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  #721  
Old 04-10-2012, 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
She could give exactly the same honour she gave Andrew for his service in The Falklands campaign. He too was admired for his war service. He didn't receive any more acknowledgement than given to the rest of those who served.

What you are suggesting is that she should honour her grandson for serving his country with a greater honour than she gave her own son for the same reason - serving his country in a war.

Sorry but that is just saying that The Queen should honour her grandson more than her own son - but with no reason for doing so.
But that's entirely different. The Falklands was a bloody but short campaign; Afghanistan is 11 years and counting and is very much at the forefront of the British public's consciousness. Giving her grandson an honour for heading to an incredibly dangerous war not once but twice, makes complete sense. It's also, by extension, a reflection of HM's gratitude to all those who have served over the last decade in a war that's really taken an enormous toll on the British Army in particular. She can't give awards to the many thousands of British service personnel who have served as it's just not practical, but she can give this very personal award to her grandson.

There's also the fact that the Queen's very, very unlikely to live to see Prince Harry hit his 40s, if she's going to give him the ultimate recognition she can, she's going to have to do it sooner rather than later. 30 years ago the Queen knew she'd in all likelihood live long enough to give Andrew the honour when he was older, that's not the case here. I firmly believe that the Queen would want to honour Harry herself, rather than leave it to Charles when she's gone.

I hope Andrew would be big enough to understand that.
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  #722  
Old 04-10-2012, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Artemisia View Post

I believe the Queen will eventually create Camilla Royal Lady of the Order of the Garter purely because that would be the clearest and final indication of "acceptance". And for various reasons, it is quite important for Camilla's future role alongside her husband. As for Prince Harry, it seems unlikely he'll be made Royal Knight of the Order of Garter until Prince Charles is King.
I would like to see Camilla being appointed to the Garter within the Queen's reign, ideally in 2-3 years from now (10th anniversary present?). I agree with a number of posters, this would certainly help cement Camilla's position as future Queen.

As regards Harry, a lot depends on how he conducts his life over the next few years. That said, I think he will have to wait another 7-8 years at least, which would well mean that he is appointed by Charles.
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  #723  
Old 04-10-2012, 03:13 PM
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The Order of the Garter is limited to 24 members, and there are two vacant spots. Wonder who HM will appoint, if anyone. William was the most recent appointee.
  #724  
Old 04-10-2012, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EIIR

....

There's also the fact that the Queen's very, very unlikely to live to see Prince Harry hit his 40s, if she's going to give him the ultimate recognition she can, she's going to have to do it sooner rather than later. 30 years ago the Queen knew she'd in all likelihood live long enough to give Andrew the honour when he was older, that's not the case here. I firmly believe that the Queen would want to honour Harry herself, rather than leave it to Charles when she's gone.

I hope Andrew would be big enough to understand that.
I completely agree. The older the queen gets the more she recognizes her own mortality and there are certain things she just would like to do the honors herself And I think Harry is one of them...I do think in the case of Harry and Camilla... She would have discussed with Charles. The same concept applies to The Family Order. I expect Kate to have one in the next year maybe this year with the jubilee... Which may be a little sooner than others ( altho Diana did get it pretty early on). But HM wants to recognize her. And I always love the Royal Family orders when they have more than 1. QEQM had 3, right?
  #725  
Old 04-10-2012, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by KittyAtlanta View Post
The Order of the Garter is limited to 24 members, and there are two vacant spots. Wonder who HM will appoint, if anyone. William was the most recent appointee.
The 24 members are outside any royal or foreign knights. Not sure who she would appoint. Traditionally former PMs get the KG at some point but maybe Blair and Brown havent been out of office long enough, or perhaps they would prefer not to receive it. Ted Heath was long out of office before he accepted it.

Again we are getting a bit off topic since furure appointments dont really involve Camillas current events.
  #726  
Old 04-10-2012, 03:55 PM
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I think it would be absolutely wonderful if the Duchess of Cornwall received the Order of the Garter during the present reign. Indeed, it would show the Family's ultimate acceptance of her, and maybe even squash some of the nastiness from the public (I highly doubt the latter, but one can hope that people will grow up and get over what happened couple of decades ago). Perhaps, like some have hinted, this honor could be bestowed on the 10th anniversary of Camila's marriage to the Prince of Wales.
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  #727  
Old 04-10-2012, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KittyAtlanta
The Order of the Garter is limited to 24 members, and there are two vacant spots. Wonder who HM will appoint, if anyone. William was the most recent appointee.
Could the duchess of Cambridge be a future candidate?
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  #728  
Old 04-10-2012, 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Grandduchess24 View Post
Could the duchess of Cambridge be a future candidate?
In the far far far future, not the year after her wedding.
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  #729  
Old 04-10-2012, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by MichelleQ2 View Post
I completely agree. The older the queen gets the more she recognizes her own mortality and there are certain things she just would like to do the honors herself And I think Harry is one of them...I do think in the case of Harry and Camilla... She would have discussed with Charles. The same concept applies to The Family Order. I expect Kate to have one in the next year maybe this year with the jubilee... Which may be a little sooner than others ( altho Diana did get it pretty early on). But HM wants to recognize her. And I always love the Royal Family orders when they have more than 1. QEQM had 3, right?
Absolutely. I'm sure the Queen would like to give Kate the Royal Family Order, meaning it would be very likely that Kate would wear 3 family orders in the future also.

I think as the Queen gets older she's likely to get less and less bogged down in the way things used to be done. I could see her breaking with precedent / tradition more often.

I fully expect Tony Blair () to be given the Garter over the next few years given the length of time he was PM, and maybe even John Howard (I know he got the OM, but the Garter's just that bit more special).
  #730  
Old 04-10-2012, 06:42 PM
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This thread is about Camilla's honor. HM may leave further appointments for Charles to make.
  #731  
Old 04-10-2012, 11:01 PM
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Quote:
factoid I came across: Diamonds were only 'discovered' in something like 1710 or something. Totally new idea to me.
The first recorded history of diamonds dates back some 3,000+ years to India. They were greatly valued and sought after for their ability to refract light.

In Europe, it was the middle ages that saw the popularity of diamonds increase, namely because many large stones were discovered around this time.
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  #732  
Old 04-10-2012, 11:47 PM
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Let's get back on topic...Camilla's Current Events.
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  #733  
Old 04-10-2012, 11:59 PM
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An entirely sensible and admirabe system of selection! Certainly in my mind it would all but diminish the prestige of such honours otherwise.
Oh, I don't think so . . . William only had to be born to get the Garter as there is no way whatsoever, anyone can say he has done anything to "earn" it.

If earning it were the criteria then Harry would have it long before Willam.

I would love to see Camilla with it but, I will settle for the RVO. It is pretty spectacular in and of itself.
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  #734  
Old 04-11-2012, 12:24 AM
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When looking over the span of her reign, the Queen has not been frivolously generous with the bestowment of orders, and neither should she have been. It is that, to which I referred.

There are undoubtedly those who will be accorded the honour purely by being who they are; a prospective monarch in my opinion is an entirely acceptable reason for that indavidual to be made a Knight of the Order.

And let us have some perspective on the matter. William is but one of two people who were elevated to the honour for being the who they are during the Queen's reign. Charles was himself but a teenager when he was created a Knight.

Anyone would be had pressed to indentify any other persons who have been created a Knight/Lady for any reasons besides their committed and lifelong services to society (whatever the respective capacity).

Camilla will undoubtedly be created Lady of the Order, at an appropriate time. A time that I believe will be when her husband is King.
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  #735  
Old 04-11-2012, 12:30 AM
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Charles was automatically a KG as Prince of Wales, there was no need to create him one he simply needed to be formally invested in the order.

Membership in the Order is strictly limited and includes the monarch, the Prince of Wales, not more than 24 companion members, and various supernumerary members. The monarch alone can grant membership.[11] He or she is known as the Sovereign of the Garter, and the Prince of Wales is known as a Knight Companion of the Garter.
  #736  
Old 04-11-2012, 12:51 AM
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If not even bestowed but automatically granted, as opposed to 'earned'. Good heavens, what should some have to say about that!

Im in no doubt that the only ones thinking of Garters and Thistles, are us. I can't imagine the Duchess lending any thought to it.
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  #737  
Old 04-11-2012, 08:02 AM
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I know this is a thread about Camilla so I'll try not to wander off topic too much. I agree with you in regard to service medals and the like, I always think even though I hugely respect Princess Anne seeing her in full military uniform with a haul of medals is a bit disrespectful to service men and women (though I'm not 100% sure what each medal she has means and I'm sure each Royal has to earn them).
I tried to explain that in another thread, but am happy to discuss it here as well: when The Princess Royal or another Royal wears the medals or badges of certain regiments or becomes a honorary commander of this regiment it is not to honour the Royal person, but to honour the regiment.

The idea at the base of the monarchy is that the souverain and her or his blood family carry the Blood Royal and thus connect the present with the past on the highest possible level. They represent Britain through their blood which they share with close to all previous monarchs. That's part of the magic of a heirediary monarchy. All other things like titles, orders, Coat of Arms etc. are just symbols for this connection of the past with the present of the country. When a male carrier of the Blood Royal marries, his wife shares in his position and represents as well the country. When a princess of the Blood Royal has a child, this child is added to the line of succession because of the child's Blood Royal. Even if he or she does not have a title, just a right to the throne in case those with a superior right die unfortunately.

So on appointing a member of the Royal family to an honorary post of a regiment, Her Majesty decides that this regiment has been rewarded with a direct recognition by the monarchy. So The Princess Royal on wearing her uniform and her medals does so to show the Royal support for the servicemen and -women. Not for her pleasure but to honour them.
The same with Camilla.

OTOH when Camilla is granted the highest class of the Royal Victorian order, this is to show Her Majesty's gratitude for the support she received from Camilla and as a sign of her utmost trust. And let's face it: when it comes to private support, a family-link is most often stronger than a link to a stranger, thus a family member of HM is able to show support on a base that makes it understandible why HM shows her gratitude to so many family members, but not so many strangers.

I personally didn't like the article in the Daily Mail claiming that Camilla received the Grand Cross only because Charles insisted and the queen felt she had to recognize the future queen on her son's side. I have no idea how HM really feels about it but even if that was the reason behind this honour, it is a legitimate reason IMHO.
  #738  
Old 04-11-2012, 09:19 PM
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I just read that article myself, Kataryn, and have to say that it does have a somewhat jaundiced view of this honor. But, consider the source:

Frantic pleas by Charles, an honour from Her Majesty and a question... Is 'Dame' Camilla now a step closer to becoming Queen? | Mail Online
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  #739  
Old 04-11-2012, 10:53 PM
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Typical DM story. One week praise for the Duchess, next week try and knock her down and if possible stir up the Dianiacs.
  #740  
Old 04-12-2012, 12:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Baroness of Books View Post
I just read that article myself, Kataryn, and have to say that it does have a somewhat jaundiced view of this honor. But, consider the source:

Frantic pleas by Charles, an honour from Her Majesty and a question... Is 'Dame' Camilla now a step closer to becoming Queen? | Mail Online
Not a very nice article - they demeaned her by ridiculing what she does like any other royal.

And I was startled by this: "You can't say she isn’t trying (though her progress into the nation’s affections has been hampered by an incapacity to stand the strain of foreign tours)." What? Given my most recent observation on another thread I felt guilty - have I been party to feeding such an idea? Do DM people read TRF? Sudden feeling of culpability. Why would the DM claim Camilla is not bearing up to foreign tours?

Also, what is all that business about the Order of Precedence? It's unclear what is being suggested. What happened? Is all the stuff they are saying about this accurate?
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