25th Anniversary of King Baudouin's Death - 2018

[eya]

On 8 September , the Belgium Royal Family will attend a memorial service on the occasion of the 25th anniversary of the death of King Baudouin.

"Their Majesties the King and the Queen, Their Royal Highnesses the Grand Duke and the Grand Duchess of Luxembourg and the Members of the Royal Family (*) attend the Mass on the occasion of the 25th anniversary of the death His Majesty King Baudouin. This celebration, organized by the Archdiocese of Mechelen-Brussels, will be celebrated by Cardinal De Kesel in the Church of Our Lady of Laeken."


In the list so far not the names of King Albert, Queen Paola and Princess Claire:

"(*) La Princesse Astrid et le Prince Lorenz, Le Prince Laurent, Le Prince Amedeo et la Princesse Elisabetta, La Princesse Maria Laura, Le Prince Louis, Le Prince Nikolaus et la Princesse Margaretha, La Princesse Marie-Astrid, La Princesse Maria-Anunciata, Le Prince Josef-Emmanuel, Le Prince Guillaume et la Princesse Sibilla, Le Prince Paul-Louis, Le Prince Léopold, La Princesse Charlotte, La Comtesse Louis-Arnold de Looz-Corswarem, L'Archiduc et l'Archiduchesse Charles-Christian et Marie Astrid, La Princesse Léa et Mr Renaud Bichara, La Princesse Maria-Teresa de Bourbon, Le Comte et la Comtesse Jean-Charles Ullens de Schooten Whettnall"

https://www.monarchie.be/fr/agenda/m...majeste-le-roi

[Marengo]

Countess Louis-Arnold of Looz-Corswarem was born as Maria Cristina Ruíz de Ojeda y Silva and is the grand daughter of Queen Fabiola's sisters Ana Maria, who married the 18th duke of Lecera.

Do we know who is meant by Pss Maria-Teresa de Bourbon? The aunt of the duke of Parma?

[Stefan]

Originally Posted by Marengo

Countess Louis-Arnold of Looz-Corswarem was born as Maria Cristina Ruíz de Ojeda y Silva and is the grand daughter of Queen Fabiola's sisters Ana Maria, who married the 18th duke of Lecera.

Do we know who is meant by Pss Maria-Teresa de Bourbon? The aunt of the duke of Parma?

They have also listed Pricness Marie Astrid and Archduchess marie Astrid as attendign,. Will be interesting to see how she attends twice.

[Marengo]

Perhaps they meant Pss Marie-Astrid of Liechtenstein?

[Tatiana Maria]

Originally Posted by eya

On 8 September , the Belgium Royal Family will attend a memorial service on the occasion of the 25th anniversary of the death of King Baudouin.

"Their Majesties the King and the Queen, Their Royal Highnesses the Grand Duke and the Grand Duchess of Luxembourg and the Members of the Royal Family (*) attend the Mass on the occasion of the 25th anniversary of the death His Majesty King Baudouin. This celebration, organized by the Archdiocese of Mechelen-Brussels, will be celebrated by Cardinal De Kesel in the Church of Our Lady of Laeken."


In the list so far not the names of King Albert, Queen Paola and Princess Claire:

"(*) La Princesse Astrid et le Prince Lorenz, Le Prince Laurent, Le Prince Amedeo et la Princesse Elisabetta, La Princesse Maria Laura, Le Prince Louis, Le Prince Nikolaus et la Princesse Margaretha, La Princesse Marie-Astrid, La Princesse Maria-Anunciata, Le Prince Josef-Emmanuel, Le Prince Guillaume et la Princesse Sibilla, Le Prince Paul-Louis, Le Prince Léopold, La Princesse Charlotte, La Comtesse Louis-Arnold de Looz-Corswarem, L'Archiduc et l'Archiduchesse Charles-Christian et Marie Astrid, La Princesse Léa et Mr Renaud Bichara, La Princesse Maria-Teresa de Bourbon, Le Comte et la Comtesse Jean-Charles Ullens de Schooten Whettnall"

https://www.monarchie.be/fr/agenda/m...majeste-le-roi

It is excellent that so many members of the extended Royal Family are expected to attend, albeit I hope that King Albert and Queen Paola, Princess Claire, and the rest of the grandchildren will be eventual additions to the calendar.

As an aside, according to the rules used in 2013, the Royal Family was defined as "all the descendants of Leopold III and their lawful spouses". So, it is an interesting surprise for the Court to refer to relatives of spouses (who are not descendants of Leopold III) as "Members of the Royal Family".

[An Ard Ri]

Any one else notice that Prince Amedeo's wife was noted as 'Princesse Elisabetta' something that we were debating in the Belgian titles thread for many years

[Tatiana Maria]

Originally Posted by An Ard Ri

Any one else notice that Prince Amedeo's wife was noted as 'Princesse Elisabetta' something that we were debating in the Belgian titles thread for many years

The Court also noted her as "Princess Elisabetta" without "of Belgium" for her birthday and Christmas cards and the card for her first wedding anniversary.

koninklijkepost.punt.nl

The Court used "Princess Amedeo of Belgium" for the confirmation of her pregnancy, the announcement that she had given birth, and the announcement of her daughter's name, and for her second wedding anniversary.

https://www.facebook.com/BeMonarchie...84077428522557
https://www.facebook.com/PlaceRoyale...3355812262161/
https://twitter.com/RTLPlaceRoyale/s...64995834245120

So, it seems that she is "Princess Amedeo of Belgium" in situations in which she is styled as a Princess of Belgium (as she is not a Princess of Belgium in her own right), however, she is styled "Princess Elisabetta" in situations in which she is styled as a Princess but not a Princess of Belgium.

[An Ard Ri]

The Belgian court seem to be just as confused as ourselves regarding Belgian RF styles and titles of address.

[Tatiana Maria]

Originally Posted by An Ard Ri

Any one else notice that Prince Amedeo's wife was noted as 'Princesse Elisabetta' something that we were debating in the Belgian titles thread for many years

Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

The Court also noted her as "Princess Elisabetta" without "of Belgium" for her birthday and Christmas cards and the card for her first wedding anniversary.

koninklijkepost.punt.nl

The Court used "Princess Amedeo of Belgium" for the confirmation of her pregnancy, the announcement that she had given birth, and the announcement of her daughter's name, and for her second wedding anniversary.

https://www.facebook.com/BeMonarchie...84077428522557
https://www.facebook.com/PlaceRoyale...3355812262161/
https://twitter.com/RTLPlaceRoyale/s...64995834245120

So, it seems that she is "Princess Amedeo of Belgium" in situations in which she is styled as a Princess of Belgium (as she is not a Princess of Belgium in her own right), however, she is styled "Princess Elisabetta" in situations in which she is styled as a Princess but not a Princess of Belgium.

Originally Posted by An Ard Ri

The Belgian court seem to be just as confused as ourselves regarding Belgian RF styles and titles of address.

They would certainly improve from following the Dutch court's example in regard to clear communication.

Still, if we assume that the King and Court see Elisabetta as a princess but not a princess of Belgium (which is the confirmed status of her daughter), then their use of titles for her seems reasonable:

Every time she was called Princess without designation (I assume this is her own title), she has been referred to by her own first name (Princess Elisabetta).
Every time she was called Princess of Belgium (I assume this is sharing her husband's title), she was referred to by her husband's first name (Princess Amedeo of Belgium).

At least, this is the theory which for me makes the most sense out of the information provided by the court.

Originally Posted by eya

On 8 September , the Belgium Royal Family will attend a memorial service on the occasion of the 25th anniversary of the death of King Baudouin.

"Their Majesties the King and the Queen, Their Royal Highnesses the Grand Duke and the Grand Duchess of Luxembourg and the Members of the Royal Family (*) attend the Mass on the occasion of the 25th anniversary of the death His Majesty King Baudouin. This celebration, organized by the Archdiocese of Mechelen-Brussels, will be celebrated by Cardinal De Kesel in the Church of Our Lady of Laeken."


In the list so far not the names of King Albert, Queen Paola and Princess Claire:

"(*) La Princesse Astrid et le Prince Lorenz, Le Prince Laurent, Le Prince Amedeo et la Princesse Elisabetta, La Princesse Maria Laura, Le Prince Louis, Le Prince Nikolaus et la Princesse Margaretha, La Princesse Marie-Astrid, La Princesse Maria-Anunciata, Le Prince Josef-Emmanuel, Le Prince Guillaume et la Princesse Sibilla, Le Prince Paul-Louis, Le Prince Léopold, La Princesse Charlotte, La Comtesse Louis-Arnold de Looz-Corswarem, L'Archiduc et l'Archiduchesse Charles-Christian et Marie Astrid, La Princesse Léa et Mr Renaud Bichara, La Princesse Maria-Teresa de Bourbon, Le Comte et la Comtesse Jean-Charles Ullens de Schooten Whettnall"

https://www.monarchie.be/fr/agenda/m...majeste-le-roi

Het Nieuwsblad writes that, according to its source, King Albert and Queen Paola will not be present at the memorial mass for the sake of not disturbing their vacation abroad. I wonder whether their source is correct.

[Hannelore]

Not literally for the sake of not disturbing their vacations. They were invited but declined. De facto they don't live in Belgium anymore, spending 80% of the year in Italy, and travelling most of the other 20%. Now and then they still use their Belvédère residence in Laeken.

It seems they took the decision to spend the rest of their lives outside of the public light. Wether this is wise, I don't know, but I certainly don't expect to see them anymore apart from the weddings of their grandchildren, funerals or paparazzi shots.

[Duc_et_Pair]

Originally Posted by Hannelore

Not literally for the sake of not disturbing their vacations. They were invited but declined. De facto they don't live in Belgium anymore, spending 80% of the year in Italy, and travelling most of the other 20%. Now and then they still use their Belvédère residence in Laeken.

It seems they took the decision to spend the rest of their lives outside of the public light. Wether this is wise, I don't know, but I certainly don't expect to see them anymore apart from the weddings of their grandchildren, funerals or paparazzi shots.

They are retired. Maybe King Albert will remember his brother in his own private way. That is his good right.

[Stefan]

Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair

They are retired. Maybe King Albert will remember his brother in his own private way. That is his good right.

Of course that is his good right. But it doesn't show them in the best light when plenty of other Family members from abroad can attend but the only still livinig sibling doesn't attend.
And they have in the years since their abdication usually attended the King's Feast and also some other small Events with their Patronages in Belgium. So it is not that they have complety retired.

[leidi]

They never interrumpt their "holidays" (even if they are on holiday all year long), not when their youngest son was in the ICU, not when there's a big anniversary on his brother's untimely death.

Seems like their priorities are to take as much sun as possible and avoid "pesky" familiar obligations.

Some people never change and they have never been dutiful, not even as King and Queen, their priorities have always been their own lives, not family or the royal house.

[Duc_et_Pair]

Originally Posted by leidi

They never interrumpt their "holidays" (even if they are on holiday all year long), not when their youngest son was in the ICU, not when there's a big anniversary on his brother's untimely death.

Seems like their priorities are to take as much sun as possible and avoid "pesky" familiar obligations.

Some people never change and they have never been dutiful, not even as King and Queen, their priorities have always been their own lives, not family or the royal house.

I think that is not true. Under King Albert Belgium has been rocking on its foundations with all what came to the surface with Dutroux, the King has faced the longest and most difficult formation of a new Government ever, it saw the rise of separatist parties and a further crumbling of the once so strong unitary state paired with the worldwide crisis. As often as I have seen the fleet of ministerial cars ride to Laeken, so seldom are these images now. It was an eventful and active kingship. Already in 2009 King Albert was the eldest Belgian King ever and all that with a brittle state of health.

His son King Philippe, alike his neighour King Willem-Alexander seems to have abandoned the more political kingship of Albert and Beatrix and has chosen for a more social cohesive role. Less inside the palace with dignitaries. More outside the palace with social projects. But that Albert II was lazy is nonsense. His son never had the workload of his father, simply because the ongoing state reforms have crumbled the national state to the minimum, in advantage of the devolved parts in which there is no role for the King whatsoever.

[JR76]

Originally Posted by eya

Le Comte et la Comtesse Jean-Charles Ullens de Schooten Whettnall"

https://www.monarchie.be/fr/agenda/m...majeste-le-roi

This would be the son of Countess Madeleine Bernadotte, the niece of Queen Astrid. Are her children close to their royal cousins?

[Duc_et_Pair]

Originally Posted by JR76

This would be the son of Countess Madeleine Bernadotte, the niece of Queen Astrid. Are her children close to their royal cousins?

I assume so. The Ullens de Schooten family are often present at familial gatherings.

[JR76]

Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair

I assume so. The Ullens de Schooten family are often present at familial gatherings.

Thanks! I've seen them quite a lot in Oslo. I don't think anyone can forget #nipplegate

[Duc_et_Pair]

God as guide, fortune as partner, on the gate to Kasteel Schooten:

https://www.gva.be/cnt/dmf20180524_0...er-als-vanouds

[An Ard Ri]

Its a pity that King Albert and Queen Paula won't be there for the Memorial Mass.

[Somebody]

Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

Jet Nieuwsblad writes that, according to its source, King Albert and Queen Paola will not be present at the memorial mass for the sake of not disturbing their vacation abroad. I wonder whether their source is correct.

Not unexpected but still a clear sign of not having your prioriyies straight. If your children, grandchildren, and several nieces and nephews and their children make it a priority to honour your brother, is it really too much to ask to attend as well?