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  #21  
Old 07-29-2008, 07:51 PM
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I doubt seriously (although I can not say for sure without further research) that Mother Theresa inflicted anything so horrendous on those children. They had schooling, a roof over their head, and food to eat, which is more than a great many children in India, Africa and South America to name a few had.

Unfortunately we live in a society where worth is measured by how much you have and not who you are as a person. I would be willing to bet that those children have a very strong character and can live with just what they need to survive. Not that they should have to have only what they need to survive, but I don't believe for one minute that anyone in Mother Theresa's care was in any way abused or neglected.

Re: King Badouin, that is just my point, he's done nothing that I know of that would make him an option for canonization. He was very pious, but so are many other people.
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  #22  
Old 07-29-2008, 07:56 PM
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I never said that Mother Theresa was or should be a saint. However I do find that if one has to choose between Badouin and Mother Theresa, then Mother Theresa is more deserving than Badouin.
Well, I can understand you see it that way, but I'd like to add a few nuances. It's not for no reason that the process of canonization takes decades, even centuries: there's a lot of research involved and all nuances are looked at carefully. King Baudouin also did a lot of good things, seen from a catholic point of view. He was very pious and devote, a real example for other catholics. Next to that he was also involved in a lot of good, Christian charities and of course he refused to sign the abortion law in the early nineties, which probably didn't go by unnoticed in catholic circles. The problem with beatification is that it's sometimes just comparing apples to oranges when you look at the people who are beatified in the end. If I look at the beatifications which took place in my own country recently, I think one can safely say that these people did things that were of a complete different nature than the things Baudouin or Mother Teresa did and on a much smaller scale. So luckily we aren't the people who have to decide who gets this 'St.' in the end and who doesn't.
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  #23  
Old 07-29-2008, 08:01 PM
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You think that King Badouin would be more deserving than Mother Theresa? Might I ask what you base that opinion on?
Errr... you got the meaning precisely backwards. I said that Mother Teresa (despite her flaws, as pointed out elsewhere upthread) would be more deserving, at least according to the rules/policies/viewpoints of the Catholic Church.

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Slate magazine is hardly a reliable or serious publication
You'd be pretty wrong there. A lot of their investigative journalism is on par with the best world newspapers.

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However Mother Theresa has more people who will speak in her favor than not.
Yes, and the same could be said of any historically vilified figure at some point. So that's not really germane. The fact is that criticism of Mother Teresa is rather more widespread than you are accepting. Her veneration of poverty is well-known; she did nothing to actually help alleviate poverty, and in fact did many things to ensure people were kept in a grinding cycle of poverty and suffering.

But that's neither here nor there; I brought her up only to illustrate that someone who many people think is highly deserving of sanctification & canonization is still in the early stages, and that someone like King Beaudoin isn't regarded in the same way.
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  #24  
Old 07-29-2008, 08:49 PM
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So is there any new information about King Baudoin? I just realised that it's a while since this thread was started.
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  #25  
Old 07-30-2008, 02:35 AM
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Just a recent article in the Belgian newspapers that it will take a beautification and such will take a very long time. I suppose they looked for something to write about the late king, since on July 31st it will be exactly 15 years ago that he died. The newspaper interviewed Eric de Beukelaer, who is a spokesman for the Belgian conference of Bisshops.

Mr. de Beukelaer says that they are doing research and such, so I suppose somebody claimed a miracle happened after praying to the late king (otherwise what would they research?).
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  #26  
Old 07-31-2008, 04:15 AM
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Also, the famous Belgian father Damiaan has been sanctified, which makes it easy to expand and think about which other Belgians might receive this honour, and since the King is known as one of the most devout Roman-Catholics of the last 100 years who did not live in a monastary, lapses of this kind are easily made.

As for a miracle, I believe there is some woman who claimes she was cured from cancer really quickly after seeing him and talking to him or something like that. Personally, I am always sceptical when it comes to "sudden cures" to medical problems. But determining what an acceptable miracle is, is a problem for the Church.
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  #27  
Old 01-26-2011, 06:15 AM
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I think if there would be anyone "ripe" for canonisation in the future, it would have to be Fabiola.
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  #28  
Old 01-26-2011, 06:49 AM
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King Baudouin will never be blessed said Cardinal Danneels Head of the Belgian Church .

Nowadays there is only one royal which demand to be blessed coming from Solesmes ( France) is send to Rome .It is Ex Empress Zita of Austria whose husband the last Emperor of Austria was the very last person blessed by Pope Jean Paul II, whose parents gave him the surname of Karol as his father was in the Emperor's Army.
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Old 04-03-2011, 01:03 PM
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King Baudouin will never be blessed said Cardinal Danneels Head of the Belgian Church .

Nowadays there is only one royal which demand to be blessed coming from Solesmes ( France) is send to Rome .It is Ex Empress Zita of Austria whose husband the last Emperor of Austria was the very last person blessed by Pope Jean Paul II, whose parents gave him the surname of Karol as his father was in the Emperor's Army.
Fortunately it is not up to the Cardinal who gets in to Heaven (and that is a saint -anyone who goes to heaven). Some in the Vatican today might even have their doubts about the Cardinal considering some of his antics. I know of pro-life groups that already pray to King Baudouin and if their prayers are answered and all is in order his cause will go forward. I'm sure it would not be an issue if not for his refusal to sign the abortion bill. Amongst the monarchs of Europe, who did more? Reading through this thread I think it should be said that sainthood is not based on being the best 'good deed doer' nor even living a totally perfect life. It just means you went to heaven and occasionally the Church will confirm that. For myself, I believe King Baudouin is in heaven (and so a saint) but whether or not the Church ever confirms that belief is up to them.

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Old 06-26-2013, 09:05 AM
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Yesterday I watched the last episode of the -very good- VRT2 documentary on king Baudouin. They finished the programme with Baudouin's funeral where both cardinal Danneels as cardinal Suenens referred to 'the big secret' of king Baudouin, which will become clear in the future. The programme speculated that the most likely thing that they referred to is that (they thought) the king was a saint.
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  #31  
Old 06-26-2013, 09:56 AM
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Marengo , where are the miracles ?
I watched the same program as you did. Kind regards MO
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  #32  
Old 06-26-2013, 03:21 PM
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They didn't refer to any miracles yet. Just to the odd remarks by the two cardinals about the 'the big secret' that 'will make everything clear'. Quite odd to mention that several times in front of many state leaders and millions of Belgians/ other people.

Did you get to see the documentary on RTBF (no idea if they broadcasted a French version)? The people they interviewed were quite good, several former (prime) ministers, former employess of cardinal Suenens, the secretary of Queen Fabiola, Etienne Davignon etc. They even interviewed the king's Parisian surgeon- who believes there was a devine intervention during the heart surgery, which saved the king's life at the time.
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Old 06-26-2013, 03:21 PM
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They didn't refer to any miracles yet. Just to the odd remarks by the two cardinals about the 'the big secret' that 'will make everything clear'. Quite odd to mention that several times in front of many state leaders and millions of Belgians/ other people.

Did you get to see the documentary on RTBF (no idea if they broadcasted a French version)? The people they interviewed were quite good, several former (prime) ministers, former employees of cardinal Suenens, the late Prof. Robert Senelle, the secretary of Queen Fabiola, Etienne Davignon, Prof. van der Wijngaert, prince Stéphane Lobkowicz etc. They even interviewed the king's Parisian surgeon- who believes there was a devine intervention during the heart surgery in July 1993, which saved the king's life at the time.
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  #34  
Old 06-26-2013, 04:13 PM
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Yes I saw it in French and as most of my friends I cried because I remember when I met him The King looked at me as he knew me. I will never forget.
Blessing Monarchs is not a good think , they were good persons and great Monarchs.
I agree for blessing Karl the last Emperor of Austria , it was the late Pope Jean Paul II 's will , his parents gave him the name of Karol because his father was Officer in the Emperors's Army . He was totally alone , did not save his money in time and died tragically in Madeira. But his wife Empress Zita did her work as such a lot of Widows did. In France (Solesmes) they want Her to be blessed, no answer from Rome yet.
Marengo , excuse my bad English MO
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Old 06-26-2013, 08:12 PM
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your English is lovely and so much better than my French. I do not, believe, that people, can attain a stature, beyond, being people, just some people are very kind and very giving.
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  #36  
Old 06-26-2013, 08:51 PM
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The process for the beatification of Empress Zita is still ongoing.


As far as Christopher Hutchens goes he's a notorious anti-Catholic all one needs to do is google his comments about various Catholics. I'd hardly take his word about Mother Theresa as the gospel.

In regards to poverty, there will always be poor among us and there are worse things than being materially poor. That doesn't mean we shouldn't do what we can to help them.

In the end it doesn't really matter what anyone says about Mother Theresa...her actions speak for themselves.

LaRae
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