Charles and Diana

[Trudie]

@Sandy345 Diana broke her arm in a riding accident as a child so she was afraid to ride. I think Diana at first liked some country pursuits being brought up in Norfolk. I think her dislike began after the wedding when on her honeymoon Charles preferred hunting and fishing solo instead of spending time with her.

 

[Denville]

@Sandy345 Diana broke her arm in a riding accident as a child so she was afraid to ride. I think Diana at first liked some country pursuits being brought up in Norfolk. I think her dislike began after the wedding when on her honeymoon Charles preferred hunting and fishing solo instead of spending time with her.

I think she just accepted country pursuits, as part of upper class life, as a kid.. but wasn't all that interested in them. When she met Charles, she did talk herself into being interested, watching him fishing and shooting.. and seeming keen on them.. so he thought she was. But when they married, he wanted to go out shooting or stalking and she didn't feel like it any more.. She was beginning to realise that she had signed up for a lifetime of visits to Balmoral, muddy boots, rain and shooting parties and she didn't like it.. So she began to get angry and upset when C wanted to go out, and he began to go alone.

 

[Sandy345]

The first time as a married woman at Balmoral she was quite ill, she had severe morning sickness. She did not feel well I don't think it was a matter of being angry just feeling uncomfortable. She was not feeling sick the previous times she was with Charles at Balmoral. Different scenario. SHe did go stalking the following year the Fall after William was born and there are photos of her doing so. Charles should have been more sensitive to his wife and it would not have hurt him to stay with her more especially since she was not feeling well she was carrying their first baby.

 

[TLLK]

I think she just accepted country pursuits, as part of upper class life, as a kid.. but wasn't all that interested in them. When she met Charles, she did talk herself into being interested, watching him fishing and shooting.. and seeming keen on them.. so he thought she was. But when they married, he wanted to go out shooting or stalking and she didn't feel like it any more.. She was beginning to realise that she had signed up for a lifetime of visits to Balmoral, muddy boots, rain and shooting parties and she didn't like it.. So she began to get angry and upset when C wanted to go out, and he began to go alone.

I agree Denville. While Diana certainly grew up in the country and did attend weekend country parties, I believe that at heart she truly enjoyed the city life, sun and beaches over the remote Scottish highlands.

 

[Denville]

I agree Denville. While Diana certainly grew up in the country and did attend weekend country parties, I believe that at heart she truly enjoyed the city life, sun and beaches over the remote Scottish highlands.

I think that as a kid, she was oK with living in the country, because as a child one tends to accept whatever life one has, as normal. So she accepted the shooting parties at her fathers estate and the spending school hols in the country.. but she never got that fond of riding or took to hunting or shooting..
Im not sure about gardening which is often an amusement for upper class women. Did she like that as a kid?
But I think when she got to her late teens and began to live in London, she preferred it there. and when she began to go for sunny holidays abroad, where she could swim and water ski and sunbathe, she preferred that to tramping across muddy acres in Scotland or England, or watching Charles fishing or listening to the RF gabbing on about hunting and how many birds they shot. but it was expected of her then.. that all Royals spent some time in balmoral or Sandrignham and if they didn't enjoy country sports, they put up with it. But Diana began to gt upset that Charles was out enjoying himself while she was stuck in the castle looking out at the rain..

 

[Sandy345]

Diana and Charles did enjoy skiing and would go every year sometimes with the Yorks to accompany them. And later William and Harry would be seen with them.

 

[TLLK]

I think that as a kid, she was oK with living in the country, because as a child one tends to accept whatever life one has, as normal. So she accepted the shooting parties at her fathers estate and the spending school hols in the country.. but she never got that fond of riding or took to hunting or shooting..
Im not sure about gardening which is often an amusement for upper class women. Did she like that as a kid?
But I think when she got to her late teens and began to live in London, she preferred it there. and when she began to go for sunny holidays abroad, where she could swim and water ski and sunbathe, she preferred that to tramping across muddy acres in Scotland or England, or watching Charles fishing or listening to the RF gabbing on about hunting and how many birds they shot. but it was expected of her then.. that all Royals spent some time in balmoral or Sandrignham and if they didn't enjoy country sports, they put up with it. But Diana began to gt upset that Charles was out enjoying himself while she was stuck in the castle looking out at the rain..

Apart from skiing, the pair simply had different ideas on how to enjoy their downtime. Charles preferring the solitude that Balmoral's country pursuits offered while Diana enjoyed the sun and warmer climate fun. Diana didn't really care for the Balmoral traditional activities, so it must have been a very lonely time for her.

 

[Sandy345]

when the boys went with her I recall she had a much better time being with then. And when Fergie married in she had companionship.

 

[QueenMathilde]

when the boys went with her I recall she had a much better time being with then. And when Fergie married in she had companionship.

Did Diana and Fergie get along?

 

[Jacknch]

We can discuss the relationship between Diana and Sarah in the https://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f38/diana-and-sarahs-relationship-12085.html thread.

 

[Sandy345]

I don't recall if Diana had her good friends visit her at Balmoral. I think her sisters were there especially since Jane was married to a courtier, Fellowes.

 

[Denville]

Apart from skiing, the pair simply had different ideas on how to enjoy their downtime. Charles preferring the solitude that Balmoral's country pursuits offered while Diana enjoyed the sun and warmer climate fun. Diana didn't really care for the Balmoral traditional activities, so it must have been a very lonely time for her.

I don't think they had the same ideas abuot skiing even. Charles liked the hard runs, Diana enjoyed it but in a more light hearted way. and since Charles had shooting parties, and hunting as part of his routine when in the UK, she was not enjoying their day to day leisure activities either. She grew to hate the being in the country thing.

 

[Sandy345]

The point is they both liked skiing. Diana learned how to ski when she went away to school and it was something they both liked. They also had a joint interest in teaching their sons how to ski. DIana managed to be in the country every single year until the separation.

 

[Denville]

The point is they both liked skiing. Diana learned how to ski when she went away to school and it was something they both liked. They also had a joint interest in teaching their sons how to ski. DIana managed to be in the country every single year until the separation.

She didn't have any choice but to "be in the country". She was expected to go to Balmoral for shooting and Sandringham. She had to take the boys to Highgrove every weekend to see their father even when she and Charles were living discreetly apart....Once she was separated from Charles, she never voluntarily went to any country based royal gatherings...

 

[Curryong]

I for one certainly don't blame Diana for that. The vast majority of people don't go anywhere near their estranged spouses or their spouse's relatives following a separation.

And Diana wasn't the first person on the face of the earth to find that she and her husband had little in common after marriage. The fact is that BOTH partners in a relationship are at fault when that relationship fails. That is the case whether the persons concerned are Kings and Queens or just ordinary people in obscurity. Both partners in the Charles/Diana marriage could, should have tried harder but didn't.

And I have to say that if one person deliberately goes into a marriage and makes vows before God at the ceremony while not feeling in their heart what they ought to feel, then the marriage is doomed from the first, unless that individual tries to make up for it 110% from then on. Was Charles that 110% husband? IMO, No he wasn't.

 

[Nico]

I for one certainly don't blame Diana for that. The vast majority of people don't go anywhere near their estranged spouses or their spouse's relatives following a separation.

And Diana wasn't the first person on the face of the earth to find that she and her husband had little in common after marriage. The fact is that BOTH partners in a relationship are at fault when that relationship fails. That is the case whether the persons concerned are Kings and Queens or just ordinary people in obscurity. Both partners in the Charles/Diana marriage could, should have tried harder but didn't.

And I have to say that if one person deliberately goes into a marriage and makes vows before God at the ceremony while not feeling in their heart what they ought to feel, then the marriage is doomed from the first, unless that individual tries to make up for it 110% from then on. Was Charles that 110% husband? IMO, No he wasn't.

(......)
In few days Charles 's marriage with Camilla will be offcially longer than his previous union with Diana. This union didn't work, for various reasons. The case is closed. (......)


Feelings like love, hate, marriages, divorces are deeply intimate. We will never know, despite tons and tons of speculations, what was really on their minds. Never. (.....)

All of this with a lighthearted "IMO" of course ...

 

[Pranter]

Due to their inherent differences and their unique situation the major changes that would of needed to have happened to save the marriage were almost impossible to enable...Diana would of had to be the one who gave the most and I don't think there was enough incentive (refer to their inherent differences) for that to happen.

Even if Charles had never spoken to Camilla, never mentioned her name again, burned all her gifts in a big bonfire in the gardens at High Grove....he couldn't change his station in life nor who he is as a person. Neither of them could give each other what they needed.


LaRae

 

[MARG]

I think I would be more interested if more of the marriage was covered treating both Charles and Diana as real live human beings.

Did Diana see Charles as a father figure, someone who loved her and that she could lean on and always be there for her? Did her expectations of her husband doom her marriage?

Did Charles see Diana as a beautiful, intelligent and compassionate woman who, unlike his parents, loved him and would always have his back and doom his marriage?

Did the hurt and rejection that discovering the person they loved didn't love them as they thought cause both of them to seek solace elsewhere?

What part did the interference of the palace machine and BRF itself play in the ultimate disintegration play in crumbling their marriage?

 

[Curryong]

These are big questions, Marg and I believe that the Royal leisure routine in many ways did play their part in dooming the marriage, as did the couple's expectations of each other.

As we have all expressed here at one time or another, Charles and Diana's very short courtship period didn't give an adequate amount of time for them to really get to know each other. A year at least and lots more dating in that time would have made all the difference IMO.

 

[Osipi]

To boil everything down into a sticky icing, the main culprit here that was a determining factor in the success or failure of the marriage between Charles and Diana is that they *both* didn't take enough time to really get to know each other intimately as "best friends", explore and be honest about likes and dislikes and sharing hopes, expectations, fears, doubts. Most likely too, they never had a falling out with each other to determine how those "I love you but I don't like you too much right now" days would be and how they'd work things out.

The icing is gooey, sweet and sticky but the cake underneath it has a lot of ingredients that they just never got around to tasting.

The reputed 13 times spent together before becoming engaged is the main red flag for me. ?

 

[victor1319]

The reputed 13 times spent together before becoming engaged is the main red flag for me. ?

Oh, really? Were these like thirteen afternoons or something? And it is not like 13 would be a lucky number...

To me this was unknown and it makes it look like the marriage of the Shah of Persia, who did choose his later childless and then divorced bride from a staple of photographs...

This, if true, makes Charles look not very good. Especially, if one considers, that an even only emotionally ill-treated wife might perhaps lead to an Oedipus-complex and later to machismo, a Casanova-Complex with all the problems in and for the son.

What a luck, that William seems to have been become a rather stable person!

 

[Sandy345]

It is on record that Diana spent weekends with Charles at Balmoral and rather sadly, Camilla and APB hosted them for weekends at Bolehyde. So it is not like they had 13 dinner and movie dates. They spent days together.

 

[Somebody]

I doubt CHarles would get a second divorce no matter what so I am not surprised the marriage lasted. And it is immaterial how long Diana's and CHarles' marriage lasted. They did have royal children together. Camilla and CHarles did not, she won't be a royal ancestor in any case.

(......)

It's very unfortunate that they only found out after their engagement that it wouldn't work out. They shouldn't have married but apparently they and the people around them thought differently at that time (but most likely agree in hindsight).

 

[Curryong]

Camila has a home of her own, to which she escapes from the more formal life at Highgrove and CH from time to time and sees her energetic young grandchildren there (no precious heirloom China around.)

That might have been a solution from the beginning of the Charles and Diana marriage. Diana could have had her own London flat, leaving Charles at KP!

 

[Denville]

That might have been a solution from the beginning of the Charles and Diana marriage. Diana could have had her own London flat, leaving Charles at KP!

Since Dian'as complaint was that she didn't see enough of Charles and that he neglected her for his hobbies and his family and his other woman, I don't see how that would be a solution.

 

[TLLK]

To boil everything down into a sticky icing, the main culprit here that was a determining factor in the success or failure of the marriage between Charles and Diana is that they *both* didn't take enough time to really get to know each other intimately as "best friends", explore and be honest about likes and dislikes and sharing hopes, expectations, fears, doubts. Most likely too, they never had a falling out with each other to determine how those "I love you but I don't like you too much right now" days would be and how they'd work things out.

The icing is gooey, sweet and sticky but the cake underneath it has a lot of ingredients that they just never got around to tasting.

The reputed 13 times spent together before becoming engaged is the main red flag for me. ?

I so agree Osipi. The two hardly knew each other IMHO. Had they spent more time together then it is possible that they might have broken up before Charles' proposed or she might have declined the honor.



With that history in mind, I am not surprised that we've seen other Windsor couples: Edward/Sophie, William/Catherine, Zara/Mike, Eugenie/Jack etc..who dated for many years before becoming engaged and married.

 

[Ista]

Several posts have been edited or deleted to remove bickering or off topic posts. This is a reminder that this thread is about Charles and Diana, and not about Charles and Camilla, the Snowdons, or any other royal couple. Further off topic posts, or personal exchanges between posters will be removed without notice.

 

[Pranter]

I firmly believe if they had spent at least a year dating, more time together alone (spending most of your time with friends creates a buffer) they would never of made it to engagement point.

It's rather sad they spent so many years unhappy.

LaRae

 

[Denville]

I firmly believe if they had spent at least a year dating, more time together alone (spending most of your time with friends creates a buffer) they would never of made it to engagement point.

It's rather sad they spent so many years unhappy.

LaRae

I don't think so. They did have time alone but they were both blinded by their own needs, she wanted to marry and make a good marriage. She wanted security of marriying a man who could not divorce...
. He wanted to get married because he knew that he had reached the age when he really needed to consider it seriously. So they both were determined and IMO would have married even after a year's courtship.

 

[Sandy345]

Charles was advised to marry a woman of no experience. That point had been driven home to him a few years before He was serious about Davina Sheffield but her ex came forward and told about her "past" and that she had lived with him. I doubt Charles wanted that to happen again.