Savoy and Savoy-Aosta: Restoration, Succession, Heirs and Conflicts

[MAfan]

The facts are: VE acted against the rules, marrying Marina without asking the permission to the King, as VE himself wrote in his autobiography the wedding was improvvised from a moment to the next and he apprised his parents of the wedding only after the celebration in Las Vegas; and the (broken) rule stated that the automatic consequence of that action is the loss of titles, style, rank, and rights to the Throne.

Different matter is that some years before the King wrote to VE that, had VE married a commoner, he (the King) would warn all the members of Savoy Family, the Heads of foreign Sovereign Houses and Italian people of VE's loss of title, rank, pretensions. Actually the King didn't do, but the rule at issue didn't (and doesn't) require anything similar.

Another different point is the behaviour of the then Duke of Aosta and of the other members of Savoy Family. I'm the first to harshly critcize the way and the delay Prince Amedeo claimed the Headship of the Royal Family (although he is right in his claims), but better late than never.

[Cory]

In this moment the majority of italians is not in favour of Monarchy but Prince Amedeo is quite respected and i suppose Prince Aimone will be even more.
Could be hope for the Restoration in the future years?
Until now even speaking in good terms about Monarchy was not well seen in Italy but I read an interesting article by Sergio Romano seeing in a different manner Monarchy:

LE MONARCHIE IN EUROPA PERCHÉ SONO ANCORA UTILI

[MAfan]

The problem with Prince Aimone is that he is rather unknown in Italy; just a few people know who he is (the son of Amedeo), but actually nobody knows him, his activities, his thoughts, etc.
Maybe he is the best person in this world, maybe he is the most prepared Prince for taking a Royal role and duties, but since he spent and is spending his life secluded from public life, studying and now working (and moreover far from Italy), here in Italy he's unknown, and therefore almost nobody can see him as the hope for a restoration.

But the problem about the restoration is a bigger one: the links between the Monarchy and fascism. The monarchy, House Savoy, is seen as the responsible for 20 years of fascist government, for 20 years of dictatorship that lead to two wars in Italy (WW II, and the civil war in 1943-1945); last but not least, the then King Vittorio Emanuele III is seen as the King who signed the racial laws in 1938 and who abandoned in 1943 his place in Rome and above all who abandoned and betrayed his people by escaping from Rome..
Indubitably the Monarchy had its responsabilities in all that, quite surely less heavy than those attributed by 60 years of history written by the republicans, but the majority of Italian people still can't forgive the Monarchy for its faults.

[amedea]

My feeling is that more than the historical actions of the kings of Italy (Italians do not know the history very well and they have short memory), the problem with restoration is that in Italy monarchies are considered something that belong to the past. When you are at elementary school they teach you that a monarchy is "the crazy form of government where somebody has privilege because of the family he was born in" and that "the progress of humanity brought republics almost all over the world".
The fascist thing, in my opinion, is not a problem: all the country was in a honeymoon with Mussolini back then. And the posters that know Italian politics know that many people with a "post-fascist" past hold important positions nowadays (the mayor of Rome, the president of the low chamber of the Parliament..).

[MAfan]

Originally Posted by amedea

in Italy monarchies are considered something that belong to the past. When you are at elementary school they teach you that a monarchy is "the crazy form of government where somebody has privilege because of the family he was born in" and that "the progress of humanity brought republics almost all over the world".

Yes, this is another right point; or otherwise "a monarchy where the King has all the power because of his birth is deeply unjust, and a monarchy where the King doesn't have actual powers is useless, so why to have a monarchy?"

The fascist thing, in my opinion, is not a problem: all the country was in a honeymoon with Mussolini back then.

Mussolini and fascism had a strong popular support, especially in the 1930s, but as you previously told Italians have short memory...

And the posters that know Italian politics know that many people with a "post-fascist" past hold important positions nowadays (the mayor of Rome, the president of the low chamber of the Parliament..).

Correct me if I'm wrong, but most of those politicians distanced themselves from the worst fascist ideals.

[Cory]

In this moment there is no real debate about Monarchy in Italy and Prince Aimone is obviously rather unknown.I am sure he will soon be more involved in public life and he will work and live in Italy.

Even the royalists are too dived in Italy.

Anyhow there is only one House of Savoy not two .The Savoy-Aosta is only a branch of the Royal House of Savoy and not a different House.

[amedea]

Originally Posted by MAfan

Correct me if I'm wrong, but most of those politicians distanced themselves from the worst fascist ideals.

Yes, of course. What I wanted to say is that it seems that for Italians it's enough to distance oneself from those ideals.. they shouldn't have problems with someone whose only fascist connection is that their grandparents have been fascist for a while (before actually fighting the fascits).

Another problem with the restoration is, of course, that many monarchistic in South Italy support the Borbon-2-Sicilies dinasty and they prefer the republic to the return of the Savoys.

[MAfan]

Originally Posted by amedea

Yes, of course. What I wanted to say is that it seems that for Italians it's enough to distance oneself from those ideals.. they shouldn't have problems with someone whose only fascist connection is that their grandparents have been fascist for a while (before actually fighting the fascits).

I understand your point now; but imo the problem is not with one Prince because of his grandfather, but it is due to the equation Monarchy=Savoy=fascism & its consequences.
It comes to my mind the reaction of the Italian government at the request of compensation by Vittorio Emanuele and Emanuele Filiberto, that more or less sounded as "We should require them a compensation for all the damages their family caused to Italy".
Until House Savoy will be seen under this point of view (a very simplistic and misleading point, as it ignores a lot of circumstances favorable to House Savoy), nothing will change and the restoration will remain a dream in a few people's mind.

[Anne83]

I think the Restoration of the Italian Monarchy is possible
I'd like to see EF and Clothilde on the throne one day
They are a beautiful regal couple

[Cory]

Everybody ( in Italy) supposes EF is only ridiculous and the majority of italian royalists sustain Prince Amedeo so...

[Anne83]

If Prince Amedeo is the King of the Italian people's hearts then I'm with them
His son, Aimone, married a Greek Princess He married into royalty This is important
Lineage is a serious thing Aimone could succeed his Father and establish a real Monarchy in Italy

[asma]

Originally Posted by Cory

Everybody ( in Italy) supposes EF is only ridiculous and the majority of italian royalists sustain Prince Amedeo so...

how did you know that?I think you are non italian and you don't even live there.

[Cory]

I lived very many yeras in Italy for professional reasons and I travel to Italy very often.So...

[Cory]

The Court of Appeal of Florence suspended the decision of the judge of Arezzo regarding the name and surname of HRH Prince Amedeo and HRH Prince Aimone.They can use the surname "di Savoia"( and not necessarily " di Savoia-Aosta") :


Real Casa di Savoia - Comunicato Stampa del 22 settembre 2010

[Cory]

Letter of Princess Maria Gabriella to "Il Giornale regarding the decision of the Court of Appeal of Florence:

U.M.I. - Unione Monarchica Italiana - News

[rominet09]

I don't understand Italian, can someone sumarize please ?

[MAfan]

In the letter the Princess expresses her satisfaction for the positive conclusions of the trials involving her brother Vittorio Emanuele and her cousins, Amedeo and Aimone.

The first one, started later last year, saw Vittorio Emanuele accused of having took part in criminal association with the purpose of corruption of officials; he has finally been cleared of the charges.
The second one saw Vittorio Emanuele and his son Emanuele Filiberto against Amedeo and Aimone, in regard to the use of Savoy surname; VE and EF claimed that their cousins can't use the plain surname "di Savoia", because their legal surname is "di Savoia-Aosta" and their activities using the plain "di Savoia" were damaging VE&EF's activities (in particular under a socio-economic point, as it was explained in the verdict). In first instance, the Court condemned both Amedeo and Aimone to pay to each of VE and EF 50000 Euros as compensaton, but a few weeks ago the Court of Appeal of Firenze reversed the judgement, confirming that Amedeo and Aimone can use the plain surname "di Savoia" (although their legal surname still is "di Savoia-Aosta").

[rominet09]

Thank you very much for the explanation

[Cory]

Prince Amedeo , Prince Aimone and the italian royalists must be very happy about the news.

[rominet09]

I foresee a lot of new conflicts to come....