Frankish & Holy Roman Empires, Germanic States & Families, Central Europe

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Heir Presumptive
Apr 16, 2005
Amsterdam, Upstate NY
United States
Now, this is going to be taking a long time to cover, Germany in it's two previous incarnations as the Holy Roman Empire (era of Emperor by elections) and the 19th German Empire (era of hereditary Emperors) was very much like Imperial India. In the sense it was form by states, city states, etc. Comes to mind the situation in Ancient Greece and Middle Ages Italy with so many city states and local rulers. Many of these ancient German states were absorbed, eliminated or joined by war or marriage but each one had at some point it's own distinctive family of local rulers.

First Germany past and present with some great maps to give an idea of the amount of Dynastic Houses.

something on the family ties between the Emperors and the Czech Nobility:
Emperors of Holy Roman Empire and their Czech Roots
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Genealogy of the Royal House of Hannover

Genealogy of the House(s) of Saxony
And a different link on the genealogy of Saxony (every site presents the information from a different angle and in different charts, so you decide which charts are more comfortable for your reading)

Genealogy of the Royal Family of Bavaria

This one is complicated, I never liked the charts with numbers before the names. It's like reading binary codes! I prefer the traditional family tree because it's easier on my eyes, but give it a try: Paul Theroff's genealogy for House of Hohenzollern
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Prince Georg Friedrich of Prussia

Here is a link to the Family Tree of Prince Georg Friedrich of Prussia, current Head of the Imperial and Royal House of Hohenzollern.

Courtesy of juliamontague who originally posted this in the Hohenzollern thread at post #37.

Here is a Family Tree of the Dukes of Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksburg. It is easier to read at 125% or 150% magnification.

The link to the site of Schloss Glücksburg which contains family information (and this Family Tree) is:
It's really interesting to see how so many of our Swedish queens were born as German princesses: Catherine of Sachsen-Lauenburg, Christina of Holstein-Gottorp, Marie Eleonore of Brandenburg, Hedwig Eleonore of Holstein-Gottorp, Louise Ulrice of Prussia, Frederice of Baden, Hedwig Charlotte Elisabeth of Oldenburg and Victoria of Baden come to mind. Also, Ulrice Eleonore of Denmark, Josephine of Leuchtenberg, Louise of the Netherlands and Margareth of Connaught had German mothers and Louise Mountbatten was born as a princess of Battenberg. Or current king Carl XIV Gustaf's mother Sibylla of Sachsen-Coburg and Gotha was also born as a German princess, but she never became a queen. Our current queen, Silvia Sommerlath, was also German, but she was born as a commoner. I guess this happened because there were so many German kingdoms and duchies in Europe back in the old days, that non-German princes and kings often had to get their wives from one of them.
What about Brandenburg, Celle, Nassau etc?
Furienna, do you mean this like Sofia Dorothea's (wife of George I) father Herzog von Braunschweig-Zelle? If not, could you tell more about Celle? Maybe it will be easier to find them.
Yes, a Brittish queen, who was inprisoned as long as her husband George I was the king, was born a Princess of Celle.
Ok Furienna, that's what I found about her and her family.


Here you're about Sophie Dorothea on Geneweb;i=103218
and on Master Index to royal Genealogical Data

and here

and Herzog von Braunschweig-Luneburg from Europäische Länder
and few persons from B-Celle

Infos about Celle town
and on Wiki

I've hope it help.
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OMG! I tried to following the descendants of Empress Maria Theresa's children and got so lost.:ohmy: I thought that I would be able to contribute some info in this thread but I'm better off reading the links that you guys provided. Thanks to you all for your diligence and hard work.:clap:
I once stumbled upon a website that showed how the different monarchies are related. You were either somehow related to Queen Victoria or Empress Maria Teresa (?) I believe. I'll see if I can find that as that would link the German Houses.
The Imperial Council of Princes and Counts of The Holy Roman Empire , Founded 1489 , The Imperial Nobility of Germany .

would it be possible to find out who is the comic behind this internet address
the most ridiculuous of all royal stories indeed

Gaston Roger Julier Freiherr v. Badenthal

You can determine who registered the domain name by plugging the website address into the search box found on this site: - whois domain name search & lookup

Kirsten Gräfin von Moltke
Thurn und Taxis

Anyone know where I can find a genealogy of the princely family?

Reason being, I like history and I'm trying to figure out who's next in line for Head of the Household (that is, until Prince Albert II has a male heir).
Thrun Und Taxis Family Tree

Hi Jason,

Google for Paul Theroff `AN ONLINE GOTHA`. It is a truly excellent site full of constantly updated and very comprehensive family trees of all of the Royal, Princely and even most of the higher nobility from across Europe. That site also does Royal news which gives a really good up to the minute of who is engaged, who is having a baby etc, amongst the Royal Families.

Hope this helps, i think that site will give you all the information you might need.

all the best

Hi Jason R Maier esq, if you find something, can you please tell us about it?

Ask and you shall receive . . . .

Thurn u.Taxis

After carefully looking through the page, I noticed that next in line (at least until Albert II has male heirs) is his father's first cousin, Max Emanuel (b. 1935)
Are these two princes in line. I'm pretty sure that I read somewhere that the TuT family still want their heirs born of a Gotha mother.
Royal & Noble Families of Europe (15th century mainly)

Hello Everone,
I'm new to this so forgive me if I'm being irrelevant. I am trying to build a Tree of Royal & noble families of Europe & wonder whether anybody else is on the same trip. It all started when reading a book about Charles V (the Holy Roman Emporer) There was no family tree so I started to build one. So far I have close on a thousand people, mostly around the 15th & 16th Centuries. The tree ranges from William the Conqueror to our present Queen Elizabeth II and all are connected through marriages. There are Popes & Cardinals, Dukes & Duchesses all over Europe & where I can I've included portraits. No doubt there are errors & at times. things can get a bit messy when there is Illegiticy in the main line. Which was quite permitted in Elizabethan times & particulary in Italy. Popes having children etc etc - you name it !! However if this stikes anyone as interesting I would be glad to know. I am quite new to this site & not quite sure how it works so bare with me
The family trees of the various royal families are all over the web. Wikipedia would be a good place to start.
Thanks I've already used that and am still looking. However thanks for the prompt
The Anhalt website includes a very detailed genealogical chart of the House of Ascania which is worth a look (as is the rest of the site).

This family is said to have reigned in 10 countries, from the lineage of Queen Victoria and King Albert. Can anyone provide details?
The Saxe-Coburg Dynastic Successes

Wikipedia has a pretty good rundown of the Saxe-Coburg dynasty.

The Ducal House provided monarchs and consorts to:

Duchy of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha

(formerly the Duchy of Saxe-Coburg-Saalfeld until it was renamed in 1826) Reigning Dukes until 1918.
In 1893 Queen Victoria's 2nd son Prince Alfred, Duke of Edinburgh, became the Reigning Duke of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha.
On the death of Duke Alfred in 1900 the Dukedom passed to Prince Charles Edward, son of Queen Victoria's haemophiliac son Leopold, Duke of Albany. As Karl Eduard he was the last Reigning Duke of Sace-Coburg and Gotha.
Sweden: Princess Sibylla, daughter of Karl Eduard, married Crown Prince Gustav Adolf in 1932. Their son reigns today as the King of Sweden.

S-C & G connections:

Romania: Princess Marie of Edinburgh (and from 1893 of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha) became Queen of Romania in 1914 as consort to King Ferdinand I. He was the son of the Prince of Hohenzollern (-Sigmaringen) and the Portuguese Saxe-Coburg Infanta Antonia.
Hesse and by Rhine: In 1894 Marie's sister Princess Victoria Melita married Ernst Ludwig, the last Grand Duke of Hesse and by Rhine (aka Hesse-Darmstadt). They were divorced in 1901.
Russia: The now-divorced Princess Victoria Melita married Grand Duke Kirill of Russia in 1905; he proclaimed himself Head of the Imperial House of Romanov and Curator of the Throne in 1922 and Emperor and Autocrat of all the Russias in 1924; their son Grand Duke Vladimir became Head of the Imperial House of Russia in 1938.
Prussia: In 1938 Victoria Melita and Kirill's daughter Grand Duchess Kira married Prince Louis Ferdinand; he became Prince of Prussia and Head of the Royal House of Prussia in 1951.
Schleswig-Holstein: In 1898 Princess Dorothea of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha was married (or sacrificed) to Ernst Gunther, Reigning Duke of Schleswig-Holstein. Queen Victoria referred to him as "odious Gunther" and unsurprisingly there were no children of the marriage.

United Kingdom

Princess Victoria of Saxe-Coburg-Saalfeld married Prince Edward, Duke of Kent in 1818; their only child became Queen Victoria;
Prince Albert of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha married Queen Victoria in 1840; from 1901 to 1910 King Edward VII was the first British Saxe-Coburg monarch; George V was a Saxe-Coburg until 1917 when the House and family name was changed to Windsor (it was quickly applied retrospectively to 1910).

British connections:

Germany: Victoria and Albert's eldest daughter Victoria married Prince Friedrich of Prussia and in 1888 became German Empress and Queen of Prussia. Mother of the Kaiser.
Hesse and by Rhine: V & A's 2nd daughter Alice married Hereditary Grand Duke Ludwig and in 1877 became Grand Duchess of Hesse and by Rhine.
Sweden: Princess Margaret, daughter of Victoria and Albert's third son Arthur, Duke of Connaught and Strathearn, married in 1905 as his first wife Gustaf Adolf, Crown Prince of Sweden (later King Gustaf VI Adolf). She was the mother of Prince Gustaf Adolf (the current King of Sweden's father) and of Queen Ingrid (the current Queen of Denmark's mother).
Norway: In 1896 Princess Maud, the youngest daughter of Edward VII, Britain's first and last Saxe-Coburg King, married Prince Carl of Denmark. In 1905 he was elected King of Norway and she became a Queen.

Prince Leopold of Saxe-Coburg-Saalfeld, formerly married to the tragic Princess Charlotte of Wales, only child of the Prince Regent, later King George IV of Great Britain, became the first King of the Belgians in 1831 and established a new branch of the dynasty. The House name remained Saxe-Coburg and Gotha until it was dropped during the First World War.

Belgian connections:

Austria-Mexico: Leopold I's daughter Princess Charlotte married in 1857 Archduke Maximilian of Austria. He became the short-lived and soon-executed Emperor of Mexico while she became the long-lived and quite mad Empress Carlota.
Austria: Leopold II's daughter Princess Stephanie married the ill-fated Rudolf, Crown Prince of Austria in 1881. He committed suicide with his mistress eight years later.
Bonaparte: Stephanie's younger sister Princess Clementine married Prince Victor Napoleon, Head of the Imperial House of Bonaparte in 1910.
Italy: Albert I's daughter Marie-Jose married Crown Prince Umberto in 1930 and became Italy's last Queen.
Luxembourg: Leopold III's daughter Josephine Charlotte married Hereditary Grand Duke Jean in 1953 and as his consort later became the Grand Duchess of Luxembourg.


(the Catholic Kohary branch of the Saxe-Coburg & Gothas)
Prince Ferdinand of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha married Maria II da Gloria, Queen of Portugal and the Algarves in 1836 and was created King Consort of Portugal as Fernando II in 1837; their son Pedro V became King in 1853; the dynasty reigned until 1910.

Portuguese connections:

Maria and Fernando had two daughters, the Infantas Maria Ana and Antonia:
Saxony: Maria Ana married Georg I, King of Saxony in 1859. Their daughter Maria Josepha married Archduke Otto of Austria and was the mother of Karl, the last Emperor of Austria and King of Hungary.
Hohenzollern (-Sigmaringen): Antonia married Leopold, Reigning Prince of Hohenzollern (-Sigmaringen) in 1861. Their son Ferdinand became King of Romania.

Prince Ferdinand of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha ("Foxy Ferdinand") was elected Prince of Bulgaria in 1887 and became Tsar (King) of the Bulgarians in 1908; the dynasty reigned until 1946. The last King, Simeon II, was elected Prime Minister of Bulgaria in 2001.
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