The Duke & Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 5: June-July 2021

[TLLK]

Given the timing of the killings, don't you think that the Diana connection was known by the killers and that they are counting on Harry to go bonkers, which draws attention to their cause?

Frankly I don't believe that the Diana connection had any bearing on the attack. IMO Prince Harry made an appropriately dignified statement acknowledging the gravity of the situation

 

[Osipi]

Say what you will about Harry's behavior since he rode into the California sunset and the land of Oprah but one thing doesn't change. Harry's deep rooted passion and concern for those that are affected by the causes that he has taken on for himself. Not the ones representing the monarchy and the Queen but the ones he, himself, has devoted his time and energies to. HALO is one of those. He has stepped into his mother's shoes to continue to support the work that HALO does and that should never be looked down on.

I really would have been very surprised and even disappointed if Harry *didn't* speak out on this atrocity. We all should be aghast and condemn this kind of attack on people trying to do something good in this world. As far as a "conspiracy theory" that it was done to "get at" Harry, that is really elevating Harry to a place where he doesn't belong. He may be controversial at this time but to make Harry a central figure in a plot that took lives of people working for HALO, is just beyond the pale for me.

 

[muriel]

Harry’s message about this terrible massacre is heartfelt.

It is the right message for Harry to deliver after the terrible and completely unnecessary deaths.

I do not say this lightly, however, IMO, how heartfelt the message really is, is not something any of us can comment on. I would not normally make a comment like this, but after Harry's recent comments about his visit to Nepal, to me, it really is difficult to ascertain what is and what isn't heartfelt from him.

 

[Curryong]

Harry became a Patron of Halo Trust in 2013 following his mother Diana, and if he didn’t wish to acknowledge these deaths, as a private citizen then IMO he wouldn’t have done so. In my view he wished to comment on this terrible tragedy and draw attention to it internationally. Which he did in his very moving statement.

 

[muriel]

Harry became a Patron of Halo Trust in 2013 following his mother Diana, and if he didn’t wish to acknowledge these deaths, as a private citizen then IMO he wouldn’t have done so. In my view he wished to comment on this terrible tragedy and draw attention to it internationally. Which he did in his very moving statement.

Indeed. However, his recent comments in relation to the Nepal trip in 2016(?) were a good example, in his own very words, of the duplicity at play.

 

[Curryong]

We will have to agree to disagree on Harry’s statement then. You choose to regard it as insincere and possibly duplicitous, I choose to believe the statement is sincere and heartfelt. To each his and her own.

 

[Heavs]

We will have to agree to disagree on Harry’s statement then. You choose to regard it as insincere and possibly duplicitous, I choose to believe the statement is sincere and heartfelt. To each his and her own.

Harry probably is horrified over the HALO Trust murders. And I hope that statement is really from the heart.

However Muriel brings up an interesting point which is entirely of Harry's own making.

In 2016 he seemed truly heartfelt in his desire to be in Nepal to the point of staying on a few extra days to help. He recorded a message which talked about it in September 2020 where again he seemed sincere.

Not even a month ago complained about having to go to Nepal to honour the Gurkhas who had protected him in Afghanistan and people who had lost everything in an earthquake. He came across as completely lacking in any compassion for those that risked their lives for him and others who had never had as much as him and had literally had their lives destroyed.

No mention of "I was burned out but it was still good to help people".

So was he lying then or was he lying a few weeks ago?

He himself has called into question his own sincerity as a humanitarian, which wasn't something I thought we were ever going to see. I'm not sure he meant to do that in his rush to tear down everything in his old life but he mentioned it several times in different interviews when in the past he seemed at least game to turn up and meet people. It's all very sad actually.

Harry has never attacked his grandmother in words or deeds. I’ve also seen Harry in real life several times and he was affable, cheerful, caring towards those he met. Halo was taken over from his mother Diana who also devoted many years of her short adult life to charity work and did it with warmth and love.

Yes he did. Every time they attacked the "institution" they attacked her. When they stormed out with a list of public demands they attack her in deed. When they tried to separate her from "The Firm" and pretend she's just an old dear who constantly gets and follows terrible advice they attacked her. There were lots of articles in the last few days that say this has been a real frustration for her with Harry and Meghan.

You can't tear down a corporation as toxic one day, including all the senior execs and make zoom waffles with the CEO the next.

 

[Denville]

Harry probably is horrified over the HALO Trust murders. And I hope that statement is really from the heart.

However Muriel brings up an interesting point which is entirely of Harry's own making.

In 2016 he seemed truly heartfelt in his desire to be in Nepal to the point of staying on a few extra days to help. He recorded a message which talked about it in September 2020 where again he seemed sincere.

Not even a month ago complained about having to go to Nepal to honour the Gurkhas who had protected him in Afghanistan and people who had lost everything in an earthquake. He came across as completely lacking in any compassion for those that risked their lives for him and others who had never had as much as him and had literally had their lives destroyed.

No mention of "I was burned out but it was still good to help people".

So was he lying then or was he lying a few weeks ago?

He himself has called into question his own sincerity as a humanitarian, which wasn't something I thought we were ever going to see. I'm not sure he meant to do that in his rush to tear down everything in his old life but he mentioned it several times in different interviews when in the past he seemed at least game to turn up and meet people. It's all very sad actually.



Yes he did. Every time they attacked the "institution" they attacked her. When they stormed out with a list of public demands they attack her in deed. When they tried to separate her from "The Firm" and pretend she's just an old dear who constantly gets and follows terrible advice they attacked her. There were lots of articles in the last few days that say this has been a real frustration for her with Harry and Meghan.

You can't tear down a corporation as toxic one day, including all the senior execs and make zoom waffles with the CEO the next.

True, he has included his grandmothter in the "bad parenting" of the RF...
WRT his sincerity, I agree that I HAD thought that whatever his faults, he had a sincere desire to help those who were less fortunate. But HE chose to rip that apart and say that he didn't like royal work at all, that he was pretty much forced into it and worked so hard (really?) and that he didn't like meeting people who were less fortunate. Which basically means that the "Harry who liked meeting people and wanted to do good" was presumably an illusion and he was acting all the time and secretly hating it all.. and envying those who were "free" even if they were desperately poor....
It was a damning statement, as I think that even people who thought he was not very bright or a bit bullish, or just didn't like him, still would have said that he seemed sincerely caring towards people.... and now form his own lips, he has said that he wasn't.

 

[Leopoldine]

True, he has included his grandmothter in the "bad parenting" of the RF...
WRT his sincerity, I agree that I HAD thought that whatever his faults, he had a sincere desire to help those who were less fortunate. But HE chose to rip that apart and say that he didn't like royal work at all, that he was pretty much forced into it and worked so hard (really?) and that he didn't like meeting people who were less fortunate. Which basically means that the "Harry who liked meeting people and wanted to do good" was presumably an illusion and he was acting all the time and secretly hating it all.. and envying those who were "free" even if they were desperately poor....
It was a damning statement, as I think that even people who thought he was not very bright or a bit bullish, or just didn't like him, still would have said that he seemed sincerely caring towards people.... and now form his own lips, he has said that he wasn't.

Excellent observation.

 

[Denville]

Excellent observation.

I really do wonder what he is thinking now during his occasional forays into doing something charitable like delivering food parcels. Is this something he has to do to make him and Meghan look relevant and helpful? Does he hate doing it? Or does he like it better because its in America? Far as I can see he' has done the odd day or 2, and its usually appeared on the web somewhere... like his appearance in a military cemetery in November.

 

[muriel]

I really do wonder what he is thinking now during his occasional forays into doing something charitable like delivering food parcels. Is this something he has to do to make him and Meghan look relevant and helpful? Does he hate doing it? Or does he like it better because its in America? Far as I can see he' has done the odd day or 2, and its usually appeared on the web somewhere... like his appearance in a military cemetery in November.

Very fair points. Given Harry's recent pronouncements, it is not difficult to start to question the motives behind his appearances at the LA cemetery (complete with photographer), or volunteering and delivering food parcels.

 

[Denville]

Very fair points. Given Harry's recent pronouncements, it is not difficult to start to question the motives behind his appearances at the LA cemetery (complete with photographer), or volunteering and delivering food parcels.

Hm, at first I thought that although IM sure they publicised the appearances at a charity centre and a school and so on, there was something genuine in doing them... at least on H's part. He seems to love kids and get on well with them.. and I would have thought that on leaving the RF, he would have been delighted to say "Im going to give up the formal stuff and get into some hands on charity work with kids or the like"... but instead most of his time seems to be dedicated to talking to Netflix, and to going on about his mental health and his problems with the RF... and very little seems to be hands on charity work. And after what he siad a few weeks ago, you wonder is that because he really doesn't like doing it that much and only does it for show.

 

[UglyAmerican]

All these leaks-that-aren't-really-leaks make me wonder if they're paying for things by way of free publicity rather than with money, or even if they've got some kind of referral/affiliate deal worked out with the florist, the birthing center, etc. Though that still doesn't explain why they won't ever put their own names on those releases.

EDIT: The British doctor name-dropped in the article has a website selling all kinds of classes and treatments focusing on their brand of "birth experience." How utterly unsurprising.

 

[victor1319]

He himself has called into question his own sincerity as a humanitarian

Oh c'mon!

One can get tired of every job. And this was his job: Being a "charity royal". He did not chose to become one - he had to do it... until he did quit. And what we know now is, that it was not always his calling.

And I hope I will not destroy any illusions you have, but the Cambridges too have good and bad days... and sometimes their smiling and their shown interest in the fate of their future subjects might be not as sincere as it seems...

 

[Heavs]

The cemetery photoshoot was 100% about them and pretending to be working royals but just in LA. IF they had wanted it to be about honouring Remembrance Sunday they could have released a photo of the wreath having been laid at the Guard's Chapel by an old colleague or something.

As for various other volunteering? Who knows what's really in their hearts but it certainly muddies the waters when you realise the photos that are released are copyrighted by DDOS.

 

[UglyAmerican]

Oh c'mon!

One can get tired of every job. And this was his job: Being a "charity royal". He did not chose to become one - he had to do it... until he did quit. And what we know now is, that it was not always his calling.

And I hope I will not destroy any illusions you have, but the Cambridges too have good and bad days... and sometimes their smiling and their shown interest in the fate of their future subjects might be not as sincere as it seems...

I imagine the Cambridges have days where they feel exactly the way Harry now says he felt about the Nepal trip. But we don't hear about it, because they choose not to undermine their own work and their own sincerity by publicly voicing those sorts of complaints. That's a pretty big difference.

 

[Leopoldine]

I really do wonder what he is thinking now during his occasional forays into doing something charitable like delivering food parcels. Is this something he has to do to make him and Meghan look relevant and helpful? Does he hate doing it? Or does he like it better because its in America? Far as I can see he' has done the odd day or 2, and its usually appeared on the web somewhere... like his appearance in a military cemetery in November.

There's a saying popular with regular people. "Where ever you go, there you are."

 

[Denville]

I imagine the Cambridges have days where they feel exactly the way Harry now says he felt about the Nepal trip. But we don't hear about it, because they choose not to undermine their own work and their own sincerity by publicly voicing those sorts of complaints. That's a pretty big difference.

And if Harry didn't like the charity side of his royal job.. why do much the same thing in the US? All these talks about the RF and mental health are meant to be "helpful to others". So are the occasional pop ins to charities or the mention of donations that their foundation gives and their Zoom calls.

 

[Leopoldine]

The cemetery photoshoot was 100% about them and pretending to be working royals but just in LA. IF they had wanted it to be about honouring Remembrance Sunday they could have released a photo of the wreath having been laid at the Guard's Chapel by an old colleague or something.

The cemetery photo op was shameful. Especially the way, during their "solemn walk" over American military graves, Meghan poked her head out at a weird angle to make sure her whole face was in the shot.

 

[Heavs]

Oh c'mon!

One can get tired of every job. And this was his job: Being a "charity royal". He did not chose to become one - he had to do it... until he did quit. And what we know now is, that it was not always his calling.

And I hope I will not destroy any illusions you have, but the Cambridges too have good and bad days... and sometimes their smiling and their shown interest in the fate of their future subjects might be not as sincere as it seems...

Nope. When he choses to say "I didn't want to be there" "I was jealous of those people because they were "freer" even though they were poor" "They used me as a yes man and sent me to Nepal, boohoo" but forgetting to mention that it was for the Gurkhas and to help earthquake victims and he was chosen because he had a special connection to Nepal. When he complains they worked him so hard, too hard but he had 100 engagements that year which put him 11th in the family below his 90 something grandfather, grandmother, aunts, uncles and cousins. Yes I think that has utterly destroyed his image of humanitarian Harry.

I know royals don't want to be everywhere they're sent to. I have no illusions that they're delighted to always open community centres in Dunstable or make small talk with residents of care homes on a rainy Sunday afternoon but I expect them not to publicly complain about it because they don't work 9-5 and have a lot of perks in exchange.

He also had choices. He could have stayed in the army but chose to become a working royal. And had a lot more publicity than many of the others who have worked for decades without complaining

It was Harry's own pretty terrible words that has made everyone question him and his commitment to being a philanthropist via Archewell now. Harry wants to complain about everything BRF related these days but doesn't seem to realise it impacts his current ambitions which seem to be the same but commercial. Especially when he talks about trying to "monetise kindness".

 

[victor1319]

And if Harry didn't like the charity side of his royal job.. why do much the same thing in the US?

If you can do things, but don't have too - that is called freedom...

I think, one big part of the "Harry in Murica" story is, that Prince Harry wants to be everything to happen on his terms: The press, the charity work, his housing, his family.

And everytime somehing is not happen on his terms, he sues. This might seem a little bit over-confident and I personally think, it will fail, but this is how he rolls by now: Everything on his terms.

 

[Denville]

If you can do things, but don't have too - that is called freedom...

I think, one big part of the "Harry in Murica" story is, that Prince Harry wants to be everything to happen on his terms: The press, the charity work, his housing, his family.

And everytime somehing is not happen on his terms, he sues. This might seem a little bit over-confident and I personally think, it will fail, but this is how he rolls by now: Everything on his terms.

well yes but there's one thing he HAS to do, make a living. HE has a big financial commitment and he has to earn money. so things wont be "on his terms" completely. his bosses at Neflix may start asking "what work are you doing for us?"
And he may find that the America press isn't any kinder to him, in time, than the British press was, so how's he going to control that? and how does he expect people to take him seriously as a humanitarian when he himself said out loud that he didn't like the work, that he was forced into it.. that all the dancing and laughing and playing with kids and kissig people was all something he had to do which he really hated?

 

[Denville]

Nope. When he choses to say "I didn't want to be there" "I was jealous of those people because they were "freer" even though they were poor" "They used me as a yes man and sent me to Nepal, boohoo" but forgetting to mention that it was for the Gurkhas and to help earthquake victims and he was chosen because he had a special connection to Nepal. When he complains they worked him so hard, too hard but he had 100 engagements that year which put him 11th in the family below his 90 something grandfather, grandmother, aunts, uncles and cousins. Yes I think that has utterly destroyed his image of humanitarian Harry.

I know royals don't want to be everywhere they're sent to. I have no illusions that they're delighted to always open community centres in Dunstable or make small talk with residents of care homes on a rainy Sunday afternoon but I expect them not to publicly complain about it because they don't work 9-5 and have a lot of perks in exchange.


It was Harry's own pretty terrible words that has made everyone question him and his commitment to being a philanthropist via Archewell now. Harry wants to complain about everything BRF related these days but doesn't seem to realise it impacts his current ambitions which seem to be the same but commercial. Especially when he talks about trying to "monetise kindness".

He got publicity because he was young and Diana's son and not bad looking and seemed GENUINE. I had an uneasy feeling about him from back a few years ago, but I didn't question that he did honestly feel for people and wanted to do something to help....
But now I think "My uneasy feeling was right.. I was picking up that he didn't really want to do that work.."...
but all the same, when he married Meghan and started to complain about being depressed and worried and so on, i DID wonder "who is this person who is so odd and emotional? what has happened to Harry?"
So perhaps this wild change in H IS due to Meghan? Did she put it into his mind that he was being exploited and over worked by the RF? If he already felt unhappy iwht the work on some level, Meghan may have pushed him to complete and open disillusion with it.

 

[Alison H]

How many people actually do want to be at their jobs? But we all smile politely and pretend that we really are interested in our customer's accounts or grocery shopping or complaint about their electricity bill or whatever else it is that we're paid to do!


Regarding the horrific attack in Afghanistan, I'm sure everyone is aware of the many atrocities carried out by terrorists there, and the fact that the situation is worsening now that international troops have pulled out. I can't imagine that either Harry or Diana entered their minds for a moment. Whatever Harry's many faults, he's served in Afghanistan himself, and the issue of landmine clearance is particularly important to him because of Diana: I'm sure that his statement was completely sincere.

 

[Somebody]

All these leaks-that-aren't-really-leaks make me wonder if they're paying for things by way of free publicity rather than with money, or even if they've got some kind of referral/affiliate deal worked out with the florist, the birthing center, etc. Though that still doesn't explain why they won't ever put their own names on those releases.

EDIT: The British doctor name-dropped in the article has a website selling all kinds of classes and treatments focusing on their brand of "birth experience." How utterly unsurprising.

That's the one whose name we weren't allowed to know 2 years ago because of concerns for her personal well-being and safety? Seems fishy indeed.

 

[muriel]

That's the one whose name we weren't allowed to know 2 years ago because of concerns for her personal well-being and safety? Seems fishy indeed.

IMO, if there is one thing H&M are consistent in is their inconsistency!

 

[Denville]

How many people actually do want to be at their jobs? But we all smile politely and pretend that we really are interested in our customer's accounts or grocery shopping or complaint about their electricity bill or whatever else it is that we're paid to do!


.

Yes but there's a long way between "Im not crazy about my job" when you need a job to eat.. or even "I like my job some of the time but there are lots of days I am fed up with it.." and someone as privileged as Harry, who worked relatively little a few years ago, saying "I hated it all - I didn't like the people i had to be nice to because they were free and I wasn't." When you are very rich and privileged and they were usually very poor and in trouble. Im just amazed he came out with that. He really sounded so bad, he knew quite well that a certain amount of royal engagements are the price you pay for a pretty comfortable privileged life.. and he wasn't exactly working his socks off every day of the week... and he claims that he wanted to "serve".. what did he think the royal engagements were but service?

 

[muriel]

Fantastic cartoon today!

https://twitter.com/x/status/1403300474678358019

 

[Curryong]

That's the one whose name we weren't allowed to know 2 years ago because of concerns for her personal well-being and safety? Seems fishy indeed.

Dr Gowri Motha has practised as an obstetrician in London since 1981. That’s hardly being an unqualified charlatan. Nor does it seem particularly fishy IMO. She established a programme for pregnant women in 1986.

 

[Denville]

Dr Gowri Motha has practised as an obstetrician in London since 1981. That’s hardly being an unqualified charlatan. Nor does it seem particularly fishy IMO. She established a programme for pregnant women in 1986.

Nobody says she's a charlatan. Its odd that they seem to be releaseing her name now, in relation to Lili, when 2 years ago they wouldn't give any info about Archie or where he was born or who delivered him, on the grounds that it might endanger the staff..