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  #1221  
Old 08-29-2007, 01:58 AM
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4. The public at large would never be told of 1, 2 or 3.
And thats how it should be. It is no concern of the common classes what their betters do. By their birth, they have earned the right to priveledge and the rest of us simply have to work to achieve the same. There are no quick fixes or changling miracles - and that is what people seem to see in Diana, that she provided the quick fix for a commoner to become a Princess, well let me tell you, breeding is everything and I rue the day that that girl ever stepped foot inside Buckingham Palace. If Queen Mary was still alive, she'd have seen the seeds of what Diana had planned, she'd have put her firmly in her place and above all, she would have reminded everyone concerned just who God put on this earth to reign over us. Maybe it is old fashioned, maybe in these days of "my rights", such things have been forgotten along with honesty, hard work, strong faith, respect and dignity but I'd much rather see the monarchy fall because it stayed true to it's roots than fall because it forgot what it stood for. I'm in the minority, indeed, I may be the only one who holds the views I do and if that is the case then I shall content myself with being the Brigadier's wife in the corner talking of the glory days of old Britannia when the poor were poor and the rich were rich but by golly didn't we all scrub along just fine together. Values were dropped long before Camilla came onto the scene but today is different and today we have Camilla. And if she's to be a member of our Royal Family then for goodness sake let's treat her like one, bow and scrape and jolly well genuflect.

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All this because a couple of young men wanted to remember their mother?
They didn't want to remember their mother. They wanted attention. The only time they're ever complimented is when they become Di's boys with those simpering faces and that tired old guff about carrying on a legacy. You surely don't believe all that? They know that when anything gets the Diana trademark slapped on it's ass, it becomes holy. Their recent actions have seen the trademark fade a little, Harry falling out of the boozer and William upsetting the girlfriend - not good reading nanny, mummy wouldn't approve nanny. So they have a concert and the result? "What lovely boys! What angelic boys! So much like their mother!" - oh yes, the pups didn't fall far did they? Media manipulation, jazzing things up with a touch of that old Di magic to cover up the cracks. A Diana Concert, a Diana Memorial Service, you tell me this, if they're so worried about their blessed mother's memory then why haven't they dealt with that sham of a memorial fund that's currently aiding the very asylum seekers the British Government are working so hard to crack down on? If they're so worried about protecting St Diana's legacy, why didn't they shut Paul Burrell up? And if they're so worried about seeing their mother given the gilded throne at the top of society, why didn't they hold a pillow over their grandmother's face and turn the Royal Family into one giant Diana circus?

They're not Windsors, they make the very name sound common and dirty and I know what people are saying, BeatrixFan has finally flipped, well maybe she has. Maybe she is just a little tired of the ostrich tactics that everyone employs to cover the truth. William and Harry are not children, they are men and any man who uses his dead mother to give himself a halo needs a serious trip to Dr Freud. But he certainly isn't fit to be King of England and I shall choke on the very address of Majesty should I ever have the misfortune to meet the wretched creature. This memorial service could have happened 5 years ago, or every year since 1997 - but it hasn't. It's happened when the William and Harry label is a little worn out, a little tired and a little too full of Nazi armbands, pot and a wasted career at Sandhurst. To cover all that up, they've sacrificed their own father and step-mother. For shame? I call it the greatest shame ever to come on the Windsors and this tops the Duke of Windsor. Oh yes, people didn't like and Dowager Duchesses gagged on their Brown Windsor at Belvoir but they never forgot who was in charge and William and Harry, "Just call me William" and "Fetch me an African baby to cover up the costume" Harry have well and truly forgotten their place. They've put their step-mother in a ghastly position because they wanted to make themselves look better by opening a new chain in the Di brand and look whats happened - they've split the House of Windsor and they've split the public. They don't deserve Camilla, plain and simple.

So come on Gordon - call a referendum because I want to see some heads roll. And I mean it. There, it's been said. Now criticise me, damn me to hell or ban me. I've been bottling that up for as long as I care to remember and I'm forever being told, "Oh don't say that, you'll upset the Di fans" or "Keep it to yourself or you might make the Diana fans cross", well what has destroying my monarchy done for me?! Made me cross? It's drained every last drop of faith I had in the Windsors from me and that kills me, it just kills me. I'm ashamed to call myself British.
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  #1222  
Old 08-29-2007, 02:06 AM
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Decision took with the Queen's advice ?
'Queen advised Camilla over Diana service' - Yahoo! News UK
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  #1223  
Old 08-29-2007, 02:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Mandy View Post
Since we're dumping on Charles, I'll play devil's advocate for a bit. What if this is William and Harry's intended revenge against Camilla for her sins against their precious mother. We have to remember that Diana filled their heads with stories about Camilla and Charles when they were at an impressionable age. As hard as they tried, they may not have been able to overcome the psychological trauma caused by their parents' fighting and arguing and their mother's neuroses. The princes may have foreseen this outcome to the memorial service... Diana mania at its best.
I must admit the same thought has crossed my mind too. But I don't think they would do that to Charles and I have faith in Camilla. I really believe if anyone could figure out how to have a good relationship with everything that has happened, Camilla could.
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  #1224  
Old 08-29-2007, 02:49 AM
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Originally Posted by gfg02 View Post
Prince Charles hopeless judgement means he's not fit to be king

Prince Charles hopeless judgement means he's not fit to be king | the Daily Mail
Oh yes, the D.... Mail tells us that Diana´s judements are still true today...
And next time we will read what Diana is talking from ´ the next world´ to us about the British Monarchy...I´m waiting for that...

Sorry but i´m so tired of this evil gossip. If i have to read more i get a Royal depression....
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  #1225  
Old 08-29-2007, 03:00 AM
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Originally Posted by gfg02 View Post
Prince Charles hopeless judgement means he's not fit to be king

Prince Charles hopeless judgement means he's not fit to be king | the Daily Mail
And so it begins.

How predictable.
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  #1226  
Old 08-29-2007, 03:08 AM
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I'm a fan of both Diana and Camilla, as I've said, BF, and I don't think that you're being fanciful or out of order, at all, but we'll just have to agree to disagree about Diana. Diana, before anything, was a quintessential upper-class English noblewoman and if anything, illustrated the English disease of honouring birth over accomplishment, which wasn't her fault. You know that Diana is dead; thus, nothing which has recently occurred can possibly be her fault. Do her sons remain morbidly attached to her? I don't know, but I do know that she couldn't possibly have anticipated it.

I've thought a lot about Diana's sons and their apparent subservience to her memory. To a small extent it's quite understandable, but I think that it's now nudging the realms of puzzling, to say the least. This memorial service.....such a very odd idea! I think that you're right, too. It's nothing more nor less than Diana's sons seeking attention, i.e. seeking endorsement, vicariously, through their mother. It was always going to be a PR disaster, either unintentional or deliberate, and if deliberate, it was a nasty little circuitous plan to bring Camilla undone. I'm still not convinced that that wasn't the ultimate object. I don't know that the young princes did this, but I'm quite sure in my own mind that certain courtiers did indeed do so, and with malice aforethought.

I agree with you about the iniquitous position in which Camilla now finds herself. I don't believe that William and Harry (and their father) could possibly have been so obtuse as to to not understand the invidious position into which they forced Camilla. I knew that many would rail and screech about her being a prominent participant in the memorial service - so how come they didn't?

On reflection, I attribute the motives of those who promoted and endorsed this memorial service to base-level. It was unnecessary, contrived, and has had nasty and avoidable outcomes.

If, indeed, Her Majesty did intervene for decorum's sake, then, yet again, I applaud the good,solid sense of our Queen.
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  #1227  
Old 08-29-2007, 04:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Elspeth View Post
And so it begins.

How predictable.
You are so right. But if you and many others including me called this predicatable already days ago, why is the future King unable to foresee what consequences his actions could have?

Somehow he must acknowledge that the media is there and won't go away, so he must find a proper way to deal with them or at least take them into consideration when taking decisions instead of ignoring the them completely.

It's essential for his future position as King as the media does influcence the public opinion whether he likes it or not.
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  #1228  
Old 08-29-2007, 05:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Zonk View Post
You have a friend, who is a divorced man/woman (whose ex has died). One of the reasons (cause there are a couple) you divorced is due to an affair that you had while married. You have since remarried the woman in question. The sons you had with your 1st wife are having a memorial. Do you insist that the 2nd wife attend the memorial?
I have been to quite a few memorials, where the children have invited their step-parent, who was once the person having the affair. Most realise that you can't make your parent's love one another and what would it gain them by treating the step parent as a 2nd class member of the family. Nobody except the two people concerned really knows what goes on within a marriage, not even the children and sometimes they are better apart.

The fact that they are having a memorial service should mean that they are christians and the whole concept of the christian faith is built on forgiveness!

Why is there this outdated belief that the wicked step-parent should be excluded from the step-childrens love and life. Most children have the ability to forgive and to love, it seems to be others 'thinking' the worst of them that causes the problems!
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  #1229  
Old 08-29-2007, 05:30 AM
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Originally Posted by love_cc View Post
Honestly, the longer time I see Prince Charles waitng for the throne, the more sadness and uncertainty I can see in his life. Of course we cannot ask the Queen to abidicate because she is such a examplary monarch and the abidication is a dark shawdow over the monarchy.
Is she though, if she hadn't put what her advisors were telling her before what her son was asking for, to marry the woman of his dreams, none of this would have happened. She showed poor judgement then and her son has had to suffer because of it. If the queen had allowed Charles and Diana to divorce sooner, allowed Charles and Camilla to marry sooner, had shown Camilla a great deal more support, then this would not be happening.

She is giving more thought to how she might be seen, as opposed to whether or not the monarchy will survive after her!
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  #1230  
Old 08-29-2007, 05:47 AM
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Originally Posted by VuMom View Post
While Camilla is very blunt, and brass at times, and one can clearly see if she only does things for self fulfillment. Royality are to do the best for their people, not themselves. It seems every chance the Dutchess gets to prove she can better "others" before herself, she fails. Back on topic, I'm glad someone with her mannerisms did not go.
We must be seeing a totally different person. The Camilla I 'know', is kind and charitable, often personally donating her time and money to causes without the constant need for publicity and the resultant public recognition. I haven't heard of any accusations of her being blunt, if she had been, I'm sure that would have been headline news. You say she only does things for self fulfillment, in what way? She appears to have a brilliant sense of humour (the British like that) and in every report in the media where people have spoken of meeting her at an event, they say how easy she is to talk to.
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  #1231  
Old 08-29-2007, 07:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
Is she though, if she hadn't put what her advisors were telling her before what her son was asking for, to marry the woman of his dreams, none of this would have happened. She showed poor judgement then and her son has had to suffer because of it. If the queen had allowed Charles and Diana to divorce sooner, allowed Charles and Camilla to marry sooner, had shown Camilla a great deal more support, then this would not be happening.

She is giving more thought to how she might be seen, as opposed to whether or not the monarchy will survive after her!
Skydragon - I think these remarks are interesting. I never thought that way before about the Queen. I do have a question. When the Queen mother died how long after did it take Charles and Camilla to marry? I think it was her (from what I read) that stopped Charles from marrying earlier. I wish they did divorce sooner. Maybe Diana's Panorama interview would not have happen or the Prince's book.

Also from what I read the Queen did advise Camilla not to go very early on to the memorial.
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  #1232  
Old 08-29-2007, 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
You are so right. But if you and many others including me called this predicatable already days ago, why is the future King unable to foresee what consequences his actions could have?

Somehow he must acknowledge that the media is there and won't go away, so he must find a proper way to deal with them or at least take them into consideration when taking decisions instead of ignoring the them completely.

It's essential for his future position as King as the media does influcence the public opinion whether he likes it or not.

Pretty much because he is incapable of seeing past the end of his nose. As I said before, he acts like a spoiled 2 year old who isn't getting his way, and doesn't bother to find out what the long term consequences of his wants are.
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  #1233  
Old 08-29-2007, 07:33 AM
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Obviously, Camilla shouldnot attend the memorial....She was the third one in the marriage of Princess Diana and Prince Charles.
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  #1234  
Old 08-29-2007, 07:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Skydragon View Post
You say she only does things for self fulfillment, in what way?
Well, I think having a long standing affair with a married man that ruins both your marriage and his marraige and the people involved is a person that does things for self fulfillment. But everything else you say about Camilla above Skydragon I believe is right about her.
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  #1235  
Old 08-29-2007, 07:45 AM
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Pretty much because he is incapable of seeing past the end of his nose. As I said before, he acts like a spoiled 2 year old who isn't getting his way, and doesn't bother to find out what the long term consequences of his wants are.
... well said, and he obviously is surrounded by guys how have taken in the Yes Sir mentality to survive because contradiction will mean getting fired.

I wonder if this - sujective - feeling of being misjudged and bullied by the media and whoever will reflect on Charles' face on Friday. I am pretty sure he'll look very offended and blame the stupid public and the evil media that his beloved wife can't be by his side. But it's good that he gets all the fire now and not Camilla because I believe she wouldn't be the one who deserves it.
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  #1236  
Old 08-29-2007, 08:06 AM
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By the way, the memorial service will be air on the french channel France 2...
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  #1237  
Old 08-29-2007, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by BeatrixFan View Post

But you're suggesting that we have a figurehead who's simply a voicebox who reads out the script provided by the Government. In which case, why have a King at all?
But that's all The Sovereign really is and it's been that way since the reign of George V. I'm not saying the monarchy isn't important, but we have to keep things in perspective. The divine rule of Kings is long over in the UK.
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  #1238  
Old 08-29-2007, 08:24 AM
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By the way, the memorial service will be air on the french channel France 2...
I'm sorry but I looked in the TV Guide and there's no information on the memorial service being aired.
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  #1239  
Old 08-29-2007, 08:31 AM
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I've just heard this in the news of 1 pm: a france 2 TV special with our dear Stephane Bern on Friday...
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  #1240  
Old 08-29-2007, 08:34 AM
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I think it would be completely innappropriate and in very bad taste for Camilla to attend the memorial.
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