The Duke and Duchess of Sussex to Step Back as Senior Royals: January 2020

[Alison H]

Originally Posted by Florestane

Also, personally, I don't think it's fair to make this an "evil Meghan leading Harry astray" issue as some seem to be doing. I also disagree with the "evil Queen and Royal Family" doing nothing to help them.

I also completely disagree with the idea that the Royal Family have done nothing to help them … and I agree that it's unfair that Meghan is getting all the blame. This has happened throughout history - Anne Boleyn, Henrietta Maria, Marie Antoinette, the Tsarina Alexandra, Wallis Simpson and many others have all got the blame, rather than their royal husbands/future husbands. I'm not a fan of Meghan, but Harry is a grown man who is responsible for his own actions.

[RoyalNight]

Just to add to my previous comment.

IMHO I don't think that Meghan and Harry have ever gave a chance living in UK. From the begining of their relationship they were constantly in transition period. Moving in together, getting married, being pregnant, renovating and moving into new home, getting used to life with a baby. They've just starter 'a proper' life together. They should have wait to see how their normal and everyday life would feel.

[Betsypaige]

Originally Posted by Elenath

And perhaps the anger is understandable. Everyone seems to think Meghan is the driving force behind all of this, but Harry gave up a career he loved to do something he doesn't. At least not really. And only to be sidetracked so soon. If might feel that if the same thing that happened to the Wessexes will happen to them (as in no one paying attention) his sacrifice will have been for nothing. He still can't make a difference in anyone's lives, which is perhaps what made him giving up his career worthwhile.

If that’s his thinking, he should think again. Everyone in the family has made sacrifices - the Queen’s father paid the heaviest price, but she herself also. Then there’s Charles, his siblings (forget Andrew for now) and other Royals, past and present; It’s not like Harry has been asked to carry this lonesome burden. If this is his thinking, he just sounds like a child to me. No one is sidetracking him - but yes, there are heirs and heirs to be and he’s not one of them. It doesn’t mean he’s not loved or valued as much as his brother - or anyone else. As to making a difference in people’s lives, that’s rubbish - of course he can; what does he think his family - past and present - has been doing? Does Harry think that his father, uncles/aunts, etc... work has been useless because most of them aren’t heirs to the throne? If so, he needs to get his royal head out of his behind.

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by RoyalNight

Were Sussexes mentioned in the Christmas Broadcast? If not it might hurt they feelings. They know their place, but it's still nice to be recognized, especially if you pit worki in, and it's a family firm. Also, I can see them hurt by the lack of Archie's photo. His birth was surely a highlight of the year. Was he even mentioned in the speech?
I know Sussexes are down the succession line, but they were supposed to be front-line royal represantives, at least till Cambridge kids are old enough. And IMO in popularity and recognizability (is that a word?) H&M are equal to W&K.

If I recall it correctly, Archie’s birth was mentioned in the Christmas broadcast, which even included a clip of the Queen and the DoE meeting the newborn baby and his parents at Windsor.

[RoyalNight]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

If I recall it correctly, Archie’s birth was mentioned in the Christmas broadcast, which even included a clip of the Queen and the DoE meeting the newborn baby and his parents at Windsor.

Thank you. Now I don't see a reason for getting upset about heirs' photo.

[Denville]

There was no reason for him to get upset. He knows that the "direct line" is often emphasised in this way.. and he's a second son.

[Kataryn]

Originally Posted by Muhler

One of the cardinal points in the British press seems to be "financial independent."

I really have a problem with the things that are reported right now - apart from their "intent" to step down and what is written on their webpage, I have yet to hear anything from the "mouth". And I don't trust the media at all.


Plus: we are all believing that man is born free and has the right of choice how to lead his life. But where is Harry's choice? He has the right to step down as a Royal, try to finance his life independantly and live where he wants to. Or not?

And if he does it is the right of his father and his grandmother to let him keep the titles he was born with or which he did acquire in his life. And pay him an apanage from the family money. But he has to accept as well if the souverain takes his titles and if his grandmother and his father keep him from the family money apart from his part of the inheritance after both his grandmother's and father's death. That's their decision and has nothing to do with him.

But it's theirs to negociate and fix in some sort of contract. That's what they do at the moment - with the added presence of the governments of the states Harry could chose to live, as he only has the right to stay in the UK without limits.

All other people have IMHO nothing to add but their own opinion.

So I am sitting here and wait for more info from the source. And if there is none, I'll accept that, for it is Harrys life, not mine.

The whole media spectacle we see at the moment, all those people offering opinions and their own biased "information" do not help anyone but muddy the waters.

Harry is a British citizen - he is free to live his life the way he can afford it and he can already afford to live in comfort without doing anything or just working for charities. I am sure he has a contract about his Cottage in Windsor Home Park, so if it is his according to the basic rules, he can live there. Or somewhere else where they allow a Briton and husband of an US citizen to live.

So all is settled or in the process of being settled. That's enough for me.
And if Meghan wants to stay with Archie in Canada till Harry has settled his affairs or flew over to fetch the boy back to the Uk means nothing to me because I should not have an opinion about things I know nothing about. For I don't know Meghan and Harry.
But: as a trained journalist I can say that I am deeply ashamed to see how other journalists use their craft to write influencing pieces and lies about them for people who don't know them either, but believe they get to know them through reading.

[yvr girl]

Originally Posted by Denville

There was no reason for him to get upset. He knows that the "direct line" is often emphasised in this way.. and he's a second son.

Exactly. It's worth noting that only William's first child was included as well. Not to mention only the Queen's first child.

[Blog Real]

Do you think Harry will support his brother when he becomes king? Will he continue to support the Queen when necessary?

[Denville]

Originally Posted by Alison H

I also completely disagree with the idea that the Royal Family have done nothing to help them … and I agree that it's unfair that Meghan is getting all the blame. This has happened throughout history - Anne Boleyn, Henrietta Maria, Marie Antoinette, the Tsarina Alexandra, Wallis Simpson and many others have all got the blame, rather than their royal husbands/future husbands. I'm not a fan of Meghan, but Harry is a grown man who is responsible for his own actions.

He is but I think that all this stuff about making their own money comes for Meghan. He may have dreamed of walking away but I think she has supplied the idea (as an American used to earning her own money and planning her own career) that they can "make their own money" and do not have to depend on handouts from the RF. SO Harry might have opted for "quiet retirement" from royal life and a quiet life In the UK or elsewhere on what money he has, but I think seh's the one who has said "but we don't have to do that, we can make our own income.. by using our Brand or lecture tours or whatever.."

[evolvingdoors]

Originally Posted by Lumutqueen

I said this in my first full comment. This escapism isn’t new, Henry hasn’t ever wanted to be a royal that’s quite clear. The issue for me is the way it’s been handled and the abruptness of it. Meghan and Henry could have done such wonderful things as senior royals, for causes close to their heart. I personally don’t feel they had to choose this route to do what they wanted.




Hit the nail on the head. This situation wasn’t given a chance. I think that’s where Meghan comes in, whilst we’ve always known Henry didn’t like his role he was solid with his brother and sister in law. Comments from a couple of years ago were how Henry was looking forward to living next to his siblings. I personally believe Meghan’s gone, well it’s not working for me, now you have to choose.




Couldn’t agree more! It’s so clear, not only from Charles being the head of the family but he’s also firstly Henry’s father.

In regards to the bolded: the things is, when Harry spoke about life outside the royal cage it was about going and living in Africa, that was where he felt most at peace and a sense of belonging; never did that life included selling his status, playing the life of the rich and famous with cameras and Instagram influencer life style blog existence of high fashion and expensive drinks and hobnobbing with famous people who would never give you the time of day of you didn’t have an HRH before your name- that’s Meghan idea of living but that’s the life style he dislikes and which causes him so much stress and agony (by his own admission!

This life he will now have, is imo not gonna be much different to his old one, and a far cry from the Africa life he always had.

Obviously, as can be read between the lines in Harry saying in the documentary that Cape Town was not the right place for them (translation: not the place my wife wants to live, read above why). and now by their action; For Meghan Africa is a place to do basic chick feel good photo op to post on Instagram (as she did prior to Harry) so you can claim “i’m A woke humanitarian”

I have find it very telling about a person personality and honest life desires which Disney movie is their favorite. Harry’s is The Lion King (must admit mine too), while hers is The little Mermaid.

[Betsypaige]

Good.

Charles has made it clear that he will not be writing his son a blank cheque as he and his wife embark on a new life after relinquishing their roles as senior members of the royal family.

The warning came as doubts were raised about how the couple intend to become “financially independent” as they carve themselves a “progressive new role”, splitting their time between Britain and North America.

While he is unlikely to leave them without a penny, Charles has made it clear that any agreement over money depends on the details of their future role and will not be settled until that has been decided. Negotiations between Harry and his father have been going on since Christmas, which the couple spent with Archie and Doria Ragland, Meghan’s mother, on Vancouver Island.

So, yeah, they have completely rejected Harry’s family ....

When Harry tried to have a meeting with the Queen on his return, to keep her up to date with what was happening, she initially agreed but the meeting was blocked by courtiers. Harry, 35, was said to be angry and upset at the rebuff. It is thought that palace aides feared that he would use it to recruit the Queen, 93, to his cause and then use that as a negotiating tactic with his father.

The courtiers have significant power...wow.

The ITV News at Ten anchor Tom Bradby, who knows Harry well and interviewed him in Africa, said that the couple made their decision because they were not part of Charles’s plans for a slimmed-down monarchy. Bradby said: “The couple’s view was they came back and wanted to talk to the family about their plans. It had been made clear to them in their absence there was going to be a slimmed-down monarchy and they weren’t really a part of it.”

This just reflects SO poorly on Harry. He doesn’t really want to be a Royal, but then he stamps his feet and whines when it turns out he may get his wish (in terms of being asked to do less) ? He and Meghan did talk to the family, and the family wanted to help them come up with a viable solution, but they just got impatient and acted rashly to say the least.



https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/c...cash-k3b58zq6l

[Fem]

Originally Posted by Kataryn

Plus: we are all believing that man is born free and has the right of choice how to lead his life. But where is Harry's choice? He has the right to step down as a Royal, try to finance his life independantly and live where he wants to. Or not?

And if he does it is the right of his father and his grandmother to let him keep the titles he was born with or which he did acquire in his life. And pay him an apanage from the family money. But he has to accept as well if the souverain takes his titles and if his grandmother and his father keep him from the family money apart from his part of the inheritance after both his grandmother's and father's death. That's their decision and has nothing to do with him.

Oh, Harry and Meghan have a choice. No one here would bat an eye at "We're unhappy, we want to live as private citizens and not be senior royals" - their life is not half as glamorous as it looks like, the press is vile, everyone would understand. The problem people see here is that being royal half the time, representing your country and HMQ and being a celebrity that gets paid for commercial stuff the other half is not something that's really possible.

Originally Posted by Kataryn

But it's theirs to negociate and fix in some sort of contract. That's what they do at the moment - with the added presence of the governments of the states Harry could chose to live, as he only has the right to stay in the UK without limits.

Again, you're right - and I think I speak for more people than myself that we'd all be much happier if they concluded the negotations in a calm and reasonable manner, working out the solution and then presenting it to the public, without using the public and the press to put pressure on HMQ, Prince Charles and Prince William to work faster.

Originally Posted by Kataryn

Harry is a British citizen - he is free to live his life the way he can afford it and he can already afford to live in comfort without doing anything or just working for charities. I am sure he has a contract about his Cottage in Windsor Home Park, so if it is his according to the basic rules, he can live there. Or somewhere else where they allow a Briton and husband of an US citizen to live.

I see this argument in so many places - that Meghan and Harry have the money, so they can do whatever they choose - and I don't think people understand what kind of money you have to have to support a lifestyle like theirs. Solely security costs would blow through their fortunes in no time. Not to mention housing. As far as Frogmore Cottage goes (which is not a cottage, more like a huge house), unless the Duke and Duchess of Sussex are working royals, they'd have to pay commercial rent for that property. It's not his, it couldn't have been given to him, because the Queen doesn't own Frogmore Estate - it's part of Crown Estate, so only a lease is available. The non-working royals, like Pricess Eugenie, have to pay their rent - in her case, I think it was reported her father was paying for her cottage in Kensington Palace.

[Princess B]

I’ve been reading and some posters believe Meghan was vilified by the press.
While I have no doubt that she was often written about not so flatteringly, it wasn’t bad initially. But when she started doing things her way is when the press went ballistic.
Meghan isn’t the first royal to be vilified by the press. The duchess of Cambridge was t spared either. In fact I’d say she had it worse. Are we forgetting ‘waity katey’ or the news on how Carole pushed Kate to follow William or how the Middletons we’re cashing in on their royal relations.
It’s part of the deal when you date/marry a royal, and once you settle in, it stops. We don’t see negative press for Catherine anymore.

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by Kataryn

I really have a problem with the things that are reported right now - apart from their "intent" to step down and what is written on their webpage, I have yet to hear anything from the "mouth". And I don't trust the media at all.


Plus: we are all believing that man is born free and has the right of choice how to lead his life. But where is Harry's choice? He has the right to step down as a Royal, try to finance his life independantly and live where he wants to. Or not?

And if he does it is the right of his father and his grandmother to let him keep the titles he was born with or which he did acquire in his life. And pay him an apanage from the family money. But he has to accept as well if the souverain takes his titles and if his grandmother and his father keep him from the family money apart from his part of the inheritance after both his grandmother's and father's death. That's their decision and has nothing to do with him.

But it's theirs to negociate and fix in some sort of contract. That's what they do at the moment - with the added presence of the governments of the states Harry could chose to live, as he only has the right to stay in the UK without limits.

All other people have IMHO nothing to add but their own opinion.

So I am sitting here and wait for more info from the source. And if there is none, I'll accept that, for it is Harrys life, not mine.

The whole media spectacle we see at the moment, all those people offering opinions and their own biased "information" do not help anyone but muddy the waters.

Harry is a British citizen - he is free to live his life the way he can afford it and he can already afford to live in comfort without doing anything or just working for charities. I am sure he has a contract about his Cottage in Windsor Home Park, so if it is his according to the basic rules, he can live there. Or somewhere else where they allow a Briton and husband of an US citizen to live.

So all is settled or in the process of being settled. That's enough for me.
And if Meghan wants to stay with Archie in Canada till Harry has settled his affairs or flew over to fetch the boy back to the Uk means nothing to me because I should not have an opinion about things I know nothing about. For I don't know Meghan and Harry.
But: as a trained journalist I can say that I am deeply ashamed to see how other journalists use their craft to write influencing pieces and lies about them for people who don't know them either, but believe they get to know them through reading.

It has been pointed out several times on this thread that the problem is not Harry and Meghan wanting out, but rather wanting “ half in, half out” and dictating terms the way they did as if their wish list had already been agreed to. Many posters also have an issue with H&M using the royal label to develop their brand commercially and with the possible negative effects on the political neutrality of the Crown if they are let loose as free agents in their “new progressive role within the institution “ .

I think the couple’s statement speaks for itself and that their breach of or contempt for the RF’s hierarchy was evident. This is not just tabloid gossip and I think the reporting from the British press, including the BBC, has been accurate and fair.

[helenbeee]

I think youve missed the point I dont think they want to be royals but they cant get entirely away from it because it is what Harry was born into its his family its a part of Archie as well and they cant just get rid of it so from what Ive read into the situation is that they dont want to do it fulltime they want control over their lives that is perfectly acceptable and I think having security provided and paid for is also acceptable because when you read some of the comments from the nut jobs you can imagine how bad it could get and obvious the need for protection is because they are part of the BRF.

[moby]

I think they very much have control over their lives but what they really want and will never have is control over the media and public opinion... When they fully accept that they can't control that, they will be much, much happier.

[suztav]

It's not the fact that at some point the monarchy needs to be slimmed down and "other" heirs should earn their own income (a la The Netherlands). It's not the fact that, perhaps, she is going through some type of post-partnum depression. It's not the fact that, she misses calling the shots in her life. It's not the fact that she was old enough to understand that marrying a royal would be a seismic shift in her life. It's not the fact that she may have faced racism and anti-Americanism. It's not the fact that life in the royal fishbowl is more intense than life in the Hollywood fishbow.

Bottom line -- it's the premeditated method in which they announced this without allowing the Queen to know before they informed the designers of their website. That's the issue. Total disrespect!

[Denville]

Originally Posted by evolvingdoors

In regards to the bolded: the things is, when Harry spoke about life outside the royal cage it was about going and living in Africa, that was where he felt most at peace and a sense of belonging; never did that life included selling his status, playing the life of the rich and famous with cameras and Instagram influencer life style blog existence of high fashion and expensive drinks and hobnobbing with famous people who would never give you the time of day of you didn’t have an HRH before your name- that’s Meghan idea of living but that’s the life style he dislikes and which causes him so much stress and agony (by his own admission!

T have find it very telling about a person personality and honest life desires which Disney movie is their favorite. Harry’s is The Lion King (must admit mine too), while hers is The little Mermaid.

Probably Harry's dream of life in Africa wasn't all that realistic.. (livng is different to visiting).. but yes it IS different to the life that seems to be what they are now aiming at. Living in Canada/ N America, making money, mixing with the Rich and Famous Popping back to England to do royal dtuties.. And I think you're right that this is Meg's dream, not Harry's..and is even less likely to go well than if Harry walked away and went to Africa. Because He is not going to really want the cameras and the schmoozing.. (at least he has given the impression he finds the camera following him lifestyle stressful). and he and Meg may end up pulling against each other.

[wyevale]

I think deep down they knew.

Of COURSE 'they knew'.. they've been holed up abroad plotting this for SEVEN weeks..[and on her part, FAR LONGER}

I expect them to end up as 'ex-Royals', and soon - Still Duke & Duchess, but not Royal Highnesses, and not in receipt of Duchy of Cornwall monies.. in fact any BRF monies, beyond what Harry inherited from his mother & QEQM -
Their ability to monestise their link to the Crown will be severely constricted by the Queen's and UK Govt lawyers..

As for what remains of their personal relationship with his family, I imagine they are 'shot to pieces', and since the Duchess likes things that way, I can't see and 'bridges being built'.

They can live where they chose, and 'good riddance'..