The Queen: Would She Consider Abdication or Retirement?

[NGalitzine]

You are right Elizabeth is the one who created the walkabouts.

The first walk about was done by George VI and Queen Elizabeth in Ottawa in 1939. It was a spontaneous decision to leave the official party and go down into the crowds, especially to meet veterans on WWI.

 

[Roslyn]

I'm still not following your concern here.

My comments regarding the essentialness of the red boxes has nothing to do with the difficulty that lies in them. I simply think that they're an integral aspect of her role and that if she (or any other monarch) is unable to do them then it's time to look at a regency.

Bottom line: as long as she knows who she is and is able to comprehend the essential nature of the documents described to her by her advisors, and can sit in a chair, hold a stamp, and thump it down on a document, she's able to do all that a monarch has to do these days.

 

[Iluvbertie]

The red boxes are the essential part of her constitutional role so if she can't do them then there will be a regency - not at her instigation but at that of the government.

George V, like his grandmother really was only incapable of doing the boxes in the last week or so of life so no regency established.

David's walks in the people were highly controlled to people it was believed were appropriate for him to meet - not just random people in the crowd - my grandmother was one such 'chosen' as her father had been killed at Galllipoli and she had to help him plant a tree (he needed to be told where to stand, what to hold, how to plant the tree etc multiple times but she, aged 12 was only told once and had no trouble - her view was that he was 'extremely dim and needed men to hold his hand as he couldn't understand how to do even basic things' - a quote from her diary from the day. So why was she chosen and not the other kids whose fathers' had died at Gallipoli or elsewhere in the war - simply his parents had attended her parents wedding so she was deemed 'suitable' to meet him while the others were only allowed to watch from a distance. He also visited the local town where I grew up and only the local rich people were allowed to meet him while the working class were lined up in the street to wave 'enthusiastically' - on orders to the mayor's office from the office of the Prince of Wales.

 

[royal-blue]

Pardon my ignorance, but what actually are the Red Boxes? I've read about them for years on here but not sure what they actually are.

 

[BritishRoyalist]

Pardon my ignorance, but what actually are the Red Boxes? I've read about them for years on here but not sure what they actually are.

They contain Government Documents, Papers, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_box_(government)

Royal red boxes:

Other red boxes of note are the ones delivered to the British Sovereign every day (except Christmas Day and Easter Day) by government departments, via the Page of the Presence. These boxes contain Cabinet and Foreign and Commonwealth Office documents, most of which the monarch must sign and give Royal Assent to, before they can become law (an essential part of the role of a constitutional monarch).

 

[padams2359]

The papers from the government to QE2, as with most previous English monarchs come daily to the Queen for her signature. Everyday except Christmas, and most of her birthdays. No matter where she is in the world.

 

[Ish]

The papers from the government to QE2, as with most previous English monarchs come daily to the Queen for her signature. Everyday except Christmas, and most of her birthdays. No matter where she is in the world.

Actually, she receives the red boxes every day except Christmas and Easter. Occasionally, but not always, she'll be given a break for her birthday.

 

[Princess B]

With the abdication of Queen Beatrix and now the King of the Belgians, is it time for Queen Elizabeth to announce her abdication?

Clearly she's done her job well and served the UK very well. But she's well into her 80's and her health is beginning to deteriorate.

She was hospitalised twice recently an that points to the fact that she will have to slow down soon.

Princess Alexandra has cancelled all engagements, another of her cousins (can't recollect if it was the Duke of Kent or Gloucester) suffered a stroke, Prince Philip has just been released from hospital. All these people are about the Queens age and are having to cut down on engagements.

I think it's only fair that the queen steps down and let's Charles take over. He has had a long time to prepare and it would be sad to see him as a king in waiting when the older generation should actually sit back and enjoy the last few years of their life.

Of course I'm aware that for her this is a duty for life. But it's about time she really have a normal life.

 

[Lumutqueen]

I was just going to come and post that another abdication occurs and this thread will start up again.

She was hospitalised twice recently an that points to the fact that she will have to slow down soon.

Princess Alexandra has cancelled all engagements, another of her cousins (can't recollect if it was the Duke of Kent or Gloucester) suffered a stroke, Prince Philip has just been released from hospital. All these people are about the Queens age and are having to cut down on engagements.

She was hospitalised once, for the first time in 10 years (which was for a knee operation at the time) and her hospitalisation was a precaution for stomach illness. HM went in on March 3rd and came out 2 days later. Her cousins have been hospitalised and have cutback on engagements (DOK not so much) because they have been very very sick. Same goes for Prince Philip. Same cannot be said for the seemingly perfectly healthy Queen.

Of course I'm aware that for her this is a duty for life. But it's about time she really have a normal life.

I'm sorry but how do you go from being The Queen to have a "normal life". The assumption of normality in this scenario is amusing.

The Queen will never abdicate, end of story.

 

[cepe]

With the abdication of Queen Beatrix and now the King of the Belgians, is it time for Queen Elizabeth to announce her abdication?

Clearly she's done her job well and served the UK very well. But she's well into her 80's and her health is beginning to deteriorate.

She was hospitalised twice recently an that points to the fact that she will have to slow down soon.

Princess Alexandra has cancelled all engagements, another of her cousins (can't recollect if it was the Duke of Kent or Gloucester) suffered a stroke, Prince Philip has just been released from hospital. All these people are about the Queens age and are having to cut down on engagements.

I think it's only fair that the queen steps down and let's Charles take over. He has had a long time to prepare and it would be sad to see him as a king in waiting when the older generation should actually sit back and enjoy the last few years of their life.

Of course I'm aware that for her this is a duty for life. But it's about time she really have a normal life.

She is living what she believes is her normal life.

In answer to your initial question - no, she will not abdicate and no one in the BRF, government, or the public expects her to.

 

[BritishRoyalist]

With the abdication of Queen Beatrix and now the King of the Belgians, is it time for Queen Elizabeth to announce her abdication?

Clearly she's done her job well and served the UK very well. But she's well into her 80's and her health is beginning to deteriorate.

She was hospitalised twice recently an that points to the fact that she will have to slow down soon.

Princess Alexandra has cancelled all engagements, another of her cousins (can't recollect if it was the Duke of Kent or Gloucester) suffered a stroke, Prince Philip has just been released from hospital. All these people are about the Queens age and are having to cut down on engagements.

I think it's only fair that the queen steps down and let's Charles take over. He has had a long time to prepare and it would be sad to see him as a king in waiting when the older generation should actually sit back and enjoy the last few years of their life.

Of course I'm aware that for her this is a duty for life. But it's about time she really have a normal life.

We have already been through this, The Queen will never abdicate, and no ones expect her too. It is not the British Way unless forced by parliaments fir some reasons like being corrupt. Queen Elizabeth Grew up with a sense of duty and service and to never let her subjects down and never to abandoned her duties like her uncle David. She is still in good health and can still do her job so why should she abdicate? She made a life promise at age 21 to do her duties and be devoted to the service of her subject whether her Life was Short or Long. She renewed that promise last year. And everybody once they get to this age have to make hospital visits for different things and it normal. Even Queen Victoria had health issues in her last years on the throne and it never stop her from doing her jib and duties and serving her subjects. None of Queen Elizabeth recent hospital visits have been really serious (to the point that there should be a cause for concerns). If the Queen wanted to abdicate she would have by now and mo one can force her too except for Parliaments if she became corrupt or something like that but she not.

The closet there will ever be to a abdication fir Elizabeth is a Regency and that us a ling shot and inly will happen if for example The Queen begins to suffer from Dementia or other similar disease that prevent her from doing her job and Prince Charles would have to step in and act ad Regent.

The difference is her cousins and Philip are sick and not in good health The Queen is not sick. There a difference

 

[NGalitzine]

I knew this thread would reappear. It was as predictable as the sun rising in the east.

 

[Dman]

Don't think Elizabeth II would abdicate but-IF- she's unable to do the job as Monarch, Charles will go on to do it as Prince Regent.

I just hope that if something like that happened, the people of the United Kingdom & Commonwealth and the media would respect The Queen's situation and accept the reality.

 

[Ish]

She was hospitalised twice recently an that points to the fact that she will have to slow down soon.

Princess Alexandra has cancelled all engagements, another of her cousins (can't recollect if it was the Duke of Kent or Gloucester) suffered a stroke, Prince Philip has just been released from hospital. All these people are about the Queens age and are having to cut down on engagements.

Wow, two things.

One: HM has been slowing down and reducing her engagements for awhile, because she cannot maintain the same amount of stamina that she once had when she was younger. That said, HM has never had any serious health problems, and she seems to enjoy continuing to do engagements given as she's the one who choses to do them.

Two: HM is not about the same age as Princess Alexandra or the Duke of Kent. Or, for that matter, her other paternal cousins. The Duke of Kent is the closest in age, and yet he's still 9 years younger than her. We've seen the Kents and Gloucesters reduce their engagements for a number of reasons: one, in the case of Alexandra and the DoK they have had some serious health problems, and two, they're minor royals who are never going to inherit the throne, and who there is very little public demand from.

I think it's only fair that the queen steps down and let's Charles take over. He has had a long time to prepare and it would be sad to see him as a king in waiting when the older generation should actually sit back and enjoy the last few years of their life.

Of course I'm aware that for her this is a duty for life. But it's about time she really have a normal life.

The older generation has no requirement to sit back and hand the reigns over to a younger generation. And, as it has been said many times in this thread, HM has made several vows throughout her life dedicating herself to the service of her country for all of her days. In her eyes, she has sworn to God and her subjects that she will serve Britain and the Commonwealth as best as she can until she dies. That doesn't really come about by abdicating.

Personally I don't think it's sad to see Charles as PoW at all, regardless of his age. In a lot of ways he has been freer to do things and express himself than it would be (and will be) were he king. I have no doubt that when he does step into the role of King Charles will do wonderful, as he is well aware of what is expected of him and what he can and cannot do once in that role. However, I don't think he's actually rushing for it, as people seem to believe. He's always been a little too political, which he knows he cannot be once he is king.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

[/B]

She is living what she believes is her normal life.

In answer to your initial question - no, she will not abdicate and no one in the BRF, government, or the public expects her to.

Precisely. HM will not abdicate. She is living out what she considers her duty before God and her countrymen. As long as she has her mental and physical capacities to do so, she intends to reign. Good for her.

Every time a European monarch abdicates I wait for this topic to reassert itself here at TRF. I can almost tell time by it. Any minute now, the same blaring question will appear on the front page of the Daily Mail.

 

[Dman]

I think it's pretty natural to think about The Queen when we see another Monarch step down from the throne and pass the torch over to the heir. I think everyone have questions in the back of their mind about what will happen if The Queen isn't able to do her job as Monarch.

Queen Elizabeth II is enjoying good health at the moment or-at least it appears she is- because we really don't know everything about her health. The reality is that she's getting older and slower and I think it's pretty natural and fair to talk and think about the future.

 

[Aliza]

Queen Elizabeth will never abdicate. The word is not even in her vocabulary pertaining to the British Monarchy.

 

[GraceKellyFan]

She is close to 90 and her consort is past 90. They should be allowed a retirement and the younger generations take over

 

[Queen Camilla]

Queen will never abdicate. Said it before the woman wants to pass QV and no matter what her health she's not going to let Vicky win. She'll slow down to a crawl but never ever quit.

 

[cepe]

The more interesting question (rather than "would she consider...") is whether she should abdicate.

EDIT: But we probably can't discuss that

 

[Lumutqueen]

They should be allowed a retirement and the younger generations take over

They are allowed and nobody is preventing The Queen from abdicating. However The Queen and Prince Philip are never fully going to leave public life, even if HM does abdicate, until their death. There's no normal life for them, there's no normal retirement. I can't see Prince Philip sat at Windsor watching re-runs of keeping up appearances and having his 3 square meals a day at 9, 1 and 6 on the dot. They're not that couple.

 

[Ish]

The more interesting question (rather than "would she consider...") is whether she should abdicate.

EDIT: But we probably can't discuss that

That is a more interesting question, and I can't see why we couldn't discuss it.

 

[BritishRoyalist]

That is a more interesting question, and I can't see why we couldn't discuss it.

I thought that what this thread was about

 

[xenobia]

One thought that crossed my mind is what wold happen if (or when, he's human) the DoE passes away. His health hasn't been the best lately. I have a hard time seeing the queen doing her job without his support.

 

[NGalitzine]

I thought that what this thread was about

No. There is a difference between "would" and "should".

 

[Duchess Marie]

Queen will never abdicate. Said it before the woman wants to pass QV and no matter what her health she's not going to let Vicky win. She'll slow down to a crawl but never ever quit.

Agree, i do want the Queen to pass Victoria as the longest reigning British monarch.

 

[cepe]

That is a more interesting question, and I can't see why we couldn't discuss it.

i thought that there might be problems, but in my view I think she should.

this is a new idea for me which has developed following the abdication of Beatrix. HMQs duty is to the people and the monarchy itself and she is making it harder and harder for Charles to be accepted positively as King when the time comes. a 70/80 year old king at the start of his reign creates barriers to acceptance.

It would also clarify the position of the Cambridges and they should be full time royals, learning their craft.

There is a lot of talk about the bredth of the royals, but there is also the depth with 3 generations . And that costs a lot more money. And there will be pressure brought to bear on costs and the payment of taxes, particularly the sovereign to sovereign transfer which carries no tax liability.

If she abdicated, she would be seen the support Charles transition to kingship, there would be a positive response to the Cambridges moving up and the reduction of the BRF would start, at a time when it is needed.

I admit that these thoughts are "work in progress" and I am looking forward to reading other views.

what I think would be wrong, is for sentiment to get in the way of good decisions.

 

[BritishRoyalist]

Agree, i do want the Queen to pass Victoria as the longest reigning British monarch.

Agree with you and Queen Camilla. I want the Queen to pass Victoria and become the longest Reigning Monarch in British History also and I can't wait for that day to happen. It only Two Years away and I have no doubt that she will live to that day and beat Queen Victoria Record! I wonder if there will be some sort of Guns salute or Fireworks that day?

You know the Queen is aware of how close she is too passing and breaking her Great-Great Grandmother record reign of 63 Years and becoming the longest reigning Monarch (And Queen) in British History. Correct me if I am wrong but I believe she would becoming the longest reigning Queen in Europe History as well?

She is aware just like I bet Queen Victoria was aware in 1894 when she was approaching her Grandfather (George III) record reign and was close to beating him and becoming the longest reigning monarch in British History.

I do wonder sometimes if Queen Victoria thought that someone would someday beat her Reign and overtake her as the longest reigning monarch or if she thought that she would always be number 1?

I wonder what she would have to say about Queen Elizabeth closing in on her record?

 

[Lee-Z]

IMO the recent years have only improved my opinion of QEII (which was already good) and i don't see any reason why she should abdicate.
Further more I'm glad that she didn't retire at 65 or 70....IMO that would NOT have been good for the popularity of the BRF....

 

[monarchist-us]

HMQs duty is to the people and the monarchy itself and she is making it harder and harder for Charles to be accepted positively as King when the time comes. a 70/80 year old king at the start of his reign creates barriers to acceptance.

IMO she's making it a lot easier. Most of the unpopularity Charles has is from the Diana years. The more time that passes, the more it gets out of the public's mind.

The longer Charles and Camilla are together the more she will be accepted and the more likely it is that she will be Queen. I think Charles really wants that.

I don't get why a 70-year-old king would be negative. HM is more popular than ever in her old age. I think he would be seen more as a grandfatherly figure.