The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #781  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:25 PM
Commoner
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Memphis, United States
Posts: 12
I’m not being critical of Harry and Meghan’s choices or making a fuss over it, but I do think it’s fair to have a discussion on Archie’s title. Even if he is a three day old baby.

I’d be really surprised if Harry and Meghan’s children become Prince/Princess when Charles becomes king. I expect a new LP to be issued. I just don’t see the point in calling him Archie “to give him the best chance a normal life” if he’ll become Prince Archie before his tenth birthday.

I think I personally just find the lack of clarity about it odd. I don’t really see the point of not using Earl of Dumbarton from birth. Of course he’ll just be Archie to the family, but letting him publicly be known as Earl seems fine. The Gloucester and Kent families still use subsidiary titles and Lord/Lady and it hasn’t greatly effected their lives. I don’t think being Lady Louise or Viscount Severn has effected the Wessex children any. Archie is always going to be famous and scrutinized. But because he’s Harry and Meghan’s child, Diana’s grandson. Having him be regular Master Archie in the court circular won’t change that.

Of course the fact that everyone is happy and healthy is paramount. But titles and styles interest me and I find this decision curious.

Edit: I get the point of “why” does he need the subsidiary title. He doesn’t. It doesn’t change anything. I just wonder “why not?”
__________________

  #782  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:28 PM
duchessrachel's Avatar
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Birmingham, United States
Posts: 1,089
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dman View Post
The HRH will come the moment Charles ascends to the throne. HRH Prince Archie. For right now, he’s just Archie.
Would Harry and Meghan have the right to turn that down? If so, I hope they don't, but then I am not them. They have to do what they think is best
__________________

  #783  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:29 PM
MaiaMia_53's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Midwest, United States
Posts: 1,918
I wonder if we'll ever find out if the comics character 'Archie Andrews' is little Archie Harrison's name inspiration.

https://slate.com/culture/2017/01/th...-reviewed.html


The name Archie apparently means 'genuine, precious,' whereas the 'bald' in Archibald actually means 'bold' or 'brave.'

Since Harrison means 'Harry's son,' it follows that Master Archie Harrison Mountbatten-Windsor is and will be a 'brave, bold' young man who is 'genuinely Harry's son.'

IOW, Archie of Sussex will surely display many of Prince Harry's outgoing and genuine, down-to-earth traits, along with exhibiting his own very unique personality.


I totally agree with the sentiment that if the Sussexes didn't wish for Archie to be called Earl of Dumbarton, why not use the 'Lord' title? I suppose we can always expect the Sussexes to do things their own way. I wonder if it's mainly Prince Harry who is against using titles for Archie, at least at this stage, and likely forever?
  #784  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:30 PM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: small town, United States
Posts: 88
I did not think of the title Lord. That would be appropriate.
  #785  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:39 PM
Rena M.'s Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Location: Kraków, Poland
Posts: 134
Anne’s children don't have titles and are free to work, earn money, don't have problems finding spouses, don't have to dress up in costumes straight out of ''Father Brown'' etc. Harry just wants a better life for his son. That's all and a common name like Archie is perfect to blend in.
Archie Harrison - genuine, bold and valuable son of Harry.
I like it
__________________
Yasmin Alibhai-Brown, "Bigoted Brits will be infuriated and unforgiving. I am already getting emails about how “the woman will pollute the bloodline” and stain national purity" https://inews.co.uk/opinion/columnis...tional-family/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCzAp5IhyL4
  #786  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:40 PM
MaiaMia_53's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Midwest, United States
Posts: 1,918
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
Frankly, not being British , I am more annoyed by their use of the media than by the baby's name and title (or lack thereof).

Harry and Meghan didn't want to do the Lindo Wing steps photo, which is perfectly fine. No mother who just gave birth should be forced to do that if she doesn't want to and feels OK with it.

However, they replaced the comparatively spontaneous (and democractic) steps photo with a highly staged (and controlled) media presentation of the baby using a historic hall of Windsor Castle as backdrop and including pictures of the Queen and the DoE. The fact that happened in the Queen's home and that the Queen agreed to pose for pictures indicates she approves it, but still that degree of pomp and circumstance is odd for a collateral line of the Royal Family.

I don't want to sound mean and rain on the couple's parade (after all, they must be rightfully thrilled with baby Archie), but I am honestly starting to believe that "what Meghan wants, Meghan gets".
Oh my. I think you are being rather harsh with these comments. Especially on such a happy, exciting and celebratory occasion as this.

I wish the Sussexes well, and I will be donating to a few of their charities in honor of Master Archie.
  #787  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:42 PM
Zaira's Avatar
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: A, United States
Posts: 1,216
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
Frankly, not being British , I am more annoyed by their use of the media than by the baby's name and title (or lack thereof).


Harry and Meghan didn't want to do the Lindo Wing steps photo, which is perfectly fine. No mother who just gave birth should be forced to do that if she doesn't want to and feels OK with it.



However, they replaced the comparatively spontaneous (and democractic) steps photo with a highly staged (and controlled) media presentation of the baby using a historic hall of Windsor Castle as backdrop and including pictures of the Queen and the DoE. The fact that happened in the Queen's home and that the Queen agreed to pose for pictures indicates she approves it, but still that degree of pomp and circumstance is odd for a collateral line of the Royal Family.



I don't want to sound mean and rain on the couple's parade (after all, they must be rightfully thrilled with baby Archie), but I am honestly starting to believe that "what Meghan wants, Meghan gets".
Again, with this sole focus on Meghan when we have no indication it was her demands.

In fact, Harry has been the one front and center throughout this. Surprisingly so actually.

As it is, I think these two are a team of equals and made decisions together about what is best, what is expected and what the compromise is, in consultation with the Queen, Charles and their staff.
  #788  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:45 PM
MaiaMia_53's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Midwest, United States
Posts: 1,918
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaira View Post
Again, with this sole focus on Meghan when we have no indication it was her demands.

In fact, Harry has been the one front and center throughout this.
I think this is very true regarding titles. Plus, for sure we all know how much Prince Harry is determined to protect his family's privacy.

In her previous life, while Meghan was always discreet and classy, she often shared pictures of her dogs along with lovely, instructive details about her life that were focused on celebrating the joys of living and caring about others.

To not see even a peep of anything about Guy or the new labrador dog, it seems to me that Meghan is adhering to Harry's wishes, because she realizes this royal fishbowl world has been a heavy burden for him, and that he doesn't want his children to necessarily have to feel burdened.

So the Sussexes will obviously try to make their offspring's lives as normal as possible, which doesn't mean they don't or won't live luxuriously well. Still, M&H are both driven by giving back to others, which passion will surely be somewhat transferred to their children by example.
  #789  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:49 PM
ACO ACO is offline
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: New York, United States
Posts: 3,589
They don't want titles. It is what it is. I respect their decision about their child. I don't see them accepting HRH but I won't say it as fact because things can change but that is likely what will happen.
  #790  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:50 PM
Commoner
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Lawrenceville, United States
Posts: 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaira View Post
Again, with this sole focus on Meghan when we have no indication it was her demands.

In fact, Harry has been the one front and center throughout this.
I am seeing that is the way on this board. Everything done be this couple is wrong and it is always "hollywood" Meghan leading him down the wrong path. Good to know.
  #791  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:54 PM
Zaira's Avatar
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: A, United States
Posts: 1,216
Lovely little bit with PA Reporter Alan who led both interviews (Harry's Monday and the family photocall today). Low key, but highly respected journalist from what RRs are saying on twitter.

Also of interest to me, the Sussexes are 2/2 for having journalists of color lead their big family moments (engagement and now family photocall).

https://twitter.com/itvnews/status/1...094873088?s=19
  #792  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:55 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Herefordshire, United Kingdom
Posts: 3,397
Quote:
They don't want titles.
So why can't they be honest and consistent -renounce their titles, become plain mr/mrs and waltz off somewhere abroad for the life of privacy they so clearly desire...?
  #793  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:59 PM
Leopoldine's Avatar
Courtier
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: New York, United States
Posts: 753
I love the name. Archie is short and informal enough so that the tabloids can't shorten it or take it down a peg. I was thinking of William being dubbed "Wills" and Andrew being called "Andy".

Perhaps a title will come later in life, depending on the number of working royals needed to support the monarch.
  #794  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:59 PM
ACO ACO is offline
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: New York, United States
Posts: 3,589
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyevale View Post
So why can't they be honest and consistent -renounce their titles, become plain mr/mrs and waltz off somewhere abroad for the life of privacy they so clearly desire...?
Why do they have to do that? They know their role and doing their job but their child will not be a working royal. I find this fascinating seeing people suddenly wanting this baby to have a title when most spent the better part of the year saying it would be better for their child to NOT have it. Now that it has happened it is suddenly an issue? Color me confused.
  #795  
Old 05-08-2019, 05:59 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Wherever, United States
Posts: 5,875
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyevale View Post
So why can't they be honest and consistent -renounce their titles, become plain mr/mrs and waltz off somewhere abroad for the life of privacy they so clearly desire...?
Out of curiosity, do you think every parent that does not give their children titles as babies should give up their own titles? How about Princess Anne? Her children will never have titles. Should she just say I'm done with this Princess thing and waltz off somewhere abroad? They are working royals, but their child is not and unlikely to be in the future. What's the big deal? Harry as a child of a future monarch, is in a different position than his son. Who can, and should, have much more freedom than he did.
  #796  
Old 05-08-2019, 06:00 PM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: L'angolo, Vatican City
Posts: 250
Agreed - Harry is following the Diana way with less formality. However, the family is also part of the state. It looks like they want a new relationship with the people where they control their public role far more strongly than before. They are making a mistake if they think they can choose to take their son out of the public sphere as part of the state as our national family. If they wanted their family to abdicate from a public status they shouldnt have accepted the dukedom of Sussex. If they really want to be private citizens and not have titles, they have the choice of renouncing all titles, royal status etc.
  #797  
Old 05-08-2019, 06:01 PM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Waterford, United States
Posts: 2,826
Like his American citizenship, the title(s) that Archie has inherited can’t be stripped of him by his parents. Presumably, when he’s 18 or 21 he can decide for himself if he wants to be Lord (or Lady) Dumbarton or Prince (or Princess) Archie, or just plain Mr. M-W.

The doors in the future can’t be effectively closed in the present, but his parents can certainly decide how he is to be addressed and referred to for the time being.
__________________
"If you look for the bad in people expecting to find it, you surely will.”

Abraham Lincoln
  #798  
Old 05-08-2019, 06:03 PM
Courtier
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Top End, Australia
Posts: 757
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyevale View Post
So why can't they be honest and consistent -renounce their titles, become plain mr/mrs and waltz off somewhere abroad for the life of privacy they so clearly desire...?
Because they work for the monarchy and, it would appear, intend to continue working for the monarchy as the Duke and Duchess of Sussex. I'm interpreting it that Archie will not carry out official duties on behalf of the monarch - in the same way Princess Anne carries out official duties but her untitled children do not. In the same way that Princess Margaret carried out official duties and her non-royal children did/do not.
  #799  
Old 05-08-2019, 06:04 PM
Ista's Avatar
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: the West, United States
Posts: 3,293
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACO View Post
Why do they have to do that? They know their role and doing their job but their child will not be a working royal. I find this fascinating seeing people suddenly wanting this baby to have a title when most spent the better part of the year saying it would be better for their child to NOT have it. Now that it has happened it is suddenly an issue. Color me confused.
I think it's more an issue of confusion. Archie has a (courtesy) title, whether it is used for him or not, and he will be an HRH at the death of the Queen, whether it is used or not. All of this is true since no LP's have been issued to change that. Hence, the confusion. There's a discrepancy that is putting everything up in the air, and what it means and what the Sussexes intend by it is all open to interpretation. Whenever there is ambiguity it opens the door to conjecture. I don't see what's so hard to understand about that.
  #800  
Old 05-08-2019, 06:08 PM
Osipi's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: On the west side of North up from Back, United States
Posts: 16,293
Quote:
Originally Posted by wyevale View Post
So why can't they be honest and consistent -renounce their titles, become plain mr/mrs and waltz off somewhere abroad for the life of privacy they so clearly desire...?
Why can't a child that has dual citizenship with parents that are going to be representatives of a Commonwealth of Nations grow up as a global citizen and embrace everything he is and decide for himself, when the time comes, just how he's going to face the world he's living in.

Frankly, the way things are going, titles and styles of this child is really just a small part of who he is going to grow up to be. Of course its part and parcel of his heritage and I don't doubt for a minute he will be aware of every nook and cranny of just who he is and be more involved in a global world than his parents or his grandparents or great grandparents were before him.

I'm glad the kid is going to just be a kid for a very long time. We saw the difference it made with both William and Harry in being allowed to follow their own paths and their inclinations and have seen the results that have come about from that.

Harry and Meghan, the Queen and Charles and most likely other members of the family totally embrace the decisions that have been made. Why can't we?
__________________

__________________
To be yourself in a world that is constantly trying to make you something else is the greatest accomplishment. ~~ Ralph Waldo Emerson ~~
Closed Thread


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 2 (0 members and 2 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Windsor/Mountbatten-Windsor: Name of Royal House and Surname HRH Kimetha British Royals 298 04-06-2021 10:39 PM
Lady Louise Mountbatten-Windsor News and Pictures 3: October 2005-March 2007 Elspeth Current Events Archive 195 06-07-2007 08:24 AM
Lady Louise Mountbatten-Windsor News and Pictures 2: May 2004-October 2005 USCtrojan Current Events Archive 220 10-10-2005 10:51 PM
Lady Louise Mountbatten-Windsor News and Pictures 1: November 2003-May 2004 montecarlo Current Events Archive 157 05-29-2004 01:38 PM




Popular Tags
abu dhabi american american history ancestry archie mountbatten-windsor baptism british british royal family british royals brownbitcoinqueen camilla camilla parker-bowles camilla parker bowles carolin china chinese clarence house commonwealth countries countess of snowdon customs doll dresses duke of sussex earl of snowdon family tree general news thread george vi gradenigo gustaf vi adolf history hochberg house of windsor imperial household italian royal family jack brooksbank jacobite japan jewellery jewelry king edward vii line of succession list of rulers luxembourg maxima meghan markle monarchy nepal nepalese royal jewels pless prince constantijn princess alexia (2005 -) princess chulabhorn walailak princess of orange princess ribha queen consort queen elizabeth ii queen victoria royal jewels royalty of taiwan serbian royal family spain sussex swedish queen thai royal family tradition unfinished portrait united states united states of america welsh wittelsbach


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:22 PM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2021
Jelsoft Enterprises
×