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Old 02-01-2020, 06:00 AM
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What will happen to the norwegian jewels in the future?

The jewels of the royal family of Norway are private jewels. All jewels are private. There's no foundation and nothing is owned by the state. We know that most of the major jewels of Princess Astrid will return to the main line (to the King) except the small pieces when she dies. What happened to Princess Ragnhild's jewels, we don't exactly know. Some people think that the major pieces is back in King Harald's posession (Maud diamond tiara and some brooches and riviere necklaces). If they are back, I think they're not used because the late princess' husband, mr. Lorentzen is still alive.

1: Queen Sonja's jewels
2: Princess Ragnhild's jewels
3: Princess Astrid's jewels.

Crown Princess Mette-Marit and Princess Märtha Louise will recieve a larger jewel collection when they inherit, than their Mother in law/mother/aunts had. The major tiaras will go to the King (Crown Prince Haakon), and the more personal jewels of Sonja go to her daughter? Or will the two Princess MM and ML share the jewels in a royal foundation? And rotate the use of them? Or will the jewels be divided?

I hope most of the major historical jewels will survive and be left to the King's property.
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Old 02-01-2020, 06:27 AM
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Originally Posted by pkl View Post
The jewels of the royal family of Norway are private jewels. All jewels are private. There's no foundation and nothing is owned by the state. We know that most of the major jewels of Princess Astrid will return to the main line (to the King) except the small pieces when she dies. What happened to Princess Ragnhild's jewels, we don't exactly know. Some people think that the major pieces is back in King Harald's posession (Maud diamond tiara and some brooches and riviere necklaces). If they are back, I think they're not used because the late princess' husband, mr. Lorentzen is still alive.

1: Queen Sonja's jewels
2: Princess Ragnhild's jewels
3: Princess Astrid's jewels.

Crown Princess Mette-Marit and Princess Märtha Louise will recieve a larger jewel collection when they inherit, than their Mother in law/mother/aunts had. The major tiaras will go to the King (Crown Prince Haakon), and the more personal jewels of Sonja go to her daughter? Or will the two Princess MM and ML share the jewels in a royal foundation? And rotate the use of them? Or will the jewels be divided?

I hope most of the major historical jewels will survive and be left to the King's property.

ML already owns her gift tiara personally. I don't think she has any need for another tiara and her daughters are unlikely to ever attend tiara events.
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Old 02-01-2020, 07:34 AM
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ML already owns her gift tiara personally. I don't think she has any need for another tiara and her daughters are unlikely to ever attend tiara events.
But she has the right to inherit jewels too. I hope she gets the gold tiara and additional gold jewels, and the historical ones remains with the King.
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Old 02-01-2020, 09:38 AM
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But she has the right to inherit jewels too. I hope she gets the gold tiara and additional gold jewels, and the historical ones remains with the King.
What's regulate by law is that each of the two children of Harald and Sonja get their lawful share of their parents estates. The law doesn't regulate exactly what those shares should be so it's entirely possible for Märtha-Louise to get her share in cash while Haakon gets everything else. That said, naturally she, and probably her daughters, will get some of her mum's pieces of jewellery.
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Old 02-01-2020, 10:42 AM
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Like in Sweden (Bernadotteske familjestiftelserna) and in the Netherlands (Stichting Regalia van het Huis Oranje-Nassau), also the Norwegians can establish a Stifting (Foundation). That is a legal, non-natural entity, which serves as the formal owner. The King has then to make (the not easy) decision donate jewels, for so long held in private ownership, to the ownership of a Foundation.
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Old 02-01-2020, 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
Like in Sweden (Bernadotteske familjestiftelserna) and in the Netherlands (Stichting Regalia van het Huis Oranje-Nassau), also the Norwegians can establish a Stifting (Foundation). That is a legal, non-natural entity, which serves as the formal owner. The King has then to make (the not easy) decision donate jewels, for so long held in private ownership, to the ownership of a Foundation.
I am not quite sure that a =foundation is really required. Jewels can be lent out by the monarch, perhaps on long term loans as required, to siblings but ownership remains with the monarch. This broad system works well in the UK.
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Old 02-01-2020, 01:32 PM
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I am not quite sure that a =foundation is really required. Jewels can be lent out by the monarch, perhaps on long term loans as required, to siblings but ownership remains with the monarch. This broad system works well in the UK.
Yes, but the UK does not have the Code Napoléon (universal succession) as system for inheritances. That system ensures all children to receive an equal share. Also the establishment of a new Fidei Commissum (the gift of property to a person - by Will- imposing upon that person the obligation to transfer it to a specified ultimate recipient) is not allowed in this system.

In the UK, a Peer can leave the bulk to a designated heir, in theory leaving the heir's siblings penniless. That is not possible in countries with the Code Napoléon.
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Old 02-01-2020, 02:54 PM
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Originally Posted by muriel View Post
I am not quite sure that a =foundation is really required. Jewels can be lent out by the monarch, perhaps on long term loans as required, to siblings but ownership remains with the monarch. This broad system works well in the UK.
I think most of the major jewels today in the NRF are owned by the King. And he lend them out to his wife, sisters and daughter/ in law. The Norwegian collection is bigger than most people believe. That is because King Olav inherited ALL the Maud jewels and also had all the jewels from his wife Märtha. He «gave» a big tiara to each of his daughters as a loan, and to Sonja, and then lent out different smaller jewelry. In 1991 under a family agreement it was said that King Harald lent out the major jewels. So therefore maybe Haakon will inherit them. I hope so.
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Old 02-01-2020, 03:34 PM
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[QUOTE=pkl;2289825

Crown Princess Mette-Marit and Princess Märtha Louise will recieve a larger jewel collection when they inherit, than their Mother in law/mother/aunts had. The major tiaras will go to the King (Crown Prince Haakon), and the more personal jewels of Sonja go to her daughter? Or will the two Princess MM and ML share the jewels in a royal foundation? And rotate the use of them? Or will the jewels be divided?
I hope most of the major historical jewels will survive and be left to the King's property.[/QUOTE]


The norwegian RF jewel collection is smaller than the swedish ones, so this makes it pretty impossible for them to "rotate".
The Queen wears 3 major tiaras, reserved for her: the emerald tiara, Queen Desiderias tiara and Queen Maud´s pearl and diamond tiara (or the copy of it) and its sets such as necklaces and earrings. There is also a diamond circlet of Queen Maud, Queen Sonja borrowed her daughter for incoming state visits once or twice back in the 1990s. This circlet hasn´t been used in the past few years anymore at all. Queen Maud´s tiara was borrowed both to the CPcss as well as Martha for very rare occasions: one time, it was for Martha´s own wedding and second for the wedding of the swedish CPcss by CPcss Mette-Marit.

The other 2 tiaras I was referring to are completely restricted to the use of the Queen or "first lady", as Prcss Astrid was until Harald married in 1968 and wore these two "queenly tiaras" in the late 1950s and 60s.
There is more flexibility to the other smaller pieces and I can imagine they would be used by other royal ladies such as Ingrid Alexandra or Martha L., too.
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Old 02-02-2020, 08:02 AM
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Have any of Princess Ragnhild's jewels been sold off?
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Old 02-02-2020, 09:28 AM
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Have any of Princess Ragnhild's jewels been sold off?
Probably not. Her husband is probably one of the wealthiest «royals» around. He is a billionaire. She had a huge collection of pearl and diamond jewellry. Most of it gifts from her husband mr Lorentzen. Her Maud diamond tiara was a loan from the king for her life, and a diamond riviere and a brooch from Maud. These pieces may be back in the vault. I suppose they will not use them since mr Lorentzen is still alive. Queen Sonja has to diamond rivieres, and Astrid/Ragnhild got one each as a loan. Read it in the bio of Astrid. So they have 4 diamond rivieres of the same style in the collection.
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Old 02-02-2020, 09:45 AM
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I know it wouldn't happen but if they are personal property does that mean that QS could even sell those fabulous emeralds if she wanted to?
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Old 02-02-2020, 10:10 AM
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I know it wouldn't happen but if they are personal property does that mean that QS could even sell those fabulous emeralds if she wanted to?
They're most likely her husband's property so if he says no she couldn't
That said they were given to Crown Princess Märtha by her mother in 1941 to sell if she needed cash in exile so they have thought about it.
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Old 02-02-2020, 01:21 PM
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Probably not. Her husband is probably one of the wealthiest «royals» around. He is a billionaire. She had a huge collection of pearl and diamond jewellry. Most of it gifts from her husband mr Lorentzen. Her Maud diamond tiara was a loan from the king for her life, and a diamond riviere and a brooch from Maud. These pieces may be back in the vault. I suppose they will not use them since mr Lorentzen is still alive. Queen Sonja has to diamond rivieres, and Astrid/Ragnhild got one each as a loan. Read it in the bio of Astrid. So they have 4 diamond rivieres of the same style in the collection.
That's interesting I didn't realize that the queen Maud Diamond Tiara was just on loan,I doubt that Princess Ragnhild's children will need a tiara.
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Old 02-02-2020, 01:30 PM
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That's interesting I didn't realize that the queen Maud Diamond Tiara was just on loan,I doubt that Princess Ragnhild's children will need a tiara.
To my knowledge the Lorenzens have kept Princess Ingeborg's Boucheron circle tiara

http://www.thecourtjeweller.com/2018...ircle.html?m=1
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Old 02-02-2020, 02:07 PM
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To my knowledge the Lorenzens have kept Princess Ingeborg's Boucheron circle tiara

Princess Ingeborg's Boucheron Circle Tiara | The Court Jeweller
Yes, the pearl tiara was inherited from Princess Ingeborg and have never been a part of the royal collection. The Maud Diamond tiara is a part of the royal collection. It is quite big so I hope to see it again with Mette-Marit (50th years aniversary?) or Ingrid Alexandra much later.
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