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  #421  
Old 02-20-2020, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
I'm sure that personally the family really hates to consider that a divorce may be on the horizon. However, they're nothing if not pragmatic and they typically will have prepared for the possibilities, especially because we have no idea whet's really gone on behind the scenes. We don't know what kind of warning signs they may have seen that have precipitated this "leaving the door open for a year" idea. Especially when you consider that the honorary military titles are basically "on hold." Personally I suspect that it might be a combination of things...they might very well be thinking that it's likely Harry will be back within a year. They might also have done this as a sort of PR move to show that they're not cutting them out. It might be a combination of both those things and more. I tend to be one of those who don't really anticipate seeing Meghan in the UK after this transition. I'm not surprised that she has to be there for a few days during this period because it is, after all, a transitional period. Whether she shows up after that is still a giant question and I personally don't really think she will. I also tend to agree with those posters who said that her behavior in January really very much looked like a "she couldn't get out of there fast enough" run back to Canada. I really don't know what to expect with this last round of engagements. I personally think we might see them arrive without Archie and that Meghan will return to Canada immediately after her engagements are finished while Harry will return after his engagements, much the same setup as we saw in January.
I thought that Harry's honorary military titles had now gone to Anne.. They may say they will review things in a year, but I agree that Meghan's behaviour In January suggested she did not want to stay..
If things go pear shaped in the next year, and they are not that well off or Harry isn't all htat happy in Canada they may decide to return and Im sure the family would like to see them back and certainly don't want to be seen as brutally cutting htem off. But I think that Meg unless things go wrong, will settle back in N Amer and wont return except for visits.
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  #422  
Old 02-20-2020, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I thought that Harry's honorary military titles had now gone to Anne.. They may say they will review things in a year, but I agree that Meghan's behaviour In January suggested she did not want to stay..
If things go pear shaped in the next year, and they are not that well off or Harry isn't all htat happy in Canada they may decide to return and Im sure the family would like to see them back and certainly don't want to be seen as brutally cutting htem off. But I think that Meg unless things go wrong, will settle back in N Amer and wont return except for visits.
Anne has been made captain General of the Royal Marines, the position Harry got from his grandfather before his wedding. Harry still holds other honorary ranks, including promotions he received after retiring. These are what are under consideration still.

I don’t think Harry will miss UK as much as people think. People become expats every year. He and Meghan are not in exile. They will return various times a year for patronage’s as well as to see family and friends.
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  #423  
Old 02-20-2020, 02:52 PM
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Quote:
People become expats every year.
They do indeed, but the ones that succeed in it, are [in my experience] those with a core mental stability, that 'travels with them' throughout life, wherever it may take them geographically.
Those I know that have not 'made a go of it', were fragile, and were 'running away' from something, rather than 'to something'

It seems to me that Sussex falls into the latter category..
  #424  
Old 02-20-2020, 02:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Countessmeout View Post
Anne has been made captain General of the Royal Marines, the position Harry got from his grandfather before his wedding. Harry still holds other honorary ranks, including promotions he received after retiring. These are what are under consideration still.

I don’t think Harry will miss UK as much as people think. People become expats every year. He and Meghan are not in exile. They will return various times a year for patronage’s as well as to see family and friends.
He may like Canada, but it is not his native land and while they may return for a week or 2 here and there, to do engagements, he is not likely to live here again unless he makes the choice to come back. Its not really possible IMO to live between 2 countries with a small child..and I believe that Meghan does not want to live in the UK any more. So harry has to choose either he stays with her, and lives in Canada, or he splits wit her. Maybe he wont miss England, but IMO if he had had a free choice, he would have chosen Africa rather than Canada, if he wanted to go away...
  #425  
Old 02-20-2020, 03:25 PM
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Except Anne hasn't been made Captain General of the Royal Marines yet unless an announcement has been made that I am unaware of. Did I miss it? From the statements yesterday it stated Harry was keeping this position in this transition period.
  #426  
Old 02-20-2020, 03:55 PM
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Who knows what will be posted here in a year....

Today, for me, it’s cut and run. I don’t see financial independence when, imo, it looks like they are still being “kept”. For as often as we’ve discussed Harry saying he wanted to leave, he didn’t for whatever his reason. I think he was given an ultimatum this time.

There’s a sweetness of self satisfaction climbing the ladder of success when you place your foot on each new rung. I don’t see it here with Harry, instead, I see Meghan getting a boost.
  #427  
Old 02-20-2020, 03:55 PM
Countessmeout's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Denville View Post
He may like Canada, but it is not his native land and while they may return for a week or 2 here and there, to do engagements, he is not likely to live here again unless he makes the choice to come back. Its not really possible IMO to live between 2 countries with a small child..and I believe that Meghan does not want to live in the UK any more. So harry has to choose either he stays with her, and lives in Canada, or he splits wit her. Maybe he wont miss England, but IMO if he had had a free choice, he would have chosen Africa rather than Canada, if he wanted to go away...

...Perhaps like most mature minded adults he realized moving permanently to Africa with a young child might not be the safest or economically sound idea. That both he and Megan have links to Canada and the USA and it makes most sense as a family.


Millions of expats choose to live abroad every year...It’s a choice and new opportunities. And unlike many expats he has the money to return numerous times during the year. Even when Archie stats school there are about three months a year they can return and not interrupt schooling.

Just because she doesn’t want to live there full time doesn’t mean she doesn’t plan to return for her patronage’s. She also had her own friends who live there. They wouldn’t keep paying Frogmorr if they didn’t intend using it.
  #428  
Old 02-20-2020, 04:11 PM
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There is still no guarantee that the Duke and Duchess will be able to stay in Canada . Whilst the Duchess may have enjoyed the mix of publicity necessitated by her career, combined with the social /legal protection of her privacy available in Canada, this came about because her job qualified her to live in the country . I can certainly understand why the couple would find this an attractive format .
However neither the Duchess or Duke currently fulfil any criteria except as visitors . I understand from previous posts they cannot earn a living as such ?
  #429  
Old 02-20-2020, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Countessmeout View Post
Anne has been made captain General of the Royal Marines, the position Harry got from his grandfather before his wedding. Harry still holds other honorary ranks, including promotions he received after retiring. These are what are under consideration still.


Anne has not been made Captain General of the Royal Marines.

There’s nothing under consideration, Henry won’t partake in any engagements for his honorary positions which are (Canadian Ranger, Commodore-in-Chief of Small Ships and Diving, Air Commandant of RAF Honington and his Royal Marines role).

Henry was given the ranks of lieutenant Commander, Major and Squadron Leader in May 2018, these won’t be taken away either.
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  #430  
Old 02-20-2020, 04:23 PM
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At least now we're getting a bit more information on things that will actually happen such as Harry and Meghan's return to the UK and the events on their schedule for that time slot. As I see it, it still does fall under the heading of being senior working royals for the "Firm". We also have a final date of March 31st that will denote the actual transition to their private life. What is planned for that private life that has been established starting April 1st is not public knowledge yet. This tells me that nothing will be announced until *after* they've fulfilled the final engagements on their calendar.

To me, this shows respect for the "Firm" and the commitment they made to do these events. I'm really not feeling any animosity here between the Sussexes and the BRF at all. The family isn't treating Harry and Meghan in the manner, to borrow from Harry Potter books, as "they who shall not be named". There is also the impression given with the statement of a review after 12 months, that things will be looked over and reviewed. To me, that doesn't hint at failure or bringing them back into the "fold" but perhaps to see just how its working, how it may fit into the statement H&M made stating they'd "continuing to honour our duty to The Queen, the Commonwealth, and our patronages".

Although totally separated from the "Firm" and, in all probability, relinquishing the use of the word "Royal" in their private foundation (they *do* need permission to use that word in the UK and I don't see them using different names for their foundation in the UK and elsewhere), it is very possible to me that there may be even some collaboration and support and working together even on some incentives together where the Sussex foundation works in conjunction with other non-Firm related endeavors.

An example of this would be the collaboration between Harry's incentive "Walk for America" which happened in the summer of 2018 which, if one looks at the Walking for the Wounded website, has quite a few corporate sponsors. There may be collaboration, for example, between two foundations backing the "Heads Together" incentive or the "United for Wildlife" incentive (do we know if Harry is no longer an ambassador for this cause?).

It may be within the realm of possibilities that we're just assuming that to be "financially independent" means that they're searching for ways to line their own pockets and garner a heftier bank account. I'm still leaning towards the idea that by that statement, they meant they want their foundation and their philanthropic work to be privately funded outside of the Sovereign Grant and its restrictions but their lifestyle, their goals and ambitions still lean towards doing the work they've already established.

I also think that they will be both in the UK far more than what we've been assuming them to be. No where has Meghan stated she doesn't like the UK. No where was it stated that North America is preferred over the UK. Their original ambition was to be able to do both their work in the UK already established and also have time to create a new family life privately. The only thing that really changed is not being allowed to be "part time" for the Firm.

Right now everything concerning their private life is the elephant in the room and we all know elephants have wrinkles to regulate their body temperatures. The transition period and the forthcoming review are to inspect those wrinkles and see how well they're protecting that elephant and its temperature and maybe even supporting and working with that elephant to the benefit of everyone.

Just thoughts here.
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  #431  
Old 02-20-2020, 04:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
It may be within the realm of possibilities that we're just assuming that to be "financially independent" means that they're searching for ways to line their own pockets and garner a heftier bank account. I'm still leaning towards the idea that by that statement, they meant they want their foundation and their philanthropic work to be privately funded outside of the Sovereign Grant and its restrictions but their lifestyle, their goals and ambitions still lean towards doing the work they've already established.
I honestly never thought independent meant making their own money. I just figured it meant not depending in anything the BRF does as an entity. So not the royal rota and no money. But a lot of people focus on the word “brand” and think Sussex Royal will be some kind of for profit company. That was never what it was supposed to be. At least not to me.
  #432  
Old 02-20-2020, 05:05 PM
ACO ACO is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elenath View Post
I honestly never thought independent meant making their own money. I just figured it meant not depending in anything the BRF does as an entity. So not the royal rota and no money. But a lot of people focus on the word “brand” and think Sussex Royal will be some kind of for profit company. That was never what it was supposed to be. At least not to me.
I agree with a lot of this. People fixate on thing and assume everything whether accurate or not. It just seemed to me that they realized that while tied to the public purse via tax dollars they couldn't do certain things. So removing that frees them to be able to work with different people and explore other avenues.

So far many have been off the mark and no doubt will continue to be because we really have zero idea what their plans going forward will be. But per their statement it seems that once they are in a good place with their foundation we will all learn more. Until then it is just a waiting game but their time as working royals will be over come April 1.
  #433  
Old 02-20-2020, 05:32 PM
Serene Highness
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
At least now we're getting a bit more information on things that will actually happen such as Harry and Meghan's return to the UK and the events on their schedule for that time slot. As I see it, it still does fall under the heading of being senior working royals for the "Firm". We also have a final date of March 31st that will denote the actual transition to their private life. What is planned for that private life that has been established starting April 1st is not public knowledge yet. This tells me that nothing will be announced until *after* they've fulfilled the final engagements on their calendar.

To me, this shows respect for the "Firm" and the commitment they made to do these events. I'm really not feeling any animosity here between the Sussexes and the BRF at all. The family isn't treating Harry and Meghan in the manner, to borrow from Harry Potter books, as "they who shall not be named". There is also the impression given with the statement of a review after 12 months, that things will be looked over and reviewed. To me, that doesn't hint at failure or bringing them back into the "fold" but perhaps to see just how its working, how it may fit into the statement H&M made stating they'd "continuing to honour our duty to The Queen, the Commonwealth, and our patronages".

Although totally separated from the "Firm" and, in all probability, relinquishing the use of the word "Royal" in their private foundation (they *do* need permission to use that word in the UK and I don't see them using different names for their foundation in the UK and elsewhere), it is very possible to me that there may be even some collaboration and support and working together even on some incentives together where the Sussex foundation works in conjunction with other non-Firm related endeavors.

An example of this would be the collaboration between Harry's incentive "Walk for America" which happened in the summer of 2018 which, if one looks at the Walking for the Wounded website, has quite a few corporate sponsors. There may be collaboration, for example, between two foundations backing the "Heads Together" incentive or the "United for Wildlife" incentive (do we know if Harry is no longer an ambassador for this cause?).

It may be within the realm of possibilities that we're just assuming that to be "financially independent" means that they're searching for ways to line their own pockets and garner a heftier bank account. I'm still leaning towards the idea that by that statement, they meant they want their foundation and their philanthropic work to be privately funded outside of the Sovereign Grant and its restrictions but their lifestyle, their goals and ambitions still lean towards doing the work they've already established.

I also think that they will be both in the UK far more than what we've been assuming them to be. No where has Meghan stated she doesn't like the UK. No where was it stated that North America is preferred over the UK. Their original ambition was to be able to do both their work in the UK already established and also have time to create a new family life privately. The only thing that really changed is not being allowed to be "part time" for the Firm.

Right now everything concerning their private life is the elephant in the room and we all know elephants have wrinkles to regulate their body temperatures. The transition period and the forthcoming review are to inspect those wrinkles and see how well they're protecting that elephant and its temperature and maybe even supporting and working with that elephant to the benefit of everyone.

Just thoughts here.
I guess Osipi I see things differently.....

For me, they showed how much respect they have for the Firm in the way they released their statement, which included “and work to become financially independent”. I take them at their word.

The statement, imo, was done so they would have no over sight. Line their own pockets is just a thought I can’t get past. I do think they will have charitable endeavors.

Addressing their situation in a year, again imo, gives Harry some breathing room in case, sadly, there is a separation.

Coming back to fulfill commitments is nice. Neither you nor I really know how that was even worked out.

At this point, I’m a cynic. They chose to play hardball.
  #434  
Old 02-20-2020, 05:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
At least now we're getting a bit more information on things that will actually happen such as Harry and Meghan's return to the UK and the events on their schedule for that time slot. As I see it, it still does fall under the heading of being senior working royals for the "Firm". We also have a final date of March 31st that will denote the actual transition to their private life. What is planned for that private life that has been established starting April 1st is not public knowledge yet. This tells me that nothing will be announced until *after* they've fulfilled the final engagements on their calendar.

To me, this shows respect for the "Firm" and the commitment they made to do these events. I'm really not feeling any animosity here between the Sussexes and the BRF at all. The family isn't treating Harry and Meghan in the manner, to borrow from Harry Potter books, as "they who shall not be named". There is also the impression given with the statement of a review after 12 months, that things will be looked over and reviewed. To me, that doesn't hint at failure or bringing them back into the "fold" but perhaps to see just how its working, how it may fit into the statement H&M made stating they'd "continuing to honour our duty to The Queen, the Commonwealth, and our patronages".

Although totally separated from the "Firm" and, in all probability, relinquishing the use of the word "Royal" in their private foundation (they *do* need permission to use that word in the UK and I don't see them using different names for their foundation in the UK and elsewhere), it is very possible to me that there may be even some collaboration and support and working together even on some incentives together where the Sussex foundation works in conjunction with other non-Firm related endeavors.

An example of this would be the collaboration between Harry's incentive "Walk for America" which happened in the summer of 2018 which, if one looks at the Walking for the Wounded website, has quite a few corporate sponsors. There may be collaboration, for example, between two foundations backing the "Heads Together" incentive or the "United for Wildlife" incentive (do we know if Harry is no longer an ambassador for this cause?).

It may be within the realm of possibilities that we're just assuming that to be "financially independent" means that they're searching for ways to line their own pockets and garner a heftier bank account. I'm still leaning towards the idea that by that statement, they meant they want their foundation and their philanthropic work to be privately funded outside of the Sovereign Grant and its restrictions but their lifestyle, their goals and ambitions still lean towards doing the work they've already established.

I also think that they will be both in the UK far more than what we've been assuming them to be. No where has Meghan stated she doesn't like the UK. No where was it stated that North America is preferred over the UK. Their original ambition was to be able to do both their work in the UK already established and also have time to create a new family life privately. The only thing that really changed is not being allowed to be "part time" for the Firm.

Right now everything concerning their private life is the elephant in the room and we all know elephants have wrinkles to regulate their body temperatures. The transition period and the forthcoming review are to inspect those wrinkles and see how well they're protecting that elephant and its temperature and maybe even supporting and working with that elephant to the benefit of everyone.

Just thoughts here.
I love your thoughts!

I mean, if I'm going to look at it positively, the fact that Harry and Meghan didn't want to completely ditch the BRF (granted, they wanted to pick and choose) indicates that they weren't actually prepared to make a complete break. That would explain why their plans seemed so haphazard.....and it would explain reports that they were taken aback/surprised/shocked that their half-in, half-out plan wasn't workable in the end.

I'm mostly excited to see the family reunited again.
  #435  
Old 02-20-2020, 07:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Elenath View Post
I honestly never thought independent meant making their own money. I just figured it meant not depending in anything the BRF does as an entity.
Yep, I had similiar thoughts! Because the life as a charity person makes only sense if one has money; you got to be loaded with it like Melinda and Bill Gates and their Foundation.

So, if Meghan and Harry want to give, they better have already... - otherwise it would look like stealing from the needy. Real Royals have already the problem, that it is said, they are leechers on the expense of the tax payers and do not really work.

Meghan and Harry can't have a luxurious life as charity entrepreneurs!
  #436  
Old 02-21-2020, 02:36 AM
Serene Highness
 
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I completely agree with the people who've said that the word "brand" is confusing. It makes them sound like McDonald's or Coca-Cola.
  #437  
Old 02-21-2020, 03:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
I completely agree with the people who've said that the word "brand" is confusing. It makes them sound like McDonald's or Coca-Cola.
Exactly. Same problem with the trademarks despite the fact that the rest have done the exact same thing. Trademarks and brands = profit apparently.
  #438  
Old 02-21-2020, 04:17 AM
Majesty
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elenath View Post
I honestly never thought independent meant making their own money. I just figured it meant not depending in anything the BRF does as an entity. So not the royal rota and no money. But a lot of people focus on the word “brand” and think Sussex Royal will be some kind of for profit company. That was never what it was supposed to be. At least not to me.
what else can independent MEAN but making their own money and not being dependent on allowances from his fater?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
I love your thoughts!

I mean, if I'm going to look at it positively, the fact that Harry and Meghan didn't want to completely ditch the BRF (granted, they wanted to pick and choose) indicates that they weren't actually prepared to make a complete break. That would explain why their plans seemed so haphazard.....and it would explain reports that they were taken aback/surprised/shocked that their half-in, half-out plan wasn't workable in the end.

I'm mostly excited to see the family reunited again.
No, they didn't want to "ditch the BRF" they wantd to be half and half, which wasn't a workable plan and Harry at least should have known that. So why put it forward? And I don't think the family is going to be "reunited". Harry and Meg will come back for a short time, to do engagements, and perhaps for Bea's wedding.. and other events like that. But IMO their life is in N America now unless things don't go well and they come back here, ready to live in Frogmore again and see what kind of life they can make here. I don't think that "coming over to do a few charity engagemetns" is going to work out for too long. They will be busy with their business in Canada, they will have a small child that will have to be taken into account, and hopping ot the UK now and again wont be practical. They will remain members of the family, they are not being treated as outside the family, lke the DOW was, but All the same there may well be tension about their decision to walk away...

Quote:
Originally Posted by victor1319 View Post
Yep, I had similiar thoughts! Because the life as a charity person makes only sense if one has money; you got to be loaded with it like Melinda and Bill Gates and their Foundation.

So, if Meghan and Harry want to give, they better have already... - otherwise it would look like stealing from the needy. Real Royals have already the problem, that it is said, they are leechers on the expense of the tax payers and do not really work.

Meghan and Harry can't have a luxurious life as charity entrepreneurs!
so if Harry and Megan don't make money how are they going to fund this charity wrok that they are going to do?
  #439  
Old 02-21-2020, 05:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
so if Harry and Megan don't make money how are they going to fund this charity wrok that they are going to do?


That’s what sponsors are for. For example polo matches that are for charity, the people that run the charity don’t pay for the event, the get sponsors on board like jewellery brands, banks etc who fund the event in return for exposure on a huge stage.

That’s what events like at JP Morgan and networking are exactly for.
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  #440  
Old 02-21-2020, 05:18 AM
Majesty
 
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Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
That’s what sponsors are for. For example polo matches that are for charity, the people that run the charity don’t pay for the event, the get sponsors on board like jewellery brands, banks etc who fund the event in return for exposure on a huge stage.

That’s what events like at JP Morgan and networking are exactly for.
My understanding was that they wanted to be free to earn a "professional income" and to use at least some of that money to be channelled into the charities they wanted to support. Why did they talk about financial independence and a professional income if they don't intend to make money for themselves (and their charities)...
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