The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #821  
Old 01-04-2017, 12:44 PM
Nobility
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Tennessee, United States
Posts: 301
I really doubt we who aren't in that family have anything close to an accurate understanding of what it does or doesn't really mean to them these days, and therefore what to interpret from Kate not having one yet.

For all we know, it could just be that the Queen thinks wearing two (as she does) is not the most comfortable thing given all the other accoutrements that queens wear to state occasions, that three is really the absolute most anyone should be saddled with, and she's decided to spare Kate the potential of ending up with four if she outlives William.
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
  #822  
Old 01-04-2017, 12:47 PM
duke of poliganc's Avatar
Courtier
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: cairo, Egypt
Posts: 604
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
Now I have a question. Is it actually a requirement for those attending such events to wear the RFO or whatever other orders that they've received or is it an opportunity?

Just wondering.
it's a requirement if you had it if you don't then no it's not princess michael had been attending banquets for years but she don't ware one cause she don't have one .

Quote:
Originally Posted by loonytick View Post
I really doubt we who aren't in that family have anything close to an accurate understanding of what it does or doesn't really mean to them these days, and therefore what to interpret from Kate not having one yet.

For all we know, it could just be that the Queen thinks wearing two (as she does) is not the most comfortable thing given all the other accoutrements that queens wear to state occasions, that three is really the absolute most anyone should be saddled with, and she's decided to spare Kate the potential of ending up with four if she outlives William.
if you think thats uncomfortable you should see the ones queen margrethe ii of denmark wear
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
  #823  
Old 01-04-2017, 12:51 PM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 7,312
The difference with Sweden also is that there The King's Miniature is not only worn when in long dress, but also for events with ladies in formal daywear, like christenings, jubilees, state events, etc. In Britain this would mean: the Trooping the Colour or so. Then we would have seen the princesses sporting their RFO while riding down the Mall in formal daywear with hats and gloves.

So indeed, as one of the previous posters remarked: maybe Beatrice and Eugenie, princesses of the blood royal and grandchildren of the Sovereign, have a RFO but we simply have never seen them wearing one by lack of appropriate events to do so...
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #824  
Old 01-04-2017, 04:51 PM
LauraS3514's Avatar
Nobility
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: San Jose, CA, United States
Posts: 422
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Anyway, we may expect Catherine with the RFO, any more time it takes, the shorter the wait, let us say.

For the Princess Michael I have the theory that the RFO is for every born senior Princess in the royal family, spouses to Princes in the direct line and by extension spouses of royal Dukes.

This means that junior princesses (like Beatrice, Eugenie, Louise and Michael), as well the future non-royal Duchesses of Gloucester and Kent will not receive the RFO.

This theory means that the RFO will be worn by Camilla, Catherine, the future Princess George, Charlotte, the future Princess Harry, Anne, Sophie, plus Alexandra, Brigitte and Katharine as the remnants of the extended family.
IIRC, Queen Victoria gave hers to all her granddaughters - not just the British princesses (i.e. Marie-Louise and Helena Victoria who also received Edward VII's, George V's and George VI's) and George VI gave his to his niece Princess Alexandra of Kent, who also received QEII's order despite not being in the direct line or a royal duchess. We don't know if Beatrice and Eugenie have received their grandmother's order or not, as they've never attended an event where it would be worn. It comes down to "we just don't know HM's criteria." I do however agree that the future non-royal duchess of Gloucester, Kent, and Edinburgh will NOT receive the RFO.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #825  
Old 01-04-2017, 06:13 PM
Countessmeout's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: alberta, Canada
Posts: 6,962
Yes, the order of Victoria and Albert was granted to her extended family including all of her granddaughters, foreign included.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roya...ria_and_Albert

Princess Alice, countess of althone at the time of her death had five (her grandmother Victoria, her uncle Edward vii, her cousin George v, his son George vi and Elizabeth)

Edward vii rewarded the order, as did his son, to the daughters of his sister Louise, Alexandra and Maude of fife.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #826  
Old 01-04-2017, 07:11 PM
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Alexandria, United States
Posts: 132
I have a theory that makes sense in my head. The Queen's modern day requirement for the RFO is 6 years, unless you are Princess of Wales, Duchess of Cornwall. Think about it, for Sophie, six years, Sarah never got one because her marriage lasted just 6 years 9seperation), and Kate is just getting to the sixth year, so maybe this is her year. Now for the Kents and Gloucesters I think it was when you got married, except Pss Michael.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #827  
Old 01-05-2017, 07:07 AM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 7,312
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoyalHighness 2002 View Post
I have a theory that makes sense in my head. The Queen's modern day requirement for the RFO is 6 years, unless you are Princess of Wales, Duchess of Cornwall. Think about it, for Sophie, six years, Sarah never got one because her marriage lasted just 6 years 9seperation), and Kate is just getting to the sixth year, so maybe this is her year. Now for the Kents and Gloucesters I think it was when you got married, except Pss Michael.
Katherine of Kent and Brigitte of Gloucester are royal peeresses, like -before them- Alice of Gloucester, Marina of Kent and Alice of Athlone. Marie-Christine (Princess Michael) is "just" married to a junior prince without a peerage. Maybe there is also a reason.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #828  
Old 01-05-2017, 04:25 PM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Manchester, United Kingdom
Posts: 75
I did notice that the Duchess of Cornwall has the RFO, but the Duchess of Cambridge does not ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoyalHighness 2002 View Post
I have a theory that makes sense in my head. The Queen's modern day requirement for the RFO is 6 years, unless you are Princess of Wales, Duchess of Cornwall. Think about it, for Sophie, six years, Sarah never got one because her marriage lasted just 6 years 9seperation), and Kate is just getting to the sixth year, so maybe this is her year. Now for the Kents and Gloucesters I think it was when you got married, except Pss Michael.
But Princess Beatrice and Princess Eugenie have been in the RF longer than 6 years - do they have the RFO?
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #829  
Old 01-05-2017, 04:31 PM
Countessmeout's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: alberta, Canada
Posts: 6,962
Eugenie and Beatrice have never attended an event where they would wear it so we don't know.

As for Camilla and Kate.... Camilla has been married for eleven years to the prince of Wales. And has been a full time working royal for. all that time. Comparably Kate is just about six years and is a part time royal. Their situation is not comparable.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #830  
Old 01-05-2017, 04:35 PM
Gentry
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Manchester, United Kingdom
Posts: 75
Quote:
Originally Posted by Countessmeout View Post
Eugenie and Beatrice have never attended an event where they would wear it so we don't know.

As for Camilla and Kate.... Camilla has been married for eleven years to the prince of Wales. And has been a full time working royal for. all that time. Comparably Kate is just about six years and is a part time royal. Their situation is not comparable.
Perhaps if they attend the Coronation Ball - which will happen within the next 10 years at the most I would expect - we will see if Eugenie and Beatrice have the RFO ...
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #831  
Old 01-05-2017, 04:46 PM
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: England, United Kingdom
Posts: 1,584
The truth is we will never really know who exactly has the RFO as we only know who has it if they wear it. Beatrice, Eugenie and even Zara may have the RFO but we just don't know as we are unlikely to ever see them wear it
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #832  
Old 01-05-2017, 05:20 PM
Dman's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Midwest, United States
Posts: 13,468
The York Sisters aren't working members of the family. Zara isn't titled or a working member of the family. They wouldn't have the family orders.

The only person that's due to get it is Catherine. After attending these state events she should have it.
__________________
"WE CANNOT PRAY IN LOVE AND LIVE IN HATE AND STILL THINK WE ARE WORSHIPING GOD."

A.W. TOZER
Reply With Quote
  #833  
Old 01-05-2017, 05:30 PM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 7,312
It is not needed to be working members. Elizabeth, Margaret and Alexandra are examples of ladies who got the RFO as adolescent or younger. Alice of Athlone, Marina of Kent and Alice Gloucester were doing public events so now and then, in connection with their (husbands') patronages. The all got the RFO. So it seems that having a full royal agenda is not a requirement for a RFO. It is possible that King Charles III will give the RFO to Princess Charlotte while she is still a child. Who knows.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #834  
Old 01-05-2017, 05:41 PM
duke of poliganc's Avatar
Courtier
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: cairo, Egypt
Posts: 604
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dman View Post
The York Sisters aren't working members of the family. Zara isn't titled or a working member of the family. They wouldn't have the family orders.

The only person that's due to get it is Catherine. After attending these state events she should have it.
by that premises then princess michael and Sarah Ferguson should had got the RFO and they have attended far more even't for far more years than kate .
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #835  
Old 01-05-2017, 06:10 PM
Osipi's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: On the west side of North up from Back, United States
Posts: 9,679
What it all boils down to is that the RFO is given by the Queen at her pleasure and we will never know what her reasons for giving it or not giving it is. The only person that could really clear all this up and set the record straight is HM, herself, and she's not talking.

The best any of us can really do is guess.
__________________
“In my walks, every man I meet is my superior in some way, and in that I learn from him.”
~~~Ralph Waldo Emerson~~~
Reply With Quote
  #836  
Old 01-05-2017, 06:11 PM
RoyalProtocol's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Belfast, United Kingdom
Posts: 796
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dman View Post
The York Sisters aren't working members of the family. Zara isn't titled or a working member of the family. They wouldn't have the family orders.

The only person that's due to get it is Catherine. After attending these state events she should have it.

I think the only person who can make the call on when the Duchess of Cambridge receives the RFO is The Queen, it is her order after all.

This debate has gone round and round and round and really is becoming rather tedious to read.

Here are the facts - we only know when someone receives the RFO when they appear in public wearing it.

We cannot know the Duchess of Cambridge's personal thoughts on ivory therefore we cannot speculate on whether she has an issue with it.

The Order is in The Queen's personal gift, she makes the rules and decides when to hand it out.

Everything else is pure speculation!


Sent from my iPad using The Royals Community
__________________
Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II
59 Years of Dedicated and Devoted Service

God Save The Queen!



Reply With Quote
  #837  
Old 01-05-2017, 06:51 PM
Nobility
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Tennessee, United States
Posts: 301
There's a very silly part of me that likes to think the whole family has decided to play games with royal-watchers heads' by making sure RFOs appear on a seemingly nonsensical schedule. "Catherine, you know I like you, I like you very much, but if I give you an RFO right now they'll be convinced they know my criteria. Let's wait another year or two, make it look like it's tied to, oh, I don't know, how many vacations you've taken. You know, in retrospect, maybe I should have given it to you on your wedding day. That really would have thrown them for a loop!"
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #838  
Old 01-05-2017, 07:12 PM
Dman's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Midwest, United States
Posts: 13,468
Quote:
Originally Posted by RoyalProtocol View Post
I think the only person who can make the call on when the Duchess of Cambridge receives the RFO is The Queen, it is her order after all.

This debate has gone round and round and round and really is becoming rather tedious to read.

Here are the facts - we only know when someone receives the RFO when they appear in public wearing it.

We cannot know the Duchess of Cambridge's personal thoughts on ivory therefore we cannot speculate on whether she has an issue with it.

The Order is in The Queen's personal gift, she makes the rules and decides when to hand it out.

Everything else is pure speculation!


Sent from my iPad using The Royals Community
The reason why we keep talking about this year after year is because she's attending these state events with her tiara, but no family order after all this time.

I bet she'll attend this years state banquets and diplomatic reception without it. Although, I'm speculating about the ivory issue, it speaks volumes that she don't have it yet.

I know some might go into the whole marriage rumors...due to unfounded speculations about the family attitudes towards Sarah...but I think it's a down right shame that Catherine is working and serving The Queen, but can't be gifted the family order from the very family she's working for.

That's wrong and very much unfair and people should start talking loud and drawing crowd over this issue.
__________________
"WE CANNOT PRAY IN LOVE AND LIVE IN HATE AND STILL THINK WE ARE WORSHIPING GOD."

A.W. TOZER
Reply With Quote
  #839  
Old 01-05-2017, 07:30 PM
duke of poliganc's Avatar
Courtier
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: cairo, Egypt
Posts: 604
sophia and camilla who are more senior than kate had to wait for years while they were being full time royals and you want kate who for me had been less than a part time royal be given the RFO just because she started to attend one event every year for the last three years ?!!
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #840  
Old 01-05-2017, 08:00 PM
AdmirerUS's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Midwest, United States
Posts: 5,130
It is her majesty's decision Live with it.
__________________

__________________
"And the tabloid press will be a pain in the ass, as usual." - Royal Norway
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
orders and decorations, protocol, royal family order


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





Popular Tags
albania birthday carl gustaf chris o'neill crown princess mary crown princess victoria current events denmark duchess of cambridge style duchess of york earl of snowdon family general news hereditary grand duchess stéphanie hereditary grand duke guillaume infanta cristina infanta leonor infanta sofia iñaki urdangarín king carl gustaf king felipe king felipe vi king philippe king willem-alexander letizia liechtenstein monarchy news prince alexander prince carl philip prince daniel prince felix prince gabriel prince harry prince nicholas prince of wales prince oscar princess beatrice princess claire princess claire of luxembourg princess diana lady spencer princess estelle princess leonore princess madeleine princess margriet princess mary daytime fashion princess mary hats princess of asturias princess sibilla princess sofia princess sofias hats princess victoria queen elizabeth ii queen letizia queen letizia casual outfits queen letizia daytime fashion queen letizia fashion queen mathilde queen maxima queen silvia rohans sofia state visit state visit from argentina stephanie sweden swedish royal family the duchess of cambridge daytime fashion the duchess of cambridge hats victoria



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:30 AM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2017
Jelsoft Enterprises