The Prince Andrew and Jeffrey Epstein Controversy 1: 2010-2022

[Sionevar]

There's no way he'll be let anywhere near jubilee events. He's out. For good. To imagine otherwise is to totally misunderstand public opinion in Britain.

Let's see what they do with him at the service for Prince Philip. Where they put him, how visible they let him be, if they make him sneak in through a side door. If they even allow him to attend.

 

[Durham]

Let's see what they do with him at the service for Prince Philip. Where they put him, how visible they let him be, if they make him sneak in through a side door. If they even allow him to attend.

I would imagine at the service he'll be treated in the same way as his siblings. It would seem unfair not to considering the circumstances. But I'm sure that'll be a one off.

 

[HighGoalHighDreams]

I don't understand. If he says he wasn't guilty why would he go for a settlement? To avoid going on trial?

The vast majority of civil suites (well over 90%) never reach trial. As you can imagine, many of these involve people who would not be held civilly liable (there is no "guilty" in civil court) agreeing to settle.

This is for financial reasons; to avoid embarrassing issues being aired in public; and to allow all parties to move forward with their lives. I suspect all are at play here.

 

[tommy100]

Exactly, Chris Ship said as many as 98% of US civil cases end in settlement. Andrew had the added pressure of his family advising him to settle or get the matter resolved asap to avoid overshadowing the Jubilee. All it means IMO is that both sides felt there was a decent chance a jury would find against them and that they could get what they want from a settlement.

 

[TLLK]

Let's see what they do with him at the service for Prince Philip. Where they put him, how visible they let him be, if they make him sneak in through a side door. If they even allow him to attend.

To be honest I believe that Prince Andrew will be discouraged from attending this event as it would take the focus away from the purpose of honoring the late Duke of Edinburgh. Andrew was in attendance at his funeral in 2021 as should be expected, but IMO it's too soon to have him out in public.


However I do expect that in the future that Andrew will be present at his mother's funeral but that might be his last BRF public appearance.

 

[Claire]

If I understand it correctly - a settlement offer was previously rejected. But after requests for testimony from several people as well as a general note that Andrew's lawyers were not above character assassination's. I dont know if this is a new offer she has accepted, or the old one. But considering they cannot find the photograph, have letters to various family members about her changing story line and have several people that were willing to go on record about her. She should be happy.
However it should be noted that as she now is official a New York Citizen, the women that she arranged for Epstein are free to ask for charges to be filed. I wouldn't be surprised if she leaves to Australia today.

 

[Alison H]

The consensus in the press seems to be that he's decided a trial's not a good idea. He couldn't handle being quizzed by a journalist on ITV. Imagine him being cross-examined by a top lawyer who knows exactly which buttons to push.

 

[Denville]

Probably they always wanted to settle - but were not going to say so too soon. He had said that he didn't remembmer meeting her and that he didn't have sex with her, which means that agreeing to a settlement is backing down from those statements. So he couldl not do it too suddenly. And She would have wanted to get the best financial deal that she could and he'd want to get her to agree to a gag order

 

[Osipi]

To be honest I believe that Prince Andrew will be discouraged from attending this event as it would take the focus away from the purpose of honoring the late Duke of Edinburgh. Andrew was in attendance at his funeral in 2021 as should be expected, but IMO it's too soon to have him out in public.


However I do expect that in the future that Andrew will be present at his mother's funeral but that might be his last BRF public appearance.

When it comes to events that surround the family itself, like Philip's Service of Thanksgiving and his mother's funeral or weddings in the family, Andrew should be treated as who he is. The second son of the monarch and a prince of the UK. He's still, regardless of his shortcomings, a beloved member of the family. That doesn't change.

When it comes to celebrations like the Platinum Jubilee which is a celebration of the Queen's 70 year reign on the throne and her monarchy, Andrew is no longer relevant to anything to do with monarchy and should be excluded from appearing with the family on the balcony. We've already seen the precedent set from 2012 and the Diamond Jubilee that the balcony appearance portrayed the continuity of the monarchy with the main line of succession only appearing. This isn't excluding Andrew because of his mistakes but because he's actually not in the main line of succession to the throne.

Andrew has paid the price (literally and figuratively) for his defects of character and overblown sense of ego and entitlement that is permanent. There's nothing that will ever restore his "good name" and he's been put out to pasture for the rest of his days. At least with the settlement now, its over and done with and the final curtain drawn on his involvement with Epstein. His official statement though in support of Epstein's victims though, to me, rang hollow. Too little, too late.

 

[angieuk]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ed-settlement-principle-Virginia-Giuffre.html

Both had the option for it to go to court; both have chosen to close the matter!

 

[tommy100]

When it comes to events that surround the family itself, like Philip's Service of Thanksgiving and his mother's funeral or weddings in the family, Andrew should be treated as who he is. The second son of the monarch and a prince of the UK. He's still, regardless of his shortcomings, a beloved member of the family. That doesn't change.

When it comes to celebrations like the Platinum Jubilee which is a celebration of the Queen's 70 year reign on the throne and her monarchy, Andrew is no longer relevant to anything to do with monarchy and should be excluded from appearing with the family on the balcony. We've already seen the precedent set from 2012 and the Diamond Jubilee that the balcony appearance portrayed the continuity of the monarchy with the main line of succession only appearing. This isn't excluding Andrew because of his mistakes but because he's actually not in the main line of succession to the throne.

Andrew has paid the price (literally and figuratively) for his defects of character and overblown sense of ego and entitlement that is permanent. There's nothing that will ever restore his "good name" and he's been put out to pasture for the rest of his days. At least with the settlement now, its over and done with and the final curtain drawn on his involvement with Epstein. His official statement though in support of Epstein's victims though, to me, rang hollow. Too little, too late.

I would agree that Andrew should attend his father's memorial but I wouldn't say he should do so as "second son" and "Prince" if that puts him above others who are still "official royals" IMO it should be HM, C&C, W&K, Anne, Tim, Ed & Sophie, the HRH cousins then the "private royals"

 

[angieuk]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/index.html

7.5 MILLION SETTLEMENT!

If he had won his case, I assume he would have paid out NIL.
If he had lost his case, would he of had to have paid more than the above sum?

 

[Osipi]

I would agree that Andrew should attend his father's memorial but I wouldn't say he should do so as "second son" and "Prince" if that puts him above others who are still "official royals" IMO it should be HM, C&C, W&K, Anne, Tim, Ed & Sophie, the HRH cousins then the "private royals"

Isn't it up to the Queen to decide the order of precedence in a matter such as this? As it's a family memorial, the order of precedence shouldn't hinge on who is working for the "Firm" and who isn't. That would make a difference though when it comes to something like the Platinum Jubilee which is a specific celebration of the monarchy.

As far as the family goes, Andrew is and will remain the second son of the monarch and The Prince Andrew until his mother passes and he's then relegated to being the brother of the monarch. Then there will be a new order or precedence as Charles wants it for both events concerning the family and the monarchy (his coronation for one).

Working royals and private royals are relatively new constructs of modern times as it wasn't that long ago that "working" royals weren't really a job description of royal standing.

 

[Tatiana Maria]

From PA news agency's Q&A on the story:

Will the substantial charity donation be made from Andrew’s own private money?

Representatives of the duke declined to comment on the source of funds for the donation.

What have both sides said about the settlement?

Andrew’s representatives said they would not be commenting further than what was said in the court documents.

David Boies, the lawyer acting on behalf of Giuffre, said: “I believe this event speaks for itself.”​

Buckingham Palace has declined to comment.

Probably they always wanted to settle - but were not going to say so too soon. He had said that he didn't remembmer meeting her and that he didn't have sex with her, which means that agreeing to a settlement is backing down from those statements.

Neither side has backed down from their earlier statements about what did or did not transpire. JoanHarry quoted almost all of the joint statement issued by Prince Andrew and Virginia Giuffre, but it can be read in its entirety here: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ed-settlement-principle-Virginia-Giuffre.html

But considering they cannot find the photograph, have letters to various family members about her changing story line and have several people that were willing to go on record about her.

I don't think the news about the photograph has been posted yet.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/epste...iuffre-lost-her-famous-photo-of-prince-andrew

I have not seen anything in the press so far about "letters to various family members".

To be honest I believe that Prince Andrew will be discouraged from attending this event as it would take the focus away from the purpose of honoring the late Duke of Edinburgh. Andrew was in attendance at his funeral in 2021 as should be expected, but IMO it's too soon to have him out in public.

However I do expect that in the future that Andrew will be present at his mother's funeral but that might be his last BRF public appearance.

In my opinion the memorial service can be regarded as a substitute for the funeral which would have been held for the Duke of Edinburgh had it not been for the Covid-19 limitations at the time of his death.

It was made known last week that the Duke of York would attend his father's memorial service as a "private citizen".

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/royal-f...iuffre-interviewed-prince-andrews-lawyer-sex/

"On March 29, the Duke will appear in public alongside the Queen and the rest of the Royal family for a service of thanksgiving for the Duke of Edinburgh at Westminster Abbey.

Although he has been stripped of all royal patronages and effectively been sacked as a working royal, the Duke will attend as a “private citizen” and a member of the family."​

It was also made known when his military titles and patronages were stripped that he would not be attending the Jubilee.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/...e-palace-queen-buckingham-palace-b976597.html

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ed-settlement-principle-Virginia-Giuffre.html

I wonder if the "senior palace source" who "believes" that the settlement will total around $10 million (£7.5 million) and that it will be funded by the sale of the Duke of York's Swiss chalet is basing those beliefs on information or is merely speculating like anyone else.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/index.html

7.5 MILLION SETTLEMENT!

If he had won his case, I assume he would have paid out NIL.
If he had lost his case, would he of had to have paid more than the above sum?

Your link only goes to the home page of the Daily Mail. Do you have a source for that number (besides the quote from the "senior palace source" who may only be guessing)?

 

[Lumutqueen]

Returning from my hiatus to say I am very surprised by this outcome. It's clear to me that VG didn't have enough to push Andrew to trial and Andrew was afraid of what VG had to go to trial. Considering the push from VG and her lawyers, along with others, I was expecting this to be a slam dunk see you in court situation.

I don't believe this changes anything in Andrew's situation - he is a private member of the royal family who holds peerage and that is it. I expect him to retreat somewhere, potentially remain at Windsor or to go somewhere with Fergie and "become" a retiree so to speak.

 

[Muhler]

I'm more interested in what is going to happen to Andrew.

If he or anyone else believe this case is closed and buried, they will be soooo wrong.
Anyway, I believe this is more about closing Andrew's mouth than anyone else.
Andrew being questioned by even a reasonably competent layer could very easily have ended up in an even worse PR-disaster.

So what will happen?
Well, the case is officially buried. But not in the press...
And I think Andrew is officially buried for good as well. He may think he will be forgiven after a couple of years and can return to his place in the BRF and his former royal status. - And he can forget all about that!
He's out, on grass, banished from court. He might just as well be bricked up at Balmoral.

His doting mother QEII might have taken him back after a while, but Charles and William? They have in so many ways taken over and will take over even more. They don't need Andrew anywhere near them. Especially not during the state when QEII is no more and Charles has to settle in his new role. A very difficult period for any new monarch.

 

[angieuk]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/...xperts-say-Duke-Yorks-reputation-rebuilt.html

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ed-settlement-principle-Virginia-Giuffre.html

I believe he will definitely attend his father's Memorial service on 29th March, 2022.

 

[sophie25]

Apparently a non disclose clause was not part of the deal which means VG can go on talking about it for the rest of her days. A lot a commentators think she will write a book about her life. So, unfortunately for PA, this probably isn't ever going to go away for good.

 

[tommy100]

Well if true that suggests IMO that Andrew has been poorly advised. Even the most basic of settlements usually contain a confidentiality clause.

 

[Mbruno]

To make the problem go away, quietly and quickly and cleanly.

Lots of people settle court cases for this reason, whether they are guilty or not. A long legal fight can be very hard on a person, both financially and emotionally.

If I was being sued, and it would cost me 100k right now to settle, or 500k over 3 years to fight, I know what I would do. Especially if the settlement was confidential and did not require admission of guilt.

Out-of-court settlements are the American way. Especially with rich and powerful defendants. I am not surprised at all as it is clear that Virginia Giuffre filed this lawsuit solely to force a settlement, which Andrew had turned down before. The fact that it came so quickly though suggests that her case maybe was not as strong as her legal team thought.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/...xperts-say-Duke-Yorks-reputation-rebuilt.html

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ed-settlement-principle-Virginia-Giuffre.html

I believe he will definitely attend his father's Memorial service on 29th March, 2022.

It would be cruel and unusual to keep a son from his father's Memorial service, wouldn't it?

 

[Tatiana Maria]

Apparently a non disclose clause was not part of the deal

Who is the source for that?

i news, citing an anonymous "source close to Prince Andrew’s legal team", says otherwise.

https://inews.co.uk/news/prince-andrew-settles-sex-abuse-lawsuit-with-virginia-giuffre-1462536

As part of the settlement both the Duke of York and Ms Giuffre have agreed to never discuss the case in public with gag orders being imposed on both parties, i has been told.

The disgraced prince has agreed to pay a settlement to Ms Giuffre, a separate “substantial donation” to her sexual abuse victims’ charity and is understood to have also agreed to pay her legal fees.

The first payment to Ms Giuffre is due from the prince within 30 days and, once paid, the case against him will be dropped officially.

While neither party would disclose the amounts involved in the settlement, a source close to Prince Andrew’s legal team told i the total payout would run into the “low millions of pounds.”​

 

[ACO]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1493654302728019969

The Telegraph hearing Prince Andrew on the hook for a figure north of £10million in his settlement with Virginia Giuffre.

 

[Somebody]

In my opinion the memorial service can be regarded as a substitute for the funeral which would have been held for the Duke of Edinburgh had it not been for the Covid-19 limitations at the time of his death.

It was made known last week that the Duke of York would attend his father's memorial service as a "private citizen".

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/royal-f...iuffre-interviewed-prince-andrews-lawyer-sex/

"On March 29, the Duke will appear in public alongside the Queen and the rest of the Royal family for a service of thanksgiving for the Duke of Edinburgh at Westminster Abbey.

Although he has been stripped of all royal patronages and effectively been sacked as a working royal, the Duke will attend as a “private citizen” and a member of the family."​

It was also made known when his military titles and patronages were stripped that he would not be attending the Jubilee.

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/...e-palace-queen-buckingham-palace-b976597.html

If Andrew is attending events as a 'private citizen', which seems to mean 'not as a royal highness', imho he would rank among the other non-royal dukes in the order of precedence, which would be second to last as Harry would be behind him as his dukedom was created later. However, for his father's memorial service, I assume he will take his position as son, just like the others will take their position based on their family relationship. Note that for example Peter Phillips took precedence over both William and Harry in the funeral procession as they went by age (both among the children as well as the grandchildren).

 

[Osipi]

If Andrew is attending events as a 'private citizen', which seems to mean 'not as a royal highness', imho he would rank among the other non-royal dukes in the order of precedence, which would be second to last as Harry would be behind him as his dukedom was created later. However, for his father's memorial service, I assume he will take his position as son, just like the others will take their position based on their family relationship. Note, that for example Peter Phillips took precedence over both William and Harry in the funeral procession as they went by age (both among the children as well as the grandchildren).

This is the kind of thing we need to remember when pertaining to Andrew and his standing in the scheme of things to come. We need to differentiate between a family event and an event pertaining to the institution of the monarchy itself.

As far as the monarchy is concerned, Andrew is now a private citizen in all matters pertaining to it. Not involved at all and on the outskirts and irrelevant to its workings. Family wise, Andrew may now be the "black sheep" that has behaved badly and he's paid the price dearly for it and tanked his reputation and soiled his character but that doesn't remove him from the family that still loves him, warts and all.

 

[sophie25]

Who is the source for that?

i news, citing an anonymous "source close to Prince Andrew’s legal team", says otherwise.

https://inews.co.uk/news/prince-andrew-settles-sex-abuse-lawsuit-with-virginia-giuffre-1462536

As part of the settlement both the Duke of York and Ms Giuffre have agreed to never discuss the case in public with gag orders being imposed on both parties, i has been told.

The disgraced prince has agreed to pay a settlement to Ms Giuffre, a separate “substantial donation” to her sexual abuse victims’ charity and is understood to have also agreed to pay her legal fees.

The first payment to Ms Giuffre is due from the prince within 30 days and, once paid, the case against him will be dropped officially.

While neither party would disclose the amounts involved in the settlement, a source close to Prince Andrew’s legal team told i the total payout would run into the “low millions of pounds.”​

The lawyer Lisa Bloom. She said it on GB News here in UK. The newscaster pressed her on it and she seemed to be pretty certain there was no NDA.

 

[tommy100]

The only way I can see Andrew's lawyers allowing for no NDA is if Andrew was happy with that meaning it would mean a much, much lower payment. Makes no sense IMO but who knows.

 

[Denville]

I very much doubt it. Andrew's lawyers would push for an NDA and Im sure he would too.

 

[maria-olivia]

Now the Duke may sell his Verbier Chalet .

 

[ACO]

Now the Duke may sell his Verbier Chalet .

Well according to this the Queen is helping foot the bill.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1493708165136932867

 

[Osipi]

Well according to this the Queen is helping foot the bill.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1493708165136932867

I'd rather not trust any information coming from a Twitter account and any article that marks itself "exclusive". I didn't bother to read it because I sincerely believe that if the Queen wants to help Andrew pay this off out of her own private funds, that's *her* business and not anyone else's.