Tamara is hispanic?
I thought she was, but now you come to mention it, I'm not sure where I picked that up from.
Tamara is hispanic?
Just like AlbertIf Rotolo is her maiden name, then she is of Italian descent.
GREAT I said several times that I don't understand what I 'm allowed to post.......Mandy, I had to jump in here because, you are right the problem is that we have new (young?) people trying to take the informed (old?) people who have been following from the beginning, the ones that have seen all the photo's, read all Charlene's interviews, little quips, & remarks to task. We have seen all the posing, the pictures with Charlene's head in Albert's lap, on her first public outing where he is a member of th IOC, never mind a Head of State. Then her first official public picture where she accompanies the family for the first time, very inappropriatly dressed leaning over the balcony with a cigarette dangling out of her mouth. I'm sorry but we are talking again about te same person's attack on all of the people who don't share her opinion. We are continuosly told by her we have no right to judge or have or form the opinion that most of us hold! You might ask yourself why this is? Why do so many women who do not know each other, from different backgrounds, different ages, share the same opinion of this girl? You seem to want to have equel sides on this board? It's simply that people from all over have came to the same conclusion. ................. (We have all seen the many pictures from that event, with Charlene hanging on Albert) Again, if people are puzzled by our opinions, they should do their own research, it is not our job to catch them up & do the work for them. If they want to participate in the conversation, they should take the time to know what we are actually talking about, before trying to take us to task. The moderators seem to want to defend this immature behaviour? While trying to silence the majority of people that hold another opinion. We have had this same conversation about the same poster who keeps harping on us? There are some very smart accomplished women who post on this board, with a well reasoned opinion and they have a right to it. Unless this board is meant to be a Miss America pagent? The people that have posted above, have not gone in to anything other than Charlene's portrayed behavior? Not petty remarks on her looks, not her lack of formal education only Charlene's words about the lack of importance to it in her life?
There are people much newer to the board that seem to be able to get up to speed. I do not know why we have to continuosly coddle, conjole & make consessions for the same few that cannot be bothered or refuse to inform themselves before they open their mouths. I'm sorry but it seems to be the same poster's that are bent on causing the tirade. I don't think we should have to tolerate them because they want to remain ignorant to the topic. I vote we should move on and ignore and not reply to those posters. I can't help but to point out, that the problem we are having with the posters, is the same we have with Charlene.
Well put, Gislaine
I have to jump in here, I think almost everyone's post has been excellent, MyAdia's, very articulate & intellegent posts, as well as everyone else's including Elspeth, who I mostly agree with. The fault is with Albert, for dating someone like Charlene & bringing her where she does not belong.
The reason Charlene get's the attention, one reason is because she has courted it! But we are always being asked to support are ill opinion and know matter how we back it up, we are bitched at (that is exactly the word for it) that we do not have a right to form an opinion, that is what we are told by the few who think a pretty face is a good enough reason for someone to marry someone, especially someone that may be in the position of Head of State's wife. Someone you would think that was dating a 50 year old would not need a mentor or training. I'm sure Camilla handles herself just fine. So, that said, it doesn't let Charlene off the hook for her behavior and that has been what the turn off has been for most from the beginning.
Mandy, I had to jump in here because, you are right the problem is that we have new (young?) people trying to take the informed (old?) people who have been following from the beginning, the ones that have seen all the photo's, read all Charlene's interviews, little quips, & remarks to task. We have seen all the posing, the pictures with Charlene's head in Albert's lap, on her first public outing where he is a member of th IOC, never mind a Head of State. Then her first official public picture where she accompanies the family for the first time, very inappropriatly dressed leaning over the balcony with a cigarette dangling out of her mouth. I'm sorry but we are talking again about te same person's attack on all of the people who don't share her opinion. We are continuosly told by her we have no right to judge or have or form the opinion that most of us hold! You might ask yourself why this is? Why do so many women who do not know each other, from different backgrounds, different ages, share the same opinion of this girl? You seem to want to have equel sides on this board? It's simply that people from all over have came to the same conclusion. I think if we were discussing George Bush we would have one side with far more weight. You cannot try to change what the concensus actually is? I'm sorry but the statement by the poster "you can't tell by one picture"? Pretty much makes the argument, we have some people who have seen a library of photos from one & every event, and one who wants to take everybody to task because she has only seen one picture? (We have all seen the many pictures from that event, with Charlene hanging on Albert) Again, if people are puzzled by our opinions, they should do their own research, it is not our job to catch them up & do the work for them. If they want to participate in the conversation, they should take the time to know what we are actually talking about, before trying to take us to task. The moderators seem to want to defend this immature behaviour? While trying to silence the majority of people that hold another opinion. We have had this same conversation about the same poster who keeps harping on us? There are some very smart accomplished women who post on this board, with a well reasoned opinion and they have a right to it. Unless this board is meant to be a Miss America pagent? The people that have posted above, have not gone in to anything other than Charlene's portrayed behavior? Not petty remarks on her looks, not her lack of formal education only Charlene's words about the lack of importance to it in her life?
There are people much newer to the board that seem to be able to get up to speed. I do not know why we have to continuosly coddle, conjole & make consessions for the same few that cannot be bothered or refuse to inform themselves before they open their mouths. I'm sorry but it seems to be the same poster's that are bent on causing the tirade. I don't think we should have to tolerate them because they want to remain ignorant to the topic. I vote we should move on and ignore and not reply to those posters. I can't help but to point out, that the problem we are having with the posters, is the same we have with Charlene.
Again, if people are puzzled by our opinions, they should do their own research, it is not our job to catch them up & do the work for them. If they want to participate in the conversation, they should take the time to know what we are actually talking about, before trying to take us to task. The moderators seem to want to defend this immature behaviour? While trying to silence the majority of people that hold another opinion. We have had this same conversation about the same poster who keeps harping on us? There are some very smart accomplished women who post on this board, with a well reasoned opinion and they have a right to it. Unless this board is meant to be a Miss America pagent? The people that have posted above, have not gone in to anything other than Charlene's portrayed behavior? Not petty remarks on her looks, not her lack of formal education only Charlene's words about the lack of importance to it in her life?
There are people much newer to the board that seem to be able to get up to speed. I do not know why we have to continuosly coddle, conjole & make consessions for the same few that cannot be bothered or refuse to inform themselves before they open their mouths. I'm sorry but it seems to be the same poster's that are bent on causing the tirade. I don't think we should have to tolerate them because they want to remain ignorant to the topic. I vote we should move on and ignore and not reply to those posters. I can't help but to point out, that the problem we are having with the posters, is the same we have with Charlene.
I seconed that Sandsla! There are few posters including myself whom had spent up to six months following and reading this boards before joining in. By the time I had started to post I was informed well enough to express my opinion on Charlene and her relationship with PA.
I didn't come on this board with an agenda the way some had said (why would I?). I do agree that my comments might sound a little bit to harsh at times, but that is just because I don't have to much patience with these "new posters" who didn't take time to do a little research before joining in. Instead they ohhs and ahhhs on how perfect Princess Charlene would be just because she looked (to them) so nice on one picture. They go so far to call us jealous and are puzzled by the fact that we need something more then someones looks to like them or to believe that they are suitable for certain position.
I do agree that everyone has a right to think whatever they want and to like Charlene based on her appearance only, but I do not like when my opinion is deleted just because someone does not agree with it.
I believe that bringing in a little humor wouldn't hurt either! We should all lighten up a bit, after all PA marrying Charlene or someone else won't have impact on any of our lives. At least not on mine, that's for sure! LOL
I seconed that Sandsla! There are few posters including myself whom had spent up to six months following and reading this boards before joining in. By the time I had started to post I was informed well enough to express my opinion on Charlene and her relationship with PA.
I didn't come on this board with an agenda the way some had said (why would I?). I do agree that my comments might sound a little bit to harsh at times, but that is just because I don't have to much patience with these "new posters" who didn't take time to do a little research before joining in. Instead they ohhs and ahhhs on how perfect Princess Charlene would be just because she looked (to them) so nice on one picture. They go so far to call us jealous and are puzzled by the fact that we need something more then someones looks to like them or to believe that they are suitable for certain position.
I do agree that everyone has a right to think whatever they want and to like Charlene based on her appearance only, but I do not like when my opinion is deleted just because someone does not agree with it.
I believe that bringing in a little humor wouldn't hurt either! We should all lighten up a bit, after all PA marrying Charlene or someone else won't have impact on any of our lives. At least not on mine, that's for sure! LOL
great royal and sansdla... now are we talking about censorship and deleting posts ???
I think that deleting or censorship it's showing us that charlene is a real "problem" for Monaco, if she wasn't this forum would be quiet. When some of us are posting, smiling, "linking" elsewhere we know that our mods can pock us with a stick but we know that we are allowed to see behind glamourous (!!!)and watch current life.
anyway it's being controlled by the Palace at Monaco/the Danish Royal Family/Clarence House/King Abdullah/the Invisible Pink Unicorn/whatever."
While I applaud your posting I think you forgot about Bozo, the Clown and I wonder why?
Well said Elspeth and thank you for your patience.
My vote is on the Invisible Pink Unicorn! They're taking over the world!Second, I'm really getting tired of this business about "TRF only allows fairy-tale fantasies; you can only say nice things about people at TRF regardless of how bad they are, it's a board where only sugar is allowed, and anyway it's being controlled by the Palace at Monaco/the Danish Royal Family/Clarence House/King Abdullah/the Invisible Pink Unicorn/whatever."
Just so that everyone is clear, I wasn't referring to your board when I was talking about the no-holds-barred snake pits out there. I know you're also trying to maintain high standards of civility over at your forum.
My vote is on the Invisible Pink Unicorn! They're taking over the world!
Sorry, I'll make a more sensible post next time.
i second you LauraElizabeth.Well said Elspeth and thank you for your patience.
some people who were here didn't saw her.. they were not around all the time.LOL What have you put in your tea?
And now back to the snake pits (just kidding mods). Charlene apparently was at the Monaco yacht show we just didn't see pics of her, so now I wonder if she wasn't with him in NY and Washington. can any of our picture sleuths see if they can turn up any? Thanks!!
I haven't seen the article yet. let's just read it first before jumping to conclusions.LOL What have you put in your tea?
And now back to the snake pits (just kidding mods). Charlene apparently was at the Monaco yacht show we just didn't see pics of her, so now I wonder if she wasn't with him in NY and Washington. can any of our picture sleuths see if they can turn up any? Thanks!!
Other than myself and miraglia(?) I don't think any posters have come here and "oohed" and "ahhhed" over CW. I think we have both stated that she looked lovely on a particular occasion. I for one have never referred to her as "Princess".
I am confounded by yours and other's assertion that new posters come here without "doing the homework". Do you mean going back and reading the posts? Reading as much as the European press that we can understand?
Fine. What do you say to those of us who have done ALL of the above and still don't agree with much of what CW is accused of being on this Forum??
My own humble opinion is that for months this Forum consisted of a small cadre of posters who shared markedly negative views of CW and posted articles and photos-some more than four years old-to support their "truth". There was little or no real dialogue. It was months of congratulating one another on their "intelligence" and the so-called articulate way that the criticisms were posted.
Then BOOM! A newcomer comes around and disagrees/opposes. I say the reason WHY I disagree, and am immediately rebuked as ignorant and uninformed and not up to speed. What an eye-opener.
I have stated this many times but here goes again...I don't think CW is the perfect bride-to-be for a Prince of Monaco. But...I also don't think she is the complete catastrophe some here have made her out to be. She seems rough around the edges. She apparently lacks refinement, and she needs lessons in protocol. But these are not issues that cannot be overcome and in any case PA and the Palace have not made any indication that she is being reared for this role(as one of the Moderators pointed out)
So why all the opprobrium?
Can we please move on? I clicked the thread thinking that there was something new with Prince Albert and Charlene's relationship and that's what I am on this forum. Can we get back on track and just talk about their relationship? It's getting boring. Please post when you have something new to say about them. Thank you.
I don't know if you are referring to me specifically in this message. On the chance that you ARE?? A) I am not young. I am middle aged. B) I don't expect to be "coddled" or "consoled" by you or anyone else on a message board Forum. C) I am not ignorant, or uninformed on any subject I choose to address here. D)I have never posted a "tirade" I don't care about being ignored by you or anyone. I am accustomed to being ignored here since I obviously don't share the majority view. That is fine with me.
Finally, I am not invested in any "fairy tale" regarding CW. I am too old for fairy tales and too jaded to believe in them. I DO believe in fairness and in giving people a chance. This was ingrained in me from childhood as part of an upbringing as a member of a minority race in America. I want to be given a chance and don't want my mistakes held against me forever, therefore I extend that courtesy to others. It's all quite simple.
I came to this board after lurking for many months and reading post after post. I read all the articles. I read your opinions. Guess what, ma'am?? I STILL DON'T AGREE WITH MOST OF YOU AND FIND SOME OF YOUR STATEMENTS PETTY, ILL-FOUNDED AND EVEN RUDE. You have the right to say the same thing about me, as doubtless you have or will.
I find it curious that any time a positive article appears about CW in any peridodical it is usually dismissed here as propaganda or white washing. Any negative thing is pounced upon as gospel. If anyone can explain this to me I'd be delighted.
The moderators have to come to this particular Board and issue admonishments more than any other. That tells me everything I need to know about the vaunted "intelligence" and fairness of the posts and posters.
The problem seems to be that many of you don't like being disagreed with and take any opposition to your opinion as an "attack" (I keep hearing that word. My conclusion is that we have vastly different ideas about what it means to attack another person vs. oppose or disagree with them)
Personally I like your posts even though I disagree with your opinions most of the time. At least you had always backed up your opinions by explaining your point of view which it seems to be much more liberal/less demanding then mine. Also I know by now that Miraglia "loves" Charlene and is openly ruting for her to become next princess... so everything Charlene does and wears is just sooo beautiful. It took me some time to accept her gushing over Charlene, since I haven't found any deepth in her (Charlene). Now I even find Miraglia's explanation, that she likes Charlene just because she likes her and that is all that matter to her, very cute.
Posters that are annoying to me are ones that pop up only when there is a "nice" photo of Charlene, which is not very often, and make statements that Charlene is the best thing ever to happen to PA, that she is the most beautiful girl by his side ever, that she looks nice and should be a Princess..... I find that ridiculous....
If PA was my neighbor I would said go for it, since I have seen many successful men marrying a dumb girls just to divorce in a few years after they (girls) had got kids and had financially secure their future. I could care less for one more idiot. Unfortunately for PA he happened to be a Prince and his wife won't just be his wife, but she will have an important job to do. At least i would expect that to be true. If PA's expectations are so low then be it. He didn't have to wait this long to do that!JMO
Charlene is who she is and there must be a good reason why PA is keeping her around, which we might never find out. I have no problem with that either!
My "problem" is A) that there are posters who believe "she" only needs to look nice to be married to PA, and B)that PA is bringing her places where she doesn't belong until she is his wife or at least his fiancee.
So...that's all! Ahhhh maaaan.........I am ready to move on! I am starting to annoy myself!!!
Hi RP, thanks for your kind and thoughtful response. I am actually more conservative regarding Royals than I appear to be in posts. During the unfortunate saga of the Prince and Princess of Wales, I was often apalled at Diana's behavior and found her dishonest and manipulative. "The People's Princess" stuff didn't move me at all, and I thought it was awful the way the populace badgered the Queen into "showing emotion" and attempting to force the poor woman into a display of grief that she perhaps did not feel.(at Diana's death) It disappointed me, because I always thought that the Brits were more dignified. BUT...I am not a fan of Camilla Parker Bowles and on the whole I admired the late Princess much more than her.
This current crop of Royal wives also disturbs me for many reasons. I am certain that Mette Marit Hoiby is a lovely woman in person, but I was appalled at the way Haakon apparently forced this woman upon his country by threatening to step down if he was not allowed to marry her...Mette Marit was involved with a crook and has a child by him. Even once they were given permission to marry, they flouted convention by living together openly up to the wedding, which was disgraceful. I think Johan Friso's wife Mabel Smit is another bad example of this current 20th Century and Western phenomenon of Royals choosing love above all other considerations when choosing a life partner. It's not that simple for them, sorry they are not like you and me in some areas.
Even Princesses Caroline and Stephanie have, in my eyes, done much to lower the bar on what is acceptable behavior among princely and aristocratic women.
In the case of CW, my personal choice is that PA would choose a woman who can contribute something to his Principality in terms of social awareness, intelligence and yes elegance and looks. Failing that I think she should at the very least be a DECENT HUMAN BEING who is capable of changing and growing. The jury is still out on whether Charlene is that person. I am not convinced that PA has any intention of marrying her or anyone else, I think he-like his siblings-is spoilt and entitled and sort of enjoys thumbing his nose.
He might feel that the succession is secure through The Princess of Hanover and her children. I think he is failing in his duty in this area, personally.
I agree with you. I don't feel Royal brides should be chosen in the area of looks alone. Everyone wants an attractive Princess, no one wants a homely one and that is understandable. I think people who come to the Forum and "ooh and ahhh" that CW would make a fine Princess based on how well she wears clothes are really being naive.
I know that my obsession with wanting fairness and balance might have made me appear more strident and intolerant than I actually am, and for that I apologize.
I will try harder to tone down my rhetoric in the future and maybe add some humor to the dialogue here.
This current crop of Royal wives also disturbs me for many reasons. I am certain that Mette Marit Hoiby is a lovely woman in person, but I was appalled at the way Haakon apparently forced this woman upon his country by threatening to step down if he was not allowed to marry her...Mette Marit was involved with a crook and has a child by him. Even once they were given permission to marry, they flouted convention by living together openly up to the wedding, which was disgraceful. I think Johan Friso's wife Mabel Smit is another bad example of this current 20th Century and Western phenomenon of Royals choosing love above all other considerations when choosing a life partner. It's not that simple for them, sorry they are not like you and me in some areas.
Even Princesses Caroline and Stephanie have, in my eyes, done much to lower the bar on what is acceptable behavior among princely and aristocratic women.
I agree with you. I don't feel Royal brides should be chosen in the area of looks alone. Everyone wants an attractive Princess, no one wants a homely one and that is understandable. I think people who come to the Forum and "ooh and ahhh" that CW would make a fine Princess based on how well she wears clothes are really being naive.
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I seconed that! I just hope that PA won't follow the trend and choose the most unsuitable person for his wife. He would be much safer/better staying unmarried then to marry wrong one, especially at his age. Also, he is the only one from the European Royalties that actually rules.
While I think that it is a very romantic to put love above everything else, when it comes to royal marriages there are many other things to be considered as well. Royals can't have everything, something has to give, after all they do live "different" lives from us "mere mortals" and there should have much higher standards at least when choosing a spouse. Royal title does come with some sacrifice, after all! If ones can't handle it they should just move aside and give up all privileges. Otherwise why not be like everyone else if they want to live by the standards of ordinary folks.