The Royal Forums Coat of Arms

Go Back   The Royal Forums > Non-Reigning Houses > The Imperial Family of Russia

Join The Royal Forums Today
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #41  
Old 10-11-2006, 12:33 AM
Courtier
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 894
Quote:
Originally Posted by branchg
The Emperor approved the marriage of Victoria to Grand Duke Cyril and declared their daughter a princess of the imperial blood with the rank of Highness. He acted harshly at first because The Empress was furious at Victoria for divorcing her brother, Grand Duke Ernst of Hesse.
This has been discussed before. I can't find the sources now, but according to first-hand accounts Alexandra was much more sympathetic to Victoria Melita and Cyril than Nicholas.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Katya
I am not talking about Kyril's marriage to Victoria Melita, I am talking about his father's marriage to Maria Pavlovna. She was not Orthodox at the time of their marriage, thus making any offspring of hers (including Kyril) ineligible to inherit the throne. Thus from the time of his birth, no matter what he or anyone else said, was legally unable to inherit the throne of Russia.
They were listed as members of the Imperial Family and dynasts in the annual rosters, and were recognized as dynasts by the Tsar. That's all that matters. Moreover, according to the law, only the Tsar and the heir-apparent were really required to marry Orthodox brides.
__________________

__________________
  #42  
Old 10-11-2006, 01:55 AM
RubyPrincess168's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Sun Prairie, United States
Posts: 1,619
Quote:
Originally Posted by charlottestreasures
I just read "Nicholas and Alexandra" by Robert K. Massie and am now reading an abridged copy of his latest book "The Romanovs The Final Chapter".
His second book explains why GD MV is not to be considered the heir to the throne.

I can't see the Russian government ever wanting to restore the monarchy, but I'm sure they'd like to exploit them for tourism purposes.
__________________

__________________
  #43  
Old 10-11-2006, 07:48 AM
lord_rankin's Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Detroit, United States
Posts: 130
RubyPrincess, if you want to read a really good book on the Romanovs after reading Robert K Massie's book try The Last Tsar by Edvard Radinsky, it is such a well documented account of what led up to there deaths straight up until there remains were reburied. Highly recommended.
__________________
  #44  
Old 10-11-2006, 08:30 AM
Commoner
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Santa Barbara, United States
Posts: 12
RubyPrincess, I also highly recommend Radzinsky's book on Nicholas II. Another good book about Nicholas II is by Dominic Lieven. It is called "Nicholas II: Twilight of the Empire" and it provides a very unbiased view (Lieven refuses to portray NII as a 'bad ruler') of Nicholas' reign, his abilities as a ruler, and the trials he had to face.
__________________
  #45  
Old 10-11-2006, 11:32 AM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: , United States
Posts: 2,736
Quote:
Originally Posted by RubyPrincess168
His second book explains why GD MV is not to be considered the heir to the throne.
Massie doesn't take a position on the controversy, except to hint that Paul Ilinsky, as the senior line descendant of Alexander II, is actually the rightful heir if the morganatic question were ignored.

He interviews both Maria and Nicholas and accepts that she is Vladimir's heir as Head of the House.
__________________
  #46  
Old 10-11-2006, 11:41 AM
fanletizia's Avatar
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Madrid, Spain
Posts: 4,269
Hearings in Romanov rehabilitation case postponed

http://www.interfax.com/3/201745/news.aspx
__________________
  #47  
Old 10-12-2006, 12:15 PM
Salomé's Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Genève, Switzerland
Posts: 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by branchg
Putin has no interest in restoring the imperial throne unless they could totally control it and use it for their own ends. The last thing the Government wants is a more powerful Orthodox Church allied with a Tsar ruling as a symbol of state.

It's not going to happen.
I agree with you.

this is totally a joke,and this would never happen.
Knowing the reality of the Russian actual society and politics,nobody want to hear about a royal family in Russia,including the politics and the newely rich russians who control the whole country,and untill now,I do not see a power which can change that.
__________________
  #48  
Old 10-20-2006, 08:55 PM
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: -, United States
Posts: 1,021
Duchess seeks local help in restoring Russian monarchy
By Joan Greene
Thursday, May 19, 2005
Grand Duchess Maria Vladimirovna believes translating her Web site to English might help in her quest to restore the monarchy to Russia...
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_335154.html
__________________
Sii forte.
  #49  
Old 10-29-2006, 10:59 PM
Toledo's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Spain, residing in the USA, United States
Posts: 1,522
I remember reading that article some time ago, quite interesting. But I think the Grand Duchess and her son have already a helping hand since she was the one who represented Russia during the Reburial Ceremony. That's according to the interview I read in Point De Vue with Prince Michael of Greece. That explains her getting so much exposure while her cousins were sidelined. Time will tell if the pro monarchy movements gets off the ground, and maybe sooner that what we can expect.
__________________
  #50  
Old 10-31-2006, 08:06 PM
Charlottesville's Avatar
Gentry
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sulphur, United States
Posts: 66
I wouldn't support her claim if I were a Romanov. The Grand Duke Cyril placed a red badge on his arm and betrayed the emperor, and even called away the troops from the Alexander Palace. He was not "Emperor in Exile".
__________________
"My heart tells me it is she," -Olga Alexandrovna when meeting Anna Anderson who claimed to be her godchild Anastasia Nicholaevna, before she changed her mind, saying that she was a deluded imposter.
  #51  
Old 10-31-2006, 08:40 PM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: , United States
Posts: 2,736
Maria is the Head of the Imperial House and is recognized as such by the Russian Government. That's the end of that.
__________________
  #52  
Old 11-02-2006, 12:50 AM
Charlottesville's Avatar
Gentry
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sulphur, United States
Posts: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by branchg
Maria is the Head of the Imperial House and is recognized as such by the Russian Government. That's the end of that.
It dosen't really matter what the current Russian government thinks. According to the laws of succession, she is not eligible due to Grand Duke Cyril's betrayl as well as his marriage which Nicholas II did not support. That's the end of that.
__________________
"My heart tells me it is she," -Olga Alexandrovna when meeting Anna Anderson who claimed to be her godchild Anastasia Nicholaevna, before she changed her mind, saying that she was a deluded imposter.
  #53  
Old 11-02-2006, 07:22 AM
Warren's Avatar
Administrator
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 15,427
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlottesville
It dosen't really matter what the current Russian government thinks. According to the laws of succession, she is not eligible due to Grand Duke Cyril's betrayl as well as his marriage which Nicholas II did not support. That's the end of that.
We need to introduce some reality and rationality into this "debate". As Grand Duchess Maria appears to be recognised as Head of the Imperial House by those that matter (which includes the current Russian government), that's probably enough for most royal observers.

Personal opinions about alleged "betrayals", no matter how fervently or emotionally held, have no relevance whatsoever to Maria's position within the Gotha, and should not be thrown up as a smoke-screen to obscure or deny the reality.
__________________
Seeking information? Check out the extensive Royal A-Z
  #54  
Old 11-02-2006, 09:36 AM
lord_rankin's Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Detroit, United States
Posts: 130
lol I could not agree more warren!
__________________
  #55  
Old 11-02-2006, 04:38 PM
Charlottesville's Avatar
Gentry
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sulphur, United States
Posts: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren
We need to introduce some reality and rationality into this "debate". As Grand Duchess Maria appears to be recognised as Head of the Imperial House by those that matter (which includes the current Russian government), that's probably enough for most royal observers.

Personal opinions about alleged "betrayals", no matter how fervently or emotionally held, have no relevance whatsoever to Maria's position within the Gotha, and should not be thrown up as a smoke-screen to obscure or deny the reality.
But according to the actual laws, Grand Duke Cyril would never have been Tsar, and therefore there's no reason that Maria's claim should be valid. The Romanovs obviously don't recognize her.
__________________
"My heart tells me it is she," -Olga Alexandrovna when meeting Anna Anderson who claimed to be her godchild Anastasia Nicholaevna, before she changed her mind, saying that she was a deluded imposter.
  #56  
Old 11-02-2006, 05:47 PM
lord_rankin's Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Detroit, United States
Posts: 130
No offense to Charlottesville but you should look over the the preceding thread as this topic has been discussed ad nauseam.
__________________
  #57  
Old 11-02-2006, 07:02 PM
Charlottesville's Avatar
Gentry
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sulphur, United States
Posts: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by lord_rankin
RubyPrincess, if you want to read a really good book on the Romanovs after reading Robert K Massie's book try The Last Tsar by Edvard Radinsky, it is such a well documented account of what led up to there deaths straight up until there remains were reburied. Highly recommended.
And to add to the "Fate of the Romanovs" by Greg King and Penny Wilson is the most recent so it covers more.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lord_rankin
No offense to Charlottesville but you should look over the the preceding thread as this topic has been discussed ad nauseam.
No offense taken.
__________________
"My heart tells me it is she," -Olga Alexandrovna when meeting Anna Anderson who claimed to be her godchild Anastasia Nicholaevna, before she changed her mind, saying that she was a deluded imposter.
  #58  
Old 11-04-2006, 07:02 PM
Commoner
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Santa Barbara, United States
Posts: 12
I have to agree with Rankin on this issue. As much as I disagree with Maria's claim, she is recognized as heir by the Russia and other governments. I have come to the conclusion that it is a waste of time to sit around arguing about the Pauline laws and Kirill's actions after the February Revolution, because Maria is the accepted "heir" to the non-existent Russian throne.
__________________
  #59  
Old 11-05-2006, 03:32 AM
Charlottesville's Avatar
Gentry
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Sulphur, United States
Posts: 66
Well, I still disagree that just because the Russian government recognizes her as heir makes her the "rightful" heir, but that's okay. In the end, it dosen't really matter because the throne dosen't exist.
__________________
"My heart tells me it is she," -Olga Alexandrovna when meeting Anna Anderson who claimed to be her godchild Anastasia Nicholaevna, before she changed her mind, saying that she was a deluded imposter.
  #60  
Old 11-06-2006, 08:50 PM
Salomé's Avatar
Aristocracy
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Genève, Switzerland
Posts: 145
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlottesville
Well, I still disagree that just because the Russian government recognizes her as heir makes her the "rightful" heir, but that's okay. In the end, it dosen't really matter because the throne dosen't exist.
I personally agree with u Charlottesville,

Why she claims the throne? if the royal family of Russia still existed,she would not be allowed to be a part of it,as she is not a Romanov,and the Romanovs are the lonely rightful to that throne.


I don't think that the actual Russian governoment which recognizes her as a pretendent for the Russian throne is NOT an indice to the person who's the most rightful,as everybody knows,the governoment encourages only those who would serve him,and not those who would change the face of power.

Anyway,I don't think that Maria Vladimorovna or any pretendent for the russian throne would be restored,at least with the actual conditions,very improbable and hard.
__________________

__________________
Closed Thread

Tags
bagration, grand duchess maria vladimirovna, grand duke georgi, grand duke vladimir, leonida, maria vladimirovna, prince nicholas romanov, romanov claimant, russian pretender


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Grand Duchess Maria Vladimirovna: June 2008- Marengo The Imperial Family of Russia 703 11-06-2014 07:30 AM
Grand Duke Henri & Grand Duchess Maria Teresa, Current Events 5 (June 2006-Mar 2008) Danielle Current Events Archive 203 03-04-2008 12:55 AM
Grand Duchess Maria Vladimirovna: Current Claimant to the Throne 1: 2003 - Oct 2006 Danjel The Imperial Family of Russia 211 10-01-2006 04:56 AM
Grand Duke Henri & Grand Duchess Maria Teresa, Current Events 4 (February-June 2006) Alexandria Current Events Archive 196 06-04-2006 02:14 AM




Popular Tags
belgium brussels carl philip charlene chris o'neill crown prince frederik crown prince haakon crown princess mary crown princess mette-marit crown princess victoria current events engagement fashion genealogy germany grand duke henri hohenzollern infanta sofia jewellery jordan king carl xvi gustav king felipe king felipe vi king harald king juan carlos king philippe king willem-alexander letizia luxembourg nobility official visit olympics ottoman pieter van vollenhoven poland president hollande president komorowski prince albert prince albert ii prince carl philip prince daniel prince floris prince pieter-christiaan princess aimee princess alexia (2005 -) princess anita princess beatrix princess charlene princess laurentien princess madeleine princess margriet princess marilene princess mary princess mary fashion queen letizia queen mathilde queen maxima queen rania queen silvia queen sofia royal royal fashion russia sofia hellqvist spain state visit sweden the hague wedding winter olympics 2014



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:48 PM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2014
Jelsoft Enterprises

Royal News Delivered to your Email!

You can get the latest Royal News right in your inbox.

unsusbcribe at anytime with one click

Close [X]