Prince Nicholas (1872-1938), Grand Duchess Elena (1882-1957) and daughters

[snowflower]

Photos of Elana as a child
1) I don't know why she is dressed like that it seems an ... odd outfit for a Grand Duchess. Perhaps a costume ball
2) With her brother Andrei.
3) A portrait of the 13 years old Grand Duchess. Please tell me that this is some kind of faux headpiece because I really can't stand the idea that a girl who was not even in her teens yet was wearing that tiara

 

[CarolinaLandgrave]

That is a bit much in the tiara department.... for a girl of 13 - even for Marie Pavlovna's only daughter!

 

[snowflower]

These photos were taken after Nicholas ' death I think . The second it's a Christmas card showing Elena in her villa in Psychico, where she lived from 1938 until her death ( in 1923 she and Nicholas decided to sell their palace). She send it to various relatives including her daughters because at that time Greece was at war with Italy and she couldn't leave the country easily to visit them. It's awfull how WWII separated for most of her relatives ( blood relatives as well as in laws). She later confessed that living with Alice was a great deal of comfort at that time.

 

[maria-olivia]

I am a little bit confused with Maria Pavlovna the elder and the younger ,
I think the elder is Elena's mother and the younger Prince Lennart of Sweden's mother?

 

[Lumutqueen]

I am a little bit confused with Maria Pavlovna the elder and the younger ,
I think the elder is Elena's mother and the younger Prince Lennart of Sweden's mother?

Grand Duchess Maria Pavlovna of Russia (16 February 1786 – 23 June 1859) was the third daughter of Paul I of Russia and Sophie Dorothea of Württemberg.

mother of

Elena Pavlovna (1784–1803) m. Friedrich Ludwig, Hereditary Grand Duke of Mecklenburg-Schwerin (1778–1819), and had two children.

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Grand Duchess Maria Pavlovna of Russia, known as "Maria Pavlovna the Younger" (St. Petersburg, 18 April 1890 - 13 December 1958) was the daughter of Grand Duke Paul Alexandrovich and Alexandra Georgievna of Greece.

mother of

Gustaf Lennart Nicolaus Paul Bernadotte, Count of Wisborg (8 May 1909 – 21 December 2004), was Prince of Sweden and Duke of Småland from 1909 to 1932.

 

[EmpressRouge]

That is a bit much in the tiara department.... for a girl of 13 - even for Marie Pavlovna's only daughter!

That's nothing compared to Grand Duchess Alexandra Pavlova, eldest daughter of Paul I. This portrait, featured on the cover of Prince Michael of Greece's Jewels of the Tsars, painted c. 1790 shows a 7-8 year old Alexandra "encumbered with a pearl necklace, opulent earrings and an imposing diamond encrusted diadem."

Amazon.com: Jewels of the Tsars: The Romanovs and Imperial Russia (9780865651715): Prince Michael of Greece

 

[snowflower]

That's nothing compared to Grand Duchess Alexandra Pavlova, eldest daughter of Paul I. This portrait, featured on the cover of Prince Michael of Greece's Jewels of the Tsars, painted c. 1790 shows a 7-8 year old Alexandra "encumbered with a pearl necklace, opulent earrings and an imposing diamond encrusted diadem."

Amazon.com: Jewels of the Tsars: The Romanovs and Imperial Russia (9780865651715): Prince Michael of Greece

Personally, I find this picture slightly horrifying . To me, it appears to be a nowaday's equivalent of a 7 or 8 year old walking around in stilettos. Well, after that , I wouldn't be surprised if I learned that Romanovs used to offer as gifts diamond rivieres to children's birthday parties ....
By the way , how comes Elena wears the sash of an order in the picture I posted above? Wasn't she a little young then to have recieve any order?

 

[CarolinaLandgrave]

That's nothing compared to Grand Duchess Alexandra Pavlova, eldest daughter of Paul I. This portrait, featured on the cover of Prince Michael of Greece's Jewels of the Tsars, painted c. 1790 shows a 7-8 year old Alexandra "encumbered with a pearl necklace, opulent earrings and an imposing diamond encrusted diadem."

Amazon.com: Jewels of the Tsars: The Romanovs and Imperial Russia (9780865651715): Prince Michael of Greece

That's horrible! That poor young girl.
Reminds of that show on one of those channels, I cant tell you which one off the top of my head.. but its where these horrible parents dress up their little girls in makeup, and heels, and dresses for beauty pageants!
Just awful!!

 

[Vasillisos Markos]

But surely these little girls were not wearing jewels all the time! I'm sure they were adorned merely for portraits and official photographs but were dressed in age appropriate clothes the rest of the time. Even the adults did not go about wearing their royal finery all the time. There were plenty of photographs showing the daughters of Nicholas and Alexandra of Russia wearing their tiaras and royal sashes at court balls when they were young girls.

 

[maria-olivia]

Thanks a lot Lumitqueen. May I ask
1. Maria Pavlovna the older is Empress Carherine II 's grand-child?
2. Which Pavlovna married the Crown Prince of the Nederlands Anna or Maria?

 

[CarolinaLandgrave]

HIH Grand Duchess Anna Pavlovna was the daughter of HIM Czar Paul I of Russia and Empress Maria Feodorovna (nee' HSH Duchess Sophia Dorothea of Wurttemberg). She was the wife of HM King William II of the Netherlands.
HIM Czar Paul I of Russia and Empress Maria Feodorovna (nee' HSH Duchess Sophia Dorothea of Wurttemberg) had a daughter named Maria Pavlovna who married Charles Frederick, Grand Duke of Saxe-Weimar-Eisenach (they were the parents of the Empress Augusta of Germany, wife Kaiser Wilhelm I).

Marie Pavlovna (the elder) was the wife of Grand Duke Vladimir Alexandrovitch of Russia, she was born a Duchess of Mecklenburg-Schwerin (she was a great-great granddaughter of Czar Paul I through his daughter the Grand Duchess Elena Pavlovna who married the Hereditary Grand Duke Friedrich Ludwig of Mecklenburg-Schwerin)

I think I have this all correct...... Snowflower??

 

[maria-olivia]

Anna (Netherlands) Maria (Saxe-Weimar -E) and Elena (Mecklenburg-Schwerin) were sisters ?
Czar Paul Ier is Catherine II 's son .

 

[snowflower]

Anna (Netherlands) Maria (Saxe-Weimar -E) and Elena (Mecklenburg-Schwerin) were sisters ?
Czar Paul Ier is Catherine II 's son .

Yes , they were sisters, and Catherine II's granddaughters through her son Paul. They also had three more sisters ( it was a total of six): Olga Pavlova ( died aged 3), Alexandra Pavlova ( married Archduke Joseph of Austria and died at childbirth), and Catherine Pavlova ( married twice , first Georg, Duke of Oldenburg and had two sons with him and after his death she married king Wilhelm I, King of Wuttemberg and had two daughters. Her youngest daughter Sophie married her nephew William and became Queen of Netherlands).

By the way , I believe that Marie of Mecklenburg Schwerin chose the patronymic Pavlova upon her marriage to Grand Duke Vladimir to underline her Romanov ancestry, of which she was very proud. She once said to he husband that ,when it came to lineage, she was in fact more Slav than him

 

[CarolinaLandgrave]

I could see Marie Pavlovna saying that to Vladimir!

Snowflower is a treasure-trove of wonderful information and stories!!

 

[maria-olivia]

Well, I learned a lot thanks to Carolina and Snowflower.

 

[snowflower]

Here is a photo of baby Marina with Dad.

Marina was the only member of the family to be born in the Nicholas palace ( or " Petit Palais" as it was also called). The birth was quite traumatic and Elena nearly bled to death . She was ill for a long time after the deliveryThat's why they didn't have any more children after her although they were quite young, Nicholas especially was very afraid. He used to say later " Marina was a dear baby. She nearly cost her mother her life".

 

[CarolinaLandgrave]

I didnt know Elena had a difficult birth with Marina. Thanks again for another great picture!!

 

[snowflower]

Marina wearing the Greek ruby parure at the opening of the Parliament ion 1937.
Although it looks really good on her, I think that from all the ladies that have worn it ( the two Olgas, Marina , Frederika and Anne-Marie), Olga of Yugoslavia has worn it the best way, it somehow suited her the most.
By the way, how comes Marina was at the opening of the Parliament? The wifes of Royal Dukes were present then? Because in the recent years, judging from photos I ve seen , I the Duchesses of Kent and Gloucester and the Countess of Wessex are not attending the opening of the Parliament.

 

[Vlaha Karatsokaros]

Everything looked good on Olga of Yugoslavia and Marina of Kent. There was magic about these two ladies, absolute magic, something that will never be repeated. In a way, one may argue, this is true about people in all walks of life. The glamour of, say, Katharine Hepburn or Audrey Hepburn cannot be repeated etc etc.

Back then, the Opening of Parliament was quite a ceremony. Nowadays all these have been simplified. If I am not mistaken, along with Prince Philip, Diana had escorted here and there the Queen.

Here is a photo of baby Marina with Dad.
Marina was the only member of the family to be born in the Nicholas palace ( or " Petit Palais" as it was also called).

It was and still is a small by royal standards but superb building in Queen Sophia (Vassilissis Sofias) Avenue that today houses the French or Italian Embassy (I am not sure which of the two)

 

[Vasillisos Markos]

I believe it is the Italian Embassy which is housed in the Nicholas Palace. It is a gorgeous structure.

 

[Vlaha Karatsokaros]

I believe it is the Italian Embassy which is housed in the Nicholas Palace. It is a gorgeous structure.

I always mix certain buildings in my mind because Vassilissis Sofias Ave is packed with embassies, museums and building of grand style. I am being told that Princess Irene occupies an apartment on the avenue.

 

[CarolinaLandgrave]

I was just in Athens last week...and had to go see the Italian Embassy...
I love the Nicholas'

Here is a thread with some great pictures of the HI&RH Helen:
YouTube - Grand Duchess Elena Vladimirovna of Russia / Princess Nicholas of Greece and Denmark

 

[snowflower]

The clue may lie with the fact that Elena and Frederika did well overall despite their strong personalities and huge age difference (exactly 35 years). Thus, that they respected each other's superior pedigree and acknowledged each other's standing as being not above, but at par with, their royal station - this is the 'key" here.

.

I believe that apart from respect towrads one another they had developed a bond when Frederika firstly came to Greece. Among the older generation ,Elena seems to have taken a more active role than Alice and Marie helping her adjusting to Greece , teaching her about the Greek society and those close to the palace etc ( this may also has to do with the fact that Prince Nicholas died shortly after Frederika and Paul's marriage and Elena, being widowed with all her daughters married abroad , found some confort mentoring Frederika instead of staying at home and thinking about her new state of life) Frederika referred very fondly to " Aunt Ellen" , as a great maternal figure in her new life - and I also believe that at first she was sligtly intimidated of Elena , who had little reservations in expressing her opinion about Frederika's behaviour in public when she didn't like something . I remember reading about an incident that I think had taken place during the Greco Italian War , I believe. The story goes that Frederika and Elena were together at some public function and given all the stress and tirednes she had experience working day and night, plus the news from the front, Frederika lost her temper and started crying in public - Elena , instead of consoling her , took her aside and said to her very firmly not to ever again dare lose her temper because " people like you and me never cry in public. We just don't "

 

[Marc23]

" people like you and me never cry in public. We just don't "

I read in a book about Princess Olga that the same sentence she said to all her daughters...Something like:"If you choose to cry,you must do it when sure that nobody sees you....don't let others know you are suffering!"

 

[CyrilVladisla]

A book being shared by Princesses Olga, Elizabeth, and Marina
http://www.gettyimages.com/license/862428298

 

[eya]

Another beautiful story shares Prince Dimitri, this time for the great grandfather Prince Nikolaos of Greece and her great grandmother, Grand Duchess Elena of Russia

https://www.instagram.com/p/BoEqSm8nJVu/?taken-by=prince.dimitri

 

[Blog Real]

Prince Nicholas and Grand Duchess Elena with their daughters, circa 1908.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/13/NicholasHelenchildren.jpg

 

[Blog Real]

Prince Nicholas married Grand Duchess Elena Vladimirovna of Russia, daughter of Grand Duke Vladimir Alexandrovich of Russia and Marie of Mecklenburg-Schwerin.
They had three daughters:

• Princess Olga of Greece and Denmark (1903–1997); married Prince Paul of Yugoslavia. Olga was the maternal grandmother of actress Catherine Oxenberg and author Christina Oxenberg.
• Princess Elizabeth of Greece and Denmark (1904–1955); married Count Carl Theodor of Toerring-Jettenbach.
• Princess Marina of Greece and Denmark (1906–1968); married Prince George, Duke of Kent. Marina was the mother of Prince Edward, Duke of Kent, Princess Alexandra, the Honourable Lady Ogilvy, and Prince Michael of Kent.

Source: Prince Nicholas of Greece and Denmark - Wikipedia