles would never do anything to harm or hurt his country, so if this meddling actually exists it's for the good of the country.
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Old 05-29-2012, 03:57 AM
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Seeing as how over stepping his bounds have come up, I would also like to know what these bounds are? I believe the RF in the UK are prohibited from voting but does that mean they can not address issues they support? Has Charles publicly stated I support one politician over another? What are the written rules to what non-monarch on the BRF are allowed to do?
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Old 05-29-2012, 04:22 AM
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Seeing as how over stepping his bounds have come up, I would also like to know what these bounds are? I believe the RF in the UK are prohibited from voting but does that mean they can not address issues they support? Has Charles publicly stated I support one politician over another? What are the written rules to what non-monarch on the BRF are allowed to do?
As far as I know only the monarch himself cannot vote, all other members of the Royal family could but don't do it as they feel they should be above politics. But if Beatrice of York decided to become a politician she could even become prime minister. Charles as well, as long as he is not the king. As for taking sides and influence politicians - of course he should do so! As long as he doesn't try to get others to do something against the law, it is okay. IMHO, of course. But to give input on upcoming laws should be the right of any citizen of a democracy, prince or no prince. Later, as king, Charles will have other opportunities to advise "his" government. But for now, it is absolutely correct to make good on his rights as a citizen.

One should not forget that the "Royal peerages" were created to give the Royal family personal influence in the House of Lords at a time when the House of Lords actually ruled.
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Old 05-29-2012, 07:24 AM
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One of the joys of an unwritten or uncodified constitution is that it's incredibly flexible and vague. There is no document or statute that details the constitutional role or responsibility of the Prince of Wales. The only royal with a responsibility to remain apolitical is the monarch.

However, the royal family generally as a whole try not to be party political, and very rarely take on issues with an overt political overtone. The Prince of Wales has chosen to dedicate his life to using the 'convening power' of his position as he puts it to try and tackle the big issues of the day which are political. He doesn't support one political party over another, however.

So he is well known for writing regularly to ministers to give his opinion on matters about which he is passionate and has experience of through his charities. The democratically elected ministers are under no obligation to act on Charles correspondence. They can read Charles's letter and bin it if they want to.

If we're going to be strict about this, we need to acknowledge that everything is political. If you're going to ban Charles from touching anything even vaguely political, he won't be able to do anything. In working to try and counteract the problem of climate change, he is dealing with a political issue. It just so happens that his opinion on it is the 'accepted' wisdom on this issue, so no one says anything about it.

We also need to acknowledge that the Queen is not entirely apolitical. We know that she lobbies on behalf of the armed forces via her regular meetings with the PM and other ministers. She has spoken out, quite subtly, against the break up of the Union.

So long as Charles in not party political, I think he's safe enough. When he's King his ability to try and affect the sort of change he wants to see will be curtailed, but I think he knows that and will amend his behaviour accordingly.
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Old 05-29-2012, 08:33 AM
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I agree!

Better a POW who cares about real issues, and who has the ability to carve out a role for himself than Edward VII and VIII.

As for Charles' popularity as King, he will never be as popular as his mother, but this does not mean people will not support the monarchy in general in Britain, esp. with popularity for Will and Kate who follow.
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