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  #2121  
Old 08-24-2019, 12:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sophie25 View Post
I don't see what I want to at all. The woman Andrew waved off from Epstein's house looked like a woman and the girl with the ponytail looked like a teenager. If you looked 12 or 13 when you were 30 who am I to argue with you but bearing in mind the sexual leanings of the man involved here I am prepared to guess that a girl who looked like a young teen entering his house was exactly that.
And yet until Andrew's friend was identified and known to be a 28 year old woman, some people were saying she must be one of Epstein's young teen girls.
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  #2122  
Old 08-24-2019, 01:43 PM
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Did Andrew really and truly whine and compare his lot in life to that of Prince Albert of Monaco..who gets to " do whatever he wants" and no one bothers him?

Albert Grimaldi...the billionaire work horse non taxpayer funded ruler of an independent city-state?

THAT Prince Albert??

Because if so, every rumor ever uttered about Andrew's sense of entitlement and lack of intelligence is in fact true.

***Andrew's statement was quoted in the Guarduan article posted above, allegedly during his foot massage with Epstein".****
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  #2123  
Old 08-24-2019, 02:02 PM
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Even thought the image of Andrew's face was only a few seconds, what was most striking was how pleasant and friendly Andrew looked. He appeared absolutely at home and comfortable and totally content. In his public life he is often described as arrogant, haughty and distant. In this apartment, he seemed totally happy like a different man who have never seen before. Maybe this division in personality is the real cause of the tension. I do not think his brothers and sister can be associated with such a sharp distinction. They are basically comfortable with themselves in their public roles - and apparently also in their private lives now. Puzzling.
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  #2124  
Old 08-24-2019, 03:07 PM
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Please explain to me how this is helpful

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nds-claim.html

This friend did no favors. I'm a horndog for legally aged females is not going to fly.
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  #2125  
Old 08-24-2019, 05:35 PM
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I wonder what kind of dirt is coming out next considering this desperate, full of lies statement that has been brought out. It's interesting to me how there is focus on the age of some of the girls. I mean, how many girls came forward with a similar story? Over 50? And they expect any critical thinker to believe it when he says that he didn't know why Epstein went to jail, or why there were young women hanging around the property all the time? He made an informed choice while bleating about the ''privilige'' of Prince Albert and the likes.

This is a guy who drove an expensive car into a closed fence because he couldn't be bothered to drive somewhere else or wait for it to open. This is not a man who has ever lived by fair judgement and a sound mind. He better buckle his seatbelt and stir more stories about the Suxxeses because it's not going away any time soon and nor should it.
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  #2126  
Old 08-24-2019, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marengo View Post
That is the system indeed. But the fact remains that the Duke was a friend of a convicted pedophile who groomed and raped dozens of children. The duke himself is accused of all sorts of things.

Any charity or event that the duke will visit will be overshadowed by this case. It will distract from the purpose of a visit, in which case it may be better to send another member of the family.

I imagine few associations or people will be jumping with joy with the thought of a visit of the Duke at this moment. Some may even find it uncomfortable to see their charity or event associated with somebody who befriended a convicted pedophile, who at least condoned the behavior of this monster and perhaps even did worse.
As there is NOTHING that has been revealed in the past few weeks that wasn't in the public domain in 2011 why would charities and organisations turn on him now when they have known all these details since 2011.

There is simply nothing new that has come out.

It was known as far back as 2008, when Epstein was convicted, that Andrew had been one of his friends.

It was known in 2011 that Andrew had visited Eptein's New York home in late 2010 (the time of the video).

It was known in 2011 that there were allegations that Andrew had flown on Epstein's planes (along with Clinton, Trump etc etc).

The Prosecution in the UK will have to prove guilt. It is not up to Andrew to prove his innocence. That is a crucial part of the system.

People who like to convict as a result of 'trial by media' have been burnt many times in the UK in recent times with literally 100s of cases of sexual and other assaults being thrown out of court once the accused is in the court despite the media's beat up. The media's evidence is not the whole story and often is even thrown out as compromising the case or cases are even dismissed as it is impossible to get an impartial jury due to the media's role in investigating a case. Good media outlets take their evidence to the police and work with them to get a conviction and then run an exclusive. They don't do the exclusive first as they would be compromising and subsequent legal case.
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  #2127  
Old 08-24-2019, 07:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
As there is NOTHING that has been revealed in the past few weeks that wasn't in the public domain in 2011 why would charities and organisations turn on him now when they have known all these details since 2011.

There is simply nothing new that has come out.

It was known as far back as 2008, when Epstein was convicted, that Andrew had been one of his friends.

It was known in 2011 that Andrew had visited Eptein's New York home in late 2010 (the time of the video).

It was known in 2011 that there were allegations that Andrew had flown on Epstein's planes (along with Clinton, Trump etc etc).

The Prosecution in the UK will have to prove guilt. It is not up to Andrew to prove his innocence. That is a crucial part of the system.

People who like to convict as a result of 'trial by media' have been burnt many times in the UK in recent times with literally 100s of cases of sexual and other assaults being thrown out of court once the accused is in the court despite the media's beat up. The media's evidence is not the whole story and often is even thrown out as compromising the case or cases are even dismissed as it is impossible to get an impartial jury due to the media's role in investigating a case. Good media outlets take their evidence to the police and work with them to get a conviction and then run an exclusive. They don't do the exclusive first as they would be compromising and subsequent legal case.
That the problem, people treating this like old news. Andrew got the benefit of the doubt because the claims were dismissed without a full and thorough investigation. In the area of the Me Too Movement, a lot of bull from the powerful and well-connected aren’t flying anymore. There should be a full investigation into the claims and Andrew need to answer some serious questions, because these statements are weak and full of bull.
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  #2128  
Old 08-24-2019, 09:14 PM
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Edward VIII was never convicted of any crimes, yet his morals were judged to be lacking and he was forced to abdicate.
I see two separate issues with Andrew - the first being whether he committed a crime & could he be convicted of doing so - and given the passage of time and his likely diplomatic immunity I doubt that he could be convicted.
The second issue is whether in the era of ‘me too’ someone such as Andrew, whose defense now appears to be yes I’ve slept with 1000s of women but they were all adults & besides I barely knew Epstein, is a liability to the firm due to his actions & choices and if so, what actions will the firm or the charitable organizations Andrew is patron of take to limit the damage.
Last time the firm just rode it out, but this time more information is coming to light and the public mood seems different.
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  #2129  
Old 08-24-2019, 09:54 PM
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DM had this story but it was taken down

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...mments-7391369
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  #2130  
Old 08-24-2019, 09:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sndral View Post
Edward VIII was never convicted of any crimes, yet his morals were judged to be lacking and he was forced to abdicate.
I see two separate issues with Andrew - the first being whether he committed a crime & could he be convicted of doing so - and given the passage of time and his likely diplomatic immunity I doubt that he could be convicted.
The second issue is whether in the era of ‘me too’ someone such as Andrew, whose defense now appears to be yes I’ve slept with 1000s of women but they were all adults & besides I barely knew Epstein, is a liability to the firm due to his actions & choices and if so, what actions will the firm or the charitable organizations Andrew is patron of take to limit the damage.
Last time the firm just rode it out, but this time more information is coming to light and the public mood seems different.
What does Edward the VIII have to do with this situation-Nothing! And he wasn’t forced to abdicate for lack of morality.

The “playboy life defense” was supposedly said by an unidentifed “friend” in a DM article. Not said by Andrew and caught on tape by a microphone.
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  #2131  
Old 08-24-2019, 10:11 PM
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I agree with those members who believe Andrew needs to come clean about what he witnessed and give full assistance to any authorities making enquiries.

The biggest difficulty I have at the moment in all this is that he continued meeting with Epstein even after he had been accused and prosecuted. To say he only saw him once or twice a year doesn’t really matter, he shouldn’t have been seeing him at all!
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  #2132  
Old 08-24-2019, 10:54 PM
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Folks, Andrew knew Jeffery Epstein was a convicted paedophile. He only continued to hang around Epstein because he was getting something out of it. Sex and pleasure. Don’t fall for the palace oke doke. This is a very serious matter that involve underage girls being used as sex slaves for the rich and powerful. These official statements Buckingham Palace are issuing are full of baloney and they think we’re all fools. They are the fools if they think they can just statement themselves out of this.
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  #2133  
Old 08-25-2019, 12:34 AM
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Several accusatory posts directed at fellow posters have been removed.

Once again, the moderating team asks that we stick to facts and what is known, and focus it on Andrew's connection to the scandal. With what we know of the situation, there is no need to inflame it further with overt speculation and accusations.
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  #2134  
Old 08-25-2019, 12:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
What does Edward the VIII have to do with this situation-Nothing! And he wasn’t forced to abdicate for lack of morality.

The “playboy life defense” was supposedly said by an unidentifed “friend” in a DM article. Not said by Andrew and caught on tape by a microphone.
Edward VIII is an example of some one who’s personal relationship choices cost him the throne. Princess Margaret faced the same choice & opted to remain in the firm. At the time marrying a divorced person was unacceptable & the consequence was losing your position in the RF. Thus, there is precedent for ostracism if the royal’s choices are legal but unacceptable. Thus, I see two issues, the first being if he were convicted - which as I noted is unlikely, and the second being irrespective of a conviction whether his current role will be changed - as it was last time he & Epstein hit the news - and if it’s changed, how. We’ve read he’s avoiding the U.S. due to fears he’ll be caught up in the civil suits there.
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  #2135  
Old 08-25-2019, 12:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dman View Post
Folks, Andrew knew Jeffery Epstein was a convicted paedophile. He only continued to hang around Epstein because he was getting something out of it. Sex and pleasure. Don’t fall for the palace oke doke. This is a very serious matter that involve underage girls being used as sex slaves for the rich and powerful. These official statements Buckingham Palace are issuing are full of baloney and they think we’re all fools. They are the fools if they think they can just statement themselves out of this.
The bolded part is where I disagree with you. I honestly believe that Epstein had a bigger draw for Andrew than the girls, themselves. I think Andrew saw Epstein as living a lifestyle that he really wished could be his own. The homes, the cars, the boats and planes. Epstein knew and rubbed shoulders with some very powerful people and had clout when it came to getting what he wanted. It may be just me but my impression of Andrew is that he was born into royalty, had everything at his fingertips but he found his life lacking and wanted more. A lot more. He wanted what he saw Epstein had and perhaps thought Epstein could open doors for him. Perhaps Epstein did. It isn't rocket science that Sarah ran to "dear friend Jeffrey" when she needed money.

I do believe Andrew knew what was going on with the girls and perhaps even shrugged it off as a "quirk" of a man with a lot of money. I'm pretty sure that Andrew would have reveled in Epstein's girls fawning all over him. After all he *is* a prince and entitled to be treated as the entitled person he is. This is the draw I see Epstein having for Andrew. Not the girls and not the sex. He may or may not have participate in less than honorable ways in Epstein's company but that has yet to be proven. I think Andrew is sincerely aghast at the downfall of his "friend". After the 2008 conviction, things went along just as before the conviction and Andrew thought nothing of sticking with the person that could make him feel like a king rather than a prince.

Now, Andrew is looking at his buddy and seeing that money does not buy everything, power is fleeting and his friend's actions led to Epstein taking his own life. Pride goes before a fall and Epstein fell hard. He was being held accountable for his actions which were heinous and criminal and there would be no way out for Jeffrey this time. No special treatments. No "sweetheart" deals. No "work program". His money was useless and his influence and power evaporated into thin air and all that was left was a man facing himself in a prison cell. Andrew realized it was the end of the road where Epstein was concerned. Now Andrew is facing his own actions where his involvement with Epstein is concerned and its not a flattering picture at all.

So far both Florida and the MPS have declined to prosecute Andrew for any misdeeds. Whether or not he'll be named in civil suits remains to be seen and we'll just have to watch the story unfold. Right now I don't think it matters if Andrew is indicted or convicted of a crime. The worse damage has already been done to Andrew's reputation and his character. His worse judge and jury right about now most likely is his own conscience.
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  #2136  
Old 08-25-2019, 01:33 AM
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Part of the draw

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Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
The bolded part is where I disagree with you. I honestly believe that Epstein had a bigger draw for Andrew than the girls, themselves. I think Andrew saw Epstein as living a lifestyle that he really wished could be his own. The homes, the cars, the boats and planes. Epstein knew and rubbed shoulders with some very powerful people and had clout when it came to getting what he wanted. It may be just me but my impression of Andrew is that he was born into royalty, had everything at his fingertips but he found his life lacking and wanted more. A lot more. He wanted what he saw Epstein had and perhaps thought Epstein could open doors for him. Perhaps Epstein did. It isn't rocket science that Sarah ran to "dear friend Jeffrey" when she needed money.

I do believe Andrew knew what was going on with the girls and perhaps even shrugged it off as a "quirk" of a man with a lot of money. I'm pretty sure that Andrew would have reveled in Epstein's girls fawning all over him. After all he *is* a prince and entitled to be treated as the entitled person he is. This is the draw I see Epstein having for Andrew. Not the girls and not the sex. He may or may not have participate in less than honorable ways in Epstein's company but that has yet to be proven. I think Andrew is sincerely aghast at the downfall of his "friend". After the 2008 conviction, things went along just as before the conviction and Andrew thought nothing of sticking with the person that could make him feel like a king rather than a prince.

Now, Andrew is looking at his buddy and seeing that money does not buy everything, power is fleeting and his friend's actions led to Epstein taking his own life. Pride goes before a fall and Epstein fell hard. He was being held accountable for his actions which were heinous and criminal and there would be no way out for Jeffrey this time. No special treatments. No "sweetheart" deals. No "work program". His money was useless and his influence and power evaporated into thin air and all that was left was a man facing himself in a prison cell. Andrew realized it was the end of the road where Epstein was concerned. Now Andrew is facing his own actions where his involvement with Epstein is concerned and its not a flattering picture at all.

So far both Florida and the MPS have declined to prosecute Andrew for any misdeeds. Whether or not he'll be named in civil suits remains to be seen and we'll just have to watch the story unfold. Right now I don't think it matters if Andrew is indicted or convicted of a crime. The worse damage has already been done to Andrew's reputation and his character. His worse judge and jury right about now most likely is his own conscience.
Wealth power, powerful men, big money, I to believe he wanted to part of this and we will have to wait to see if he is charged with a crime. But bad judgement one thing after another, Fergy as a wife? for starters. Chinsey statement. All his life he lived by rules, regs, scrutiny to be free wheeling would have been a big draw. Innocent until proven guilty.



















ld
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  #2137  
Old 08-25-2019, 02:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
The bolded part is where I disagree with you. I honestly believe that Epstein had a bigger draw for Andrew than the girls, themselves. I think Andrew saw Epstein as living a lifestyle that he really wished could be his own. The homes, the cars, the boats and planes. Epstein knew and rubbed shoulders with some very powerful people and had clout when it came to getting what he wanted. It may be just me but my impression of Andrew is that he was born into royalty, had everything at his fingertips but he found his life lacking and wanted more. A lot more. He wanted what he saw Epstein had and perhaps thought Epstein could open doors for him. Perhaps Epstein did. It isn't rocket science that Sarah ran to "dear friend Jeffrey" when she needed money.

I do believe Andrew knew what was going on with the girls and perhaps even shrugged it off as a "quirk" of a man with a lot of money. I'm pretty sure that Andrew would have reveled in Epstein's girls fawning all over him. After all he *is* a prince and entitled to be treated as the entitled person he is. This is the draw I see Epstein having for Andrew. Not the girls and not the sex. He may or may not have participate in less than honorable ways in Epstein's company but that has yet to be proven. I think Andrew is sincerely aghast at the downfall of his "friend". After the 2008 conviction, things went along just as before the conviction and Andrew thought nothing of sticking with the person that could make him feel like a king rather than a prince.

Now, Andrew is looking at his buddy and seeing that money does not buy everything, power is fleeting and his friend's actions led to Epstein taking his own life. Pride goes before a fall and Epstein fell hard. He was being held accountable for his actions which were heinous and criminal and there would be no way out for Jeffrey this time. No special treatments. No "sweetheart" deals. No "work program". His money was useless and his influence and power evaporated into thin air and all that was left was a man facing himself in a prison cell. Andrew realized it was the end of the road where Epstein was concerned. Now Andrew is facing his own actions where his involvement with Epstein is concerned and its not a flattering picture at all.

So far both Florida and the MPS have declined to prosecute Andrew for any misdeeds. Whether or not he'll be named in civil suits remains to be seen and we'll just have to watch the story unfold. Right now I don't think it matters if Andrew is indicted or convicted of a crime. The worse damage has already been done to Andrew's reputation and his character. His worse judge and jury right about now most likely is his own conscience.
Well, you do know that Andrew has been accused of actually having sex with an underaged girl, right? Not being in awe of the wealth, power and “lifestyle” of Jeffery Epstein. There’s video of the man in and waving off a young lady from what’s described as “the House of Horrors.” So the idea he had not a clue in the world what was really going on is ridiculous. It’s like standing next to Leatherface in his basement, but saying you didn’t see any bodies, blood and didn’t hear any human screams going on around you.

Andrew, his official advisers and lawyers knows he’s in some major doodoo and they’re releasing the dumbest of dumb statements that I’ve ever seen released from Buckingham Palace. They are digging deeper holes right before their feet.

These allegations can’t be tossed in the garbage like before. There must be a full and thorough investigation into all the claims and the facts laid bare for everyone to see. The victims in this sick case deserve their justice.
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  #2138  
Old 08-25-2019, 02:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Dman View Post
Well, you do know that Andrew has been accused of actually having sex with an underaged girl, right? Not being in awe of the wealth, power and “lifestyle” of Jeffery Epstein. There’s video of the man in and waving off a young lady from what’s described as “the House of Horrors.” So the idea he had not a clue in the world what was really going on is ridiculous. It’s like standing next to Leatherface in his basement, but saying you didn’t see any bodies, blood and didn’t hear any human screams going on around you.

Andrew, his official advisers and lawyers knows he’s in some major doodoo and they’re releasing the dumbest of dumb statements that I’ve ever seen released from Buckingham Palace. They are digging deeper holes right before their feet.

These allegations can’t be tossed in the garbage like before. There must be a full and thorough investigation into all the claims and the facts laid bare for everyone to see. The victims in this sick case deserve their justice.
And I don't think that Andrew's conscience bothered him when he hung out with Epstein and remained "loyaL" to him and Fergie borrowed money
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  #2139  
Old 08-25-2019, 03:08 AM
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Andrew not only knew what was going on, but he was so close to Epstein and Maxwell that he invited these people to party with his family at the royal estates. As I said before, the royals vet their potential friends. They just don’t let you in their most inner circle because you’re nice to them.
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  #2140  
Old 08-25-2019, 03:29 AM
Majesty
 
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Andrew not only knew what was going on, but he was so close to Epstein and Maxwell that he invited these people to party with his family at the royal estates. As I said before, the royals vet their potential friends. They just don’t let you in their most inner circle because you’re nice to them.
I don't think Andrew vets his friends. If they have money.. and provide him with a pleasurable lifestyle.. he's in. its a pity because I think tthat he once had a better side...
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