The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #881  
Old 08-11-2015, 10:38 PM
Nobility
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Regina, Canada
Posts: 368
Quote:
Originally Posted by nascarlucy View Post
Could this be possibly a dispute over a girlfriend or a woman (non-royal or someone who is very commoner) that the family thinks it isn't suitable for Nicholas?
He was previously engaged to a commoner Rebecca Byatt and she was with him at events in Romania. His mother and aunts married commoners. Marlene says he is not gay, so it is unlikely it is about his choice of partner.

It could be he just is not as hard a worker, as has been implied. But his generation in most royal families don't work as hard as past generations.

It also could be he has gotten into business or associates with the wrong people like Laurent of Belgium, who is now fully on the public purse and would have to give it all up if he got into business again. There are advantages to being a royal, but also certain freedoms you give up such as also choice of occupation, business dealings, expressing political opinions, etc.

The talk does implies he has or wants to do that which he is not free to do as a royal.
  #882  
Old 08-12-2015, 02:01 AM
LadyFinn's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Southwest, Finland
Posts: 34,250
According to this, Nicholas has borrowed a lot of money, played at the casino, lost the money and been in contact with suspicious people.
CV Tudor_ Principele Nicolae împrumuta bani și juca la cazinou _ DC News _ De ce se intampla
Translation
  #883  
Old 08-12-2015, 02:25 AM
eya eya is offline
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: -, Greece
Posts: 23,451
IF that is true they don't have to discuss anymore if King Mihai take the right desicion or not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post


So many royals have played in casinos. So many royals have made debts. If it was all about this, just pay the debts (as Royal House) and tighten the reins and discipline Nicholas.
And how do you propose to do this? His pull the ear and put them punishment to be good boy?
Nicolae played and lost the position(if is true). King Mihai took the most difficult but correct decision. As it might cost the monarchy the King first of all knows this
  #884  
Old 08-12-2015, 04:22 AM
Jacknch's Avatar
Former Administrator
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Suffolk, United Kingdom
Posts: 9,227
Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyFinn View Post
According to this, Nicholas has borrowed a lot of money, played at the casino, lost the money and been in contact with suspicious people.
CV Tudor_ Principele Nicolae împrumuta bani și juca la cazinou _ DC News _ De ce se intampla
Translation
I do hope this is not true, but I suppose it would be reason enough to take Nicolae out of his role and remove his titles etc.

The article suggests that Margarita was involved in the decision more so than the King. HOWEVER, I hope that we can get a proper translation.
__________________
JACK
  #885  
Old 08-12-2015, 05:52 AM
maria-olivia's Avatar
Majesty
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Brussels, Belgium
Posts: 7,474
The King gave his reason : lack of modesty and moral principles .
His way of living is not the one whished by King Michel.

Do we have proofs ?

Mrs M. Koening must be devasted .
  #886  
Old 08-12-2015, 08:26 AM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 13,232
Quote:
Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
"Wise decision"? More a decision of a silly, stubborn old man. Nicolae has done much more in and for Romania and the royal house than Michael back there in switzerland in the past 5 years!
What justifies a measure like this?!
But that was not the point. I understood Nicholas concluded for himself that his ideas about his future life did not combine well with his position as a member (and future head) of the Royal House.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceallach View Post
Irina and her children were stripped after she pled guilty to charges in the US related to hosting illegal cock-fighting derbies and serving tacos at them. At the time, the children said they had not even spoken to their grandfather in years. There was already a disconnect and they disassociated themselves with the whole family not just Irina. I am not sure about documentation, but it changed on the website.

Romanian princess Irina Walker, husband sentenced to probation for roles in cockfighting ring | OregonLive.com

Sophie was stripped over her choice of husband and later re-instated.
That was one of the most silly reasons ever to remove a born royal from the place of succession. It is illustrative for the arbitrariness and total lack of fundament concerning the succession rules in the House of Romania.

Imagine that Queen Elizabeth II had stripped her grandson Harry because he was caught binge drinking with a Nazi-uniform? It is in the same category, what are we talking about? Cockfighting (a cruel sport indeed but royals shoot animals all over the world...).



Quote:
Originally Posted by nascarlucy View Post
Could this be possibly a dispute over a girlfriend or a woman (non-royal or someone who is very commoner) that the family thinks it isn't suitable for Nicholas?
Heu... Princess Margareta married a commoner, Princess Elena married a commoner, Princess Irina married a commoner, Princess Sophia married a commoner, Princess Maria married a commoner...



Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyFinn View Post
According to this, Nicholas has borrowed a lot of money, played at the casino, lost the money and been in contact with suspicious people.
CV Tudor_ Principele Nicolae împrumuta bani și juca la cazinou _ DC News _ De ce se intampla
Translation
So many royals have played in casinos. So many royals have made debts. If it was all about this, just pay the debts (as Royal House) and tighten the reins and discipline Nicholas.
  #887  
Old 08-12-2015, 09:01 AM
Nobility
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Regina, Canada
Posts: 368
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
So many royals have played in casinos. So many royals have made debts. If it was all about this, just pay the debts (as Royal House) and tighten the reins and discipline Nicholas.
If this was all over gambling then I agree pay the debts, send him to rehab, tighten the reins, discipline him, keep him busy but to throw it all away over this is overkill. I think they have been quick to judge and punish. They really need to touch base with other royal families, cause the stories they could tell. Michael has 13 descendants and 7 are presently stripped of succession and possibly all related to gambling. Irina was hosting gambling ie cockfighting and he tossed out her children (Michael, Angelica) and great-grandchildren (Kohen, Courtney, Diana) too. Sophie had been stripped and reinstated and I am not sure how that affected her daughter. So possibly only 4 of 13 have never been stripped of succession. When they were stripped, Michael and Angelica admitted they hadn't had contact in years with their grandfather. Elena was informed by letter of her son being stripped of succession and titles. It seems ridiculous at this point if this is all that this is about. This seems to be a very dysfunctional fractured family and that what was really needed was a family intervention. When was the last time all of them were actually together? This has also been handled badly from the PR point of view too.
  #888  
Old 08-12-2015, 09:09 AM
JR76's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Malmö, Sweden
Posts: 4,592
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceallach View Post
If this was all over gambling then I agree pay the debts, send him to rehab, tighten the reins, discipline him, keep him busy but to throw it all away over this is overkill. I think they have been quick to judge and punish. They really need to touch base with other royal families, cause the stories they could tell. Michael has 13 descendants and 7 are presently stripped of succession and possibly all related to gambling. Irina was hosting gambling ie cockfighting and he tossed out her children (Michael, Angelica) and great-grandchildren (Kohen, Courtney, Diana) too. Sophie had been stripped and reinstated and I am not sure how that affected her daughter. So possibly only 4 of 13 have never been stripped of succession. When they were stripped, Michael and Angelica admitted they hadn't had contact in years with their grandfather. Elena was informed by letter of her son being stripped of succession and titles. It seems ridiculous at this point if this is all that this is about. This seems to be a very dysfunctional fractured family and that what was really needed was a family intervention. When was the last time all of them were actually together? This has also been handled badly from the PR point of view too.

People with gambling debts do have a tendency to get involved with and in the hands of people that the head of a royal family shouldn't associate themselves with.


Sent from my iPhone using The Royals Community mobile app
  #889  
Old 08-12-2015, 09:17 AM
Debbies's Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Milano, Italy
Posts: 205
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post

So many royals have played in casinos. So many royals have made debts. If it was all about this, just pay the debts (as Royal House) and tighten the reins and discipline Nicholas.
In my understanding, the King's letter made specific reference to the requirements for belonging to the Romanian Royal House.
Romania is a country with many problems and the letter emphasised the need for modesty and moral values.
It would be awkward to put a gambler in contact with the poor and socially challenged and maintain credibility.
You quickly suggest the Royal House to cover gambling debts. Are you informed on their financial resources before making such firm statements?
The Romanian Government grants an annuity to King Michael as to all former rulers. Do you think they would if he was rich?
If the info on the gambling habits is accurate, I fully sympathise with the King's point of view.
  #890  
Old 08-12-2015, 10:07 AM
Nobility
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Regina, Canada
Posts: 368
Gambling is an addiction. To deal with an addiction by taking away that person's job, home, country, purpose, future and possibly family while publicly admonishing them for being immoral, immodest, etc does not seem helpful for Nicholas who is their family. A reformed addict, someone who has overcome something and turned their life around, can be a good person to help others and relate to their difficulties and encourage them. They said it was yet scandalous and they were trying to prevent a scandal and that he owed casinos. In time the debt can be paid and repaid by Nicholas. A broken relationship, family, man; they are much harder to fix.
  #891  
Old 08-12-2015, 10:13 AM
Lee-Z's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Heerlen, Netherlands
Posts: 3,495
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Imagine that Queen Elizabeth II had stripped her grandson Harry because he was caught binge drinking with a Nazi-uniform? It is in the same category, what are we talking about? Cockfighting (a cruel sport indeed but royals shoot animals all over the world...).

Big difference is, no matter how wrong you or i think their actions were: what P.Harry did was not illegal, what then P.Irina did was in the area...
She didn't just attend some cockfight, but she was one of a number of people who organized gambling on cockfights in an country were that's illegal.
I can well imagine K.Mihai was not thrilled about that as these activities do not reflect well on a family reestablishing their name and fame
__________________
Wisdom begins in wonder - Socrates
  #892  
Old 08-12-2015, 10:19 AM
Jacknch's Avatar
Former Administrator
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Suffolk, United Kingdom
Posts: 9,227
Quote:
Imagine that Queen Elizabeth II had stripped her grandson Harry because he was caught binge drinking with a Nazi-uniform? It is in the same category, what are we talking about? Cockfighting (a cruel sport indeed but royals shoot animals all over the world...).
I can understand what you are saying here, Duc. However, the Romanian royal family need to show themselves as completely irreproachable, without scandal, no laws broken (re: cockfighting) of high standing, good morals, etc (as was inferred in King Michael's statement). In the hopes of a restoration, King Michael will have needed to take immediate and strong action in order to maintain such morality etc. In other words, they are in a less "stable" situation that, say, the British royal family.

To that end, I can understand King Michael's decision, and would feel disappointed in Nicolae if there are these elements in his life which seem at odds with the image I and others have built up of him.

I say all this only on the assumption that the gambling etc is true and we must remember that it hasn't yet been confirmed.
__________________
JACK
  #893  
Old 08-12-2015, 12:36 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,668
Petition online for young Nicholas to get back his role/titles he had until the beginning of august:

PNTCD – PETITIE ONLINE: ”DORIM: PRINTUL NICOLAE SA FIE RECUNOSCUT ALTETA REGALA A ROMANIEI”
  #894  
Old 08-12-2015, 12:38 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,668
The gambling story has nothing to do with facts!
  #895  
Old 08-12-2015, 12:40 PM
eya eya is offline
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: -, Greece
Posts: 23,451
But the story Cory is that we don't know the facts.
  #896  
Old 08-12-2015, 12:43 PM
LadyFinn's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Southwest, Finland
Posts: 34,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory View Post
The gambling story has nothing to do with facts!
I hope not, but I think that similar ugly stories of possible reasons will come out more and more. Especially if there has been some people who have wanted Nicholas out of the line of succession.

I have read many articles both in english and translated from romanian. There has been written that the Royal Family of Romania has serious imago problem. Crown princess Margarita has done some good work, but she can't really talk with people. And that Prince Radu is the one who steers the royal family nowadays and has a lot of power at the family, and that he isn't liked at all. And that Margarita and Radu are seen as very old-fashioned people who are not living in this time. And that Nicholas was the only royal who really had a contact with the common Romanian people.
  #897  
Old 08-12-2015, 12:45 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,668
The facts are quite clear: The King had a meeting with his eldest daughter and her husband and few advisers and did not invite young Nicholas and his mother Princess Elena at this meeting. The only hope for the future of the Family was stripped of his titles ans place in the Line wanted by the King because he was considered to be fit to be Head of the Family in the future. The Family explained everything was about prevention not punishement so...
  #898  
Old 08-12-2015, 12:47 PM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 13,232
The difference between King Michael and other Sovereigns, even if one of the ruling Sovereigns really want to remove one of the successors, he/she simply can not do so. In almost all cases an Act of Parliament is needed.

For an example, let us take one of them, eeeeerrrmmmm, King Willem-Alexander of the Netherlands. Let us assume he wants to remove his brother from the line of succession. Then the Government has to offer a special Bill on behalf of the King to the two Chambers of Parliament, which will read this in a joint assembly and has to approve the proposed Bill with at least a 2/3rd majority. So that is quite a heavy procedure which illustrates the thought behind this: the lawmaker wants to ensure that the line of succession is never depending on the whim of the day or changed arbitrarily or unilaterally.

Let us take another example: in Belgium there is no such a provision in the Constitution. So there King Philippe can -in principle- do like King Michael: change things unilaterally. But Belgium is a constitutional monarchy: the King is inviolable, the ministers are accountable (art 88 of the Constitution). So that means that always and ever the Government needs to agree with the King and on its turn the Government is accountable before Parliament. With other words, King Philippe can do nothing without convincing arguments, an advice by constututional specialists, a willing Prime Minister and a backing by a majority in Parliament.

The official reason: Nicholas can not combine his future career with his membership of the Royal House. That seems a bit far-sought to me. When we look to some other monarchies, for an example the Netherlands, then we see that there (former) successors have fulltime jobs or their own companies even. The late Prince Friso was director of TNO Space and of Urenco (an uranium enrichment conglomerate). Prince Constantijn is special advisor to the European Commission on digital markets. Prince Maurits van Oranje-Nassau, Van Vollenhoven owns a company which gives strategic advices to businesses. Prince Bernhard van Oranje-Nassau, Van Vollenhoven owns a company which aims at global ICT-sourcing and has an holding in a real estate firm. Prince Pieter-Christiaan van Oranje-Nassau, Van Vollenhoven is a Major in the Royal Marechaussee (military police force) and Chairman of the Dutch Association of Security Managers. Prince Floris van Oranje-Nassau, Van Vollenhoven works as a senior analyst at KPMG Corporate Finances. Etc. Etc. None of them has been stripped of title or of their place in the line of succession because they pursued their own careers outside the Royal Firm...

It is very, very, very weird that Nicholas apparently did not see possibilities to combine both worlds. His Dutch cousins (the Orange-Nassaus and the Hohenzollerns share a lot of history) show that it can work. In a ruling monarchy even. So why not in a non-ruling monarchy?
  #899  
Old 08-12-2015, 12:54 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,668
The official explanation is very weird. Nicholas was very involved in many projects in Romania and he said all the day he was ready to become King. It was not his decision but that of his grandfather, eldest aunt and her husband and the advisers of the King.
  #900  
Old 08-12-2015, 01:05 PM
LadyFinn's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Southwest, Finland
Posts: 34,250
Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
The official reason: Nicholas can not combine his future career with his membership of the Royal House. That seems a bit far-sought to me. When we look to some other monarchies, for an example the Netherlands, then we see that there (former) successors have fulltime jobs or their own companies even. The late Prince Friso was director of TNO Space and of Urenco (an uranium enrichment conglomerate). Prince Constantijn is special advisor to the European Commission on digital markets. Prince Maurits van Oranje-Nassau, Van Vollenhoven owns a company which gives strategic advices to businesses. Prince Bernhard van Oranje-Nassau, Van Vollenhoven owns a company which aims at global ICT-sourcing and has an holding in a real estate firm. Prince Pieter-Christiaan van Oranje-Nassau, Van Vollenhoven is a Major in the Royal Marechaussee (military police force) and Chairman of the Dutch Association of Security Managers. Prince Pieter-Christiaan van Oranje-Nassau, Van Vollenhoven works as a senior analyst at KPMG Corporate Finances. Etc. Etc. None of them has been stripped of title or of their place in the line of succession because they pursued their own careers outside the Royal Firm...

It is very, very, very weird that Nicholas apparently did not see possibilities to combine both worlds. His Dutch cousins (the Orange-Nassaus and the Hohenzollerns share a lot of history) show that it can work. In a ruling monarchy even. So why not in a non-ruling monarchy?
Because this is the Royal Family of Romania, and they have their own policy and etiquette. Ioan-Luca Vlad, the advisor of the Royal Family said at an interview of Nicholas' exclusion:
- If you want to make yourself a trader, you can't be a member of the Royal family.
Ioan Luca Vlad, consilier al Casei Regale_ Principele Nicolae a fost chiar usurat de decizia Regelui Mihai _ Sentimentul de antreprenoriat e foarte greu de dezvoltat in cadrul Casei Regale - Esential - HotNews.ro
Translation
Closed Thread

Tags
prince nicolae, royal family of romania


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Prince of Wales - Title, Succession and Wales Jo of Palatine British Royals 96 01-19-2023 07:35 PM
Prince Nicholas (son of Ferdinand and Marie) (1903-1978) Johan The Royal Family of Romania 26 12-07-2022 05:07 AM
HSH Prince Hans-Adam II (1945- ) and the late HSH Princess Marie (1940-2021) Mandy Princely Family of Liechtenstein 158 12-04-2022 07:29 PM
Prince William's Suitability to be King CharlotteAmalia The Prince and Princess of Wales and Family 1099 12-02-2022 12:15 PM




Popular Tags
#alnahyan #baby #princedubai #rashidmrm america arcadie arcadie claret british caroline charles iii claret crest current events defunct thrones edward vii elizabeth ii emperor naruhito empress masako fabio bevilacqua fallen empires fallen kingdom football garsenda genealogy general news grimaldi hamdan bin ahmed history hollywood hotel room for sale international events introduction jewels king king charles king willem-alexander leopold ier list of rulers matrilineal monaco monarchy new zealand; cyclone gabrielle official visit order of the redeemer overseas tours pamela hicks portugal preferences prince & princess of wales prince albert monaco prince christian princess of wales queen alexandra queen camilla queen elizabeth ii queen mathilde queen maxima ray mill republics restoration royals royal without thrones silk soccer spain spanish royal family state visit to france state visit to germany switzerland william


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:39 AM.

Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2023
Jelsoft Enterprises