The Queen and Canada: Residences, Governor General, etc...

[Shaiya]

I kind of want to see Canada cut off from the British monarchy. But other than that, I don't see the UK becoming a republic or any other serious change in the system. The British people will accept Charles as their King, and then when the time comes, William. As to how their reigns will go, who knows?

 

[Mermaid1962]

Why? We're politically independent. The Queen is Canada's Queen when she's here, not a representative of the UK.

I kind of want to see Canada cut off from the British monarchy. But other than that, I don't see the UK becoming a republic or any other serious change in the system. The British people will accept Charles as their King, and then when the time comes, William. As to how their reigns will go, who knows?

 

[Shaiya]

I'll give you a quote from Globe and Mail's editor and columnist, Margaret Wente.

"The truth is that the monarchy stands for much that has held Canada back. It embodies the triumph of inheritance over merit, of blood over brains, of mindless ritual over innovation. The monarchy reminds us to defer to authority and remember our place. In Quebec, the Royals are regarded as an insult."http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republicanism_in_Canada#cite_note-1

Canada is so multi-cultural and very into equality, and the Queen does not represent our values which are distinct from Britain's. We alienate Quebec with having the Queen as head of state and having her image on our currency. There have been so many who have actually had a great impact on Canada who should be on our currency instead. The Queen has not done anything here except come on infrequent visits. Also, many Canadians are unaware that she is our head of state. They see her as a British lady who comes to visit every decade or so, it would be better to have a Canadian head of state with whom we can relate better to. I understand that she does not meddle in our politics and I have great respect for her, but the very role that she has is unacceptable to me and many other Canadians, especially Quebecers.

 

[muriel]

Canada is so multi-cultural and very into equality, and the Queen does not represent our values which are distinct from Britain's.

Whata re the areas that you think "Canadian values" are different from British ones?

Also, many Canadians are unaware that she is our head of state.

I had not realised that the educational system in Canada left so much to be desired. Perhaps education is an issue that you should be raising in your next election for PM!

I understand that she does not meddle in our politics and I have great respect for her, but the very role that she has is unacceptable to me and many other Canadians, especially Quebecers.

I appreciate your republican sentiments, but clearly your thoughts are not shared by the vast majority of your fellow Canadian subjects who continue to support the monarchy.

 

[Shaiya]

Whata re the areas that you think "Canadian values" are different from British ones?

Any sort of inherited political (even symbolic) position goes against our value of egalitarianism. British values may be more favourable toward peerage and aristocracy.

I had not realised that the educational system in Canada left so much to be desired. Perhaps education is an issue that you should be raising in your next election for PM!

That is because the Queen does absolutely nothing in Canada. Obviously she cannot be here all the time, so we have a governor general who represents her. If the Queen had a more active role in Canada and was here all the time (which she can't because she's a British monarch first) then the people might be more familiar with what her role actually is. And our education system is actually one of the best in the world, and many international students come here to study. I actually learned that the Queen was head of state in my civics class last year (which is a mandatory grade 10 class), so it's not a matter of education. It's a matter of impracticality, the Queen cannot be active in Canada, is irrelevant to Canada, why have her as head of state?

I appreciate your republican sentiments, but clearly your thoughts are not shared by the vast majority of your fellow Canadian subjects who continue to support the monarchy.

The vast majority? No, not really, it's split pretty even. So yes, I still stand by my statement that many Canadians do share my sentiments.

I'm sorry for veering off topic anyway, we should be discussing what happens to the monarchy after Elizabeth II. And I see it continuing with Charles, though I'm not sure Canada will remain a constitutional monarchy with anyone other than Queen Elizabeth.

 

[muriel]

And our education system is actually one of the best in the world, and many international students come here to study. I actually learned that the Queen was head of state in my civics class last year (which is a mandatory grade 10 class), so it's not a matter of education.

You may have a good education system, but it is very telling when somebody says they only found out who the head of their state was when they got to a grade 10 mandatory civics lesson. Perhaps a generalisation as to the failings of the Canadian education system may be a bit unfair, after all.

 

[Shaiya]

Why would we need to know about the Queen in elementary or middle school? She does nothing in Canada, there's nothing to suggest that she is head of state. Perhaps in Britain they know because she actually does something there and the role of the monarch is etched onto them in history class. Her irrelevancy to Canada is one of my reasons I feel we should have a republican model.

 

[JulieS]

And I see it continuing with Charles, though I'm not sure Canada will remain a constitutional monarchy with anyone other than Queen Elizabeth.

I'm Canadian (and Quebecer) and, personally, I think that Canada will remain a constitutional monarchy.

 

[wbenson]

And I see it continuing with Charles, though I'm not sure Canada will remain a constitutional monarchy with anyone other than Queen Elizabeth.

If not for any other reason, I think it will continue for a good long while due to the near-impossibility of changing the constitution. Getting normal amendments through is hard enough (Meech Lake, etc.), let alone one that requires the consent of all ten provinces.

 

[Mermaid1962]

It doesn't help when you have the Governor General refer to herself as "The Head of State" as Jeanne Sauve did/

I had not realised that the educational system in Canada left so much to be desired. Perhaps education is an issue that you should be raising in your next election for PM!

 

[Mermaid1962]

Actually, the monarchy is egalitarian in that a monarch can be a perfectly average person and still be a good monarch.

 

[Mermaid1962]

Perhaps people don't know much about the monarchy because successive governments have downplayed the monarchy and then downplayed it some more for political reasons. It used to be that the Queen was on all our stamps and all our currency and people used to actually sing God Save the Queen at political events rather than just listen to someone play it in the background. The education system reflects the political mind.

Why would we need to know about the Queen in elementary or middle school? She does nothing in Canada, there's nothing to suggest that she is head of state. Perhaps in Britain they know because she actually does something there and the role of the monarch is etched onto them in history class. Her irrelevancy to Canada is one of my reasons I feel we should have a republican model.

 

[Shaiya]

Perhaps people don't know much about the monarchy because successive governments have downplayed the monarchy and then downplayed it some more for political reasons. It used to be that the Queen was on all our stamps and all our currency and people used to actually sing God Save the Queen at political events rather than just listen to someone play it in the background. The education system reflects the political mind.

We have absolutely no reason to sing God Save the Queen or have immigrants swear an oath to the British Queen to become citizens of Canada. The Queen plays no role in our country yet continues to hold the highest office for some strange reason. Since nobody even knows about the Queen, her roles, what she actually symbolizes for Canada (old British imperialism - incompatible with our value of progress and innovation) it's best that we move on. I'm sure most people on this forum share much different views, so I guess we will have to agree to disagree.

Actually, the monarchy is egalitarian in that a monarch can be a perfectly average person and still be a good monarch.

It is not egalitarian because the monarch(reigning, not consort) is something you must have had the good fortune of being born into, not something you acquire through merit or through popular vote. I am not saying this is necessarily bad, just that it does not comply with Canadian values.

 

[wbenson]

I am not saying this is necessarily bad, just that it does not comply with Canadian values.

Who defines "Canadian values" and when did they decide that the monarchy is not in compliance with these values? What are other "Canadian values" I should take note of?

 

[muriel]

Why would we need to know about the Queen in elementary or middle school? She does nothing in Canada, there's nothing to suggest that she is head of state. Perhaps in Britain they know because she actually does something there and the role of the monarch is etched onto them in history class. Her irrelevancy to Canada is one of my reasons I feel we should have a republican model.

Irresective of who the head of state is, it is a very good indicator of basic "general knowledge" when people get as far as grade 10 to find out who their head of state is! The form of government or the Queen is not going to help you with that!

 

[Shaiya]

^You should do a survey of British teens and how well they know their government. =P Trust me, we Canadian kids are a smart and knowledgeable bunch.

Who defines "Canadian values" and when did they decide that the monarchy is not in compliance with these values? What are other "Canadian values" I should take note of?

I believe I've already listed quite a few, feel free to go and read my earlier posts. I've already studied our country's values and norms pretty extensively, and my deduction is that they cannot ethically coexist with having a foreign monarch as our head of state. But as you seem to be a staunch monarchist, I can pretty much guess that you will have a different view of what Canadian values are in relation to the monarchy.

 

[muriel]

^You should do a survey of British teens and how well they know their government. =P Trust me, we Canadian kids are a smart and knowledgeable bunch.

I am sure Canadaian kids are a smart and knowledgeable bunch, but I have absolutely no desire to "trust" anybody who did not know who th head of their state was till they reached grade 10!!!

 

[wbenson]

I believe I've already listed quite a few, feel free to go and read my earlier posts.

And one of them was multiculturalism. It is the antithesis of that to reject someone merely for being "foreign."

But as you seem to be a staunch monarchist, I can pretty much guess that you will have a different view of what Canadian values are in relation to the monarchy.

I reject the premise that there is a definable set of "Canadian values," actually.

 

[Shaiya]

I am sure Canadaian kids are a smart and knowledgeable bunch, but I have absolutely no desire to "trust" anybody who did not know who th head of their state was till they reached grade 10!!!

I was fourteen at the time. Any earlier and the biggest thing on my mind was what colour to dye my hair. It's because we have a governor general and prime minister who do most of the work around here that a head of state would normally do and most people think it's either one of them who are the head of state. Also, many people do not know exactly what the head of state means or is. That's one of my reasons I think we should abolish the monarchy in Canada. Because the Queen really serves no role here, she just lays claim to the highest position.

And one of them was multiculturalism. It is the antithesis of that to reject someone merely for being "foreign."

Of course we accept foreigners into our country. I myself having an immigrant parents, feel very strongly about that. But being a Canadian citizen is important to being the head of state of Canada, no?

 

[wbenson]

But being a Canadian citizen is important to being the head of state of Canada, no?

I don't really think so, obviously. I think we're just fine having a head of state that is not a citizen of any country.

 

[yvr girl]

You didn't know the Queen was Head of State

until you were a teenager. I am frankly astonished. Did you never question the fact that her picture is on money, stamps etc? I don't rememer not knowing.

 

[Mermaid1962]

...and the pictures hanging in every school and federal and provincial buildings...

until you were a teenager. I am frankly astonished. Did you never question the fact that her picture is on money, stamps etc? I don't rememer not knowing.

 

[wbenson]

...and the pictures hanging in every school and federal and provincial buildings...

Not in every school anymore by far.

 

[Shaiya]

...and the pictures hanging in every school and federal and provincial buildings...

Uhh, they don't hang in any school I've been in(and I've been inside enough schools) and there are absolutely no pictures of her anywhere that I've seen. They were slowly removed from most places during the 70's. Plus, nobody ever mentions her, she plays no role in the lives of Canadians.

until you were a teenager. I am frankly astonished. Did you never question the fact that her picture is on money, stamps etc? I don't rememer not knowing.

I still am a teenager, that was only last year. And I'm sad that this discussion has deteriorated into accusations of my supposed ignorance. Does it really matter when I found out? The facts still stand. And trust me, plenty of adults don't know that the queen is the head of state here in Canada.

"Four in ten (42%) believe that the Prime Minister is Canada’s head of state, and one in three (33%) think this title belongs to the Governor General. In truth, though, the Queen is Canada’s Head of State, and only one quarter (24%) of Canadians knew this."

-http://netnewsledger.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1923&Itemid=75

Actually, the monarchy is egalitarian in that a monarch can be a perfectly average person and still be a good monarch.

Sadly, I wish this was the case. According the The Act of Settlement of 1701, the head of state must not be a Roman Catholic and the must hold the position of the Head of the Church of England. This is contradictory of our Charter of Rights and Freedoms that state that nobody can be discriminated against on the basis of "race, national or ethnic origin, colour, religion, sex, age, or mental or physical disability" unfortunately though, the 'criteria' for our head of state is rather discriminatory on basis of religion.

 

[muriel]

.

And I'm sad that this discussion has deteriorated into accusations of my supposed ignorance. Does it really matter when I found out? The facts still stand.

Little more to be said, from my perspective. You have said it all!!!!

 

[Shaiya]

Here are two awesome, awesome videos about this issue. They are both really funny too:

A video on comedy show 22 Minutes with my favourite Canadian comedian/journalist, Rick Mercer (well, he's my favourite after Russell Peters of course!).
YouTube - Rick Mercer rants about the Queen

A commentary by a fellow Canadian on the recent Canadian political crisis and how the GG, the representative of the Queen in Canada was the one who decided the outcome, not the people, as would have been in a democratic republic.
YouTube - Why Canada is Insane in Four Minutes

 

[Mermaid1962]

I've seen them around here.

Not in every school anymore by far.

 

[wbenson]

A commentary by a fellow Canadian on the recent Canadian political crisis and how the GG, the representative of the Queen in Canada was the one who decided the outcome, not the people, as would have been in a democratic republic.

Except that it wouldn't be that way. If Canada became a republic (it's already democratic), it would likely be the exact same system with a ceremonial president (either directly elected or appointed by Parliament) doing the exact same thing. The recent "crisis" (it really wasn't a crisis, IMO) was an effect of the system of government, not the origin of the head of state.

Take issue with the way parliament works and the fact that we have a ceremonial head of state, regardless of how they are selected for this issue. There is not always a clear result with a parliamentary system. Sometimes nobody has a "mandate," despite some of the hyperbole of the last month. It might not be ideal, but it has nothing to do with the Queen. Plenty of republics have had the same issues.

 

[JulieS]

...and the pictures hanging in every school and federal and provincial buildings...

Not in schools and provincial buildings in Quebec (except perhaps the office of the lieutenant-governor)

 

[Humera]

Here's another Rick Mercer video from his show - he explains who Canada's head-of-state is.
Videos - Rick Mercer Report - CBC Television

It's under Season 6 - Feb 3, 2009 and titled "Canada explained"
I loved this one!