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  #1381  
Old 01-06-2023, 11:59 PM
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Just to add some nuance to the narrative BT among others are trying to create about the public's opinion and the DRF's comments sections: From one of the most popular Danish meme-accounts on Instagram.
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  #1382  
Old 01-07-2023, 11:36 AM
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Interesting article from Tatler about it all

https://www.tatler.com/article/danis...t-what-went-on
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  #1383  
Old 01-07-2023, 12:23 PM
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Not much other than a suggestion it's conniving court officials and not Daisy responsible.

And even Tatler can't get their titles right; they never had HRH.
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  #1384  
Old 01-07-2023, 06:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tommy100 View Post
Interesting article from Tatler about it all

https://www.tatler.com/article/danis...t-what-went-on
I wish I knew who “royal insider” Mette Dahlgaard is???
( There is a Danish journalist by that name, but she’s not
writing about royalty, according to her CV)
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  #1385  
Old 01-07-2023, 07:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viv View Post
I wish I knew who “royal insider” Mette Dahlgaard is???
( There is a Danish journalist by that name, but she’s not
writing about royalty, according to her CV)
She is an investigative journalist for Berlingske, which is a serious, conservative (Copenhagener newspaper, even though it's a national newspaper, it really doesn't sell in the western half of DK). The paper is pro-monarchy but not uncritical and I'm very sure this paper is among those QMII is known to read every day.
Mette Dahlgaard is not a royalty-journalist, but her assessment of this is nevertheless to be considered serious and informed.
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  #1386  
Old 01-07-2023, 07:48 PM
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A "serious and informed" journalist who makes comments like:

"(...) Joachim’s children would lose their titles, while Crown Prince Frederik and Crown Princess Mary’s children – Prince Christian, 17, Princess Isabella, 15, and twins Prince Vincent and Princess Josephine, 11 – will keep theirs."

– Pardon me, but an informed journalist simply wouldn't feel the need to note that A well-informed journalist would know the distinction between the two set of siblings and not bundle them together as a homogeneous group.

"Nowhere in Frederik's speech was there a mention of his only sibling."

– And why would there be? It was a speech addressing QMII as a leader, not a mother. It was a jubilee, not a birthday.

"(...) planning to relocate to Copenhagen, he quickly learnt that there was no room and not enough duties for him and his wife in the capital.

– Not enough duties? I don't recall them attempting to up their engagement count.

"But Joachim is popular with the Danish public. 'People sympathise with the prince, who has always been loyal to the throne,' says the royal insider. While Frederik played the field in his youth, Joachim settled down and had children; the model of constancy. Plus, adds the insider, 'He's perceived as the better public speaker – the more natural royal.'"

– Joachim has consistently ranked bottom in approval ratings for the past many years – he even managed to be outdone by Henrik in the end. The title debacle has not changed that. Approval ratings from December 2022 still placed him in the bottom – 41% off of Frederik. Making the above paragraph a distortion of the truth at best.

"Jim Lyngvild, a Danish designer and society figure, is aghast."

– Right, lost me there Simply can't take a journalist who considers Lyngvild, a professional celebrity, a source for expert knowledge serious.

________

A very Team Joachim piece. I see Jacob Heinel Jensen, who's employed by Berlingske's tabloid spinoff BT, has been interviewed as an expert. Might I be so bold and venture a guess that he doubles as one of the "insiders" quoted in that article. Speaking as a "royal expert" on record and as JM&A's go-to journalists off record
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  #1387  
Old 01-07-2023, 08:03 PM
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M&F's children are not losing their titles - at least not right now, if ever. So that's true.

No, Frederik did not mention Joachim, which is true. - Indeed why should he? But it's not incorrect what she is saying.

The move to Copenhagen, that's Mette Dahlgaard's assessment/opinion, which we can agree with or not. It's still an assessment/opinion.

In regards to Joachim's popularity, there I do agree with you. I wonder if she somehow meant that the public sympathize with him. And to a considerable extent people do, in this case. Believing that it was no way for QMII to treat her son.

Jim Lyngvild is a self-proclaimed super royalist, but he is not afraid to voice a negative opinion about the DRF either. I believe I came across a headline the other day about him not being too impressed about how this was handled. - Didn't bother reading it though.

The BT dude... Yes, he is in the habit of interviewing himself in BT, something I find comical. But if no one else call you a royal expert, you can do it yourself...
I doubt however that the journalists on Berlingske have that much respect for the journalists on BT, even though they belong to the same publishing house.
The journalists on Politiken are not too impressed with the journalists on Ekstra Bladet, even though these two papers also belongs to the same publishing house. Not the same as Berlingske and BT - they are in fact competitors, not least for the market in Copenhagen.

So I still find Mette Dahlgaard's take serious. And as I stated, she is not a royal reporter.
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  #1388  
Old 01-07-2023, 08:40 PM
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Indeed, she's no royal reporter. And perhaps that's exactly why I don't find her input particularly informed.

Obviously it's true that Frederik's kids retain their titles. So much so that no truly well-informed journalist would have felt a need to mention it as Frederik and Joachim's children were never each other's titular equals to begin with. The mere mention of Frederik's children's titles makes it sound like Frederik's kids were "allowed" to keep their titles when Joachim's were not. Which is extremely inept reporting to me.

Likewise, her mention of the speech also creates a narrative that Frederik purposefully left out Joachim when, in reality, there wasn't really any reason to mention him to begin with as it wasn't a speech to "mom Daisy" but to "boss Daisy". Dahlgaard may well be factually correct about these things but the inflated importance of insignificant facts help create a misconstrued narrative.

And as for shamelessly interweaving her own opinion... AFAIK the article isn't an opinion piece and as such, the author's own opinion shouldn't be reflected.

Lastly, and not really a discussion for here, but as someone with "insider" knowledge (to use Mette Dahlgaard's own term) there's a much closer affiliation between BT and Belingske than there is between Ekstra Bladet and Politiken
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  #1389  
Old 01-07-2023, 09:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archduchess Zelia View Post
Indeed, she's no royal reporter. And perhaps that's exactly why I don't find her input particularly informed.
Perhaps, but it doesn't disqualify her from writing this piece. Could be that Tatler decided to get the opinion of a serious journalist from a serious newspaper?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Archduchess Zelia View Post
Obviously it's true that Frederik's kids retain their titles. So much so that no truly well-informed journalist would have felt a need to mention it as Frederik and Joachim's children were never each other's titular equals to begin with. The mere mention of Frederik's children's titles makes it sound like Frederik's kids were "allowed" to keep their titles when Joachim's were not. Which is extremely inept reporting to me.

Likewise, her mention of the speech also creates a narrative that Frederik purposefully left out Joachim when, in reality, there wasn't really any reason to mention him to begin with as it wasn't a speech to "mom Daisy" but to "boss Daisy". Dahlgaard may well be factually correct about these things but the inflated importance of insignificant facts help create a misconstrued narrative.
That is of course your interpretation.
It's no more biased or inept than works from other journalists who are linked/quoted in posts here on TRF.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Archduchess Zelia View Post
And as for shamelessly interweaving her own opinion... AFAIK the article isn't an opinion piece and as such, the author's own opinion shouldn't be reflected.
I disagree with you here, I read this as an opinion piece.

It's not different from the foreign correspondent Ulla Terkelsen, who is a very good journalist. She usually comments of royalty stuff, the DRF but also in particular the BRF. And I have often found that her opinions and interpretations regarding the BRF would no doubt differ considerably from that of most the British members here. But her assessments are nevertheless serious, albeit also very entertaining.
It is in that light I view this piece.
Right now there more than five million different opinions about this topic, in DK alone. Mette Dahlgaard is but one of them, but being from a serious journalist, I do find it to be a serious input worth reading.
Whether you, the reader, agree or not, is another matter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Archduchess Zelia View Post
Lastly, and not really a discussion for here, but as someone with "insider" knowledge (to use Mette Dahlgaard's own term) there's a much closer affiliation between BT and Belingske than there is between Ekstra Bladet and Politiken
Well, it could hardly be worse.
Ekstra Bladet and Politiken is like comparing the Guardian with the Express.
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  #1390  
Old 01-07-2023, 09:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Archduchess Zelia View Post
Indeed, she's no royal reporter. And perhaps that's exactly why I don't find her input particularly informed.



Obviously it's true that Frederik's kids retain their titles. So much so that no truly well-informed journalist would have felt a need to mention it as Frederik and Joachim's children were never each other's titular equals to begin with. The mere mention of Frederik's children's titles makes it sound like Frederik's kids were "allowed" to keep their titles when Joachim's were not. Which is extremely inept reporting to me.



Likewise, her mention of the speech also creates a narrative that Frederik purposefully left out Joachim when, in reality, there wasn't really any reason to mention him to begin with as it wasn't a speech to "mom Daisy" but to "boss Daisy". Dahlgaard may well be factually correct about these things but the inflated importance of insignificant facts help create a misconstrued narrative.



And as for shamelessly interweaving her own opinion... AFAIK the article isn't an opinion piece and as such, the author's own opinion shouldn't be reflected.



Lastly, and not really a discussion for here, but as someone with "insider" knowledge (to use Mette Dahlgaard's own term) there's a much closer affiliation between BT and Belingske than there is between Ekstra Bladet and Politiken
Mette wrote for a foreign audience that doesn't know about this and who, in many cases, might not know anything about the royal family at all besides Crown Princess Mary and maybe Queen Margrethe.
Personally I have no problems with "regular" journalists writing about the royal family. I'd rather prefer it since they are less fawning than the royal reporters and bring a much needed dose of reality to the duckpond that is royal reporting.
I have no idea how close the different newspapers are, but it's a fact that the two Jacobins from BT and Berlingske often work together with Steen Olsen a frequent guest at Heinel Jensen's podcast.
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  #1391  
Old 01-08-2023, 02:30 AM
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Of course I cannot rule out that Mette Dahlgaard who usually covers
more serious subjects at “Berlingeren” fell for the temptation of selling
a piece to the Tatler, which, by the way, has covered the DRF title issue
earlier.
However we Danes don’t know her as a “ royal insider” and her Tatler piece,
is not exactly an example of serious, deep digning journalism! The final straw
was qouting Jim Lyngvild, the local dandy, who has an opinion on everything, whether he’s been asked or not and whether he knows anything about it,
or not!
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  #1392  
Old 01-08-2023, 02:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
Perhaps, but it doesn't disqualify her from writing this piece. Could be that Tatler decided to get the opinion of a serious journalist from a serious newspaper?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
I disagree with you here, I read this as an opinion piece.

It's not different from the foreign correspondent Ulla Terkelsen, who is a very good journalist. She usually comments of royalty stuff, the DRF but also in particular the BRF. And I have often found that her opinions and interpretations regarding the BRF would no doubt differ considerably from that of most the British members here. But her assessments are nevertheless serious, albeit also very entertaining.
It is in that light I view this piece.
Right now there more than five million different opinions about this topic, in DK alone. Mette Dahlgaard is but one of them, but being from a serious journalist, I do find it to be a serious input worth reading.
Whether you, the reader, agree or not, is another matter.
And that's fine but if that was the author's intention to write an opinion piece, then it should be branded as such. Instead, it's presented as a feature.

Difference between Ulla Therkelsen and this author, I imagine, is that Therkelsen is actually relatively well-informed about the DRF. You don't have to be a royal reporter to be genuinely well-informed about the information you're relaying. That's not the vibe Dahlgaard gives me with this piece.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
That is of course your interpretation.
It's no more biased or inept than works from other journalists who are linked/quoted in posts here on TRF.
True, but I expected a bit more than pseudo-tabloid journalism from a Tatler piece. Maybe that's my mistake

Quote:
Originally Posted by JR76 View Post
Mette wrote for a foreign audience that doesn't know about this and who, in many cases, might not know anything about the royal family at all besides Crown Princess Mary and maybe Queen Margrethe.
All the more reason to be careful what kind of narrative you're creating!
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  #1393  
Old 01-08-2023, 05:54 AM
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Fair enough, we can disagree on the validity of this opinion piece, and that's it.

However, this does represent an opinion and view by a serious journalist working for a serious paper.
This is not grabbed out of thin air. This is something they discuss among her fellow journalists on Berlingske and something she and her friends, who presumably come from a similar segment of the population, also discuss.
So in that perspective, it is interesting.

Because this differs from say the BT guy Jacob, who admittedly is pretty sympathetic towards Joachim and his family.

It also differs from the random comments by readers on Instagram or Ekstra Bladet (Their comments section is an open sewer!) or the professional (and far from always well informed) opinion makers who fight for headlines.
I think it's good to have sound analysis and opinion from someone else than you and me for example. We can agree or not, be critical or not, but it's an angle worth reading IMO.

However, apart from a very select few, no one really knows what is behind all this. In fact I suspect the total number is less than the fingers on a hand.
I don't. You don't. Mette Dahlgaard don't. Nor does any Dane you'd care to stop on the street. - So all we have left is speculation and opinions.

Anyway, we are getting off topic and this is after all about the stripping of titles.

In fact there was a pretty good discussion going on in this thread over the past week, I'd personally like to see that continued.
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