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  #1061  
Old 08-11-2013, 10:07 PM
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Poor, Poor Charles. Gave so much, got so little. What crap. He was in his 30's, she was 19. His press force has really been at work since her death. Oh, Camilla, barely knew her. Never was her "tampon", etc. Diana should have run. The BRF has only one ideal and that is themselves. Although, I see Kate making a space for herself and child. Would not be possible without her mother-in-law. Spending the first 2 weeks at her mother's house. Wow. Charles was spoiled person, to this day he has someone crack his egg in the morning, yuck!!! He has never earned a dime, and I doubt he has given much away, on a personal level. But I do respect his trust. And, please tell me what is Camilla's big contribution?
No surprise here then.
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  #1062  
Old 08-11-2013, 10:17 PM
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Giraffe and Cepe, you both bring up really good points.

I will disagree with two things. For starters, Diana is a historical figure so I don't think it's really fair to say that we should simply leave her to rest in peace. That's not what happens with historical figures. If it's alright for us to debate the life and personality of Mary of Teck and George V, Alexandra of Denmark and Edward VII, David and Wallis, etcetera, then it reasons it's also alright for us to debate Diana (and Charles). As a historically inclined individual I believe we can learn a lot through such debates.

I also have a hard time with excusing Diana's behaviour by saying she had a mental illness an therefore can't be blamed. Yes she was mentally unstable, but she should also be held accountable for her actions. They should be explained (in part) by her illness(es), but not excused. To excuse them is to ignore the people that she hurt through her behaviour.

And Countess, you just keep on drinking that koolaid.
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  #1063  
Old 08-11-2013, 10:18 PM
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Nope, not at all. Just the continuing saga about how he suffered and what he gave up. The BRF is hard to fight, they can spew any invective and make it sound true. She is dead, so who cares and a lot of the junk now is many years after the those who are too young have no idea. It doesn't matter any longer. Her sons know the truth. Which is why they have included her in what they do. Her ring on Kate is a huge symbol. Could have been reset. She was no saint, too young, too insecure, fighting selfish and controlling.
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  #1064  
Old 08-11-2013, 10:24 PM
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No surprise here then.
Yes, LOL, my first thought was "First Wives Club". I expect well known member of that Club to chime in soon.
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  #1065  
Old 08-11-2013, 10:28 PM
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I also have a hard time with excusing Diana's behaviour by saying she had a mental illness an therefore can't be blamed. Yes she was mentally unstable, but she should also be held accountable for her actions. They should be explained (in part) by her illness(es), but not excused. To excuse them is to ignore the people that she hurt through her behaviour.

.
Bingo !!! I agree 100%
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  #1066  
Old 08-11-2013, 10:43 PM
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Giraffe and Cepe, you both bring up really good points.

I will disagree with two things. For starters, Diana is a historical figure so I don't think it's really fair to say that we should simply leave her to rest in piece. That's not what happens with historical figures. If it's alright for us to debate the life and personality of Mary of Teck and George V, Alexandra of Denmark and Edward VII, David and Wallis, etcetera, then it reasons it's also alright for us to debate Diana (and Charles). As a historically inclined individual I believe we can learn a lot through such debates.

I also have a hard time with excusing Diana's behaviour by saying she had a mental illness an therefore can't be blamed. Yes she was mentally unstable, but she should also be held accountable for her actions. They should be explained (in part) by her illness(es), but not excused. To excuse them is to ignore the people that she hurt through her behaviour.

And Countess, you just keep on drinking that koolaid.
We will have to agree to disagree - but that's ok

Going over this again and again does not change a thing. I don't sit in any particular Diana camp but her life was marred by poor decisions (not only hers) and possibly mental health issues (never been confirmed by medical sources).

I feel that she should be allowed to rest in peace, appreciated for her positive impact on causes such as fighting AIDS and the HALO TRust; and not deified or made greater than she was.
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  #1067  
Old 08-11-2013, 10:45 PM
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The "mentally unstable" stuff comes from the BRF press office. Diane was insecure, stupid and much too young. She was bulimic for a period of time, so say what you will. And she is dead, so the powerful living can make whatever out of her. Sorry. Charles was selfish, self-serving and a reprobate. He hardly can claim the better half. Actually, in this marriage there was no better half. Each as so absorbed with themselves, they gave little time to the marriage. It was the usual royal marriage, i.e. Edward and Alexandra, but it hit the wrong times for Charles.
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  #1068  
Old 08-11-2013, 10:49 PM
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Poor, Poor Charles. Gave so much, got so little. What crap. He was in his 30's, she was 19. His press force has really been at work since her death. Oh, Camilla, barely knew her. Never was her "tampon", etc. Diana should have run. The BRF has only one ideal and that is themselves. Although, I see Kate making a space for herself and child. Would not be possible without her mother-in-law. Spending the first 2 weeks at her mother's house. Wow. Charles was spoiled person, to this day he has someone crack his egg in the morning, yuck!!! He has never earned a dime, and I doubt he has given much away, on a personal level. But I do respect his trust. And, please tell me what is Camilla's big contribution?
Indeed. Poor Prince Charlie T! The Charles and Camilla claque LOVE to gloss over the whole Camillagate tape. CHarles is incredibly spoiled, having way more staff than QEII.
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  #1069  
Old 08-11-2013, 10:50 PM
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The "mentally unstable" stuff comes from the BRF press office. Diane was insecure, stupid and much too young. She was bulimic for a period of time, so say what you will. And she is dead, so the powerful living can make whatever out of her. Sorry. Charles was selfish, self-serving and a reprobate. He hardly can claim the better half. Actually, in this marriage there was no better half. Each as so absorbed with themselves, they gave little time to the marriage. It was the usual royal marriage, i.e. Edward and Alexandra, but it hit the wrong times for Charles.
My post was referring to Diana's legacy - which is what this thread is about.
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  #1070  
Old 08-11-2013, 11:18 PM
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Perhaps ultimately Diana's legacy will best be summed up by that absolutely maudlin ballad performed by Sir Elton at her funeral.
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  #1071  
Old 08-11-2013, 11:53 PM
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To be fair, I think she was incapable of good parenting - she just had too many issues.
I'm glad William & harry have no problem making it known that she was a good mother who loved them very much and they loved her right back.
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  #1072  
Old 08-12-2013, 12:14 AM
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Perhaps ultimately Diana's legacy will best be summed up by that absolutely maudlin ballad performed by Sir Elton at her funeral.
If that's true then I find it interesting that it's stolen from another woman....
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  #1073  
Old 08-12-2013, 12:17 AM
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William & Harry have been honest (countless times) about their feelings (publically) about their mother. They talk about how she was a great mother, her funny side and how she cared about other people and taught them to care for the less fortunate.
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  #1074  
Old 08-12-2013, 12:42 AM
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Its easy to love the dead, they make so few mistakes.
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  #1075  
Old 08-12-2013, 01:35 AM
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Its easy to love the dead, they make so few mistakes.
On the other hand, they don't have the opportunity to explain or to atone, either.
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  #1076  
Old 08-12-2013, 08:53 AM
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On the other hand, they don't have the opportunity to explain or to atone, either.
Unfortunately that is very true. Perhaps one of Diana's legacies is to remind us to try and let go of anger and vindictiveness. It can be terrible to leave children with painful memories.
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  #1077  
Old 08-12-2013, 09:55 AM
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I'm glad that her and Charles were on their way to patching up their relationship before her passing. It was painful but she did go on to accept reality and Charles's relationship with his current wife.

I never try to make excuses for Charles & Diana's past inappropriate actions but I do understand that when there's infidelity involved on both sides, that can cause a great deal of pain and anger and sometimes it causes the spouses to act out their anger and pain. That's just reality and when it's being done in public, whether you're famous or not, it can be an ugly site.

I don't try to put one person down and try to make the other look good or even less responsible but I hold both their feet to the fire and try to be fair as possible.
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  #1078  
Old 08-12-2013, 10:06 AM
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They were having similar problems like any regular commoner might have- with a divorce-rate of ca 50% many people know how it feels to have that sort of problems Diana & Charles had to go through. They only did not have the media to publicise their issues & arguments and they also did not have to represent a royal family...
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  #1079  
Old 08-12-2013, 10:24 AM
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Which is why I always point out that the royals are just like everyone else. They are born or married into an old institution but they are normal human beings like us all and they aren't perfect and go through family and personal issues like the rest of us. We on the other hand, have the privilege of not having everyone in our business and blowing up our issues as if it's the worst thing in the world.
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  #1080  
Old 08-12-2013, 02:29 PM
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Yes, you make a good point. There are treatments for mental illnesses, and perhaps she should have investigated those more rather than indulging in new-age therapies and occult practitioners. But then isn't denial a huge part of serious mental illness? I realize that her having a mental illness has never been "medically confirmed", but it wouldn't be. That will be up for the historians to discover when things are unsealed some time in the future.


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I also have a hard time with excusing Diana's behaviour by saying she had a mental illness an therefore can't be blamed. Yes she was mentally unstable, but she should also be held accountable for her actions. They should be explained (in part) by her illness(es), but not excused. To excuse them is to ignore the people that she hurt through her behaviour.
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