The Ancient Dukedoms of France (Aquitaine, Brittany, Normandy etc)

[Warren]

The Ancient Dukedoms of France

(Aquitaine, Brittany, Normandy etc)

France 1154

Map by Lotroo, courtesy of Wikipedia and released into the Public Domain
​

 

[Midwestern Mom]

The Ancient Dukedoms (Aquitaine, Brittany, Normandy etc)

Are the former provinces (or however they were called) like Aquitaine etc more or less defunct and now would be considered (if France still had a ruling Monarch) just part of France or would they still have a local noble over that territory?


MM

 

[Meraude]

As most of the French medieval non-royal duchies merged with the throne through the marriage between a independet duchess and the French king or heir to the throne, and the next duke would also be king of France, there wouldn't be any non-royal duchies.

Claude of France, Duchess of Brittany married Francis I of France; the duchy was inherited by their son Francis III, Duke of Brittany and when he died without issue, the duchy went to his younger brother Henry, later king Henry II of France and the Duchy of Brittany merged with the crown.

The title Duke of Aquitaine was held by the English kings after the death of Eleonor of Aquitaine, duchess of Aquitaine in her own right and queen of England, until Aquitaine was annexed by France during the reign of Henry VI of England.

The Duchy of Burgundy merged with the French crown after the death of Philip I, Duke of Burgundy. His mother had married king John II of France and when Philip died at the age of 15 his stepfather "inherited" the duchy.

The Duchy of Normandy was/is held by the English monarchs, but the mainland part of Normandy was confiscated by France in 1204, but queen Elizabeth II is Duchess of Normandy as the Channel Islands was a part of the Duchy of Normandy and still are English.

The Kingdom of Navarre merged with the French crown when king Henry of Navarre became king Henry IV of France in 1589.

 

[An Ard Ri]

Are the former provinces (or however they were called) like Aquitaine etc more or less defunct and now would be considered (if France still had a ruling Monarch) just part of France or would they still have a local noble over that territory?


MM

The old Ancien Régime Provinces of France were abolished in March 1790 with the establishment of the département.

La Royaume de France- Anciennes Provinces 1789
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/96/France_anciennes_provinces_1789.jpg

 

[An Ard Ri]

The Kingdom of Navarre merged with the French crown when king Henry of Navarre became king Henry IV of France in 1589.

Only upper Navarre merged with France,the southern rump of that kingdom had been annexed by Ferdinand of Aragon in 1512.The Queen of Navarre,Catherine I then fled to what remained of her kingdom north of the Pyrenees.

When Henri IV became King of France,he also held vast lands in France which had belonged to his parents,Jeanne III,Queen of Navarre and Antoine de Bourbon.

Jeanne III d'Albret also held the following titles

In her own right

Duchess of Albret (1555–1572)
Countess of Limoges (1555–1572)
Countess of Foix (1555–1572)
Countess of Armagnac (1555–1572)
Countess of Bigorre (1555–1572)
Countess of Périgord (1555–1572)

By Marriage
Duchess of Vendôme (1550–1562)
Duchess of Beaumont (1550–1562)
Countess of Marle (1548–1562)
Countess of La Fère (1548–1562)
Countess of Soissons (1550–1562)

 

[THORFIN]

ROBERT II “THE DEVIL” 6TH DUKE OF NORMANDY c999–22/7/1035

I have a small problem in that I am trying to work out the parentage of ADELAIDE de CRECY c1026-c12/10/1104 is it possible that she is a daughter (Adelisa) of ROBERT II “THE DEVIL” 6TH DUKE OF NORMANDY c999–22/7/1035 and Arlette of Falaise c1008-c1050 can anyone help please

Many thanks

 

[Ish]

ROBERT II “THE DEVIL” 6TH DUKE OF NORMANDY c999–22/7/1035

Robert and Herleva did have a daughter named Adelaide, but I don't know that she's in any way connected to "de Crecy". She was born circa 1030 and died sometime between 1086 and 1089. She was the Countess of Aumale in her own right.

Adelaide was married to Enguerrand II of Ponthieu in 1049, but the marriage was annulled within a year. She later married Lambert II of Lens, who died in 1054. In 1060 she married Odo of Champlagne.

She had 2 daughters, Adelaide II, Countess of Aumale (with Enguerrand) and Judith of Lens (with Lambert), and 1 son, Stephan, Count of Aumale (with Odo).

 

[Countessmeout]

The closest link between Adelaide and the Duke I can find would be through her first husband Bouchard. Her first husband Bouchard II Comte de Corbeil was the great grandson of Richard I Duke of Normandy. His grandfather Mauger was the younger brother of Richard II. That made Mauger paternal uncle, and his son William (father of Bouchard) first cousins, to Robert the devil.

 

[An Ard Ri]

Possibly to compensate that Louise de Savoie was not a queen but a Princess of the house of Savoy,Madame la Régente amassed quite a lot of titles many of them bestowed by her son François Ier others were inherited like the Bourbon lands which she claimed via her mother upon the death of her cousin Suzanne de Bourbon in 1524 .

Duchesse d'Anjou
Duchesse d'Angoulême
Duchesse de Bourbon
Duchesse de Touraine
Duchesse de Nemours
Comtesse de Forez,
Comtessede Clermont
Comtesse de la Marche
Dame de Beaujeu.

 

[An Ard Ri]

A map of the Kingdom of France in 1477

The noble houses of both Foix and Albret would soon marry consecutively into the royal house of Navarre and giving Navarre an extra chunk of domains in France comprising of the Countdoms of Foix,Armagnac,Biggore ,Limoges &
Périgord.

 

[Durham]

Could British monarchs still claim to be the Dukes of Aquitaine?

Watching that fantastic film the Lion in Winter with Katherine Hepburn as Eleanor of Aquitaine got me interested in history as child.

 

[Gawin]

No, not since the 1701 Act of Succession limited the British Crown to the Electress Sophia and her Protestant descendants, skipping over Roman Catholic relatives who had a better claim to Aquitaine. If anyone could claim Aquitaine I suppose it would be the Jacobite pretender.

 

[An Ard Ri]

The last holder of that title was a Bourbon Prince, Xavier de France , Duke of Aquitaine the second son of Dauphin Louis de France and Princess Maria Josepha of Saxony he died in 1754.

 

[Durham]

Thanks to the both of you

I understand that the Queen is referred to as the Duke of Normandy by some of the inhabitants of the Channel Islands. Am I right in thinking that she is not strictly speaking their queen even if she would be called that on the islands as a matter of courtesy?

 

[An Ard Ri]

Its quite possible and unofficial as the Channel Islands were once part of Normandy and thus the only part of the former duchy in Crown hands but its incorrect as France is a Republic but we won't burst their bubble

The former Duchy of Normandie

 

[Durham]

Thank you

 

[An Ard Ri]

The Duchy of Berry

Created 1360
Became Extinct 1820

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duke_of_Berry

 

[An Ard Ri]

The 'altered' Book of Hours of François Ier, Duke of Brittany following his second marriage to to Isabel of Scotland (daughter of James I).

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/science...taboola_feed&ns_mchannel=rss&ico=taboola_feed