Royal Protocol and Etiquette

If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
I have heard that story re the finger bowl about victoria and an indian guest.

Re wilhelmina, someone told me that she merrily farted at soestdijk when she received dignitaries.

Marengo said:
In the Netherlands most of these rules are already abolished. Only after WWII a courtier had the nerves to tell Queen Wilhelmina that the rule that when she is done with her dinner everybody else should stop as well, caused the guests to go home with an empty stomach (restaurants near the palace were usually filled after a royal banquet). Juliana abolished the curtseying and the walking backwards in a room sas she was afraid somebody would fall and embarrased if old people had to bow.

However some things didnt change. Somebody once started speaking to Queen Wilhelmina, the Queen gave an icely told her lady-in-waiting to inform that person that when in presence of a queen one is not expected to talk first (probably she didn't like the person who spoke as she was usually very courteous in situations like this. Once Paul Kruger attended a banquet at the palace and he mistook the bowl in which you can clean your greasy hands for something to drink from. After the Queen notced that Kruger drank from the bowl she did the same, in rder not to emberras him).
Royal Protocol

Replying to Royal Invitations, if one recieves an invitation from HM The Queen you should respond to it as a Royal Command rather than and Invitation using the formula below:

(Your Name In Full) presents his/their compliments to The (member of the houshold who sent the comand) and has the honour to obey Her Majesty's command to attend (details of the event)

For Example:

The Right Honourable The Prime Minister presents his compliments to the Lord Stewart and has the honour to obey Her Majesty's command to attend the State Banquet in Honour of the Visit of His Excellency The President of Chili on Thursday the Second of September 2005 at seven o'clock.
Warren said:
It was a London tabloid-driven "uproar". Keating touched her back to guide her as he was introducing her to various people.
There was no suggestion from the Palace that the Queen was in any way "offended".
Just another storm in a teacup with a political agenda.

ps.. ref the photo in BeatrixFan's BBC link (post under): the man with his arm around the Queen is not the former Australian Prime Minister Paul Keating.

The man is Louis Garneau, the former cyclist and now a successful businessman and designer of sports wear. He's from Quebec City. He's a caring family man with beautiful values.

The incident took place in Ottawa (Onario) - as the Queen NO LONGER comes anywhere in the province of Quebec after some threatening incidents in the 50s or early 60s and also because of the *&?$()?"!!!!! separatist movement in that province. I can use this languague because I live in that province and I am stuck with that political group BEURK.

As a Quebecer, especially a French-speaking one, it took Garneau lots of courage to show his respect to her Majesty. You can guess that being a monarchist is a big no-no in my province. He took a lot of blame for that after the picture was shown. He remained very respectful of her Majesty saying he was very sorry he broke the protocol and explaining that when the picture was taken he just leaned toward her as she was so nice, just like you would do with your grandma or a lovely grand-aunt.
Former Royals and State Protocal

I'm not sure how to ask this question in an proper way, and thus the reason I didn't do a search (I wasn't sure on how to word the search). So, if this is a question that has been asked, or answered in another thread then I apologize now.

Are former ruling familes, such as the Romonov's, Bourbon's, or any former royal ruling familes, ever given any special treatment? I'm not talking special treatment on taxes or speeding tickets, but in attending state functions, or how they are addressed by members of state? I came across a picture (sorry, I can't find it now) of the funeral of Henri, Comte de Paris, and I got to wondering if anyone from the government would have attended on an "official" basis. Am I making sense? I hope so. Thanks, AdmiralSteven
Protocol - How do Royal people appreciate it ?

It is interesting to see in the medias that some Royal persons are quite rigid with the protocole and seem to appreciate being addressed to and treated like a king, a queen, a prince or a princess with all of the advantages linked to their title...

...while some of them, instead, try to escape from it as often as they can and to have what they think is a "normal life" : they send their boyguards to hell, go shopping "incognito" in the next supermarket, like to chat with people on a bench in a park, walk their dog all alone in the bush, push a baby carriage without the help of any servant.

So I was wondering how each of your favorite Royal appreciates either one or the other type of condition :whistling:
i think most of them like a combination of both postures. while they like being addressed properly (some royals actually demanded people to refer to them as "your royal highness") and all the pomp and circumstance of royal protocol, some others are more laid back and participate in activities that some other royals wouldn't. some prefer a bit of both, depending on the circumstance. i guess it depends on how known you are, what role you have in the family and your age and previous position as commoner or royal by blood.
one story I think fits was when Prince Charles and Prince William went to school (particularly secondary school). Prince Charles always wanted to be addressed as "Your Royal Highness," particularly by teachers, but William just wanted to be addressed only as "William Wales"
The late Queen Juliana dispised protocol. There was a notorious television interview in the 80-ties with Juliana and Bernhard and when Juliana was asked about protocol she became very angry. Talking about how people were mean and used protocol as an excuse to prohibit her from doing things. SHe especially referred to an incident from her youth, when a courtier prohibited her from doing something with protocol and her mother, Queen Wilhelmina as an excuse.

Juliana was still angry about that 70 years later and raised her voice and said that she was absolutely certain that her mother would allow it, as she wanted her daughter to make fun. In the end Juliana was so angry that she was banging her fist on the table. She explained that there isn't such a thing as protocol, it simply doesn't exsist. Prince Bernhard in the mean time was smoking his pipe and clearly enjoyed his wife's tantrum, with the usual sparkle in his eyes he just had to smile.
They would have to ask permission in both countries, the order in which this would be done doesn't seem to be set. It would also depend on if there was a requirement to gain the sovereign's consent on the marriage and not, I think.

Given that Frederick is above the age of 25, he wouldn't have to have the Queen's permission, but if he didn't ask for it, he would have to give notice to the Privy council and then wait 12 calendar months to marry. From what I've gathered from the Royal Marriages act of 1772, anyway. I'm not sure how this would fit into the Act of Settlement from 1701, though?

I suppose as Madeleine is currently 3rd in line in Sweden and Frederick 31st in the UK, as well as the last person in line, it would be more likely to appeal to her father to ask the cabinet for permission for her to wed.
Anybody know where the princess like maxima, learn protocol and etiquette????
So for example, you say, "Did Your Majesty enjoy the performance?" and not "Did you like it?".


If you have read Debrett's you should know not to ask questions!!
Is it impolite ?

I you see a queen or a king or any other royal either on the street or at the exit of a church for instance:

is it impolite or even coarse to adress this person and give her or him a little present and/or tell her/him some kind words ?

Because I read in the Etiquette section that "normal" people are not supposed to adress a Royal first...

Thank you in advance for your information ! ;)
Interesting question, in my opinion, i think that rule would apply in the olden days and not necesarily in this day and age. I'm not sure though, maybe it is still a valid requirement/rule. I don't think a monarch would find it rude if you pay a compliment to them.

Also, if they are in a public place then they should expectpeople wanting to talk or wave at them really.
good question alto as a Texas it goes against my grain to not be polite and friendly. i agee you shouldn't approachat a formal protocol event, but it's a sad day when a friendly good moring while passing on a street is considered impolite. of course "yo queeny" would never do, but a sincere good morning seems ok, imo
I would probably give them space and privacy if they are not on duty. Personally, I would freak if a stranger comes up to me and speak as if they are on familiar terms. I'm not even talking about terrorism, just stalkers (and not just the paparazzi kind) would make such encounters nerve racking. I keep reading about the royals, particularly the younger ones, looking for "normality" or anonimity in daily life. If they are not breaking any laws, I'd leave them alone to walk around in peace.
While I was growing up in the military, we were taught not to talk to a superior (officer or royalty) until spoken to. Of course, one can always send a warm smile their way.
I think its fine to say "Good Morning Your Royal Highness" and perhaps give a bow or quick curtsey, but leave it at that, if they want to speak further I'm sure they will otherwise move on and leave it, after all they want to have a life out of the spotlight.
While I was growing up in the military, we were taught not to talk to a superior (officer or royalty) until spoken to. Of course, one can always send a warm smile their way.

I think much of that depends on whether you see a royal as your superior. The HOS is one thing but there children, grandchildren and siblings are a different matter altogether.
I think I would drop a quick curtsey, look up and smile, then continue on my way. If he/she wanted to further detain me, they would have to make that move.
Thanks to everyone !

Well, I was thinking of a queen I might meet. A lady who knows her well told me she is very simple, doesn't "play queen" in daily life and likes to move around in the city (she meets her regularly while shopping). So if I ever see Her Majesty I do not know what to do. I want to remain respectfull but at the same time express her my true affection.

My respect for this queen is high but I am not good at expressing these things "formally". My "latin side" is prompt to take over...

Well I think I would choose Vanishing Lady's option :flowers: but I guess that with the years Her Majesty is used to receiving the most clumsy expressions of affection from people of all cultural backgrounds !

Thanks to you all again !
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I think the rule "not to initiate a contact" or address a (royal) first is similar to the Knigge ideas of WHo greets whom first who puts out the hand for the handshake first, etc.
In earlier times those rules were enforced quite strictly in every day life. Men would get up when a lady stood and only resume seating once she also sat down, you wouldn't turn your back to your superior, you would not address a superior without seeking his permission. You can find examples of this behaviour in all walks of life up until I would say WWII. And since clocks in the royal palaces tick a bit slower, you still walk backwards (and pretty awkwardly out of the room still facing the Queen and hoping not to bump into some furniture and make a foul of yourself.)
Other than that I don't think that the rules are so much different:
Who would honestly approach Mr. President and yell a friendly : " Yo, George, how is it going?"
On the other hand I have seen pictures of people posing next to the Queen, arm around her shoulder and she smiled sweetly into the camera (didn't hear of any execution afterwards either:lol:)
Well, the established rule is you wait for them to approach you but a simple "Good Morning Ma'am" as they pass is a nice way of making a greeting that isn't too pushy and gives them the opportunity to say the same back or to engage in a longer conversation.
I would agree to you, RoyalProtocol ,
but also i think it depends somehow which royal - A Sheik , The Queen or some young prince, princess and of which country.
But since I dont know anyone returning from such an event - maybe its very dangerous :ROFLMAO: if you dont do it right. The pictures with the Queen might be fakes.

Anyway - I wonder what would really happened if anyone of us meets any or his favourite royal somewhere in public field. (IMO I would hit the nearest lamppost while looking at her and hummling some Aehs,Ohs - so the most impolite way will happen - with some headage :headache:)
I read in a British publication (I can't remember which one), that unless one is a subject of that particular royal, then one is not required to curtsy when they see a royal on the street or in another public place. I do like to think that if I had the pleasure of meeting a royal in person (i.e. if I was to be introduced to Queen Elizabeth at an event), I would still curtsy. Offering my hand would not seem polite, even though I am not her subject. Has anyone read the same thing?
This is an outstanding thread. I am originally from California, and we (Californians) are rather informal people. It is nice to learn about etiquette and courtesies. It seems that these are things of the past in the United States, and this is not a good thing. One thing that makes me especially crazy is seeing people chewing gum in public and men who spit on the sidewalk. I think that polite behavior is not always evident in today's society. This is unfortunate, and perhaps Americans can learn from these rules of etiquette, despite the fact that we don't have royalty. These rules can apply to everyday life.
In Malaysia, there are 2 types of etique and courtesy that being used..
There are 9 royal families in Malaysia, 8 of them used a traditional Malay custom of etique and courtesy.
While the Johor Royal Family used the same as European system.
i heard that too: you have to bow or curtsy when you meet them, but again it depends wich royal from wich country, it's quite different. ;)
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