Jazmin Grace Grimaldi Current Events 3 : June 2006 - Jan.2007

[Cassi]

Was it this article? The 'secret daughter' of Prince Albert who could claim the crown of Monaco
By Sharon Churcher and Caroline Graham, Mail on Sunday Apr 17 2005

This is a very interesting article. If it is true Albert really liked Tamara and she wasn`t just a one night stand. Tamara must be very down to earth when she refused to stay in Monaco for a longer time and wanted back the reality as a waitress. And the way she presented her daughter to Albert for the first time and the fact that she never gave an interview on TV is kinda cool. The more I know about her the more I like her.

Albert seems like a coward and Rainier must have been some sort of family-tyrant.

 

[Toledo]

Tamara's hairdo is called "The Dolly Parton" look. It's very dated looking, isn't it?

Now you made me wonder if she has country music on her car's set radio stations.

But back to the lost of privacy. It was bound to happen. That's why I said she gives me some mixed feeling because in order to make the right thing that is give her daugther a sense of belonging (to a family) she also placed her life and hers in the spotlight. This was for the Rotolos what is called a Pyrrhic Victory. You win but you lose something in the process.

 

[lynda]

I read the article a while ago. I have learned that journalists put their spin on articles and most of the time they are not privy to factual information. This article in particular, you could almost here the violins playing in the background as you read each paragraph. The two journalists probably got most of the information from several articles and compiled bits and pieces with a few of their own thoughts to make the viewer believe they know what is going on in the situation. If you noticed, upon reading the article, it was open for discussion to add more speculation.

You have to be perceptive when reviewing some of these articles. You have to be able to decipher fact from fiction because most of what is written is the journalist thoughts and not the true story. Their tactic is to persuade you over to believe the article is god’s honest truth when it is only speculative.

In all honesty, this is a private matter between PA and TR and anything beyond these lines is invasion of privacy. I have learned over the years not to read too much into what the media prints.

 

[CasiraghiTrio]

Wow.... this thread is fascinating. It is so amazing how the tide of opinion on the forum has changed in favor of TR and JG. I don't care at all about TR or Albert. All I care about is that Jazmin is ok. Jazmin is the one who never asked to be in this situation. For TR and Albert, it was a choice they made several years ago, to have unprotected sex; that was their choice, their fault, and they can pay the consequences. Jazmin should not have to pay for it.

 

[Toledo]

Wow.... this thread is fascinating. It is so amazing how the tide of opinion on the forum has changed in favor of TR and JG...

Well, sometimes we rush to judgements based on the little information we have with those news links. And sometimes when we step back and see the picture from a distance we come to appreciate the circumstances with a different point of view. Is not that people change their minds here on a daily basis but that we examine the news links and react to them in a different way even when is the same information. Reminds me of a joke that says people hurt themsleves by jumping to conclusions.

I have my own feelings about Tamara, Albert and Nicole and the mess they got themsleves into. But I also see what moved each one to act that way. That does not mean it gets my approval but understanding why people do the things they do makes these thresome not that different from people we know in our lives. They are all in a situation that happens every day everywhere.
Who do I feel sorry for? the two kids. They will grow up and grow out of this or we will see them transform into extensions of the circumstances that we discuss today. That's why I see the best solution for Albert is to protect his offsprings from the media by bringing them closer to the 'nest'. And maybe that will help him too to come to terms with fatherhood.
And make us all here at Royal Forums proud.

 

[CasiraghiTrio]

Well, sometimes we rush to judgements based on the little information we have with those news links. And sometimes when we step back and see the picture from a distance we come to appreciate the circumstances with a different point of view. Is not that people change their minds here on a daily basis but that we examine the news links and react to them in a different way even when is the same information. Reminds me of a joke that says people hurt themsleves by jumping to conclusions.

I have my own feelings about Tamara, Albert and Nicole and the mess they got themsleves into. But I also see what moved each one to act that way. That does not mean it gets my approval but understanding why people do the things they do makes these thresome not that different from people we know in our lives. They are all in a situation that happens every day everywhere.
Who do I feel sorry for? the two kids. They will grow up and grow out of this or we will see them transform into extensions of the circumstances that we discuss today. That's why I see the best solution for Albert is to protect his offsprings from the media by bringing them closer to the 'nest'. And maybe that will help him too to come to terms with fatherhood.
And make us all here at Royal Forums proud.

Yes, I hope Albert does the right thing. Tamara has been paying for the mistake Jazmin's whole life + the 9mos. of pregnancy, and Albert has not paid his due. He needs to do more than his due, of course, but he has not even done that, and if he wants sensible people to respect him, he must do what is right as a father and as someone who wants to set an example for his nephews,his nieces. He should be acting as someone who can say, "This is me accepting responsibility for my mistakes and doing the right thing," instead of acting like a victim. After he publicly acknowledged Alexandre in 2005, his subsequent interviews sounded like a man who was asking people to feel sorry for him, saying he felt "tricked". He sounded so childish. I hope he realizes that now and won't start acting like that again. It's not very becoming in anyone, let alone a head of state.

 

[Ghislaine]

Wow.... this thread is fascinating. It is so amazing how the tide of opinion on the forum has changed in favor of TR and JG.

Yeah, I noticed that too. I admit to having read a few of this weeks tabloids in which JG (or "Jazzy" ) has been painted basically as an angel, the next Einstein, the next princess Grace and Albert's favourite girl. I've never read much favourable press about Eric/Alexandre and/or his mum. Exactly why is the JG situation so much different, why is JG so much better and so much more loved than Eric/Alexandre and why is TR praised for her perseverance while NC is painted as a madwoman? The situation is the same, why isn't the public judgement?

G.

 

[lynda]

Wow.... this thread is fascinating. It is so amazing how the tide of opinion on the forum has changed in favor of TR and JG. I don't care at all about TR or Albert. All I care about is that Jazmin is ok. Jazmin is the one who never asked to be in this situation. For TR and Albert, it was a choice they made several years ago, to have unprotected sex; that was their choice, their fault, and they can pay the consequences. Jazmin should not have to pay for it.

MY reply:
IMO I doubt if PA or TR will do an interview any time soon concerning their daughter’s well being because it is a private matter. The internet/news media is the last place to rely on accurate information concerning JG.

I have been a fan of the Grimaldi family for many years. I am not taking sides, just keeping an open mind.

 

[CasiraghiTrio]

Yeah, I noticed that too. I admit to having read a few of this weeks tabloids in which JG (or "Jazzy" ) has been painted basically as an angel, the next Einstein, the next princess Grace and Albert's favourite girl. I've never read much favourable press about Eric/Alexandre and/or his mum. Exactly why is the JG situation so much different, why is JG so much better and so much more loved than Eric/Alexandre and why is TR praised for her perseverance while NC is painted as a madwoman? The situation is the same, why isn't the public judgement?

G.

Hmm, it could be as simple as Jazmin being a girl and Alex a boy. The media loves a "little princess".

 

[Laviollette]

Hmm, it could be as simple as Jazmin being a girl and Alex a boy. The media loves a "little princess".

The problem is she's not a "little princess". She is just white.

 

[Toledo]

The problem is she's not a "little princess". She is just white.

You just made me smile by the sincerity of your comment. Because under all the media marketing of any celebrity issue we always see 'that' as the understatement.

 

[Neat2912]

Kudos today to some great thinking in my opinion-Posts 514-through the end. IMO-Tell it like it -if not is-ought to be!!!!!

 

[Lillia]

I never understood the theories that say PA can't do anything for his illegitimate kids because PR changed the constitution in 2002. First of all Jazmine was born before the change, so legally it may not even apply to her. Alex was born after the law change, but if PA is Sovereign Prince than he has the power to change the constitution just as his father PR did.

I don't understand how this is not clear. Did PR put some kind of stipulation in the constitution that says, it can never be changed after the changes he made. If not, why do people think PA can't change it.

He is sovereign prince now just as his dad was, and every price before him.

Prince Louis changed the constitiution, Prince Rainier changed the constitution and I beleive now Prince Albert can also change the constitutuion.

Only time will tell what he does with his children, both the illegitimate ones in JAsmine and Alex and legitimate children of his own if he ever marries one day.

Someone please shed some light on why people say the constitution was changed in 2002 therefore PA can't do anything about it.

I don't know the details, but isn't it also the case that succession in Monaco can only go thru the males, even before the change to the constitution? Isn't that way Pss Caroline was not successor to Ranier?

To start seeing them?
I'm sorry I couldn't resist; the man publicly denied that the girl was his daughter for 13 years, and now all of a sudden he wishes her to be on the throne? Maybe, if he formed a bond with his kids, he could think about changing the Constitution in 8-10 years, but right know the call of the blood is not even strong enough to make him show up with them in public...
Plus, not only the new Constitution applies to both Jazmin and Alex, but I think Rainier (and Albert with him) changed it for the exact purpose of cutting out natural children out of the line of succession (and remember in 2002 both Al and Rainier had known about Jazmin for 9 years, so they could keep the Constitution as it was, and let Albert decide whether to adopt her or not). So, I know ALbert can do what he wants, but first of all it is not very serious to change the COnstitution of a Country every two or three years, and second, I don't see Albert disagreeing with something that he helped sign just a few years ago...

I have explained my opinion; now I would like to know how Albert's behaviour leads you to believe he intends to change the Constitution...

Kisses

Ok, but again, isn't it the case that the successor would have to be male anyway, so even if Albert had all girl children out of wedlock and before any changes to their constitution, they still would not be in line anyway.

Is that correct? Anyone know?

Personally, my opinion has not changed on Albert because of his recognitions of these children, J or A, nor has my opinion changed about their mothers either. Adults behaving irresponsibly (opportunistically as some may have it) and they've had to deal with the consequences, good/bad/ugly. Children caught in between, but hopefully the children will forge ahead, despite the parents.

In the end, they will all survive and will all certainly do better than most people because of the money. They have never any need to want for anything else ever again. Why should anyone ever worry about anyone in these sagas?

 

[jabilo]

The problem is she's not a "little princess". She is just white.

Bravo, everybody is trying to avoid mentioning that fact so thanks.

 

[Warren]

Bravo, everybody is trying to avoid mentioning that fact so thanks.

Well, not everybody. Some members don't see it as a skin colour issue and therefore don't see any relevance in raising it, while some obviously do. Maybe a female American teenager has more "popular" and media appeal than a relatively less known three-year old living in France. "Princess Diaries"-type fantasy will always win out, nonsense though it is.

 

[Grace]

I don't know the details, but isn't it also the case that succession in Monaco can only go thru the males, even before the change to the constitution? Isn't that way Pss Caroline was not successor to Ranier?


Ok, but again, isn't it the case that the successor would have to be male anyway, so even if Albert had all girl children out of wedlock and before any changes to their constitution, they still would not be in line anyway.

Is that correct? Anyone know?

In Monaco both before and after the Constitutional change natural (born out of wedlock) children, were not in line. The difference in this regard is that before the Consitutional review the Sovereign could adopt someone, a child, a relative or anyone else, and make him in this way his heir (that's what Prince Louis did with Charlotte, Rainier's mother); now adoption does not count for the succession to the Throne so Albert could not adopt let's say Andrea, Louis, or Alex and make them his heirs.
As for the female issue, women could always acceed the throne, but only if they had no brothers, because in Monaco there is a "male preference"; that's why Caro is the first born, but Albert is the heir. Had Albert been a girl, Caro would now be on throne.
What was changed in 2002 is that before, only direct (children and grandchildren) discendents were in line, so Albert, Caro, Steph and their kids were all in line until Rainier was alive; if Albert had died before Rainier, Caro would have been the legitimate heiresse. Once Albert got on the throne, Caro and Steph would be cut off because they were not direct discendents (daughters) of the current Sovereign, but collateral (sisters).
In 2002 Rainier decided that also collateral discendants can be in line to the Throne, thus keeping Caro, Andrea, Pierre, Char, Alex, Steph, Louis, Pauline all in the succession line. Camille is not in line as a child born out of wedlock...as adoption is not an option anymore, she (as Alex and Jazmin) could be in line only if Steph married her father. Anyway, if natural children were in line (this would require a new change of the Constitution!), Alex and not Jazmin would be Albert's Heir, due to the mael preference or Salic Law.

Hope it was clear, otherwise, feel free to ask,

Kisses

 

[Cassi]

Bravo, everybody is trying to avoid mentioning that fact so thanks.

For me, skin colour doesn`t matter. I think Alex is a very sweet boy, he just isn`t that present at the moment. I really would like to see a picture of PA with his 2 children together, but I doubt that will ever happen. But who knows what the future will bring!

 

[Ariel]

Well, not everybody. Some members don't see it as a skin colour issue and therefore don't see any relevance in raising it, while some obviously do. Maybe a female American teenager has more "popular" and media appeal than a relatively less known three-year old living in France. "Princess Diaries"-type fantasy will always win out, nonsense though it is.

I agree with this, I personally dont see this as an skin colour issue. I think it changes because Alex is too young and the press dont get that much interest on him, in the other side, his sister is older and starts getting the attention of the people, specially after Albert denied being her father for so long and the fact that she is american like her grandmother, makes her the center of all this fairy tales types of stories. Another example is that you see how Alexandra gets less attention than the casiraghis and it is because of her age. I dont think people has treated better TR than NC, before Albert recognized JG, people attacked Tamara in all the ways possible. Now it seems that they are taking it quiet, as she proved everybody to be wrong and now people are expecting her next move. If she does something like NC did, going to photoshoots and giving interviews, i think people will criticize her the same way.

 

[Toledo]

Well, not everybody. Some members don't see it as a skin colour issue and therefore don't see any relevance in raising it, while some obviously do. Maybe a female American teenager has more "popular" and media appeal than a relatively less known three-year old living in France. "Princess Diaries"-type fantasy will always win out, nonsense though it is.

Well, in the USA is always about race considering this is a society that barely forty years ago had minorities demanding their basic human rights. even today, with the mass migration of workers from non-majority caucasian places you see the double standard on the media. To this day race is a big issue over here. And little things like the way the press cover he news, for example on Jazmin Grace, shows this double standard. She is the idea exploited on The Princess Diaries while her half brother Alexandre is barely a foot note even when he made the recognition news a year before.

So, Warren, over here news like this on Jazmin are always presented with an agenda. I don't know if the same happens in the other places our Forum colleagues post from but in the US is a whole different approach. That's why it sounds so shocking to our fellow members in other countries. In this day an age you just don't comprehend why the subject of race is still a big issue in a society, but it is. That's the terrible thing, it is.

 

[CasiraghiTrio]

I agree with Warren. Like I said before, the [especially American] media always love to have their princess darlings.

 

[MURPHY]

Sadly, Princess Grace's death turned Albert into a playboy.

 

[Toledo]

Sadly, Princess Grace's death turned Albert into a playboy.

That seems to be a turning point to the Grimaldis life.
Her death caused a chain reaction on that family like none other. But an unexpected and tragic death often causes that in any family. You just don't know how to recover because the family is caught off guard. That also shows how important Grace was as the matriarch of the family, the glue that kept everyone in check and tied together. When she died it was like a personality change for everyone in that family as if one assumed the role of the other one. Princess Caroline became a new family matriarch, her young sister became what Caroline was (the rebel princess) and then some. Prince Albert became his father back in the 1950's when he was the single playboy.

One person was left out, Rainier. He became a ghost, he followed in life his beloved wife and never recovered from losing her. I have heard so many stories on how rocky their lives were, but Rainier's life after Grace died showed they loved each other deeply. One could not continue without the other. That was true love what those two had.

 

[Kastalia]

For me, skin colour doesn`t matter. I think Alex is a very sweet boy, he just isn`t that present at the moment. I really would like to see a picture of PA with his 2 children together, but I doubt that will ever happen. But who knows what the future will bring!

So true Cassi.

 

[ally_cooper]

I think is like Warren said. She's a girl, she's american and she's an adolescent is like a different kind of American Dream. I have friends in the States and they are facinating with the fact to have a Monacharchies here, Princes and Princesses and Jazmin is an american girl that is not a Princess, but is the daughter of Sovereign... almost the same (I know she will not reign and never will be a Princess but there is not so important for the press). On the other hand we have Alexandre, a cute a sweet boy... but he's just 2 years old. Lol I think is more a thing of ages. What sells more? An american teenager who's daughter of a Prince or a 2 year-old-boy son of the same Prince?

 

[Ariel]

Another thing is that she can sell their magazines, he cant, unless people are interested to know how is he doing on preschool. One important factor is that she is american so american magazines are more interested in her as it is normal, french will be more intersted in alexander if he was not so young. For some people the fact of the race could be important but i dont think the majority of the people thinks the same way or share those views. The attention of the press now is on JG because she is the latest of his children being recognized.

 

[jabilo]

Well, not everybody. Some members don't see it as a skin colour issue and therefore don't see any relevance in raising it, while some obviously do. Maybe a female American teenager has more "popular" and media appeal than a relatively less known three-year old living in France. "Princess Diaries"-type fantasy will always win out, nonsense though it is.

sorry, i did not mean everybody but quite a few, sorry about that. However I do believe skin colour is an issue and will always be raised. And in this case, alex will always have to deal with that. That is just how the world is.

 

[Cassi]

That is just how the world is.

Then let us make a difference!!!

 

[Louis14]

Another thing is that she can sell their magazines, he cant, unless people are interested to know how is he doing on preschool. One important factor is that she is american so american magazines are more interested in her as it is normal, french will be more intersted in alexander if he was not so young. For some people the fact of the race could be important but i dont think the majority of the people thinks the same way or share those views. The attention of the press now is on JG because she is the latest of his children being recognized.

I agree with you. Most of French, whites, are more interested by Alex than JG because he was born and live in France. I don't think that the fact he is a mixed blood child is so important, especially in Europe.
We love JG too and we hope she will come to study in France.


Par la Grâce de Dieu, Louis-le-14ème.

 

[TrustWorthy]

sorry, i did not mean everybody but quite a few, sorry about that. However I do believe skin colour is an issue and will always be raised. And in this case, alex will always have to deal with that. That is just how the world is.

We can continue to hope for a day when the color of one's skin, the manner of one's speech and the attire one wears isn't an automatic character assassination or judgement -- where we can all live as one and be judged on our words and actions and not the expectations of others.

For some of us, maybe most of us, we live that life today -- and are thankful the worst is behind us -- but then at times we can be so easily reminded how shallow, narrow-minded, resentful and judgemental a few can be -- spoiling it for the rest of us.

We have a choice: ignore those who taint us with these comments, or dignify them by either agreeing or disagreeing. If we don't give them an audience and ignore them -- they will go away.

Whether age 2 or 14 -- boy or girl -- both are young children and may have never known a world whereby prejudice exists -- Alex and Jazmin are blood and how poetic that despite being of different color -- they will grow and love as brother and sister.

 

[Qsophy]

I agree with you. Most of French, whites, are more interested by Alex than JG because he was born and live in France. I don't think that the fact he is a mixed blood child is so important, especially in Europe.

Par la Grâce de Dieu, Louis-le-14ème.

I agree that JG being an American probably plays a large role in America's interest in her story. But when Angela Brown (looks like a Black American woman, raised in America from childhood--born in Panama) married Prince Maximillian of Lichstenstein, there was no coverage in the United States. One can hardly imagine such a scenario would have occurred had Angela Brown been of European descent. So posters who believe that race plays a role in how the U.S. media treats royal-esque stories are not entirely baseless in their viewpoints.

...where we can all live as one and be judged on our words and actions and not the expectations of others.

For some of us, maybe most of us, we live that life today -- and are thankful the worst is behind us...

I live in New York City, a cultural melting pot, and can tell you from experience that this statement is not even close to being very accurate. And I know people from many different cultures around the world that are not living in the utopia you describe. Racial discrimination and colorism are real issues that continue to affect many people's lives--including those of us on these message boards. The world has not put issues of race, color, religion or socio-economic status behind them at all. These things remain an issue for many people in the world.

We have a choice: ignore those who taint us with these comments, or dignify them by either agreeing or disagreeing. If we don't give them an audience and ignore them -- they will go away.

Maybe I am misunderstanding you here, but I am not sure why the assumption is that the poster was deliberately taunting those of us on the board. I thought the idea is that we get away from assumptions! Perhaps the poster was expressing a view, based on his or her own experiences, and his or her opinion simply differs from yours. On an internet forum board, this is perfectly acceptable. I do not assume the poster meant any ill-will by it. Especially since he/she apologized afterward for making a generalization.

Bottom line: In my opinion, America is always more interested in stories about Americans (including JG), but America also treats media stories differently depending on the race of the person involved (such as NC and Alex).