The Duke and Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 1: September-December 2020

[Somebody]

Weren't they in the States last year as well celebrating Thanksgiving as a family? So, that would make it the second time?!

 

[TLLK]

Weren't they in the States last year as well celebrating Thanksgiving as a family? So, that would make it the second time?!

Last year I believe they would have been in Canada for (American) Thanksgiving.

 

[TLLK]

I'm certainly not surprised....



https://www.usmagazine.com/celebrit...dness-for-meghan-and-harry-after-miscarriage/


There's also this:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/megha...riage-op-ed-in-the-new-york-times-with-royals

Neither am I.

 

[Betsypaige]

Neither am I.

The idea that Harry’s family wouldn’t be there for he and Meghan never even entered my mind. Whatever issues there have been, they are family; I’m glad Harry and Meghan are allowing themselves to be comforted ...

 

[UglyAmerican]

And for Meghan, being biracial herself, the killings of black people by the police is a deeply disturbing thing and I don't think she feels ok when she thinks about that. She doesn't feel ok when she thinks about the management of the pandemic and how it badly affected so many people. The miscarriage was her very personal low in 2020 but there are other things to mention, things that could have gone easier on a lot of people if only we all responded in kindness and with the willingness to help.

Two - George Floyd and Breonna Taylor’s death were traumatic and painful for many people. When people who look like you and are killed for no other reason reason than they look like you, it will do something to your soul - and the fact that we were dealing with a soul crushing pandemic with the deceased into the 100,000s, a global recession, and (in this country) a divisive political situation made it ten times worse.

I think treating those things as equivalent to a miscarriage illustrates the problem with this her expectations, though. Sympathizing with someone who’s had a miscarriage is a no-brainer if you’re close enough to have any kind of emotional connection with that person. There’s not room for any factual or moral disagreement about whether they had a miscarriage or whether having a miscarriage is sad. But if you ask someone “Are you ok?” and the answer you get is something politically loaded like “No, I’m not ok because Trump’s challenging the election in court and it would be horrible if he won” or “No, because the police keep shooting black people” or “No, because if we’d done XYZ differently fewer people would have died of covid,” many people are going to disagree with the factual truth of those statements. Many others will disagree on what should be done about it even if the statements are true.

That doesn’t mean she’s wrong to believe what she believes or feel whatever she feels based on those beliefs. But it means it’s not realistic to expect others to respond to someone's sadness about those things the same way they would to someone's sadness about having a miscarriage. That’s why I don’t understand her including all those other issues in the piece. If she happened upon someone sobbing on a street corner, asked them “What’s wrong?” and they said “I’m sad because Trump lost,” I don’t think her response would be “There, there… How can I help you heal?” And it shouldn’t be. That’s an appropriate response to a personal tragedy, but not to a disagreement about politics or current events.

 

[evolvingdoors]

I think treating those things as equivalent to a miscarriage illustrates the problem with this her expectations, though. Sympathizing with someone who’s had a miscarriage is a no-brainer if you’re close enough to have any kind of emotional connection with that person. There’s not room for any factual or moral disagreement about whether they had a miscarriage or whether having a miscarriage is sad. But if you ask someone “Are you ok?” and the answer you get is something politically loaded like “No, I’m not ok because Trump’s challenging the election in court and it would be horrible if he won” or “No, because the police keep shooting black people” or “No, because if we’d done XYZ differently fewer people would have died of covid,” many people are going to disagree with the factual truth of those statements. Many others will disagree on what should be done about it even if the statements are true.

That doesn’t mean she’s wrong to believe what she believes or feel whatever she feels based on those beliefs. But it means it’s not realistic to expect others to respond to someone's sadness about those things the same way they would to someone's sadness about having a miscarriage. That’s why I don’t understand her including all those other issues in the piece. If she happened upon someone sobbing on a street corner, asked them “What’s wrong?” and they said “I’m sad because Trump lost,” I don’t think her response would be “There, there… How can I help you heal?” And it shouldn’t be. That’s an appropriate response to a personal tragedy, but not to a disagreement about politics or current events.

You just captured perfectly! my misgivings about the letter and those aspects of its content.
?

"That’s why I don’t understand her including all those other issues in the piece"
To me, reading the letter and thinking about it, it almost feels like the miscarriage is the added on to the letter. I know it sounds bad, and i'm not accusing her of anything, this is simply my personal reflection on it.

 

[cathy50]

You just captured perfectly! my misgivings about the letter and those aspects of its content.
?

"That’s why I don’t understand her including all those other issues in the piece"
To me, reading the letter and thinking about it, it almost feels like the miscarriage is the added on to the letter. I know it sounds bad, and i'm not accusing her of anything, this is simply my personal reflection on it.

Yes, I cannot always express in English what I think, but agree very much.
There is another point, they do not share the positive things but now the sad news, is this the plan ? I do know some UK journalists who felt very mocked about Archie's pregnancy/birth .... being given wrong information....
and now? Though the fact itself it sad, the news is , too, another piece if "hello, we are the poorest, everybody is against us, hej take a look...." just like the africa interview. and to compare a miscarriage(horrible word) with a person killed has it's own quality and the folks of the murdered have their own feelings about it.
it's not ok and they use the "taboo" for their own business and unfortunately the , considered negative, reactions will give them confirmation of their far from reality narcissm characters.
and the press already makes new stories up, making money of course only, asking" uhh, look at Meghan in August, wasn't she tough working with the schoolchildren after her loss"..... nice tool to make up an image.... very old tactic to find excuses afterwards...
the game will go on.
by the way the BRF has dine a lot to fill the void, putting mire and more emphasis on women's subjects meghan surely would habe picked up, Sophie is very much in it.. and being in the news with it, another tool to fresh up one's image-it's a big game after all. only the RF still seem to serve the country and the Sussex couple their own purse&fame.

seems as if the wide parts of US society is still very behind the european countries',
a stigma, really? how odd is this, same country in which vips have surrogate mothers not to ruin their bodies?

 

[RoyalNight]

To those who follow the reportas and reactions to M&H's łosoś. Are there voices critisizing the RF for not offering public support? Do people expect the RF to say something publicly?

 

[muriel]

To those who follow the reportas and reactions to M&H's łosoś. Are there voices critisizing the RF for not offering public support? Do people expect the RF to say something publicly?

Speaking as a British person, I can tell you that I would not expect the BRF to publicly offer support. We see it as a private matter. Any support provided would have been done so privately, outside the public gaze, and at the time of the incident, rather than when it was publicised.

 

[Denville]

To those who follow the reportas and reactions to M&H's łosoś. Are there voices critisizing the RF for not offering public support? Do people expect the RF to say something publicly?

I cant imagine why anyone woudl expect the RF to make a public statement about a private matter....

 

[AC21091968]

To those who follow the reportas and reactions to M&H's łosoś. Are there voices critisizing the RF for not offering public support? Do people expect the RF to say something publicly?

I haven't encountered an article that directly criticise the royal family for not publicly supporting Meghan. However, I found a spike article by Brendan O'Neill on how some people criticised the royal family for being stiff-upper-lips in previous instances. The criticism isn't just narrowing down to the Royal Family, but also those who likes to keep their emotion themselves.

The pressure to reveal all is very strong. Anyone who keeps things to themselves, or shares them only with their intimate circle of friends and family, is seen virtually as disordered. They’re ‘in denial’. Consider how the stiff upper lip of the rest of the royal family is so often demonised, and medicalised, these days. Stoicism is out, self-revelation is in. But we lose so much when we erase the line between private life and public life. When we advertise our private thoughts, emotions and experiences to a detached audience, our private life loses its meaning. It becomes performative, something we do to please others rather than to satisfy our own deeper needs. The private sphere is where we can be open, honest, frank, reflective. Raising the curtain on this world to outsiders will denude it of its sanctity and deprive us of a space in which we can truly be ourselves.

The whole spike article is basically criticising Meghan and other celebrities, mostly on the privacy issues and revealing private emotions out. I know that some may abhor Brendan's view, so I posted the related part in quote section.
Do we really need to know about Meghan Markle’s miscarriage?
Harry and Meghan are now invading their own privacy.
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/11/26/do-we-really-need-to-know-about-meghan-markles-miscarriage/

 

[Duchess of Wakanda]

To those who follow the reportas and reactions to M&H's łosoś. Are there voices critisizing the RF for not offering public support? Do people expect the RF to say something publicly?

No. Most people were focused on the article itself and support of Meghan and Harry.

 

[Curryong]

I haven't encountered an article that directly criticise the royal family for not publicly supporting Meghan. However, I found a spike article by Brendan O'Neill on how some people criticised the royal family for being stiff-upper-lips in previous instances. The criticism isn't just narrowing down to the Royal Family, but also those who likes to keep their emotion themselves.



The whole spike article is basically criticising Meghan and other celebrities, mostly on the privacy issues and revealing private emotions out. I know that some may abhor Brendan's view, so I posted the related part in quote section.
Do we really need to know about Meghan Markle’s miscarriage?
Harry and Meghan are now invading their own privacy.
https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/11/26/do-we-really-need-to-know-about-meghan-markles-miscarriage/

Well apparently, for one, Prince William doesn't agree O' Neil's views on the stiff upper lip approach. He's said publicly several times over the past few years that he beieves the stiff upper lip in internalising everything can be psychologically damaging.

https://www.newsweek.com/prince-william-british-stiff-upper-lip-damaging-documentary-1505470

 

[acdc1]

I do find the contrast in public reaction to Meghan’s revealing her miscarriage and other royals or members of the royal family who revealed their miscarriages or losses very telling. I do want to say that the vast majority of reactions that I’ve seen have been sympathetic and supportive, but on social media and in online comments I HAVE seen people saying things along the lines of “why does she have to go out and say their private business? Don’t they want their privacy?” and others mocking her words or calling her an attention-seeker. When Zara Phillips revealed her miscarriages I didn’t see anyone criticizing her or making light of it, same with Sophie and her ectopic pregnancy.

 

[Lee-Z]

I do find the contrast in public reaction to Meghan’s revealing her miscarriage and other royals or members of the royal family who revealed their miscarriages or losses very telling. I do want to say that the vast majority of reactions that I’ve seen have been sympathetic and supportive, but on social media and in online comments I HAVE seen people saying things along the lines of “why does she have to go out and say their private business? Don’t they want their privacy?” and others mocking her words or calling her an attention-seeker. When Zara Phillips revealed her miscarriages I didn’t see anyone criticizing her or making light of it, same with Sophie and her ectopic pregnancy.

my 2cts on this (mind you, personally i think you should let each person grieve the way they choose), i think the reaction we see might indeed be different to when the other two ladies talked about their loss, but reactions (as far as i know, mind you, i don't read daily mail, twitter and such) are not about the fact *that* she spoke out about her loss, but the way *how* she did.

this seems a recurring thing with many of the reactions the Sussexes ger, whether it is this, or a visit to a cemetary, or dispensing food etc:
- *that* they do is, again afai can tell, appreciated and encouraged
- *how* they do it, occassionally raises questionmarks

 

[RandyDrx]

I do find the contrast in public reaction to Meghan’s revealing her miscarriage and other royals or members of the royal family who revealed their miscarriages or losses very telling. I do want to say that the vast majority of reactions that I’ve seen have been sympathetic and supportive, but on social media and in online comments I HAVE seen people saying things along the lines of “why does she have to go out and say their private business? Don’t they want their privacy?” and others mocking her words or calling her an attention-seeker. When Zara Phillips revealed her miscarriages I didn’t see anyone criticizing her or making light of it, same with Sophie and her ectopic pregnancy.

This is just my theory, but I think it's because Zara already revealed her pregnancy, so she had no other choice but to reveal her miscarriage. With Meghan, people had no idea that she was pregnant and therefore, she wasn't obliged to share her miscarriage to the public.

 

[Curryong]

[.....]

A NZ article on the different reactions to Meghan's loss and those of Zara and Sophie. And again it should be noted that Meghan has received unstinted backing for her article from heads of organisations that actually work with bereaved parents and their families due to miscarriages.

There are no whinges from them regarding Meghan's phraseology in her letter, only praise for getting the message out there.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/life-style/...at-of-zaras-and-sophies--and-it-is-very-wrong

 

[Betsypaige]

To those who follow the reportas and reactions to M&H's łosoś. Are there voices critisizing the RF for not offering public support? Do people expect the RF to say something publicly?

No, I haven seen a thing about it. I think everyone understands that this is a private matter...

 

[MARG]

So did they do anything for Thanksgiving that I missed? Served food or something?

I believe all "Missions" etc. didn't have the usual monster charity Thanksgiving events out of an abundance of caution. They did their best to ensure their usual guests where otherwise taken care of. COVID still dictates how we behave and, if it doesn't it should. Were this not true, I am sure they would have rolled their sleeves up.

 

[RoyalNight]

Thank you for all your answers. I'm happy that no one expects the BRF to make statements. Months after the loss it would be only for the rags.
As for difference in reactions to the announcements it's all about why and how. Zara didn't have a choice and Sophie spent some time in a hospital and had to postpone her scheduled engagements.
Meghan didn't have to announce her miscarrige, though I think it's good to publicily speak about it.
Zara and Sophie had official announcements - the way BRF always uses to communicate with people. Meghan chose the article in one of the most popular newspapers in the world. For me that's a bit attention-seeking.

 

[Curryong]

It's perhaps forgotten, I think, that neither Harry or Meghan have had any IG or Twitter Page operating for months. Archewell is still not launched. I have a feeling that if it had been, Meghan would have posted her letter via Archewell.

 

[Betsypaige]

[...]

I also think that it IS a good idea to ask people if they are ok....Although she referenced the Africa interview, I'm choosing not to focus on that. The entire world is going through an historic pandemic, where people are often isolated.....for many months at a time. Making sure loved ones are ok, are doing well, is necessary.

 

[Mbruno]

I do find the contrast in public reaction to Meghan’s revealing her miscarriage and other royals or members of the royal family who revealed their miscarriages or losses very telling. I do want to say that the vast majority of reactions that I’ve seen have been sympathetic and supportive, but on social media and in online comments I HAVE seen people saying things along the lines of “why does she have to go out and say their private business? Don’t they want their privacy?” and others mocking her words or calling her an attention-seeker. When Zara Phillips revealed her miscarriages I didn’t see anyone criticizing her or making light of it, same with Sophie and her ectopic pregnancy.

Most of the criticism was actually about how Meghan made her miscarriage public, i.e. in a NYT op-ed piece bringing up George Floyd, Breonna Taylor and the South Africa tour.

 

[Countessmeout]

Most of the criticism was actually about how Meghan made her miscarriage public, i.e. in a NYT op-ed piece bringing up George Floyd, Breonna Taylor and the South Africa tour.

Yes I mean its better to tell about it to the Sunday times and BBC news

How dare she mention her struggles including her tour?


[...]

 

[Jacknch]

A reminder of the Mod Note posted a couple of days ago:

With regard to Privacy, the discussion has gone round and round in circles for months. Meghan and Harry are not going to live a quiet life completely hidden from the public, so let’s refrain from bringing up that topic every single time they do an interview, or make an appearance in the media.

Members are asked to stop bringing up the Privacy debate all the time - thank you.

 

[Grousewood]

I am very sympathetic about their loss - I do think it is good that she revealed her miscarriage in hopes of encouraging others to share their grief in order to help them come to terms with it. I just wish I didn't always feel that she is not sincere - that she is performing. She just hits me the wrong way.

 

[acdc1]

I am very sympathetic about their loss - I do think it is good that she revealed her miscarriage in hopes of encouraging others to share their grief in order to help them come to terms with it. I just wish I didn't always feel that she is not sincere - that she is performing. She just hits me the wrong way.

I think you really phrased a conflicting feeling I have been having as well. I was very moved by the piece and wholeheartedly believe that it is genuine... but it’s a bit of a “boy who cried wolf” syndrome. So much of what the Sussexes have done has been self-serving or to seek attention and paint themselves as victims, so when they do put out something that is very heartfelt and sincere it’s difficult to take them seriously, and I feel like I’m constantly looking for ulterior motives.

 

[Countessmeout]

I think you really phrased a conflicting feeling I have been having as well. I was very moved by the piece and wholeheartedly believe that it is genuine... but it’s a bit of a “boy who cried wolf” syndrome. So much of what the Sussexes have done has been self-serving or to seek attention and paint themselves as victims, so when they do put out something that is very heartfelt and sincere it’s difficult to take them seriously, and I feel like I’m constantly looking for ulterior motives.

Its less of 'cried wolf' and more of the usual double standards.

They are hardly the only royals who have ever sued for breach of privacy. Or demanded/wanted privacy. Others are 'just protecting their children', 'entitled to their down time'. The Sussexes are liars, secrative, denying the people the right to see their kid.....

[......]

Some people will not be happy with this couple until they slither down the hole where they are never heard from again that people claimed they would disappear in when they left royal life.


[......]

 

[Grousewood]

Its less of 'cried wolf' and more of the usual double standards.

They are hardly the only royals who have ever sued for breach of privacy. Or demanded/wanted privacy. Others are 'just protecting their children', 'entitled to their down time'. The Sussexes are liars, secrative, denying the people the right to see their kid.....

[......]

Some people will not be happy with this couple until they slither down the hole where they are never heard from again that people claimed they would disappear in when they left royal life.


[......]

All that being said, I do hope they will be able to have a second child. Most people recover from their grief following a miscarriage, though they always carry sadness for what might have been. A successful pregnancy and baby would go a long way to recovery.

 

[Lori138]

I do find the contrast in public reaction to Meghan’s revealing her miscarriage and other royals or members of the royal family who revealed their miscarriages or losses very telling. I do want to say that the vast majority of reactions that I’ve seen have been sympathetic and supportive, but on social media and in online comments I HAVE seen people saying things along the lines of “why does she have to go out and say their private business? Don’t they want their privacy?” and others mocking her words or calling her an attention-seeker. When Zara Phillips revealed her miscarriages I didn’t see anyone criticizing her or making light of it, same with Sophie and her ectopic pregnancy.

I am not disagreeing with you, but perhaps the difference was that Zara and Sophie did not sue for Invasion of privacy and moan about the lack of same all the time the way that Meghan has. And, perhaps that is why their revelations did not evoke as much controversy.