Here's my thought. You dont get to be a Harvard MBA by being a shy, retiring , depressed little wallflower. Anyone who gets in and stays the course there is a tough, smart determined person. How she went from there to here is open to speculation.
I dont think she's hiding in the prison, I mean palace. I think she's not allowed out by the IHA and that's what her 'disorder' is. It's very unfortunate, because with a Harvard MBA and a back ground in diplomacy she could have been a wonderful asset to the Imperial family and the country.
You know, I really do like reading about Masako and other "Commoners" who elect to marry into Royal Regimes.
But, I cannot help but think that Masako is smart enough to KNOW that she must do more and more to promote her new Family, rather than continue to hide and make excuses for NOT doing enough for it.
I sympathise with her, and her plight.
But, I also feel that she must think very strongly about just bucking up and getting on with it, now. She's been allowed the luxury of being in treatment for her "adjustment disorder" for a few years now, and I think things are getting down to the wire. Either, she is getting truly better and will be contributory, or ... she must get out altogether, if she see herself as being unfit, overall to fulfill her duties.
It is, as they say, "fish or cut bait" time.
So I take it that you think that if Masako were to announce that she was going to Rome/Paris/London for xyz reason, she would be 'allowed' to get on the plane? When was the last time she left Japan, does anyone have the date?
Please, don´t get me wrong either.
But this woman is diagnosed with an ILLNESS. If she had a problem to carry out her duties because of (say) breast cancer would you also say she should better get a divorce and get out of the way because she is obviously too sensitive for the job she has undertaken? Of course, we all wish to see her strong and healthy and fit to have an impact on the imperial family in a positive way, maybe trying to support working women like her sister-in-law does. (I am not choosing to take sides. I admire both of them.) But it is a bit unfair (and very easy for us) to say she should just try harder. Again: you don´t recover from a serious illness like hers or like cancer or aids or whatever by just trying and being a nice girl.
I am very, very glad that everything went well with Kiko´s pregnancy although it didn´t look so well for a time. BUT: If she actually HAD lost her baby it wouldn´t have been her fault either. It would have been only one very, very sad story with nobody to blame. You also need a bit of luck in order to be successful.
Did I say she must divorce? Maybe she was mistaken marrying the Crownprince, but facts are facts and here they are. She already married him. So she MUST try to get along with her task too. And I never liked divorce, so, I can't understand how my English could be so bad you understood I was proposing the Princess to divorce.
And if we must speak about her illness, don't forget that nervous illness are EMOTIONAL, so we can do something about them with a little of our own will. Psychologic experts can help you a little, but if you don't try to overcome youe emotional problems they will never be solved.
A physical disease is different. cancer could kill you and no psychologic expert could even help you. They could do the better to help you to accept the illness and help yo to acceot it and try to fight it. It's the same for a miscarriage. Your body is the only responsible for physical illness, even if they have a psychologic origine. Stress is psychosomatic and all emotional illness depends somewhat in your attitude facing life.
I DO thing, yes, that if Princess Masako tried to be "a nice girl" things will be better. I tried it myself in life, and believe me, I'm happier now than when I believed that everybody (except me) where responsible of my sadness and problems. I began to be nicer than I was to people and surprisingly to me IT WORKED! All that psychologic expert couldn't do for me, my own attitude toward life DID. I'm very happy and even feel better physically. I repeat: it works. All of us have a lot of psychological pressions from our friends, family, work-mates, etc. All of us could choice between trying to be nice and help others or have a nervous breakdown. I choice the first option. Being cheerful to others, brings happiness to your own life.
Vanesa.
Did I say she must divorce? Maybe she was mistaken marrying the Crownprince, but facts are facts and here they are. She already married him. So she MUST try to get along with her task too. And I never liked divorce, so, I can't understand how my English could be so bad you understood I was proposing the Princess to divorce.
And if we must speak about her illness, don't forget that nervous illness are EMOTIONAL, so we can do something about them with a little of our own will. Psychologic experts can help you a little, but if you don't try to overcome youe emotional problems they will never be solved.
A physical disease is different. cancer could kill you and no psychologic expert could even help you. They could do the better to help you to accept the illness and help yo to acceot it and try to fight it. It's the same for a miscarriage. Your body is the only responsible for physical illness, even if they have a psychologic origine. Stress is psychosomatic and all emotional illness depends somewhat in your attitude facing life.
I DO thing, yes, that if Princess Masako tried to be "a nice girl" things will be better. I tried it myself in life, and believe me, I'm happier now than when I believed that everybody (except me) where responsible of my sadness and problems. I began to be nicer than I was to people and surprisingly to me IT WORKED! All that psychologic expert couldn't do for me, my own attitude toward life DID. I'm very happy and even feel better physically. I repeat: it works. All of us have a lot of psychological pressions from our friends, family, work-mates, etc. All of us could choice between trying to be nice and help others or have a nervous breakdown. I choice the first option. Being cheerful to others, brings happiness to your own life.
Vanesa.
I am a bit puzzled. You are Vanesa. The words I quoted were from HRH Abigail?
I would certainly not be the right person to criticize anybody`s English anyway as I am not a native speaker myself. But as far as I can see, yours is excellent. I don´t think that is the point.
Abigail said Masako has two possibilities in her opinion: „Either, she is getting truly better and will be contributory, or ... she must get out altogether.“
The first is clear: be a good girl, not be ill any longer and do her duty. But if she finds herself to be too „sensitive“ as you said in your post and accordingly unable to choose this option what would be the second one? How can she „get out altogether“ if not by a divorce?
I don´t share your opinion concerning emotional/psychological illnesses. (Nor does the mainstream medical world as far as I am informed.) And undoubtedly there is not such a clear line between illness on the psychical and on the bodily level. Emotional illness can be partly caused by the body (genetical predispositions, for example). And on the other hand psychical aspects influence the state of the body and can even co-cause severe illnesses of the body (stress, continually suppressed anger, extreme grief...). (There seems to be even evidence that among people with cancer there is a significant number who have problems of dealing with emotions of anger, more than the average population.)
And certainly pregnancy and birthgiving are extremely vulnerable to strong emotional impressions and stress. Why was it such a „biggie“ for Kiko to have her son? O.k., she was 39, not 25. But nowadays it is not unusual for a 39-year-old-woman to have her third child. (Geena Davis had her first at 46, and the next two two years later...) Kiko has given birth to two daughters without any problems I ever heard of. And from a physical point of view it is no more difficult or dangerous to give birth to a boy than to a girl. But from a psychological point of view? Oh well...
Of course, she knew the whole country was watching her. In the beginning it probably was fun and pride – for her, it was rather optional to give birth to a male heir, not a duty like for her sister-in-law. But when the months passed fear began to grow: now all hopes of the country and the imperial family were on her and what if anything happened to this baby? They had blamed her sister-in-law for „not trying hard enough“ to get pregnant. (Which is obviously absurd. You can try harder to win a football game but not to get pregnant.) If anything went wrong wouldn´t they blame her in the same absurd way of not having been „cautious enough“ or of not having „fully realized her duty in this important situation“?
I am absolutely convinced that Kiko`s problems in her third pregnancy were co-caused by the stress and strong emotional pressure she was under. In the end she made it, in spite of that. But this same pressure under which Kiko tumbled after a few months had been on Masako for over ten years... (I am not saying that this was the reason why she didn´t get pregnant. But I can well imagine that as, in fact, she did not get pregnant she in the end fell prey to this immensely stressful situation.)
I don´t think that anybody in this forum (myself included, of course) has an experience that comes even remotely close to this situation. We are all human beings, and so we can sometimes say „been there, done that, I know how you feel“, and in a way this also gives us a right to judge because we have an idea how much we are asking of a person.
But there are situations that are too special, like this one. We can only guess what it means to be in Masako´s position and what we are asking if we say she should try more. And we really can´t be sure if we ourselves in her situation would be able to do it. I am convinced that even Kiko - who was close enough to be well informed - thought it would be much easier before she had to do it herself.
And I am not sure if we do anything good by blaming Masako. As Elsbeth said her burden has been (is) on Michiko, it is/was as I explained in a way on Kiko, it will be on Hisahito. AND do you have any idea how much it will be on Hisahito´s wife? No mother still in her right mind will let her daughter marry this poor guy...
You say you want to forward Masako´s happiness. And I am sure that is what we all would want. But I think it is not effective to keep saying that Masako is "THE PROBLEM". If they would just stop blaming Masako she could do a big favour to her country and to the imperial family: to help them recognize that it is necessary to change this f...ing law of male succession that threatens to make one generation after the other miserable. (I don´t care for the theoretical background. I only see that they are sacrificing living human beings to this theory and I don´t think that any theory can be worth that.)
Masako´s illness could be a gift for the whole country if they would only accept it. Perhaps it is they who should try harder...
Dear Abbie, generally, I share your opinion: Love it, change it or leave it.
But I also know from my own experience that it can take a lot of time sometimes to "love things into change". I think Masako nonwithstanding her difficult position and her obvious difficulties in dealing with it has at least two excellent reasons for investing that time: her husband and daughter.
Naruhito is lucky that he is a male. If he were not he certainly would be criticized at least as much as his wife. He does not "fit in" any more than she. Is not that "big" for the heir of a throne to say: "If I can´t have this woman I won´t marry at all."? Or to unconditionally and publicly support his wife who has failed in fulfilling her first duty (to get a boy)? Maybe he even prevented Masako from leaving by saying: "Even if you leave I won´t marry again and then you will have sacrificed yourself for nothing." Considering what we know about him I think that absolutely possible.
From the "imperial" point of view he is neglecting the duties of his position in an irresponsible way.
But on the other hand: is not this way of unconditionally loving and supporting this one person he has chosen, no matter what happens and no matter how little she "fits in", is that not exactly what we are all dreaming of - not only in marriage but in all human relationships? To be appreciated for who we are, not for our "showing off" qualities?
I think such an relationship is very well worth fighting for. And as far as we can see it is this what Masako is doing.
And I think she has every right to it, no matter how long it takes and how much the japanese people or the imperial family are afraid of "losing their face" because of her.
I have already explained why I think that Masako is not "the problem", she is only a symptom of "the problem". If she gets out, maybe (maybe) HER life will be better but the main problem will remain unsolved.
Masako is so disturbing to people because her condition makes it so obvious that it is nearly as difficult to survive in her position as in the "dead zone" on the Mount Everest. Michiko suffered silently. That was, of course, more comfortable (for everybody except herself).
If Masako did leave and Naruhito then did remarry (which I doubt) the next one would have the same problems. Probably, she would not express them in the same way as Masako, maybe she indeed would get breast cancer. So people could pity her and go on with being in denial. But I don´t see that there is any use in that.
And I am absolutely sure that everybody in this position would have the same problems in one form or other. I practice Aikido, and so I look at people intuitively from a "fighting point" of view. And Masako (as well as Michiko, bye the bye, although now there is only a faint shadow left of her former self) is champion´s level concerning will and inner strength, in my perception. Concerning that, she is one in a million. If she cannot do it, nobody can.
Well, I suppose, so we agree to disagree...
One thing just to make things clear: when you say Masako should "get out" (if she chooses that option) you do mean by a divorce? Or is there another possibility I have overlooked?
You CAN'T (as Diana learnt to her peril) CHANGE Royalty, especially if you are Commoner who's married into it. Diana was NO Commoner but she was too "modern" for the antiquated Royal status quo.
One has NO CHOICE but to adapt to IT and its archaic rules, peccadillos, and practices. The Royal System will NOT adapt to you, and your demands.
This is especially true of the Imperial Family of Japan, the worlds most conservative Royal System.
Naruhito's brother, Akishino attacked him and gave him public hell, whilst his own parents did likewise. So, he wasn't at liberty to attack The System any further.
I have truly enjoyed reading the exchange of opinions. I would like to commend you on such thorough understanding of Asian culture.
Fully sharing your views, I would like to note the following. Crown Princess Masako can not just get a divorce and go on with her life like Princess Alexandra of Denmark or Princess Diana did. She has to weigh pros and cons super carefully. Divorce involving members of the Imperial family is viewed as unacceptable. If Crown Princess Masako opts for divorce, she may become an outcast. Her only child may be taken away from her (this will not surprise me much). Furthermore, divorce may adversely affect reputation of her family. Given the utter secrecy surrounding the Japanese Imperial family, it is hard to determine whether Crown Princess Masako recovers or not. At the same time, it will be fair to say that the IHA will announce her full recovery, if she gets pregnant again.
Right you are noting that Crown Prince Naruhito have exhausted his reasons to attack the system. Now it is up to Crown Princely couple to make a decision.
Dear Abbie, as you probably can imagine I feel exceedingly flattered. (I am indeed German, no native speaker.) Thank you very much!
For me, it is a wonderful experience, too, that people can clearly express differing opinions without taking it personally and without quarrel. It takes two for that… Thank you. In this way, dissent is not an annoyance but to the contrary, a pleasure and something that helps me to learn and to see new aspects. I still don´t agree with you in some points but while contemplating about what you said I came to think about some things I probably otherwise would never have thought of.
I think we do agree in that there should be some change in Masako´s situation because it is obviously disagreeable to everybody concerned. We differ concerning WHO should change. But when we come to the REASONS for our views perhaps we are already getting closer to each other… Basically, you say (if I understand you right) that whatever one might think about the necessity of change in the system, the system certainly won´t change, so it has to be Masako, for practical reasons if not for any else. And I say, it´s the system that has to change because any other change would be purely "cosmetical".
I still think I am right but I am afraid you are right, too. I am well aware that when a powerful group of people is resolved against facing reality and against opening themselves for necessary change, centuries may pass before they are forced into it... ("The earth is flat." How much time and suffering, how many burnt "heretics" did it take us to get that one right? - Just one example.) (And, to make that absolutely clear, I am NOT talking about any individual in the imperial family. They are all paying their price for belonging to the system, and some of them a fairly high one, especially the women.)
Considering this, I have come to reflect about what I think Masako COULD do. And, honestly, I don´t think she should – or even could – "try harder". Look, she is an eldest child, an eldest daughter even, in a culture that prefers sons, and she has a very strong will. Taking into account these facts, I´d bet ten freshly made cream cakes against your old green hat that she is highly over-responsible, is very hard upon herself and expects herself to be absolutely perfect. The pressure from the people surrounding her is undoubtedly immense but maybe the pressure she is putting UPON HERSELF is even stronger. If she could remove at least that she might have much better chances to recover.
Accordingly, in my opinion, she should just relax, let go, forgive herself for being "a complete failure" and allow herself to be just herself, a wonderful human being, no matter what others may think or whatever (even reasonable) demands she may not be able to fulfill. Instead of trying harder, she should just STOP TRYING.
Easily said, considering the circumstances. Although her surrounding bears with her because in a way they just have to, they would probably be very far from thinking her wonderful exactly as she is or from supporting her in giving up trying. The only "star of hope" is again Naruhito.He alone seems to be able to accept and love her as she is – although it would be for him, of course, much more comfortable to have a healthy wife and although it would be very easy for him to project his own bad conscience on her.
"Bad conscience?" you will say. "Nobody is blaming Naruhito." In fact, we all seem to agree that he is doing his very best under very difficult circumstances. But he is an eldest child, too… I am sure that although nobody else does it, he is blaming HIMSELF. He is blaming himself for having lured her into marriage – of which he knew she was horribly afraid – by a promise to protect her. And now he is so powerless to do that... I am sure he is having a bad conscience and because of that, in his stead, 999 men out of a thousand would look for somebody to "pass it on". It would be easy for him to say: "Well, sure I promised to protect her but not under those circumstances. How can anyone protect such a loser?" But he refrains from doing that and is as good as his word, no matter what it costs him. (You probably perceive that I admire him exceedingly.)
Both of them, Naruhito as well as Masako are, in my opinion, dealing with the human experience of being powerless and vulnerable in a situation where they "should" be strong and competent. They are challenged to accept themselves as "only human" and be compassionate upon each other AND upon themselves in a situation where everybody (including themselves!) expects them to be "superhuman". We are all constantly learning life lessons but that one is decidedly "advanced level"…
So, I think if Masako would really accept what Naruhito is giving her, relax, forgive herself, see herself (like with his eyes) as wonderful and perfect and just let all the others have their opinion, she might have a real chance to recover. (And then, strong and healthy, she might even be able to change some of the system…)
But that, again, is easily said… We are all dreaming of unconditional love. But to be open to it in real life is another story. When it does come, how many of us are able to set aside all feelings of pride, of unworthiness and of "I have to do something to earn it." and simply fall to their knees, bow their head and accept it?
I'm sorry Vanessa for the ordeal you went through in life, and even without knowing the circumstances, I guarantee that you can't compare your situation to that of Masako's. Your were able to deal privately with your issues, and we would have been none the wiser if you had not informed us about them. However, Masako is being bullied on a very public stage and by an entity, the IHA, of which she has absolutely no control. They decide whether or not Masako is "well enough" to perform her royal duties which she does willingly and with a smile.
Even with my medical experience, I would never dare to pass judgement on someone who is ill except to say that no two persons ever react exactly alike when they are in the same situation especially when they are world's apart.
I've never said that Princess Masako WAS the problem. She HAS a problem , that it is very different of blaming her for the present situation. A person who has a problem is not blamable. She must be helped to go out of it as soon as possible. But people, as persons who all of us are, have their own limitations: character, temper, education, etc, etc . Any of us could be out of it. Sometimes we acts wrongly believeing we are doing the right thing. And other persons needs to come and said us what we are doing. Then, with love and understanding, we may start to go out of the problem.
I don't thing that the Crownprincess could be guilty of anything so bad that couldn't be repaired. I'd rather think there is some person behind her problems, using them to support their political and social opinions: she represents the liberal, outgoing, executive woman: the anti-tradition. So they support her against the "evil, evil, dark people" who likes tradition and Japanese culture and cosmovission. There is another party who is behind Princess Kiko, for she represents the Imperial House Tradition, the woman who wouldn't rebelles herself against the Imperial House rules...and who gave a male heir to the throne. So, there is a rivlary who is not in these two women, but in press parties and in people like me or you, who are supporters of one possition or another. We must admit it, and we wouldn't fight as bloody ennemies because these two innocent women.
I suppose you already knew it , since I'm a regular poster here, but I like Princess Kiko a lot: she is always smiling and does what she must do. When she entered to the Imperial Family she knew in what dance she was entering in. I like a lot persons that have no scandals around her. Since I was a child, smiling persons are my favorite. These loving and caring persons to whom you could go and have sweet words of consolation. I've never liked these crying, pouting persons who, inestead of giving love (which makes you happy, very happy, for the one who gives love always has love in return) are always asking for love. Adding to this, I never was a feminist. I always loved men and women walking TOGETHER and never one behind or ahead of the other. I've never liked competition among sexes, and if I consider important the self-developpement of all individual, being woman or man, I've never liked liberals and entreprise people. And much less in Royal Houses: I like writers, painters, historians, architects, musicians, teachers...I know maybe I'm wrong, but by temper, I could not like Princess Masako as well as Princess Kiko...and much less after the last one's pregnancy, when certain people wished strongly the DEATH of the little innocent boy or that his mother suffered some bad accident, only for Princess Aiko could inherite a throne. Sincerily, I'm not against women inheriting thrones, but I'm also an admirer of having some respect for other cultures, who could have their own reasons to act the way they want.
I wish with all my might that Princess Masako could change and become a worthy Empress when the moment comes. Now, I think she still needs some help to become a real Princess. When you are one, you can't do everything you wishes to...But, wait..i think that this is even for commoners. As far as I know, any of us is able to do ALL that we want. Isn't it?
Vanesa.
I don't thing that the Crownprincess could be guilty of anything so bad that couldn't be repaired. I'd rather think there is some person behind her problems, using them to support their political and social opinions: she represents the liberal, outgoing, executive woman: the anti-tradition. So they support her against the "evil, evil, dark people" who likes tradition and Japanese culture and cosmovission. There is another party who is behind Princess Kiko, for she represents the Imperial House Tradition, the woman who wouldn't rebelles herself against the Imperial House rules...and who gave a male heir to the throne. So, there is a rivlary who is not in these two women, but in press parties and in people like me or you, who are supporters of one possition or another. We must admit it, and we wouldn't fight as bloody ennemies because these two innocent women.
Vanesa.
One of the differences between Masako and Kiko is that Kiko was at university with Prince Akishino and they seemed to be an item even then, so she was adjusting while quite young to the prospect of marrying him. Masako, on the other hand, had graduated from university and had several years of experience in a job when the prospect of marrying into the royal family presented itself. It seems to be fairly well documented that it wasn't a prospect she relished, whereas the photos of Kiko and Prince Akishino together as students show two young people who were relaxed in each other's company. The transition for Masako would have been much more traumatic, especially since apparently she was being put under pressure at home. You can see with Diana that when a family is more interested in getting the daughter married off into the royal family than in thinking about what it might do to the daughter, things can turn fairly ugly.