Herlufsholm Boarding & Day School - Incidents and Reactions of the Royal Family

[norwegianne]

Honestly, it is the only way they could do it given the report, their positions and the Mary foundation's work in general.

A problem might be, from what I gather, that the admissions to the high schools in Copenhagen and the region, have already been completed for 2022, so if Isabella ends up going to a popular public school, it might end up that she is taking someone else's spot as it did when Christian started at tranegårdskolen back in the day.

 

[Somebody]

Honestly, it is the only way they could do it given the report, their positions and the Mary foundation's work in general.

A problem might be, from what I gather, that the admissions to the high schools in Copenhagen and the region, have already been completed for 2022, so if Isabella ends up going to a popular public school, it might end up that she is taking someone else's spot as it did when Christian started at tranegårdskolen back in the day.

If I understand it correctly, Isabella has one more year before she is going to middle school, so the easiest solution would be to stay where she is for one more year. For Christian, the situation is different as they will have to find a new school for him. But I am sure there are private schools who are happy to take him. What school did Felix go to? And would that school be an option for Christian as well?

 

[polyesco]

I'm glad they took their time for the investigation to take place and not just jump to react. A shame for Christian who had no fault in this.
I hope they find a new school where their kids can continue growing.
It must be hard to balance their public roles with the important roles as parents.
As for the school I hope it does change from here.

 

[Somebody]

I am afraid most students played a part in this; if it was not actively it most likely was passively by going along and accepting these things as part of the 'norm'. It's a culture and that can only exists if (almost) everybody plays along. For example, the birthday tradition in which first graders are lift from their bed by third graders and are beaten to ensure that they understand that even on their birthday they shouldn't think they are anything special... That's not something that will go unnoticed but will most likely be played down as 'it's just a prank/silly tradition' - while in reality it was part of a wider abuse of power of the older students over the younger students. And when students went so far that even the school started to worry, their solution was to encourage the offended students to forgive and forget - to protect the reputation of the school and of the offenders - instead of protecting the students that were hurt.

Even the parents of the offenders that at some point were disciplined would refer to the culture and norms of the school that had always allowed that type of behavior, so why were their poor children punished for something they shouldn't be held accountable for?! They just went along, didn't they?

And based on the results of the school's own student wellness questionnaire that is conducted each year, the students do know that things happen that shouldn't happen. On questions related to bullying the school scores 18-20 % BELOW average. So, the students themselves report that this type of behavior takes place at alarming rates.

 

[BriarRose]

This is probably a stupid question, given the status of the crown prince couple, but is it difficult to be admitted for school for the fall term this late in the summer?

In my area, both private schools and elite public schools have their rosters set by May at the latest. My kids had to complete both testing and interviews as part of the admission process. I can understand that Isabella can stay at her former school for another year, but what about admission for Christian?

 

[Somebody]

This seems to be a very relevant part of the report and might explain why Christian (and many others) want to stay at the school even though it has serious bullying issues.

The school's wellbeing surveys show that there are challenges with bullying at school, but at the same time the pupils express an average or above average satisfaction with being at school. This paradoxical relationship, together with the information that has emerged in the case, can also be interpreted as meaning that there is a certain acceptance among the school's students that bullying and other violent acts take place at the school.

 

[Tatiana Maria]

What really startles me is the picture that draws about the DRF. If they stay there, Christian and Isabella will for ever be the ones who not only went but knowingly stayed at an institution only invested in the well being of it's strong, rich and important nembers, while delibaretly ignoring the suffering of the victims of it's system, as long as the public picture isn't affected too negatively.

It did also occur to me that when the Crown Prince Couple in their earlier statements implied that Prince Christian and Princess Isabella personally preferred to continue/enroll at Herlufsholm and their wishes would be factored into the family's decision-making, those statements partly shifted the responsibility for the royal family's/crown prince couple's decisions concerning Herlufsholm onto Christian and Isabella. At present, associating the decision-making with their older children makes little difference due to the taboo on directing criticism at minors, but if the decisions proved to be unpopular, they could continue to be remembered and associated with Christian and Isabella's reputations even after they reach adulthood, which is not far away.

 

[Somebody]

One aspect that hasn't received much attention is how the board's network had a negative influence on what the director of the school was able to do with regards to disciplining students. Their parents would just go to their friend in the board who would tell the director to change the discipline in favor of the student with influential parents...

Even with a new board (that most likely will consist of other people within the same old boys network), unless there will be regulations that they are not allowed to interfere with individual student cases (which so far, the director had no mandate to for example remove a student from the school either temporarily or permanently), the board itself with their influential network will remain a huge risk that will make it almost impossible to create a safe culture for students. As a large part of the student population will feel safe to do as they please as they will receive backing if push comes to shove - while those who want to become part of that influential group will decide to stay quiet no matter what to avoid ruining their chances in the most influential part of society.

This has been one of the major issues so far and I don't see it changing quickly nor easily.

 

[Hans-Rickard]

If I understand it correctly, Isabella has one more year before she is going to middle school, so the easiest solution would be to stay where she is for one more year. For Christian, the situation is different as they will have to find a new school for him. But I am sure there are private schools who are happy to take him. What school did Felix go to? And would that school be an option for Christian as well?

Felix went to the public school Gammel Hellerup Gymnasium... Not far away from Tranegårdskolen actually where Christian went and Isabella goes... The best solution for Isabella (unless she already has other plans) would be to just stay and do her 9:th year there...

I guess it all depends on what Christian wants and if Gammel Hellerup Gymnsium have a place for him there... I can imagine he already have talked with some of his friends at Herlufsholm and that they will try to change to the same school...

 

[Muhler]

This is probably a stupid question, given the status of the crown prince couple, but is it difficult to be admitted for school for the fall term this late in the summer?

In my area, both private schools and elite public schools have their rosters set by May at the latest. My kids had to complete both testing and interviews as part of the admission process. I can understand that Isabella can stay at her former school for another year, but what about admission for Christian?

No such thing as stupid questions, only stupid replies.

Given who M&F are, they will have no problems finding a new high school for Christian.
A DRF kid, especially a future king, = prestige not to mention funding and will probably attract good teachers as well.
Is it fair? Well, as Comrade Napoleon said: All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than the rest.

Anyway, it's no difference from say a high school burning down, provisions will be made to accommodate the students at other high schools nearby.

The Tranegaard School is located in an affluent neighborhood, pretty far from both Amalienborg and Fredensborg, yet, M&F had no problems securing a spot there.

- It is more than hinted in the press tonight that the now ex-chairman of the board von Lowzow is pretty reluctant to admit responsibility.
Perhaps no wonder, because he might actually end up with a conviction on his head!

I have a feeling that M&F are not that pleased with the former board. Some of the members belonging to at least the out circles of M&F's acquaintances.

There has been suggestions about closing the school for the next school year to start afresh in August next year.

Felix went to the public school Gammel Hellerup Gymnasium... Not far away from Tranegårdskolen actually where Christian went and Isabella goes... The best solution for Isabella (unless she already has other plans) would be to just stay and do her 9:th year there...

I guess it all depends on what Christian wants and if Gammel Hellerup Gymnsium have a place for him there... I can imagine he already have talked with some of his friends at Herlufsholm and that they will try to change to the same school...

I'm not sure that would be a good idea. I hear on the grape wine that it's a real snob-school. I.e. new money, while Herlufsholm is old money.

There is another option: Christian could attend a high school in Aarhus and live at Marselisborg with a few friends. That way he would still be kinda boarding and it's far enough away for him to vanish in the crowd, like his dad did.
There are several renowned (state) high schools in Aarhus. It crawls with young people there! The university alone holds 38.000 students, not to mention all the other schools and educational facilities.

 

[Archduchess Zelia]

I'm very pleasantly surprised by this announcement and I think it was the only right thing to do – especially for Mary's sake. This was a lost cause for her and her work.

I genuinely felt convinced that they would keep the kids there but I will also say that when I read the agency's report yesterday, although not a lot of "news" came to light, I was struck by how scathing it is worded. And yesterday's report would just be the beginning. A law firm is conducting an impartial investigation and the police has a case going on the school. So M&F were probably right to draw the line "already" (although I think they should've done so sooner – but better late than never).

And I will maintain as I have from the beginning: losing a student as high-profile as the future monarch in such a public fashion is a sure way to ensure that Herlufsholm will make changes. The school's (both the student body and the administration) general sentiment and its history of an all bark and no bite-approach to repeated appeals to make changes makes it seem pretty naive to think they would actually be able to overturn the toxic culture that rules there. It's all very grand to say that M&F should "be part of the change". But when the vast majority of those affiliated with the school doesn't believe there is a need for change and there are no immediate repercussions for not making any changes (and there exists a culture that seeks to silence the fact that no change is made), in reality I doubt keeping the kids there would've made any positive difference at all. On the contrary, having Christian (and Isabella) pulled, to me, is a guarantee that things will have to change as Herlufsholm will now be desperate to restore their reputation.

I understand that Christian and Isabella will be disappointed with this decision but at the same time, this all could've been avoided had the family factored in the school's extensive history of cases like these when deciding on Herlufsholm in the first place. So I don't really feel overwhelmed by sympathy in that regard.

I am afraid most students played a part in this; if it was not actively it most likely was passively by going along and accepting these things as part of the 'norm'. It's a culture and that can only exists if (almost) everybody plays along. For example, the birthday tradition in which first graders are lift from their bed by third graders and are beaten to ensure that they understand that even on their birthday they shouldn't think they are anything special... That's not something that will go unnoticed but will most likely be played down as 'it's just a prank/silly tradition' - while in reality it was part of a wider abuse of power of the older students over the younger students. And when students went so far that even the school started to worry, their solution was to encourage the offended students to forgive and forget - to protect the reputation of the school and of the offenders - instead of protecting the students that were hurt.

Even the parents of the offenders that at some point were disciplined would refer to the culture and norms of the school that had always allowed that type of behavior, so why were their poor children punished for something they shouldn't be held accountable for?! They just went along, didn't they?

And based on the results of the school's own student wellness questionnaire that is conducted each year, the students do know that things happen that shouldn't happen. On questions related to bullying the school scores 18-20 % BELOW average. So, the students themselves report that this type of behavior takes place at alarming rates.

This is a very important point. You don't have to actively partake in the beatings or the sexual abuse to help uphold a culture wherein occurrences of such are normalised.

And the general consensus by the majority of Herlufsholm's alumni is that these "traditions" "build character". It's part of "the experience" and if you can't "get through it", you're weak. Which also counteracts attempts to force changes.

I'm not sure that would be a good idea. I hear on the grape wine that it's a real snob-school. I.e. new money, while Herlufsholm is old money.

GHG is a blend of many different people and is no more than a "snob-school" than Øregård. Many of Christian's classmates from Tranegårdsskolen went to GHG and Ellen Hillingsø is a student from GHG. Besides, M&F's circle of friends is a blend of old and new money. Highly doubt that would factor in.

 

[Chronojourner]

Well, that happened...

Well, I stayed up the whole night (my time) reading the preliminary report (thanks for providing the link, Muhler), and all I can say is "OMFG!!!!!" I am 65 years old and have been in the business world for about 45 years. While Herlufsholm is not the worst case I've seen of an organizational culture run amok, it's certainly close. The picture this report paints is so pervasively bad and the implication of student involvement and of a culture of silence is so extensive that it's hard to imagine that any student didn't know what was happening, at lease to a small extent. If I were M&F, after reading that report, I would sit down and have a long, stern talk with my son, as I don't see how he didn't know at least a little of what was going on. That may not be a popular opinion, but it's a truthful one.

Now, I'm going to sleep for a while and process what I've just finished reading. I'm sure I'll have more to say when I wake up. Thanks!

Well, that happened.... I woke up from my morning sleep to find that the Crown Prince Couple have made their decision, which kind of surprised me until I really thought about it. Anyway, have a lot to say, so please forgive me if this post is rather rambling.

First, I'd like to say that after thinking about the situation, my personal opinion is that M&F made the right decision by removing Christian from the school. The drama isn't going to go away if they keep him there, in fact, it will just get worse as we move through the coming year and all of the reports of issues at the school pile up. This can only damage everyone and everything associated with it. Better to move him now so he can start fresh at the beginning of the school year and has two full years in the new school, rather than maybe have to move him in the middle of the year.

Second, I think pulling Christian out of the school will make it harder for the school to change, not easier. The school has changed only when the spotlight is on it, as the agency report stated. With focus moved to another school some of that spotlight is moved away.

Third, given the way the board is structured and chosen, I think it will be very difficult for the school to change its culture. It's almost impossible for parents of students along with former students not to control the board, which means that the independence of thought necessary to make change is like not to be present.

Finally, in terms of a future school for Christian, do you guys think that UWC Atlantic College in Wales is a possibility? Leonor of Spain and Princess Alexia of the Netherlands already go there, and Elizabeth of Belgium went there in the past. It has the advantage of being about as squeaky clean as schools get when it comes to things like bullying.

If not there, then has anyone heard anything about Nyborg Gymnasium? Someone, somewhere, raised it as a possibility, but I thought it was more of a technical high school, though they also seem to have some college prep programs. Thoughts?

Thanks!

 

[camelot23ca]

I think they made the right decision. I appreciate what they said in their statement about wanting to have all the facts and make a well considered decision, but the latest report was horrible. It’s clear that it’s going to take awhile for this school to really turn itself around; I would say the next 2-3 years are going to be difficult ones for the administration, but also the teachers, parents and, of course, the students who decide to stick it out. Emotions will be running high, the students will be distracted, daily life will be chaotic. It has the potential to get very messy, and it’s not a mess I’d want to leave a 16 year old in to try to navigate for himself.

I feel bad that Christian has to suddenly change schools like this. Hopefully he’ll have a happy and uneventful couple of years going forward at his new school.

 

[Mbruno]

It sounds like the right decision to me. If things are SO bad, it is almost impossible that any student attending at least is aware of some of it. By not only keeping Christian in the school (that's one thing) but even sending Isabella there while all these issues are going on, their previous commitment did suggest that personally they didn't think it was that serious.
?

It is a political decision basically and I wouldn't be surprised if there was even some ministerial advice involved.

Politically speaking, I think it was the only possible decision, but I am pretty sure Christian will resent his parents for pulling him out and will be unhappy about it. He is only 16 though, and changing schools at that age is not exactly a life-changing decision. How many kids after all had for example to move to other cities (even other countries) because of their parents' careers and change schools (more common perhaps in the US than in Europe) ? At that age, they are quite adaptable.

For Christian, as someone else said, the best lesson is that his life comes with lots of privileges, but he will never have the freedom that a "civilian" has and some choices will be made for him regardless of how he feels about it. I think he will find that out soon also when it comes to joining the military, or deciding where he will go to university, or which courses he will take.

Personally, although it may be right for F&M to do it, putting myself into Christian's shoes and trying to think like a 16-year-old boy would, I feel it is pretty unfair to him.

 

[Chronojourner]

It is a political decision basically and I wouldn't be surprised if there was even some ministerial advice involved.

Politically speaking, I think it was the only possible decision, but I am pretty sure Christian will resent his parents for pulling him out and will be unhappy about it. He is only 16 though, and changing schools at that age is not exactly a life-changing decision. How many kids after all had for example to move to other cities (even other countries) because of their parents' careers and change schools (more common perhaps in the US than in Europe) ? At that age, they are quite adaptable.

For Christian, as someone else said, the best lesson is that his life comes with lots of privileges, but he will never have the freedom that a "civilian" has and some choices will be made for him regardless of how he feels about it. I think he will find that out soon also when it comes to joining the military, or deciding where he will go to university, or which courses he will take.

Personally, although it may be right for F&M to do it, putting myself into Christian's shoes and trying to think like a 16-year-old boy would, I feel it is pretty unfair to him.

Actually, it's not just the perception of a 16-year-old that it's unfair, it actually is unfair. As much as I think that politically it was the right choice, I think it was terribly invasive of his rights as a person. Unfortunately, as long as he is going to be king, he basically has a stamp on his backside that reads, "Property of the Taxpayers of Denmark". If it were me, I would seriously consider that when I turned 18, I would renounce all of my titles and my place in line for the thrown and basically tell everyone to get lost. Then I could go off and do whatever I wanted to, and no one could say a word about it. But maybe that's just me being a persnickety American.

 

[iceflower]

Please stay on topic of this thread. A couple of off topic posts have been removed. Thank you for your understanding!

 

[Chronojourner]

(..)

To pull the conversation back around to where it began, the more I think about this whole thing with Christian, the more I hate it. Yes, the school is bad in many ways, but he liked it there and they certainly provide superior education. Their standardized test scores are significantly higher than the national average, as the Agency pointed out in its report. So, education is the one thing they got right. This means that people are forcing him to go to a school he doesn't like, to get what is likely an inferior education. I have a huge problem with that, and I'm so sorry that it's happening to him.

 

[Prinsara]

(..)

To pull the conversation back around to where it began, the more I think about this whole thing with Christian, the more I hate it. Yes, the school is bad in many ways, but he liked it there and they certainly provide superior education. Their standardized test scores are significantly higher than the national average, as the Agency pointed out in its report. So, education is the one thing they got right. This means that people are forcing him to go to a school he doesn't like, to get what is likely an inferior education. I have a huge problem with that, and I'm so sorry that it's happening to him.

I sincerely doubt that the future king of Denmark is being forced to go somewhere where he'll receive an inferior education. He may receive a superior one without the culture of bullying, lies, secrecy and elitism. He may even like his new school.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

I am late to this story, but I have read about the nature of the controversy surrounding this school and I am shocked and disgusted.Why on EARTH did the DRF ever allow Christian to attend what sounds like little more than an elite hell hole to begin with? I cannot believe that these problems at Herluf-whatever are recent. Didn't his parents and their advisors do their due diligence before enrolling him?

 

[Chronojourner]

I sincerely doubt that the future king of Denmark is being forced to go somewhere where he'll receive an inferior education. He may receive a superior one without the culture of bullying, lies, secrecy and elitism. He may even like his new school.

That is entirely possible, but it’s hard to argue against the fact that the educational levels at Herlufsholm are higher than a great many other schools in Denmark, when the education ministry itself states this in their report. So finding a school to match Herlufsholm will be difficult enough; finding one that surpasses it will be hard indeed.

 

[Sunnystar]

Actually, it's not just the perception of a 16-year-old that it's unfair, it actually is unfair. As much as I think that politically it was the right choice, I think it was terribly invasive of his rights as a person. Unfortunately, as long as he is going to be king, he basically has a stamp on his backside that reads, "Property of the Taxpayers of Denmark". If it were me, I would seriously consider that when I turned 18, I would renounce all of my titles and my place in line for the thrown and basically tell everyone to get lost. Then I could go off and do whatever I wanted to, and no one could say a word about it. But maybe that's just me being a persnickety American.

Well, this American thinks it was absolutely the right choice and that the 16-year-old is still a child and doesn't have nearly enough life experience or perspective to know what is fair or unfair. And, if his perceptions are so skewed about what is okay and what is not okay with how his fellow students are treated, that he wanted to remain at that school, then it is a dereliction of their duty as his PARENTS, first and foremost, to raise good, kind, thoughtful, HUMANE persons to allow him to remain there, whether he likes the choice or thinks it's unfair. At its very core, this decision should have had nothing to do with his future role as King of Denmark and everything to do with the character and personality being molded and shaped in these formative and impressionable years.

 

[Archduchess Zelia]

That is entirely possible, but it’s hard to argue against the fact that the educational levels at Herlufsholm are higher than a great many other schools in Denmark, when the education ministry itself states this in their report. So finding a school to match Herlufsholm will be difficult enough; finding one that surpasses it will be hard indeed.

I think it's a bit rich to allege that now that he's been "forced" out of Herlufsholm, he's also forced into an "inferior" education. Not to mention offensive to the Danish educational system (some of us who weren't so fortunate to get a "superior" education beaten into us at Herlufsholm did actually graduate from schools with stellar educational standards and a good average). Herlufsholm is certainly not the only school in Denmark to provide a good education.

Although averages really aren't exact reflections of a school's educational standards, there are a handful of schools – both private and public – that match Herlufsholm's average. Just in the region: Private school Ingrid Jespersens Gymnasieskole presented the exact same average as Herlufsholm in 2021. State schools Aurehøj Gymnasium and Rysensteen Gymnasium follow close behind (both with a significantly larger intake of students). So does the boarding school Bagsværd Kostskole. Gammel Hellerup Gymnasium, N. Zahles Gymnasieskole, Ordrup Gymnasium and Øregård Gymnasium did not present shabby numbers either although not as high as the schools listed before.

And for the record, I think most all of these schools would be more than happy to make room for the future king. I'd venture you have nothing to fear in regards to the quality of Christian's future education – although I suspect his choice of school will probably be based on number of acquaintances sooner than averages

 

[polyesco]

Let's not forget that Nikolai attended and graduated from this school. I'm sure having a family member give a good personal recommendation influenced their choice. They probably know many that had a great experience.

And now that the truth has come to light. They have made an informed and difficult choice.
As I said, I feel for Frederik and Mary as parents in the public eye. It is not easy. I'm glad they weighted in their kids voices even in the midst of so much criticism.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

It is a political decision basically and I wouldn't be surprised if there was even some ministerial advice involved.

Politically speaking, I think it was the only possible decision, but I am pretty sure Christian will resent his parents for pulling him out and will be unhappy about it. He is only 16 though, and changing schools at that age is not exactly a life-changing decision. How many kids after all had for example to move to other cities (even other countries) because of their parents' careers and change schools (more common perhaps in the US than in Europe) ? At that age, they are quite adaptable.

For Christian, as someone else said, the best lesson is that his life comes with lots of privileges, but he will never have the freedom that a "civilian" has and some choices will be made for him regardless of how he feels about it. I think he will find that out soon also when it comes to joining the military, or deciding where he will go to university, or which courses he will take.

Personally, although it may be right for F&M to do it, putting myself into Christian's shoes and trying to think like a 16-year-old boy would, I feel it is pretty unfair to him.

Agree 100%!
The topic is making international headlines too
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/...-rip-eldest-son-Christian-16-Herlufsholm.html

 

[Sunnystar]

Let's not forget that Nikolai attended and graduated from this school. I'm sure having a family member give a good personal recommendation influenced their choice. They probably know many that had a great experience.

And now that the truth has come to light. They have made an informed and difficult choice.
As I said, I feel for Frederik and Mary as parents in the public eye. It is not easy. I'm glad they weighted in their kids voices even in the midst of so much criticism.

Agreed. I think Frederik & Mary were more than fair to Christian and his wishes in all this. I do think that it's entirely possible they felt like things weren't so bad until the government's preliminary report came out. At that point, it just became undeniable and they had to make a tough choice that probably did upset their children. That's something every good parent and adult in a child's life has faced, more than once, and it's hard when your kid is upset and thinks you're being unfair. Then, someday, you grow up and have kids of your own and realize your parents were doing their best to do right by you.

 

[Chronojourner]

I think it's a bit rich to allege that now that he's been "forced" out of Herlufsholm, he's also forced into an "inferior" education. Not to mention offensive to the Danish educational system (some of us who weren't so fortunate to get a "superior" education beaten into us at Herlufsholm did actually graduate from schools with stellar educational standards and a good average). Herlufsholm is certainly not the only school in Denmark to provide a good education.

Although averages really aren't exact reflections of a school's educational standards, there are a handful of schools – both private and public – that match Herlufsholm's average. Just in the region: Private school Ingrid Jespersens Gymnasieskole presented the exact same average as Herlufsholm in 2021. State schools Aurehøj Gymnasium and Rysensteen Gymnasium follow close behind (both with a significantly larger intake of students). So does the boarding school Bagsværd Kostskole. Gammel Hellerup Gymnasium, N. Zahles Gymnasieskole, Ordrup Gymnasium and Øregård Gymnasium did not present shabby numbers either although not as high as the schools listed before.

And for the record, I think most all of these schools would be more than happy to make room for the future king. I'd venture you have nothing to fear in regards to the quality of Christian's future education – although I suspect his choice of school will probably be based on number of acquaintances sooner than averages

Everything you say may well be true, and yet, by all accounts he wanted to continue at Herlufsholm and was happy there. And that's really the bottom line. Who am I, who are you, who are any of us to stand in his way?

 

[Moonmaiden23]

Put bluntly, there is more at stake here than Christian's happiness at school.

His mother as CP has made bullying her pet cause since the earliest days of her marriage.

She now finds that her eldest son and the future king of Denmark is enrolled in an institution of learning where allegations of bullying and violence and sexual assault have been made. The Royal Family have been accused of hypocrisy and double standards for allowing their son to continue as a student there.

The baffling part-for me-is that he was ever enrolled there in the first place.

It's undoubtedly a great disappointment to the teenage Christian to learn that he will not continue his studies there after his first year but I hardly believe it will cause him lasting trauma.

Especially not compared to the blow to the prestige and integrity of his family already caused by this mess.

 

[Chronojourner]

For the record, I absolutely believe that Herlufsholm needs profound and systemic reform. IMO, that reform must begin with changing the way that the school board is structured. Currently, it is always dominated by parents and former students. No meaningful reforms can begin without changing it to be dominated by independent members, with good educational credentials, who are not associated with the school.

Oh, and the answer to the question I posed in a previous post as to "who are any of us to stand in his way?" is the Danish taxpayers. As long as they are paying the DRF's way, they have every right to insist on Christian or any other member of the family not going to Herflusholm or any other school, regardless of whether there are issues there are not. In the case of Herlufsholm, there are definitely issues. I stand by what I wrote yesterday about the school, "Herlufsholm is not the worst case of organizational culture run amok that I've seen, but it's close."

 

[Sunnystar]

Everything you say may well be true, and yet, by all accounts he wanted to continue at Herlufsholm and was happy there. And that's really the bottom line. Who am I, who are you, who are any of us to stand in his way?

Seriously? What part of "he is a teenager, so his parents have that right" is hard to grasp? As I stated above, it is the first and foremost responsibility of his parents to raise him to learn good judgment, kindness, and, the hardest lesson of all - sometimes, you don't get to do exactly as you please in life, whether you're born with a royal silver spoon in your mouth or in abject poverty.

Oh, and the answer to the question I posed in a previous post as to "who are any of us to stand in his way?" is the Danish taxpayers. As long as they are paying the DRF's way, they have every right to insist on Christian or any other member of the family not going to Herflusholm or any other school, regardless of whether there are issues there are not. In the case of Herlufsholm, there are definitely issues. I stand by what I wrote yesterday about the school, "Herlufsholm is not the worst case of organizational culture run amok that I've seen, but it's close."

No, you are wrong. The people who should stand in Christian's way of going to school wherever he wants are his parents. And they have, which is the only right and correct choice in this situation. It's just a shame that it took this preliminary government report to spur them to doing what they should have done last month.

 

[Chronojourner]

Seriously? What part of "he is a teenager, so his parents have that right" is hard to grasp? As I stated above, it is the first and foremost responsibility of his parents to raise him to learn good judgment, kindness, and, the hardest lesson of all - sometimes, you don't get to do exactly as you please in life, whether you're born with a royal silver spoon in your mouth or in abject poverty.



No, you are wrong. The people who should stand in Christian's way of going to school wherever he wants are his parents. And they have, which is the only right and correct choice in this situation. It's just a shame that it took this preliminary government report to spur them to doing what they should have done last month.

I think we are risking being off topic here, but I would like to respond to your statements, so I'll ask the indulgence of the moderator. I think that you're absolutely correct that his parents have a right to make those decisions for him as he is underage. But maturity is a sliding scale. He is only two years short of adulthood. When I was young, people that age would have been taken very seriously in being consulted about something so important as their own education, and the adults would have expected the teenager to take it seriously and apply a reasonable amount of maturity to the problem, and the teenagers would have done so. I think, from the language used in reference to the Herlufsholm situation by the Crown Prince Couple that they, in fact, have done this very thing. They stated in a couple of their statements and verbal discussion with the media that they have discussed it with their children and have tried to communicate with and listen to them. This implies that there has been a two-way conversation. Let's be clear here. Neither of us knows how that conversation went or what everyone's position was. For all we know, Christian and Isabella might have been in reluctant agreement and held the opinion that, while they wanted to continue at Herlufsholm, they understood and agreed that they could not. We simply don't know how those conversations played out. In expressing my discontent that Christian could not continue at Herlufsholm, I was trying to say that he had been happy there and I was unhappy for him that he could not be accommodated in his desire to remain at the school.

As for the Danish taxpayer thing, I very much disagree. Not only the fact that the Danes fund the DRF, but also the fact that Christian will one day be the chief administrator of the country gives them a very valid stake in his education. IMO, if the situation at Herlufsholm makes them uncomfortable, then they have every right to intervene. In fact, I think the crown prince couple have signaled that they understand this. They're reference several places that the fact that they are the crown prince couple places them in a unique position relative to the public's opinion.

But I think that the bottom line here is that we are both in profound disagreement on these things and that nothing either of us says is likely to sway the other, which is okay. The beauty of living in a free world is that we both have a right to our opinions. I am reminded of the old saying that if any two people agree on everything, then one of them isn't necessary.

None-the-less, I do think there is one thing we can definitely both agree on; and that is that Herlufsholm has a seriously messed up organizational culture that needs to be fixed as fast as possible, and if it isn't, then the school just needs to be shut down.