The Royal Forums Coat of Arms

Go Back   The Royal Forums > Non-Reigning Houses > The Royal Family of Romania

Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #81  
Old 06-29-2016, 08:52 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,061
When we speak about a non-reigning House we respect the rules that House had before the end of the Monarchy.
The King ask for a title for his son in.law knowing he could not give one himself. The "titles" given in 2007 have nothing to do with the Constitutions of the Romanian Kingdom.
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #82  
Old 06-29-2016, 09:06 AM
MAfan's Avatar
Super Moderator
Royal Blogger
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: N/A, Italy
Posts: 5,536
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory View Post
All the wifes (speaking not about morganatic marriages) of Romanian Kings were Queens and all the wifes if the Romanian Princes were Princesses.
Nobody else received any title because the King did not have such a right in the Constitutions of 1866 and 1947.
So, are you saying that nobody has ever created a specific title in 1926 ("Principesă mamă") for the wife of the then Carol Caraiman, nor in 1940 ("Regina mamă") for the former wife of an ex-King?
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
  #83  
Old 06-29-2016, 10:25 AM
LadyRohan's Avatar
Nobility
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sweden, Slovenia
Posts: 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory View Post
When we speak about a non-reigning House we respect the rules that House had before the end of the Monarchy.
The King ask for a title for his son in.law knowing he could not give one himself. The "titles" given in 2007 have nothing to do with the Constitutions of the Romanian Kingdom.
You are being too inconstitent on this issue for it to carry relevance, and it's just a way of twisting facts to fit your argument against one person.
Your stance du jour is contrary to the very concept of monarchy, that has rules and systems in place that go beyond that of one individual, and over-arching rules that work for a longer time and a far greater span than that of one person.
It is the purview of the sovereign to bestow titles. As long as the King was a subsidiary Prince of Hohenzollern, he chose to go through that process with regards to the titles of his son-in-law, but as that process clearly showed, this was both antiquated and not the way to run a sovereign Royal House any longer.
A Prince of Romania does not need a subsidiary princely title from a distant house in another land to be royal, regal or legal. What he needs, is the sovereigns permission, to marry, entitle etc., and the King made a perfectly logical choice, that you yourself applauded on this forum, before you decided that Prince Radu was persona non grata, and that he should be reduced into irrelevance, alongside his wife, whom he has clearly made very happy through a long marriage.

The King chose to declare the Royal House of, from and for Romania when he removed subsidiary titles, just as the Swedish King did, when he ascended and dropped the old suffix 'Swedes, Gothes and Vendes King', just as the Duke of Edinburgh ceased to be a Prince of Greece and Denmark when he married Princess Elizabeth, etc. etc.
That was his sovereign choice, and it has no practical implications at all, other than to make clear where the allegiance and belonging of the family lies, with Romania.

A choice you agreed with. In writing, on these forums.
So maybe we can move on, and let this circular debate end?
__________________
"He who has never failed to reach perfection, has a right to be the harshest critic" - Queen Elizabeth II
Reply With Quote
  #84  
Old 06-29-2016, 11:38 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,061
The very concept of Monarchy is to obey rules and the only rules for the Royal House of Romania are those existent in 1947.
Reply With Quote
  #85  
Old 06-29-2016, 12:37 PM
LadyRohan's Avatar
Nobility
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sweden, Slovenia
Posts: 395
Show a source of these rules you claim to be in existence, and the discussion is over. Otherwise, the whole constructed point is null and void.
__________________
"He who has never failed to reach perfection, has a right to be the harshest critic" - Queen Elizabeth II
Reply With Quote
  #86  
Old 06-29-2016, 05:15 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,061
TheC onstitution of 1923 could be read online for those that still do not know of its existence .
Reply With Quote
  #87  
Old 06-30-2016, 02:43 AM
LadyRohan's Avatar
Nobility
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sweden, Slovenia
Posts: 395
As stated earlier in this very thread, the constitution of 1923 does not refuse the King the right to grant titles. If something isn't illegal, it is legal.
__________________
"He who has never failed to reach perfection, has a right to be the harshest critic" - Queen Elizabeth II
Reply With Quote
  #88  
Old 06-30-2016, 06:48 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,061
The rights of the Romanian Kings were very clearly stated in the Constitution of 1923 and there were no others. The right to give titles did simply not exist. It was like in Norway.
Reply With Quote
  #89  
Old 06-30-2016, 11:03 AM
LadyRohan's Avatar
Nobility
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sweden, Slovenia
Posts: 395
No idea what you are referring to, as article 34 of the Norwegian constitution places the power of giving out royal titles with the King. Interestingly, in Norway, article 4 states that the King has to be an evangelical-lutheran, even though there is no official church or state religion in Norway anymore. That provisal was insisted kept by the King when the constitution changed, so what part of the Norwegian constitution do you actually claim support for your views?

In a democracy, unless something is unlawful, it is lawful, and throughout Romanian history of monarchy, titles have been granted to heirs and spouses of the sovereigns children, and at no point have titles been the subject of external approval.
__________________
"He who has never failed to reach perfection, has a right to be the harshest critic" - Queen Elizabeth II
Reply With Quote
  #90  
Old 06-30-2016, 11:49 AM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,061
Nobody that was not born as Prince or Princess got any title in Romania before 1947. To say that if it's not explicitly forbidden is accepted has nothing to do with the constitutional tradition of Romania. The King had only the rights mentioned in the Constitution snd no others. Any marriage to a commoner brought the loss of dynastic rights and no titles were given to commoners.
Reply With Quote
  #91  
Old 06-30-2016, 03:06 PM
LadyRohan's Avatar
Nobility
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sweden, Slovenia
Posts: 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory View Post
Paul's half-brother has never called himself "of Romania" but "Hohenzollern".
The romanian Royal Family has anyhow no link with Zizi Lambrino's grandchildren.
Today decision will be surely much applauded by the Romanians.

This important decree was signed by the King today at 10.30 a.m. in the presence of a part of the members of the Romanian Royal Family, some legal advisers and counselors of the Sovereign.

The main Romanian newspapers announce with joy the hystoric decision of the King:

http://www.cotidianul.ro/145216-Rege...e-Hohenzollern
When the titles were changed, you supported the decision, stating it was in keeping with the wishes of King Ferdinand.
Duc_et_Pair explained how it was the exact same steps as the King of the Belgians had taken, when removing certain titles, and the Grand-Duke of Luxembourg, when doing the same.
You further raised the point that the King of the United Kingdom did the same after World War I, to ensure that the loyalty of the monarchy was firmly enshrined with the British.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory View Post
The lawer of the Royal House explains the decision is formal and has nothing to do with the Succession to the Throne , explaining the decree underlines the members of the Royal Family are Romanians and have nothing to do with a Principality dissapeared in the XIXth century:

Motivul pentru care Casa Regala a Romaniei a rupt legatura cu Hohenzollern www.stirileprotv.ro
Following the decision of the King to sever the links with the Hohenzollern family, you stated that the Royal Family, as you called them then, were Romanians who had nothing to do with a Principality that had disappeared a century ago.

Now you trash them, call them the King's Family, ordinary people without relevance and deserters of the cause of monarchy, while elevating the Princely family you said had disappeared, and that have shown no interest at all in the monarchy of Romania returning, and the line of succession they had a place in, being restored.

If the Royal Family are now such ordinary people without relevance, leave them alone and go hunt for a Hohenzollern willing to move to Romania.

If you can't find one, maybe then we can move on to the only relevant and possible way of returning the monarchy in Romania, the one through the actual Royal Family, that you clearly used to support yourself.
__________________
"He who has never failed to reach perfection, has a right to be the harshest critic" - Queen Elizabeth II
Reply With Quote
  #92  
Old 06-30-2016, 03:15 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,061
Everybody understands now what had happened in the ladt 15 years and the real reasons for everything.
Reply With Quote
  #93  
Old 06-30-2016, 04:01 PM
LadyRohan's Avatar
Nobility
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sweden, Slovenia
Posts: 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory View Post
Only the Head of the Romanian Royal Family can confer titles to the members of it.The Fundamental Laws of the Royal Family will registrate this change and any reference to the Hohenzollern surname will dissapear.

Familia Regala - Activitati curente
Meeting yourself in the door a little, perhaps?
__________________
"He who has never failed to reach perfection, has a right to be the harshest critic" - Queen Elizabeth II
Reply With Quote
  #94  
Old 06-30-2016, 04:17 PM
Benjamin's Avatar
Royal Highness
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: San Francisco, United States
Posts: 1,515
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory View Post
Princess Margareta was born as a Princess of Hohenzollern and at the beginning I suppose even her official surname was like this.
The decision could be linked to the importance of being Romanians because even today some argue the daughters of the King are not Romanians. The truth is that only Princess Margareta speaks a quite good Romanian.
Also, nice to see your confirmation that Crown Princess Margarita *does* in fact speak Romanian well, despite your recent assertions to the contrary.
__________________
Sii forte.
Reply With Quote
  #95  
Old 06-30-2016, 05:55 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,061
Obviously you do not know too much Romanian if you expect me to tell you how good she speaks the language. She certainly speaks a good Romanian if compared to her sisters and nephews and nieces.
Reply With Quote
  #96  
Old 06-30-2016, 07:46 PM
LadyRohan's Avatar
Nobility
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sweden, Slovenia
Posts: 395
No, I don't think anyone would expect you to state how well Margareta speaks Romanian. That would be asking you to say something supportive or non-derogatory, and it's been a few years since that last happened.

The Crown Princess' Romanian is fine, and is not a factor in the restoration process, the severing of links with the Hohenzollerns and so on.
__________________
"He who has never failed to reach perfection, has a right to be the harshest critic" - Queen Elizabeth II
Reply With Quote
  #97  
Old 06-30-2016, 07:49 PM
LadyRohan's Avatar
Nobility
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Sweden, Slovenia
Posts: 395
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cory View Post
Everybody understands now what had happened in the ladt 15 years and the real reasons for everything.
Who is 'everybody'?
Were you and these 'everybody' fooled when you supported the King and his choices a few years ago?
Who tricked you, and how?

What are these 'real reasons for everything'?
__________________
"He who has never failed to reach perfection, has a right to be the harshest critic" - Queen Elizabeth II
Reply With Quote
  #98  
Old 06-30-2016, 08:33 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,061
Only a Romanian could state how good is The Romanian spoken by the Princess.
Now it us obvious there was a strategy in different steps to arrive at what's going on now. It was important to try to avoid the House of Hohenzollern to be envolved in Romanian issues so that's why the Family severed the relationship with the Hohenzollern.
Reply With Quote
  #99  
Old 06-30-2016, 09:09 PM
Cris M's Avatar
Courtier
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Niterķi, Brazil
Posts: 847
A conspiracy theory now?
__________________
“If a thousand thrones I had, I would give a thousand thrones to get the slaves free in Brazil."

Princess Isabel (1846-1921), Princess Imperial and Regent of the Empire of Brazil, after she signed the Golden Law, in 1888, abolishing slavery in Brazil.
Reply With Quote
  #100  
Old 06-30-2016, 09:12 PM
Heir Apparent
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Kingdom, Heard and McDonald Islands
Posts: 4,061
Not at all. Just a strategy.
__________________

Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Children of King Abdullah & Queen Rania: Part 2 - February 2011 - July 2013 dazzling King Abdullah and Queen Rania and Family 285 07-02-2013 05:02 AM
King Juan Carlos and Queen Sofia's Visit to St Petersburg: February 24-25, 2011 lula King Juan Carlos and Queen Sofia 13 01-04-2013 02:23 AM
King Abdullah and Queen Rania Current Events 33: January 27, 2011 - August 2012 dazzling Current Events Archive 408 09-02-2012 01:28 PM
King Juan Carlos and Queen Sofia, Current Events Part 20: March 2010 - May 2011 Her_Majesty Current Events Archive 493 05-04-2011 03:48 AM
Royal House of Denmark: Official and Unofficial Links GlitteringTiaras Royal House of Denmark 3 10-04-2010 10:51 AM




Popular Tags
ascot 2016 best gown best gown september 2016 best hat best outfit catherine middleton style coup d'etat crown prince haakon crown princess mary crown princess mary fashion crown princess mette-marit current events diana duchess of cambridge duchess of cornwall daytime fashion dutch state visit e-mail fashion poll grand duke jean greece kate middleton king abdullah ii king felipe king felipe vi king willem-alexander member introduction monarchy new zealand nobel gala norway november 2016 october 2016 opening of parliament picture of the week prince bernhard prince charles princess marie princess mary princess mary daytime fashion princess mary fashion princess mary hats princess victoria 39th birthday princess victoria hats queen letizia queen letizia casual outfits queen letizia daytime fashion queen letizia fashion queen letizia style queen mathilde queen mathildes outfits queen mathildes style queen maxima queen maxima casual wear queen maxima daytime fashion queen maxima fashion queen maxima hats queen maxima style queen rania royal fashion september 2016 state visit state visit to denmark stewart succession sweden the duchess of cambridge the duchess of cambridge casual wear the duchess of cambridge daytime fashion the duchess of cambridge fashion the duchess of cambridge hats


Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 01:27 AM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2016
Jelsoft Enterprises