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  #221  
Old 03-31-2016, 10:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
Ekstra Bladet has an article about the expenditure of the DRF in 2015, which they naturally manage to twist in a negative angle.


With all expenses paid there was a deficit of 4.2 million DKK.
The Crown Prince couple's court was on the + side. Did EB manage to twist that into something negative too?
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  #222  
Old 03-31-2016, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Nordic View Post
The Crown Prince couple's court was on the + side. Did EB manage to twist that into something negative too?
Give them time, give them time.
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  #223  
Old 04-01-2016, 08:47 AM
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Dankortet gløder i luksusvillaen: Nye tal afslører Joachims rekordhøje privatforbrug

BT has an article about Joachim's vat refund.
As you know the members of the DRF are exempt from taxation and when paying vat for goods or services, the vat can be refunded.
Joachim's refunds were for 2015 three times higher than the year before, after moving in at their new home.
That has already been covered elsewhere in this thread.

Here is the interesting bit. The DRF members can only get a refund of up to 25 % of their total apanage. - That IMO is a very sound precaution.
Anyway, Joachim has for 2015 been given the highest possible refund, i.e. 25 % of an apanage of 3.411.486 DKK, which amounts to 852.872 DKK.

BT has been in contact with Søren Kruse who is the one in charge of the finances within the DRF: "It costs to move into a new property and that's what the Prince has used his money on. When the Prince is having the house painted, buys new furnitures, security-equipment and so on, that vat-refundable. That is well within his rights".

But the maximum amount refundable?
"I don't think it has happened before (*). There is nothing odd in that, the Prince doesn't do it every year. If you yourself move into a villa, you will have more expenses, but that you don't do every year".

(*) Actually Alexandra after the divorce from Joachim, while she was still a princess, also used her vat exemption to the fullest at least once. I clearly remember that article and I might be able to dig it up.
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  #224  
Old 04-01-2016, 12:49 PM
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thanks Muhler
makes sense when you make a move, your expenses go up.
now, if this happens every year then EB has a story lol
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  #225  
Old 04-01-2016, 02:48 PM
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Daily Mail has had a look at the figures as well, mostly for M&F it seems:
Crown Princess Mary scrapes in under her royal budget for 2015 | Daily Mail Online

I'll leave commenting for someone else.
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  #226  
Old 04-01-2016, 03:11 PM
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So they were under budget this year but of course they focus on the two years (out of 11) they were over.
Nice pictures though
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  #227  
Old 05-30-2016, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
With eight royal grandchildren, “simple mathematics” will require a rethinking of who qualifies for an annual salary financed by Danish taxpayers, politicians said over the weekend.

There is uniform agreement that Crown Prince Frederik’s son, Prince Christian, should receive the annual apanage as an heir to the throne. But future funding for Christian’s three younger siblings and the four children of Prince Joachim appears less certain.

“Simple mathematics dictate that there needs to be some sort of limit. Otherwise within a few generations there will be several hundred princes and princesses who need an annual salary. Anyone can see that that won’t fly,” Jakob Elleman-Jensen, a spokesman for ruling party Venstre, told Politiken.
Read more: Denmark ready to cut off money to royal grandkids - The Local
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  #228  
Old 05-30-2016, 03:10 PM
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Yes Rudolph,

A huge debate is running in Denmark these days - including both the Danes and politicians - should Prince Joachim and family continue to receive annual salary/apanage?

Now that Prince Nikolaj turns 18 years next year the debate is back up running.

Should Prince Joachim children receive salary/apanage?

Over 70% of the Danes means 'No'. And many politicians likewise.

And which members of the DRF shall actually receive a annual salary/apanage?

**

I understand the debate. I must admit I don't think there's enough reason to that Prince Joachim, Princess Marie and their children receive apanage. After the stunt with Schackenborg Manor they have a huge personal fortune. Maybe bigger than the Regent couple and the Crown Prince couple. Their workload is minimal! I'm actually surprised at how little they are working... The reason they would leave Schackenborg Manor and move to Copenhagen was to better reconciliation the family life with their work life. That has not happened. Never has Joachim and Marie had as light a workload as the last 2 years. Rarely have Marie more than 1-2 duties per month (in addition to the gala evenings and things like that.) They are not visible for the Danes and that is IMO one of the reasons why so large a majority of the Danes no longer think that part of the Danish royal family should have annual salary/apanage. In addition, there are several reasons too. Denmark is still in a economic crisis. Why should some have a life of luxury without doing much?

Having glimpsed a lot of Facebook comments, polls and my own generale feeling is the generale Dane's point of view is (and other Danish members are welcome to give their opinion):

Only Queen Margrethe, Crown Prince Frederik, Crown Princess Mary and their children shall receive annual salary/apanage. In short: The reigning Regent and the Heir-to-the-throne couple and their children. Or the oldest one, Prince Christian. As he also is heir to the throne.


The comment with most likes sound like this:

Only the queen, and the crown prince couple and their children should get full apanage. They're also the only ones in the royal family who actually work hard. Take away the apanage from prince Joachim and famliy. They are still wealthy after their sales of Schackenborg Manor. And not popular. Perhaps the Danish point of view had been different if Joachim and Marie had worked just a little hard for Denmark. Their effort is embarrassing minimal!! Let the queen and the crown prince couple get full salary. The reigning regent and the heir to the throne couple.

ADDED:
Also Princess Benedikte and (Count Ingolf?) receives salary. The debate does not seem to include much about them however. Prince Henrik apanage (after his retirement) is also often debated. Many no longer means he should receive annual salary. Others means he should be rewarded for the work he has done for Denmark for many years.
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  #229  
Old 05-30-2016, 04:04 PM
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I think once you start unpicking it your going to end up with the Sovereign and the Heir as the only ones receiving an official allowance.

I had't realised that Nicolai could start receiving an allowance once he turns 18. I guess this means some big decisions for the RF as whether he does start receiving an allowance or not will set a precedence for the other children of Joachim and possibly even the younger children of F&M.

If they do want him to receive an allowance maybe the best way would be for Alexandra to give up a proportion of her allowance and give it to Nicolai instead.
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  #230  
Old 05-30-2016, 04:40 PM
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In many monarchies only the present King, the future King and eventually the King who has abdicated the kingship receive an apanage. In most monarchies this is one amount per "function", so also the spouses included. In the Netherlands the apanages to the spouses are separated from that to the King or Heir, giving them independence. But that an ex-spouse to a junior prince receives an annual apanage is quite generous from the Danish taxpayers indeed.
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  #231  
Old 05-30-2016, 05:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
In many monarchies only the present King, the future King and eventually the King who has abdicated the kingship receive an apanage. In most monarchies this is one amount per "function", so also the spouses included. In the Netherlands the apanages to the spouses are separated from that to the King or Heir, giving them independence. But that an ex-spouse to a junior prince receives an annual apanage is quite generous from the Danish taxpayers indeed.
And so it also is in Denmark. Only the Monarch and Heir gets appanage. The reason Joachim gets appanage, is because the politician in 1995 decided that he(and Alexandra) also should be on civil list, because they also did work for the Royal House and Denmark. But traditionally its only the Monarch and Heir. Isabella, Vincent and Josephine will not get appanage.
The discussion in the media is just usual hysteric pseudo debate created by history blank media and politicians. The government party's political spokesperson said it quite clearly and calmly a few days ago, only the Monarch and Heir gets appanage, until the politicians by law decides to otherwise. But that was quickly(deliberately) ignored, because what should we then write about, that gives click bait and massive brainless discussions like Roskildes stupid facebook quote.

Anyway, now the Royal House has come out with a comment on the debate:
- It is not expected and it has never been that other than Prince Christian for his time must have appanage, she says Lene Balleby.
Kongehuset om apanagen: Vi forventer kun årpenge til prins Christian | Nyheder | DR
Now that should put everything to rest!:-)
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  #232  
Old 05-30-2016, 06:16 PM
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Maybe they will get around it by giving the grand children some sort of allowance out off the Queen's apanage, in the same way Henrik gets some share of the money for himself.

Interesting, I wonder why there was such a desire to give Joachim and Alexandra an appanage? Doesn't Count Ingolf also receive an allowance?
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  #233  
Old 05-30-2016, 06:41 PM
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Kongehuset om apanagen: Vi forventer kun årpenge til prins Christian | Nyheder | DR

The Royal House now steps in the debate. A bit unusual. But perhaps because of how big the debate has been and to end the dicussion.

- It is not expected, and it has never been, that other than Prince Christian for his time must have apanage, says Lene Balleby.

- It is the practice that only the heirs to the throne, their spouses and widowed queens get apanage.


**

Then it of course lead people to ask why Joachim gets apanage?
If it is only expected that Prince Christian, as heir to the throne, gets apanage.
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  #234  
Old 05-30-2016, 07:03 PM
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agree.
If Joachim gets an appanage, why not Isabella when of age. She would be in the same position as Joachim. (parent monarch and brother heir)

Def. Joachim's children should not. Besides them being "only" grandchildren, and then nephews/niece of the monarch. Joachim can more then provide for them with his sweet financial deal from the sale of his manor.
I think Joachim got one because at the time, him and Alexandra were a working couple representing the royal family. But things have changed.

and again. Alexandra once Felix turns 18 should not.
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  #235  
Old 05-30-2016, 07:43 PM
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Yes, I believe Alexandra was very popular during her marriage to Joachim, and continued to be so at their divorce.

What if, God forbid, Queen Margrethe dies in the next ten years though. Henrik is hardly likely to be active, and Joachim and Marie are off the list as far as royal duties go, with Royal duties tied to apanage? Are Christian, scarcely out of his teens and Isabella in her teens, to take over full time royal duties in those circumstances, in order to assist their parents? Seems hardly fair.

Yet, until Christian has at least completed university and some form of military service, there has to be some kind of forward planning. Would the Crown Prince couple be able to perform all duties on their own as King and Queen? What if they are out of the country and Christian is still under age? It's not just a question of money and appanage, is it?
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  #236  
Old 05-30-2016, 08:09 PM
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of course. Joachim and Marie hopefully would pick up more of the workload once Frederik is king and if Christian and siblings are still under age or barely in University.
I dont think his "salary" will be cut anytime soon.
But his kids (especially Nikolai and Felix who are older than Christian) should not expect to receive an appanage.

I guess we have to wait how things look 10-15 years from now, But maybe Isabella, being in the same position as Joachim, should receive one.

with Joachim's manor sale (lots of money and still being able to use the place when he wants), and his ex-wife still getting money, i think it just adds to the debate (it looks clearly the Joachim and family have gotten the better deal, for now)
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  #237  
Old 05-31-2016, 10:24 AM
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Denmark to stop paying salary to royal family grandchildren | Europe | News | The Independent

IMO the monarch & heir should get an apanage, nobody else. The rest either has to make their own living (not too difficult given the vast possibilities of connections) or is paid for each event they do, in case they are interested in royal life & duties.
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  #238  
Old 05-31-2016, 11:41 AM
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To me Princess Benedikte and her family are the precedent for how things will play out with non-heirs. The situation with Joachim seems like a one-off.
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  #239  
Old 05-31-2016, 03:49 PM
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Two more articles about this
Danske prinser og prinsesser kan miste statsstøtten - Politik
Politikere vil bremse royal pengestrøm til børneflokken - Politiken.dk

I do not think apanages will be given to Prince Joachim's children. But it might be that all 4 of Frederik's kids will. After-all, when Frederik is king, Christian crown prince, we can expect Isabella and the twins to help out somewhat.
Isabella, more than the twins, will be in the same position as Joachim.

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  #240  
Old 06-01-2016, 09:03 AM
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Danish royals: Only Prince Christian should get money - The Local
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