The Duke and Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 8: April - August 2023

[TLLK]

From The Times.
https://archive.is/N1OMS#selection-839.0-839.91

 

[Alisa]

They lack real direction or purpose.

I decided to check out the Archewell website.

H&M set up Archewell championing good works and on the front page of their website it states: "leading the way with compassion"[.....]

Then I ventured into the page called "AWF Marks Earth Day 2023" which contains a short piece about said Earth Day and has a link to allow you to find out ways to get involved with it. I was expecting to go to another page on their website with a list of things we can all do to save the planet (I didn't expect to see "don't use private jets" on the list I have to admit ) but all it does is redirect you to the Earthday website. So anyone who wants to save the planet can find a wealth of valuable information on how to do so without visiting H&M's website.

Next I looked in the news section and picked an article called "An In Depth Look at The Fight to Save the Okavango Delta". This "in depth" article actually contains very little and the real information is provided by links to Rolling Stone Magazine and a page on a site called Re:wild.

I then went to the page "About Archwell", saw the words: "At Archewell, we unleash the power of compassion to drive systemic cultural change." and I just fell about laughing. To misquote John McEnroe: They cannot be serious! At that point I thought, enough! and left the website for the sake of my sanity

To summarise, H&M's website seems rather superfluous. It's like they've squeezed (or gatecrashed) their way into a party; a room that's already very well populated with people who for a very long time have been discussing and indeed acting upon the issues H&M are latching on to.

My honest opinion? They've jumped onto the bandwagon of environment/poverty/mental health where they're really not needed, to do as little real work as possible yet present themselves as "humanitarians". It's not working.......

On the AWF website, they've shown and highlighted interests and matters that they've focused their attention on such as mental health, the environment, women's rights, and helping the poor and hungry- shown how they've gotten involved from a practical standpoint and provided readers with information on how they can get more information and/or get involved. I genuinely don't see what is wrong with that. That is what everyone does- whether they be philanthropists, celebrities, or royals.

The article "AWF Marks Earth Day 2023" gave an overview of Earthday and how and what AWF did to commemorate it (you conveniently left that part out �&#56841 and they directed readers to the Earthday website. The Earthday website has vast more information on everything from how people can financially donate to organizations that help the environment, test their knowledge of the environment, and practical ways people can help the environment. In my opinion, it is wise to direct people to the experts instead of being presumptuous enough to think that AWF knows it all pertaining to the environment.

The same thing was done for "An In Depth Look at The Fight to Save the Okavango Delta'. A brief overview was given, in this case Prince Harry's participation(also omitted in your post) in the fight to save Okavango was highlighted and links. Also from a practical standpoint- links had to be provided in this case because the article belongs to the Washington Post and AWF cannot just copy and paste to their website.

To summarise, Harry & Meghan's website serves its purpose exactly. Whatever people may think of them, it cannot be denied that they and the AWF do "solid work".

 

[BritishRoyalist]

What does he want? He goes on about wanting privacy, but gives interviews and publishes books which include very intimate details of his life. And attends a high profile awards event in New York City and then complains about being photographed. As one of the commenters on the NYT article said, much bigger celebrities than the Sussexes, and heads of state visiting the UN, seem to manage perfectly well without any of this drama.

I think on the basic he want to be like every average joe on the street. Who name we don’t know and is not Famous. They are going through life trying to make a simple living, the person has no one following them or anyone trying get pictures, etc,.

The problem is Harry doesn’t understand that he is not a normal person, never has been and never will be. There is always going to be interest in him and paparazzi lurking.

The fact they have spent so much time paranoid and obsessed over the press and tabloids intrusion, going after the press and criticizing them at every opportunity and go on and on about privacy and security only make it worse and make them (paparazzi, tabloids, press) gravitate even more for photos and info, which etc. but then he send mix signals but inviting them when want attention to suit him.

He want (or more strictly want his father) to control the press at all cost and dictate every story they write about him. Which is nothing bad and everything positively glowingly and lovingly about him.

I used to like Harry pre Meghan (and even a little after) but now he one of my least favorite besides Andrew and Meghan. He made some mistakes before but he was young . However he has shown his true colors over the last 3 or 4 years. Can’t stand and now I really dislike him him a lot.

 

[Alisa]

I respectfully disagree. If you were to read the Current Events and News threads of the various royals, in particular those who are their nation's Heads of State, their daily calendars are do not resemble anything that can be related to celebrity life and self-promotion. It's meetings with government ministers, signing legislation, welcoming ambassadors, reading reports, and honoring those who represent the best of their nations.

The couple cannot be compared here as not even the average royal does not do this. Generally tasks such as welcoming ambassadors and signing legislation is usually done by the Head of State/Sovereign and in some cases the heir.

It's traveling your nation on a domestic tour to go to a factory opening, touring a cancer ward on a hospital, comforting those affected by a natural or human disaster. Much of it is not glamorous and I can imagine it can be very difficult at times to keep your emotions in check.
Then it's traveling the globe as your nation's top representative which can include nations where you might have personal conflicts and concerns about the leaders whom you will be required to interact with.

The Sussexes have actively engaged in similar work that is non-glamorous and that I'm sure would emotionally affect anyone. Off the top of my head, I recall them meeting with and the homeless, helping out in soup kitchens and delivering food, meeting with women who have been battered and abused, and visited with US service members' families.

 

[mybags]

From The Times.
https://archive.is/N1OMS#selection-839.0-839.91

I love this.

 

[CrownPrincessJava]

I think on the basic he want to be like every average joe on the street. Who name we don’t know and is not Famous. They are going through life trying to make a simple living, the person has no one following them or anyone trying get pictures, etc,.

The problem is Harry doesn’t understand that he is not a normal person, never has been and never will be. There is always going to be interest in him and paparazzi lurking.

The fact they have spent so much time paranoid and obsessed over the press and tabloids intrusion, going after the press and criticizing them at every opportunity and go on and on about privacy and security only make it worse and make them (paparazzi, tabloids, press) gravitate even more for photos and info, which etc. but then he send mix signals but inviting them when want attention to suit him.

He want (or more strictly want his father) to control the press at all cost and dictate every story they write about him. Which is nothing bad and everything positively glowingly and lovingly about him.

I used to like Harry pre Meghan (and even a little after) but now he one of my least favorite besides Andrew and Meghan. He made some mistakes before but he was young . However he has shown his true colors over the last 3 or 4 years. Can’t stand and now I really dislike him him a lot.

The biggest problem I can see is that Harry knows he's not the average person and expects to be treated as such. Except he's now expecting this in a country where the founding principles were against this behaviour. Here are two adults who are becoming more and more delusional in believing their own importance in the world. There were multiple other actions they could have taken - as many have already said, hide in a restaurant, hotel or stay at the police station.

They need to change their narrative and their modus operandi before they are ostracised by the very people they need.

 

[TLLK]

I love this.

Sadly I have to agree with the author, Camilla Long.

 

[mybags]

It's like watching a car accident about to happen. Nothing you can do to stop it. You just know something bad is going to happen.

 

[Leopoldine]

You are describing the vast majority of the work of all royals.

With all due respect,

Royals give out awards, as a general tradition, not accept them. The Olympics are an exception, but physical competition on the world stage is different.

 

[UglyAmerican]

For the first time in a while, I'm starting to genuinely feel sorry for Harry. Given his history and known issues with the media, I don't for a second believe he'd have intentionally staged/created a protracted "car chase" with the paparazzi, and I don't doubt that he was sincerely traumatized by the whole affair. So how did he end up there? Well, they flew to New York for Meghan to accept some kind of award at just the sort of high-profile, media-circus event Harry (supposedly) hates.

Then it was important to stay with a "friend" rather than at a hotel. Whose idea do you think that was? Does Harry know anyone in New York well enough to strongly prefer staying at their house rather than a hotel, in spite of all the reasons not to do that? I doubt it.

Then they leave, and are somehow surprised at being followed by photographers. They "can't" go back to their residence, because the media attention might be unpleasant for the "friend" (who probably wasn't Harry's friend in the first place). And somehow no one can think of any better options than "Let's drive in circles for two hours, switch cars twice, hail a taxi driven by a random cabbie, and hang out at the police station."

We all know Harry has serious issues, and at this point, I don't think he's capable of making good decisions for himself. In a healthy, functional family, those closest to him would step up and do it for him while encouraging him to get the help he needed. That doesn't appear to be what those currently closest to him are currently doing. All I can say is that if my spouse had Harry's history and known issues, there is absolutely no way in heck I'd have ever have allowed things to unfold the way they did here.

 

[Erin9]

The Duke and Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 8: Apr. 2023 -

Sadly I have to agree with the author, Camilla Long.

Over all, I agree with her too regarding the Sussexes. She does a good job of listing many, and amazingly not even all, of the litany of possible missteps the Sussexes have made over the years, culminating in this mess, that she believes may mark a turning point.

It is rather astounding. They made their ride home for the evening unnecessarily difficult imo. We’re talking about pictures, not terrorists, bottom line. This certainly wasn’t comparable to Princess Anne’s near kidnapping, which did result in injuries. Or Diana’s tragic death. Had they proceeded with a different plan, execution, or even a better change in plan, nothing would have happened.

That they even decided to release a statement is astounding imo, given that no one knew anything happened. That’s how minor the whole thing was. Then, not only did they decide to release a statement, they released an exaggerated one.

When people started saying “recollections may vary” about this too, they decided to issue an idiotic demand to Backgrid that they absolutely knew they didn’t need to comply with, culminating in a deservedly funny, snarky response. That only made them look worse.

It’s amazing. I thought she made a lot of good points: I didn’t watch the Netflix series, but she made the point that they seem to “egg each other on until they forget how to behave normally.” I’ve thought this, in general, my self, but she says it in regards to the paps and how the Sussexes respond to them. This was also well said, sadly, “The truth is, the taxi chase is Harry and Meghan. It is their mind set, their paranoia, their chaos, their attempt to label themselves as victims again.”

She may well be correct that this may be the thing they can’t bounce back from. After so many public missteps. This was a very sad statement “They’re now in a lunatic downward spiral of fiction and fantasy.” Ouch. And then this: Meghan and Harry are “…a pair of wayward hangers on with unhealthy egos.”

 

[stunking]

I agree with the NY newspaper and the poster that said Meghan loves the spotlight, she can't see the forest for the trees.

 

[Ista]

Let's move on from debate about what makes a person royal or not. That's not the topic of this thread.

 

[Alison H]

I'm sorry if Harry was frightened, but, if you don't want media attention, don't tell the whole world how you lost your virginity, how you used Elizabeth Arden cream on your genitals and how your brother pushed you into a dog bowl, and don't keep slagging off the most famous family in the world. He can't be an ordinary person *and* keep seeking out media attention.

 

[moby]

Over all, I agree with her too regarding the Sussexes. She does a good job of listing many, and amazingly not even all, of the litany of possible missteps the Sussexes have made over the years, culminating in this mess, that she believes may mark a turning point.

It is rather astounding. They made their ride home for the evening unnecessarily difficult imo. We’re talking about pictures, not terrorists, bottom line. This certainly wasn’t comparable to Princess Anne’s near kidnapping, which did result in injuries. Or Diana’s tragic death. Had they proceeded with a different plan, execution, or even a better change in plan, nothing would have happened.

That they even decided to release a statement is astounding imo, given that no one knew anything happened. That’s how minor the whole thing was. Then, not only did they decide to release a statement, they released an exaggerated one.

When people started saying “recollections may vary” about this too, they decided to issue an idiotic demand to Backgrid that they absolutely knew they didn’t need to comply with, culminating in a deservedly funny, snarky response. That only made them look worse.

It’s amazing. I thought she made a lot of good points: I didn’t watch the Netflix series, but she made the point that they seem to “egg each other on until they forget how to behave normally.” I’ve thought this, in general, my self, but she says it in regards to the paps and how the Sussexes respond to them. This was also well said, sadly, “The truth is, the taxi chase is Harry and Meghan. It is their mind set, their paranoia, their chaos, their attempt to label themselves as victims again.”

She may well be correct that this may be the thing they can’t bounce back from. After so many public missteps. This was a very sad statement “They’re now in a lunatic downward spiral of fiction and fantasy.” Ouch. And then this: Meghan and Harry are “…a pair of wayward hangers on with unhealthy egos.”

To me, one of the more interesting things that came out from this incident are videos of the royals having absolute b*lls of steel when it comes to truly dangerous situations. People on other sites have been posting about when Prince Charles was speaking on stage in Sydney in 1994, and a gunman came very close to him, luckily the guy tripped, and security overpowered him. What did Charles do? Just stand there and look at the guy with mild annoyance, as if he didn't just fire bullets and almost killed him. Or in 1981 during Trooping the Color, when Queen Elizabeth was riding her horse side saddle and shots were fired--she handled the horse excellently and the incident barely made a blip in the parade. And of course, Princess Anne's attempted kidnapping and how she handled it. Not to mention the interviews she gave about that years later where she always spoke of it with such humor and calm. They embody that British "Keep Calm and Carry On" attitude which has been under attack with this recent need to overshare and talk about FEELINGS all the frickin time. It's hard to display regality in these modern times but I think the royals' attitude in those situations above are great displays of it.

I'm sure there are plenty more incidents such as those above that we don't even know about, but the ones above highlight the stark difference between the Sussexes' under speed limit yet somehow, allegedly, "near catastrophic car chase" vs actual attempts against the lives of some of Harry's family members.

 

[HRHHermione]

As other mod notes have already stated, all sources shared here must be from reliable news sources rather than Twitter, YouTube or similar. Additionally, discussion of other royals is off topic.

 

[Tatiana Maria]

They have been told to not use their HRHs when making money but they ae still HRHs for all other situations

I do not understand why you repeatedly state that the couple only gave up the use of their HRHs for making money and can continue to use their HRHs in other situations. The announcement of the family agreement on January 18, 2020 simply stated that "The Sussexes will not use their HRH titles". My understanding of that phrase is that the couple agreed not to use their HRHs at any time, in any situation, money or not.

https://www.royal.uk/statement-her-majesty-queen-0

With The Queen’s blessing, the Sussexes will continue to maintain their private patronages and associations. While they can no longer formally represent The Queen, the Sussexes have made clear that everything they do will continue to uphold the values of Her Majesty.

The Sussexes will not use their HRH titles as they are no longer working members of the Royal Family.​

 

[iceflower]

Shared by a number of members today, the Duke of Sussex "has lost his bid for a second legal challenge against the Home Office over its refusal to let him pay for the protection of the Metropolitan Police when visiting Britain":


** cnn: Prince Harry loses legal bid to pay for police protection while in UK **


** bbc article: Prince Harry loses challenge to pay for police protection in UK **


** dm article: Prince Harry loses latest legal challenge against Home Office after it refused to let him pay for Met Police..**

 

[Ista]

The thread has been reopened. Members should review the rules on the first page of the thread to avoid having their posts deleted. Members are also reminded that following moderator instructions is required by forum rules.

 

[Lilyflo]

This is the stand-out phrase for me:

A barrister for the Metropolitan Police argued that it would be unreasonable to expose officers to danger because of "payment of a fee by a private individual".

I completely agree with this, even if Harry hadn't increased his attack risk by making stupid comments about killing people in Afghanistan.

 

[Granada]

I expect that Harry will lose his other legal case against The Government too. The one that is challenging the original decision by RAVEC to strip The Sussex's of their protection, the same that they enjoyed as "working Royals" in The UK. That one REALLY blindsided them.

Which they thought was locked in, even after a move to "North America", no less.
He really can't seem to move on from that decision either. Losing that VIP Protection, as an exalted person of note, lies at the crux, in my opinion, of many of his issues.

And continues to feed his bitterness when that was withdrawn. Its a prestige loss, and demotion in a man that greatly struggles already with self esteem problems too.

 

[Alison H]

This is definitely the right decision. The police are not there to be hired out to private individuals.

 

[Mbruno]

Could you please kindly explain what the first legal challenge is and how it differs from the second one which has just been rejected?

 

[Granada]

Mbruno, I believe (in a nutshell) that Harry has or had two cases involving protection services for Himself and his Family.

The one that just got tossed out, was the the " hired guns " one. In which Harry was seeking to HIRE for payment, the Armed Government Police Professionals for The Sussex's when visiting The UK. As it stands now, if he is visiting and traveling outside of Royal Protected Properties, his own "private security" is NOT briefed by The Metropolitan Police OR allowed to be armed.

The lawsuit still working thru The Courts, is Harry challenging the ORIGINAL RAVEC decision to discontinue RP Officers to guard the Sussex's 24-7.

Its all very confusing, I hope I got it right.
I believe this one is doomed to fail too.

 

[kalnel]

Could you please kindly explain what the first legal challenge is and how it differs from the second one which has just been rejected?

Back in 2020 when the Home Office denied him personal protection after he ceased to be a working royal, Harry challenged the decision by offering to pay for it.

When the Home Office rejected his offer to pay, Harry asked for a judicial review to overturn the Home Office's rejection. The court ruled against him by denying that review yesterday.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/05/23/prince-harry-police-protection-court/

Harry has a lot of lawsuits against the media that also sound so similar they're a bit confusing: https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/prince-harry-his-lawsuits-against-press-2023-05-01/

 

[FigTree]

The first was an appeal to review whether removing his protection was lawful.

That has gone to review.

The one he lost today was an appeal to review whether he could pay for state protection.

He lost the right to appeal that today.

 

[Alison H]

Yes, that's correct. The case which has just been thrown out was the one in which Harry was saying that wealthy individuals should be able to hire public police officers to act as their private security guards. The case still ongoing is the one in which Harry is challenging the Executive Committee for the Protection of Royalty and Public Figures (Ravec)'s decision to remove his access to 24/7 police protection.

 

[Granada]

Thinking or demanding that Harry and Meghan, and the children, who do not work or support The Crown or The UK, are deemed worthy of 24-7 British taxpayer provided Police Protection. And they don't even live in the UK. Or hardly visit.

 

[Royalist.in.NC]

Wondering how much private security the cost of all these lawsuits would buy….

 

[FigTree]

Wondering how much private security the cost of all these lawsuits would buy….

Well money is what it is all about. That and control.

Protection is amazingly expensive. He'd rather not pay. Either would I.