A wife for Albert

[Grace]

John Paul II legitimized Caro's children in 1993, one year after her marriage with Junot was annulled by Sacra Rota, because Stefano was already dead and they couldn't marry in churh anymore...I think the monegasque diplomacy worked quite hard to obtain this legitimization, just in case Albert didn't marry, so the Casiraghi Trio are legitimate heirs both for the State and for the Catholic Church...

Kisses

 

[paca]

Neither Caroline nor Stephanie have been married in Church to their husbands, thus to my knowledge the CHurch would not recognize any of the offspring as legitimite. According to French law (which is similar to MC laws) the children are legitimate if the father signs a reconaissance d'enfant before the child is born (married or not if you are living together, but you have to make a statement that you are living together). (things are a bit more complicated if it happens after the birth). But France is a laic state whereas MC is a catholic state and thus the catholic churches point of view is very important. But I must admit that , not being catholic myself, I am not quite sure how the problem of remarriage, civil marriage and children is handled today by the church.

 

[paca]

I didn't know that about JP2. Thanks grace. That clears it up. I know that MC has an ambassador to the Vatican and there is a close contact.

 

[LadyMacAlpine]

Paca = Neither Caroline nor Stephanie have been married in Church to their husbands, thus to my knowledge the CHurch would not recognize any of the offspring as legitimite. According to French law (which is similar to MC laws) the children are legitimate if the father signs a reconaissance d'enfant before the child is born (married or not if you are living together, but you have to make a statement that you are living together). (things are a bit more complicated if it happens after the birth). But France is a laic state whereas MC is a catholic state and thus the catholic churches point of view is very important. But I must admit that , not being catholic myself, I am not quite sure how the problem of remarriage, civil marriage and children is handled today by the church.

I am Catholic. You don't have to be married in the Church your marriage can be blessed. Marriage made Stephs children legitimate. Albert signed a paper to recogonize Alexandre however he is not legitimate. Recognition only means the man is legally responsible for the child it doesn't change their legitimatcy.

 

[Grace]

I think we are confusing religion and legal legitimization:

for the State there is a difference between a recognized child (born out of wedlock but recognized by the father on their birth certificate or afterwards) and a legitimate one born by a narried couple; Monaco Constitution completely cuts out natural children from the line of succession, so Camille and Alexandre cannot possibly (under this Constitution) inherit the throne while all the others can.

For the Church legitimate children are those born in a Catholic union; from this point of view only the Casiraghi Trio are legitimate thanks to the Pope's intervention (as I've said when Caro's first marriage was finally annulled Stefano had already died), while Alexandra, and Steph's kids were born out of a catholic union.

Despite Monaco being a Catholic and not laic State, the Church legitimization has no legal value, but only a simbolic one for the succession line, so the Casiraghis, Alexandra, Louis and Pauline are all eligible for the throne...

Hope I've made things a little clearer,

Kisses

 

[mw7060a]

I too am Catholic. I would think that any man, including Prince Albert, could marry a divorced woman in the Catholic Church as long as the divorced woman had received a bona fide annullment from the Vatican dissolving the prior marriage. I don't recall hearing about any laws in Monaco barring a ruling Prince from marrying a divorcee (as long as she received the anullment) and then married the Prince in a proper Catholic ceremony in the sight of God. (As I mentioned earlier, how all of that would go over with the "old school" Monagasques is a different matter. Maybe some would be relieved just have their Prince Albert finally marry even if it was to a divorced woman, maybe not).

 

[Ariel]

Since Nicole Kidman is a divorcee, in order for her and Prince Albert to properly marry in the Catholic Church, Nicole Kidman would first have to petition and then receive an anullment from the Vatican. I think the thought of marrying a divorcee might turn off some of the "older/old school" Monagasques about their Prince. Nothing against Nicole Kidman, mind you, but just trying to look at this realistically.

Did Nicole Kidman get married by catholic church? because as we have seen, Letizia Ortiz was legally married and did not have problems to get married by church as they did not recognized her previous marriage.

 

[Donna]

I too am Catholic. I would think that any man, including Prince Albert, could marry a divorced woman in the Catholic Church as long as the divorced woman had received a bona fide annullment from the Vatican dissolving the prior marriage. I don't recall hearing about any laws in Monaco barring a ruling Prince from marrying a divorcee (as long as she received the anullment) and then married the Prince in a proper Catholic ceremony in the sight of God.

Why does she have to have an annullment? What if she can't because she has children from previous marriage?

 

[lashinka2002]

I've heard that an anullment is possible even if there are children corn from the union. I would have to look it up though....

 

[mw7060a]

Why does she have to have an annullment? What if she can't because she has children from previous marriage?

The Catholic Church does not recognize divorce. Period. Divorce is something the State grants, not the Catholic Church. "What God has joined together, let no Man put asunder." That is one of the tenets of the Catholic faith regarding the Sacrament of Marriage. The Catholic Church only recognizes an anullment. In order for a divorced person to "marry" in the eyes of the Catholic Church, they have to petition and receive an anullment from the Vatican. Without the anullment, the Catholic Church views second marriages as committing adultery. Also, having children does not bar someone from requesting/receiving an anullment nor does it cause children to become "illegitimate".

 

[wymanda]

Since Nicole Kidman is a divorcee, in order for her and Prince Albert to properly marry in the Catholic Church, Nicole Kidman would first have to petition and then receive an anullment from the Vatican. I think the thought of marrying a divorcee might turn off some of the "older/old school" Monagasques about their Prince. Nothing against Nicole Kidman, mind you, but just trying to look at this realistically.

Did Tom & Nicole marry in the catholic church?
If they didn't then the church would not recognise the marriage. It would surely be a similar case to Letizia who had contracted a civil marriage but was not considered by the church to have been married.

I also doubt that the catholic church recognises a cult like scientology!!

 

[LadyMacAlpine]

Donna you are to funny. Let me explain when I see a question asked in the Forum and I don't know the answer I research it to make the post in response. I have an investigation background in law enforcement and have been doing research in the mental health field for over 20 years. Have been researching the Grimaldis since the summer of 1998. Albert and I have the same great etc grandparents, aunts, uncles and cousins on our fathers mothers fathers side. Lady Mary Douglas Hamilton married to Albert I connects us. I read and retain information in this area due to an interest in it. As stated Albert can marry a woman that is divorced just as Albert I and Mary both remarried. She had another child Albert did not. When Albert and Mary got their annulment Louis was still considered legitimate. An annulment by the church makes any child born in that marriage illegitimate since it doesn't recognize the marriage afterwards. Exceptions do occur like with Louis to be Albert's heir.

 

[paca]

As I mentioned earlier, how all of that would go over with the "old school" Monagasques is a different matter. Maybe some would be relieved just have their Prince Albert finally marry even if it was to a divorced woman, maybe not).

I truely think that the Monegasques wouldn't have any problems with a divorcee or a woman with child as i.e. mette-marit. I even think that a child might make her accepted even easier (especially if it is small and cute) seeing how child friendly people are here. At least they would know that she can have children. I also don't think that people would compare her much with Grace. Especially not the young generation, who didn't even know her. People would like to see PA married for his own sake mostly and as long as they are happy and she does a good job, she won't have any problems with the regular monegasques. Besides a good media strategy would help as well to get her accepted, no matter who she is and what se looks like. Good PR can remedy a lot, though at present I think PA is not very well advised and using his lawyer as his speaker instead of his press office doesn't help (there seems to have been a bit of a problem there, I don't know the details but the official press office does very little for his PR. All statements about the families private life were lately issued by Mtre Lacoste. And other notes are very scarce.)

I think PA raised expectations himself by being so secretive about his GFs. Since he has not been tempted into marriage by any of those considered to be beautiful and eligible women, everybody is expecting wonderwoman now.

 

[monica17]

.....I think PA raised expectations himself by being so secretive about his GFs. Since he has not been tempted into marriage by any of those considered to be beautiful and eligible women, everybody is expecting wonderwoman now.

Right. If and when he marries, the woman will be scrutinized like no other girl was scrutinized before.

 

[hsh1969]

IMO at this time and date: it no longer matters if the woman he marries is divorced with seven kids and two elephants, he can swing that constitution in one second either way. I'm also catholic and the fact the church does not recognized divorce is just semantics; if they dont recognize it; what's the point of annull it?
After seeing the new princes of wales wear a tiara/crown bigger than the queen, the so called catholic kings of spain sign a law permitting homosexual marriages, without a blink from the king and a lot of other details, to put it nicely; credo/color/background it does not matter anymore.
And for the love of pete, we are talking Monaco here, where is the dinasty of straight blue blood?
And you know what? I don't doubt that albert go back and marries or lives with NC. For the last 2 weeks everything that you have seen or heard about royalty isn't a fairy tale of princesses loving each other till death do us 'part, it's an institution or a few royal houses trying to be kept alive.

 

[jcranma]

It seems that Nicole Kidman is gaining the votes, but I'm wondering about something else. On paper, which woman from a royal, noble, or aristocratic background would be a perfect match for Prince Albert? Those who have lost their throne or titles can be included as well. I'm not including the compatibility factor here. Just blue blooded potential brides to Albert that will make royal watchers say WOW.

For example, a hypothetical match between Prince Albert and Spain's Duchess of Alba's daughter would surely grab headlines. Can somebody suggest other matches similar to that?

 

[bad_barbarella]

I think he needs a good wife who is a great mother... putting children first...

 

[Donna]

I think he needs a good wife who is a great mother... putting children first...

I agree with you. Let's not talk more about Nicole Kidman. She is not the right woman for him, neither is any woman with blue blood. He needs someone with red hot blood, someone passionate like himself. Someone the world has never heard of and will take the world by storm

She will have a unique fashion sense. I am so tired of these celebrities with their plastic boobs hanging out of their dresses. And slits up to their waist. It is disgusting. The future princess will have class and glamour in a classy way.

 

[paca]

Another link to the Sharmine rumour. Pix on page 3

http://www.frau-im-spiegel.de/leute/sharivar.html

 

[fanletizia]

Maria-Carolina Christina Princess de Bourbon de Parme, Marchioness of Sala (Her Royal Highness)

Parents: Carlos Hugues Duke of Parma (1930) and 1964 (div. 1981), Irene Princess of the Netherlands (1939)

 

[fandesacs2003]

IMO, if Albert reached the age of 47... still single.... means that he is not interested to marry......
Either because he has other kind of preferences, or because he just loves someone not adequat for this role, he is just sincere. I prefer this behavior, that this of Prince Charles 25 years ago, he loved one woman and he marry another, ... we all know what happened ......
Albert is clear in his mind, he does not want to commit hypocritical compromises. He is young enough to rule Monaco for the next 40-50 years, and his succession in also ensured, Caroline has 2 boys and Stephanie 1. even if the sexist succession rule pertain.
And in 40 years, who knows.... mentalities will have change enough, we may see Charlotte herself or Alexandre (NC son) ruling Monaco.
Who could imagine 20 years ago, that the very catholic King of Spain will marry his son with a non aristocratic divorced woman?? And look what happened in the throne of Norway!
And that the Prince of Wales will divorce and marry a divorced mother???
Lets' wait and see in 40 years.

 

[Donna]

Albert and Miss Germany

I have completely lost all my interest in the prince. You can have him all to yourselves. If he is interested in a child woman in a dress, he is not classy enough for me.

Do you know that she arrived at the Grace award with another gentlement who she was sweet enough to let hold her and kiss her on the cheek the whole evening. But as night came she left him for the prince.

They suit each other perfectly. What a happy couple. She is even shopping for a wedding dress.

May they live "happily" ever after.

 

[Queen Mary I]

What are yours criteria of Prince Albert future wife and future first lady of Monaco?

I just don't think Albert should marry. He seems very irresponsible with siring children out of wedlock-then denying them. A woman in California sued Albert for Paternity but the laws in California couldn't touch him or something. And that woman's child is 12 I think. I forget, I'll try to find the articles I've read online. Here is one from ABC News:

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/wireStory?id=929640

Here is another from AP news:

http://entertainment.tv.yahoo.com/entnews/ap/20050910/112636494021.html

I don't know how a 47 year old man could say he wa 'set up for fatherhood'. The woman didn't get pregnant by herself and I think a prince can afford condoms and such.

The Principality should pass on to the next heir when Albert is gone-

now what is Monaco's line of succession? I know they changed the law-I think so that the Princesses Caroline and Stephanie could follow and I think by law 'illegitimate' issue cannot succeed which leaves out Albert's children by at least a couple of women according to the gossip that has been flying around. And according the Albert's own near admission that he has more children out there-somewhere.

I just think that Prince Albert should feel no pressure to marry just to marry or to sire 'legitimate' heirs. That is a very bad reason to marry.

Imo btw I don't believe in illegitimate children. Only illegitimate parents.

 

[Queen Mary I]

Since Nicole Kidman is a divorcee, in order for her and Prince Albert to properly marry in the Catholic Church, Nicole Kidman would first have to petition and then receive an anullment from the Vatican. I think the thought of marrying a divorcee might turn off some of the "older/old school" Monagasques about their Prince. Nothing against Nicole Kidman, mind you, but just trying to look at this realistically.

Did Nicole marry Tom Cruise with Roman Catholic rites? If she had a civil marriage with Tom then she would not require an annulment from the Catholic Church. That is the reason the divorced Leticia Ortiz was allowed to marry Prince Felipe of Asturias in a Catholic ceremony. She had a civil marriage with her first husband. Also the Catholic Church recognizes some marriages outside of the Church as legitimate. Anglican marriages for example, and Orthodox Christian I believe. For those an annulment is necessary. I think the Church does not recognize the Mormon marriage.

 

[Grace]

I have completely lost all my interest in the prince. You can have him all to yourselves. If he is interested in a child woman in a dress, he is not classy enough for me.

Do you know that she arrived at the Grace award with another gentlement who she was sweet enough to let hold her and kiss her on the cheek the whole evening. But as night came she left him for the prince.

They suit each other perfectly. What a happy couple. She is even shopping for a wedding dress.

May they live "happily" ever after.

You would have lost your interest much sooner if you had seen some of the Italian "ladies" our Prince has dated, for some time even: apparently he likes long legs ad no brain...I hope he if decides to marry he choses better or Monaco is in great troubles!

Kisses

 

[lashinka2002]

I think he needs to shock everyone and find an unknown bride like Mary of Denmark.

 

[Queen Mary I]

I think he needs to shock everyone and find an unknown bride like Mary of Denmark.

The thing is that I believe all the Princes of the world have met all the Princesses at some points in their lives-through Debutante balls for example. I'm sure at times their parents have tried to 'set them up' on blind dates to see if they were compatible. The can't force most to marry these days except in some religions like the Muslims. Well force or 'arrange' marriages. I read something on the Prince Of Asturias who apparently had met all the Princesses at one point or another and they just had nothing in common. If tall ladies with long legs is Albert's taste that is not really a bad thing. Tall girls need love too and they don't all lack brains. But his prospective consort should demonstrate some level of class, and taste and hopefully not have a bad reputation such as for adultery or scandalous affairs. It just reflects badly on Royalty or a Principality.

 

[Amina]

I think albert needs to marry someone whose intelligent, smart. She would have to be well educated and VERY self-confident and assured in herself. Preferably someone with no 'past' (not that this matters). Definitely someone in their 30's anyone younger would be too young for Albert.

Nicole Kidman is a good idea but i don't see her giving up her Hollyweird career for him. But still she is nearly 40 and everyone knows that in Hollyweird when an actress turns 40 its over! So i guess she'll be looking for another career - perhaps?

Also Alberts wife would have to live with the constant shadow and comparison of PG, she'll be a hard act to follow. His wife will also have to deal with his two sisters. PC i hear can be a little 'formal', PS would be the one who'll be easier to get along with. I don't think she takes herself as seriously.

Just because PA hasn't married yet doesn't mean he won't, i guess he's still waiting for the right women. However being Royal does come with certain responisbilities and duties. PA is under pressure to produce an heir - he hasn't done so yet. Not a legitimate one. I don't see him legitimizing Alexandre because i think the relationship between him and Nicole Costa? ( is that her name?) is probably very frosty at the moment.

I wish him luck in finding a bride because he's going to need it!!!! I hope he doesn't do a Prince Charles and marry a woman he's not that passionate about - just to cave into pressure.

 

[Amina]

Thought i would have some fun here and post some 'possible' candidates for PA. All these women are famous, beautiful and highly intelligent. But i doubt PA will marry any of them. But like i said i'm just having fun here...

Aishwarya Rai (image Corbis)



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aishwarya_rai

Aishwarya Rai (Kannada: ಐಶ್ವರ್ಯಾ ರೈ, Hindi: ऐश्वर्या राय; born on November 1, 1973; Ash for fans and media) is an actress from India. She is currently regarded as one of the biggest names in Bollywood.
[edit]
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/
Early life

Aishwarya was born in Mangalore to Krishnaraj and Vrinda Rai, in the South Indian state of Karnataka. She is a Miss World beauty contest winner, a professional model, and an actress in Bollywood and Hollywood films.
Rai has appeared as a model in many Indian fashion magazines, including the Indian Vogue; she is currently featured in international ads for L'Oréal Paris, De Beers Diamonds, and Coca-Cola.
She was first-runner up in the 1994 Miss India Contest.....


Gong Li (Image Profimedia)



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gong_Li

Gong Li (Simplified Chinese: 巩俐; Traditional Chinese: 鞏俐; pinyin: Gǒng Lì) (born December 31, 1965) is a Chinese film actress. Gong is her surname. In addition to her perfomances, Gong Li is also famed for having an especially noticeable appearance, which was repeatedly made reference to in The Emperor and the Assassin. She has been featured in People magazine's "50 Most Beautiful People" article, and is an ambassador for L'Oreal cosmetics.

[edit]
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Career

Born in Shenyang, Liaoning, China, she has appeared in most films directed by Zhang Yimou up till 1995. She grew up in Jinan, the capital of Shandong Province. In 1985, she enrolled in the Central Academy of Drama to study acting, and graduated in 1989. She was still a student there when Zhang Yimou chose her in 1987 for the lead role in...

 

[Amina]

Zhang Ziyi (Image Profimedia and google)



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhang_Ziyi

This is a Chinese name; the family name is Zhang. Zhang Ziyi (Chinese: 章子怡; pinyin: Zhāng Zǐyí) (born February 9, 1979) is a Chinese actress. The characters of her name can be literally translated as Zhāng (a surname, not to be confused with the more common Zhāng 张), Zǐ (child), and Yí (happiness).
Born in Beijing in the People's Republic of China, Zhang joined the Beijing Dance Academy at the age of 11, and at 15 she entered China's prestigious Central Academy of Drama. At the age of 19, she was offered her first role in world renowned director....


Karolina Kurkova (Image Profimedia)



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karolina_Kurkova

Karolina Kurkova (b. February 28, 1984 in Děčín, Czech Republic) is a supermodel.
Karolina Kurkova had an early insight into what celebrity life would be like, as her father Josef Kurka was a star basketball player. As a child, her height made her relatively awkward and gangly, but that would all change...