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  #401  
Old 10-09-2005, 12:13 PM
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Im sorry, im just used to writing that way. I didnt think it was aggresive when I wrote I was just trying to say that no one is perfect and flawed people shouldnt condemn others for being flawed. I am not concerned with the triangle I just want to know why people think charles will be a bad king and to skip him.
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  #402  
Old 10-09-2005, 12:18 PM
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Re;

If I had my way, William would never be King. His mother was nothing but a damaging force to the Monarchy - if he follows her example and not his grandmothers then the Monarchy will become a laughing stock and will crumble.

I'd much prefer to see Queen Beatrice after King Charles but unless William and Harry are killed, illegitimate or marry catholics - it aint gonna happen.

And no, I'm not wishing them dead, insinuating that they are illegitimate or are set up with catholics!
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  #403  
Old 10-09-2005, 12:38 PM
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I want the Succession to go on in the prescribed manner. After the Queen dies, then Charles succeeds and in the natural course of time William will become king. I do not forsee Parliment ever tampering with it.

Although I am not British ( and thus do not have to pay for it), I hope the pomp and circumstance of the coronations will continue as well.

I think William will be well prepared for the Throne when his time comes. I think he will take the best of both parents to the Throne and will have learned from BOTH of their mistakes.

Caroline Mathilda
  #404  
Old 10-09-2005, 12:42 PM
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The British monarchy will be poorly served by any scenario other than Charles succeeding the Queen and William succeeding Charles. No one else is prepared for the throne. William may be but monarchies are most vulnerable when the crown skips generations.

The Swedish monarchy lost a great deal when its Crown Prince was killed in a plane crash in 1945 and his son had to succeed his grandfather in the early 70s.

Above and foremost, the monarchy needs the thread of continuity to make it survive and be relevant to all the generations. And that includes a King Charles.
  #405  
Old 10-09-2005, 01:09 PM
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There has to be a show of Law and Order in the Royal Family. Skipping generations would damage the monarchy to unreparable limits. It would take away what defines the monarchy. That blood chooses monarch not goverment.
  #406  
Old 10-09-2005, 02:46 PM
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This is purely my opinion, but I think the irony in all of this debate about Charles' "worthiness" to ascend the throne that today Diana would have agreed Charles IS worthy and done everything she could to strengthen the monarchy. Her tactics and pressure on the Establishment and the Queen were designed to produce a settlement as favorable as possible to her once divorced. She totally changed her tune once everything was over and had assumed increasing duties with the Queen and the Government's approval.

Regarding Camilla, many friends of Diana were quoted as saying she had come to accept her presence and loyalty to Charles and thought he should eventually "make an honest woman of her". I think Diana would have supported a remarriage in time, provided of course, she was given appropriate rank and title as the mother of a future king.
  #407  
Old 10-09-2005, 04:31 PM
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Just a question could the Queen have created a title for Diana like The Princess Mother. People see what they want to see. Diana had a lot to lose if she did not get a good settlement. She did her part and made herself look like and victim and after the divorce there was a change. Diana did a lot of her noticable landmine and aids work after her death(if im wrong correct me).
  #408  
Old 10-09-2005, 05:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Princejonnhy25
Just a question could the Queen have created a title for Diana like The Princess Mother. People see what they want to see. Diana had a lot to lose if she did not get a good settlement. She did her part and made herself look like and victim and after the divorce there was a change. Diana did a lot of her noticable landmine and aids work after her death(if im wrong correct me).
Call my picky but don't you mean after her 'divorce' not her 'death'?

Landmine work - yes - aids work - she started relatively early in her life as POW and continued throughout.
  #409  
Old 10-09-2005, 06:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ysbel
tiaraprin, wasn't it you who said the discussion of which crown prince would succeed first was morbid because it was speculating on which monarch was going to die first?

How is it different when you have a ferverent wish that Charles die before he has a chance to acceed the throne? He may well die before his mother but praying and wishing that he die before her is like putting a death wish on him. That's morbid.
I think I was the one who said it was morbid to speculate about the current monarchs dying.

And I have never wished Charles to die first.
  #410  
Old 10-09-2005, 06:04 PM
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Quote:

Diana did a lot of her noticable landmine and aids work after her death(if im wrong correct me).
How ironic I didnt even realize I did that. I mean after the divorce. I remember now. The landmines were in 97 but Diana made huge aids news headlines in 87 when she touched an Aids victim.
  #411  
Old 10-09-2005, 06:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Princejonnhy25
Just a question could the Queen have created a title for Diana like The Princess Mother.
Assuming the Government and the Queen would have agreed Diana could return to official duties, it is likely she would have become "HRH Princess Diana". There is no meaning to the style "Princess Mother".
  #412  
Old 10-09-2005, 07:04 PM
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Yea I know I was just thinking they might make something up for her unique situation. I think they should have changed the royal law so that they could have given Diana the title of Her Highness, The Princess Diana, Princess of the Untied Kingdom of Great Britian and Northern Ireland. To not be a royal highness but become a princess in her own right. O well doesnt matter now.
  #413  
Old 10-09-2005, 09:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Princejonnhy25
Yea I know I was just thinking they might make something up for her unique situation. I think they should have changed the royal law so that they could have given Diana the title of Her Highness, The Princess Diana, Princess of the Untied Kingdom of Great Britian and Northern Ireland. To not be a royal highness but become a princess in her own right. O well doesnt matter now.
The dignity of Highness was used throughout the reign of the House of Hanover, including Queen Victoria. Her grandson, George V, abolished the use of it when he issued his 1917 letters patent governing the use of the titular dignity of Prince/Princess and the rank of Royal Highness.

Only children of the Sovereign are permitted to use "The" before their titular dignity of Prince/Princess. The one exception was when the Duke of Edinburgh was created a Prince of the UK in 1957. He was granted precedence ahead of all other princes of the UK and assumed the style of The Prince Philip. I doubt the Queen would have granted Diana a similar honour.

All princes and princesses are of the United Kingdom of Great Britian and Northern Ireland. So, if Diana had been HRH Princess Diana, she would be a princess of the same realms.
  #414  
Old 10-09-2005, 10:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Princejonnhy25
Yea I know I was just thinking they might make something up for her unique situation. I think they should have changed the royal law so that they could have given Diana the title of Her Highness, The Princess Diana, Princess of the Untied Kingdom of Great Britian and Northern Ireland. To not be a royal highness but become a princess in her own right. O well doesnt matter now.
They could also have created her Duchess of Somewhere as Queen Margarethe did for Alexandra.
I do think that with divorce becoming more acceptable there needs to be some type of title for divorced mothers of an heir, perhaps the Her Highness should be reintroduced?
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  #415  
Old 10-09-2005, 10:13 PM
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Not all princes and princess were prince and princess of the uk. Diana and Sarah were not princess in their own right. They were princes by marriage to their husband. Diana would have had to be created a Princess in her own right like the Queen did to Prince Philip. I agree I think the HH should be reintroduced. It makes everything much more eaiser.
  #416  
Old 10-09-2005, 11:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wymanda
They could also have created her Duchess of Somewhere as Queen Margarethe did for Alexandra.

Hey wymanda.

Her Majesty the Queen Margrethe II created Her Highness the Princess Alexandra a countess upon her divorce from Joachim. Apart from the fact that it was a lovely personal gesture from the Queen to her ex daughter in-law, it was also bestowed upon Alexandra so that if she were to infact remarry (which would demand the loss of Her Highness style and that of a Princess of the Kingdom of Denmark) would remain Her Excellency the countess of Frederiksborg in her own right. This title however cannot be passed down to her children and shall be placed under abeyance upon Her Highness' greatly distant passing.

I agree with both princejohnny25 and yourself that the reintrodcution of His or Her Highness styles would make the situation (whenever they come about) alot easier and less controversial for those involved.

Kind regards to you,

"MII"

I would also like to thank princejohnny25 for responding to my post. I appreciated your response and am happy to see that it was'nt interpreted in a nasty way as it was not meant to serve such a purpose.
  #417  
Old 10-09-2005, 11:38 PM
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Anyone who marries a prince of the UK automatically becomes a princess of the UK with the rank of Royal Highness. Their style and title follows their husband's peerages, if any.

The only exception was the marriage of Wallis Simpson to HRH Prince Edward, Duke of Windsor. George VI issued letters patent denying Wallis the rank of Royal Highness and princess of the UK. As a result, she was styled "Her Grace the Duchess of Windsor" and held a lesser rank than the Duke, who remained a Royal Highness.
  #418  
Old 10-09-2005, 11:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wymanda
They could also have created her Duchess of Somewhere as Queen Margarethe did for Alexandra.
I do think that with divorce becoming more acceptable there needs to be some type of title for divorced mothers of an heir, perhaps the Her Highness should be reintroduced?
It's not really the same because the rank of Highness is held by the grandchildren of the Sovereign in the male line in Denmark. The rank of Royal Highness is reserved for the children of the Sovereign only.

Alexandra remained a princess of Denmark after her divorce with the rank of Highness (equal to her children). She will lose this rank and title with remarriage, therefore, the Queen generously created Alexandra a countess with the rank of Excellency in her own right.
  #419  
Old 10-09-2005, 11:49 PM
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Originally Posted by wymanda
They could also have created her Duchess of Somewhere as Queen Margarethe did for Alexandra.
I doubt Diana would have agreed to a dukedom in her own right, rather than retaining her style as Princess of Wales. It was said she felt it was very important to retain the Wales name and would not accept anything else. I find this rather strange since if she had remarried, she would have lost the Wales style and assumed her new husband's name or title.

It would have been better for Diana to become a duchess in her own right, rather than just Diana, Princess of Wales. This way she would have retained her rank and peerage despite a remarriage.
  #420  
Old 10-10-2005, 05:08 AM
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It's hard to stop Diana discussion taking over various Charles (and Camilla) threads isn't it?

Thanks to Margrethe II and Princejonnhy25 for their civil responses. Something I learnt early on in TRF was not to assume the writing style of a member as necessarily being a true reflection of their nature or personality.

As to the use of "Highness", this was indeed abolished by George V in 1917 but with a couple of exceptions: Princesses Marie Louise and Helena Victoria (the daughters of Princess Christian of Schleswig Holstein), who have the distinction of being known as Princesses "of nothing".

I don't know what happened with the style of HH Princess Maud, who married in 1923 the Earl of Southesk and was the mother of the current 3rd Duke of Fife.

W
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