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  #241  
Old 04-28-2012, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by ricarda View Post
Scorpio and Aquarius? Something tells me this marriage will be a turbulent one.
Depends on Rising Signs, too. Wonder where her Scorpio is in her chart. For sure it is a passionate union for him - she will be the one to 'present' 'airily'. If there are others into astrology this would be an interesting thread.

By the way, can you imagine how unsettling it is to have all those cameras facing you? Walking down those steps - did she realize how tall the steps were and that she would gallumph down them? She may have been surprised, too. I sense enormous nerves from both of them - even from him, proud and delighted as he was so clearly - when he started to talk in the video in answer he was almost breathless. They were clearly jangled - having to walk and kiss and perform - if you haven't been trained to it as an actor (even politician) its disconcerting even for them the first time one experiences it (and I know actors who loath doing it - good actors - but yet who photograph badly on the red carpet because of their deep unease). There is no place to 'hide'. Momentary 'inwardness' translates as 'cold' - one must stay relentlessly outward oriented in front of the cameras - which is why its so exhausting.

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they don't look that in love to me.
What would have to be present for you to be convinced that they 'look like' they are in love?
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  #242  
Old 04-28-2012, 02:30 PM
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Originally Posted by HRHAmy View Post
-Guillaume is 30, I'm sure he was pressured to get married and have heirs very soon and with no other prospects and having dating normal people out of the question, Stephanie was the best choice.
If Guillaume wanted to, really really wanted to, he could have married who he liked.

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-Their families are obviously close, heck they are even related!
That can probably be proven in some way for every married royal couple, particularly marrying nobility. Look at Catherine of Cambridge people are still finding familial links between her and William and they hardly came from the same background.

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Originally Posted by HRHAmy View Post
-Stephanie's parents are getting up in age, especially her father, it doesn't even look like he might last too much longer.
So this engagement has happened because her parents might pass away soon?

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Originally Posted by HRHAmy View Post
-Stephanie is pushing 30 and who knows if she has any prospects.
With looks, pedigree, education, language skills like that she certainly has/had prospects. Amazing ones as well.

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Originally Posted by HRHAmy View Post
-Again, her father is old I'm sure he would like to see his last child off and married before he kicks the bucket.
Ouch. You're turning this engagement into something very clinical. Everyone would like to see they're children down the aisle, but watching them pushed down for their own happiness is a ridiculous assumption.

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-Her pedigree is very impressive.
Pedigree doesn't matter if you love someone.

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-I'm sure she is drama free and Henri and M-T are probably glad they won't have anymore of that after Tessy and Louis.
You're using that against her which is very harsh, so she's been a "good girl".

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Originally Posted by HRHAmy View Post
-And finally they have not been dating that long, I honestly don't think they know each other that well. (BTW dating is different than being friends)
Dating is different to being "friends", but how exactly do you know that they haven't dated for very long?
The majority of people on this forum didn't know Guillaume was dating anyone until his engagement. It's almost impossible to know, unless someone asks them, how long they've been dating.
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  #243  
Old 04-28-2012, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by HRHAmy View Post
Does anyone else get the feeling that this is an arranged marriage? ... [snipped]
I find it unfortunate that arranged marriages have got negative connotations in the western world. There is nothing wrong with an arranged union. It is possible that Prince Guillaume and Countess Stephanie enter the union with clear understanding of what is required and mutual respect for each other. It is not bad foundation for the marriage.
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  #244  
Old 04-28-2012, 03:12 PM
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I saw it, too - as no doubt the videographer/editor did which was why it was left in - an intriquing moment and inexplicable if it is as you suggest given all that has gone before. If you watch the video she was continually casting glances towards him to verify his cues to her - and she was absolutely in sync with his physicality with her throughout.

LINK: Erbgroßherzog Guillaume und Stéphanie de Lannoy zeigen sich auf Schloss Berg - YouTube

Because it is an intriguing moment I watched the split seconds in slow-mo and its actually an intense moment of intimacy between them - her tongue actually comes out between her lips, she is leaning in, her glance is side-long and smoky, her eyes responding to him - when he, utterly focused on her with a warm smile, touches her. Its a lover's moment - and she smiles and then leans away from his ardour but in doing so bows her head to him (as a lover) and then looks away back to the front. At no time is he displeased with her - he remains intent - but she has successfully pulled herself back into the moment which is a photo-shoot. The impression of 'contempt' is the impact her face has from a certain angle which happens as she turns to face forward - you see the angle that is her least flattering. (I wager that it will be this angle that gets endlessly interpreted in years to come). But if you watch her eyes in the fade out that comes in rapidly, she is actually basking under his gaze, and she is not displeased.

Or - the simpler explanation - the photographer was calling to them to face forward and look into the camera. Ha!

Thank you. Doesn't reveal a whole lot. Seems she was an advanced student, doing interesting student studies while she dated - and now she will marry. So its all ahead of her.
On the contrary, thank you! Love it. This is exactly the kind of frame-by-frame analysis that psychologists do to study mother-infant interactions, and I believe in the method a great deal. I didn't do it myself this time, but I trust your assessment. For the record, I wasn't at all sure that it was contempt, and it's true that Guillaume's was a private and tender gesture in the midst of a very public situation. If she's at all reserved by temperament, that alone might have made her back away; even if she's not shy, there must have been a constant awareness of the cameras pointing their lenses at her & them.

As for her education, I believe that she was finished with her studies. She obtained an undergraduate and a Master's degree in German, studied Russian language & literature in Moscow (in addition to violin & piano, apparently), and then worked for an investment bank. Can't remember where I read that last bit... it may have been on one of the Belgian forums.

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Originally Posted by HRHAmy View Post
Does anyone else get the feeling that this is an arranged marriage? I do and here are some reasons why:
Oh, I couldn't disagree more with you on this point. Here are some reasons why:

- Not only were Henri and Maria Teresa a love match; they have been very supportive of other "unequal" marriages (e.g., they attended Prince William's wedding to Kate Middleton).

- If they have proven anything in their handling of the Louis & Tessy situation, it's that they truly strive to live according to their religious and moral convictions. They rightly (IMO) take the marriage vow extremely seriously; it is a sacrament and a promise made before God, and by their actions they have shown that they will not impose it on their children, even when there is considerable social pressure to do so. They accepted Tessy's pregnancy (of course they could never have supported the idea of an abortion), and they were willing to recognize the grandchild without forcing Louis to marry immediately. They allowed the couple to take their time to make the decision to marry. It would be completely incongruous with their prior actions to now impose an arranged marriage on another child of theirs.

- The fact that Guillaume is marrying someone with an ancient lineage does not make life easier for Maria Teresa, especially in the short term. It cannot be easy for her to have all of the Luxembourgish court (who have not always been very nice to her) show that they are positively overjoyed because finally an heir to the throne is marrying someone "suitable." It must stir up and bring back a lot of unpleasant feelings of being devalued. And yet she is a loving mother and of course must feel happy for her son if he has found joy and a good partner for life.

- Most importantly, the couple looks very in love to me... especially him. He has declared publicly that, in his case, it was love at first sight. And, from looking at the videotape, I believe him.
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  #245  
Old 04-28-2012, 03:42 PM
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It's possible that its an arranged marriage, but I hope that you're analysis is wrong. To me, Guillaume looked as if he was beaming. One doesn't beam if he or she is in a contrived and unnatural situation. One beams if there is true joy come out from within one's heart. That said, as someone else pointed out, Stephanie must have not had a lack of suitors. She is aristocratic, wealthy and highly educated. How many ambitious young men would not want to have a wife like this? And as for Guillaume, as a prince, the heir to the throne and a billionaire, he could have married any women he wanted. The world as the saying goes, was his oyster.

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Originally Posted by HRHAmy View Post
Does anyone else get the feeling that this is an arranged marriage? I do and here are some reasons why:

-Guillaume is 30, I'm sure he was pressured to get married and have heirs very soon and with no other prospects and having dating normal people out of the question, Stephanie was the best choice.
-Their families are obviously close, heck they are even related!
-Stephanie's parents are getting up in age, especially her father, it doesn't even look like he might last too much longer.
-Stephanie is pushing 30 and who knows if she has any prospects.
-Again, her father is old I'm sure he would like to see his last child off and married before he kicks the bucket.
-Her pedigree is very impressive.
-I'm sure she is drama free and Henri and M-T are probably glad they won't have anymore of that after Tessy and Louis.
-And finally they have not been dating that long, I honestly don't think they know each other that well. (BTW dating is different than being friends)

These are just a few points that I have noticed, also they don't look that in love to me. They look nervous and giddy but that is to be expected when all this hoopla is going on and you haven't know the person that long. I think when everything settles down and they get into the swing of royal life it will be tough for both of them. I don't see the spark lasting that long like I see it still in Henri and M-T. I feel this is not the best choice for Guillaume and that it will not be the perfect marriage but like Stephanie's father said "They are happy and Luxembourg is happy" so I guess that's all that matters, that the state has the heir married off. I hope it works out.
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  #246  
Old 04-28-2012, 03:55 PM
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Maybe it's a combination of both? Maybe they met on a pre-arranged basis (almost like a blind date) to see if they were compatible with each other and they got along very well.
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  #247  
Old 04-28-2012, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Al_bina View Post
I find it unfortunate that arranged marriages hava got negative connotations in the western world. There is nothing wrong with an arranged union. It is possible that Prince Guillaume and Countess Stephanie enter the union with clear understanding of what is required and mutual respect for each other. It is not bad foundation for the marriage.
I agree with you Al_bina, arranged marriage doesn't mean forced marriage. People meet somewhere for their own or in arranged meetings, the most important it's how they workout their relationship, not how or where they met.
It's not because Diana's and Charles' arranged marriage was not a success it means that all the other arranged marraiges are bound to fail, and let's not forget even if it was arranged, Diana was in love....Everybody said the same about the arranged marriage of Phillippe and Mathilde, but now everybody knows that she's the best thing he did in his life, his biggest support, and the best asset of the Belgian royalty.


If we make statistics of the life of arranged marriages Vs Love's marriages, we can't say that the latter last longer, it's even the opposit, love and passion last 36 months maximum, rest is what people do with their relationship...



Quote:
Originally Posted by claypoint2
As for her education, I believe that she was finished with her studies. She obtained an undergraduate and a Master's degree in German, studied Russian language & literature in Moscow
She spent only one year in Russia. I believe she did the so called "Padgatavitilni Fakultit", the preparatory year for foreign students for university. She can speak and write russian, but don't think she can do it fluently. I myself spent 4 years in studies in Russia, that's why I permiss myself to say that....so one year, not enough to study the litterature in University.
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  #248  
Old 04-28-2012, 04:37 PM
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I don't think it's an arranged marriage. The two are so glooming and look at each other so much in love.
What's the problem, that she is a countess ??? That's discrimination just the other way !!!!

They met at a friends/relatives party and fell in love. Why not? What's the matter ??? Guillaume said at his birthday, that he's dating a girl, but not quite sure about her now. But nearly 6 month are a good time do get sure...may be they spend christmas together and a holiday. And their age is a great age to get married.

My parents were even faster: they became engaged after 3 month, married after 6 month and are married happily since 26 years. In other countries it's normal, that people marry fast.

She is his type, because she is the same type like Pia Haraldsen. He might have been thinking: beautiful girl - just my type, smart, well educated, scandal free, family girl, we have some mutual friends, she comes from Benelux states and hey ! she's a countess, with all the manners that are needed, a nice pedigree and a great family. Mommy and Daddy will be enchanted about her.

Some people wait so long for the so-called "perfect partner". And in the end all possible partners are gone and they are alone.
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  #249  
Old 04-28-2012, 04:51 PM
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Maybe it's a combination of both? Maybe they met on a pre-arranged basis (almost like a blind date) to see if they were compatible with each other and they got along very well.
They apparently met at a dance at the Château de Beloeil, which belongs to the Princes of Ligne. Of course there are many events where young people of royal or noble rank can (and perhaps are encouraged to) meet each other, but it is still their choice to pursue - or not - a relationship. That is very different from having a spouse chosen for you, which is the definition of an arranged marriage!
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  #250  
Old 04-28-2012, 04:54 PM
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Stephane and her prince accomplished their educational goal and both worked before comtemplating on marriage and I complement them for that. Their parents and countries should be proud of them.
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  #251  
Old 04-28-2012, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by claypoint2 View Post
As for her education, I believe that she was finished with her studies. She obtained an undergraduate and a Master's degree in German, studied Russian language & literature in Moscow
She spent only one year in Russia. I believe she did the so called "Padgatavitilni Fakultit", the preparatory year for foreign students for university. She can speak and write russian, but don't think she can do it fluently. I myself spent 4 years in studies in Russia, that's why I permiss myself to say that....so one year, not enough to study the litterature in University.
I'm not sure what prompted your comment, which you presented as a response to mine. I didn't say that she was fluent in Russian; I said only that she had studied Russian language & literature in Russia. This is still true, no?
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  #252  
Old 04-28-2012, 05:03 PM
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You are absolutely right Al_bina. Thanks for pointing this out. It could be just like you say that it is. By the way, didn't they say that Grand Duke Jean's marriage to the late Grand Duchess Charlotte was arranged? And look at how they grew to love each other. They had many happy years of marriage and produced five healthy, happy children. When Charlotte died, Jean was besides himself with grief. His love for her was clear. That wasn't feigned.

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I find it unfortunate that arranged marriages hava got negative connotations in the western world. There is nothing wrong with an arranged union. It is possible that Prince Guillaume and Countess Stephanie enter the union with clear understanding of what is required and mutual respect for each other. It is not bad foundation for the marriage.
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  #253  
Old 04-28-2012, 05:06 PM
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Would it be a matter if interest if he known a "nobody" for six months and married her? His father married a Cuban immigrant ... Can't imagine his parents would have coerced him into anything.

They are in love and getting married .. Let's leave if at that and start anticipating the wedding gown and tiaras at the wedding!!! :)
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  #254  
Old 04-28-2012, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Al_bina View Post
I find it unfortunate that arranged marriages hava got negative connotations in the western world. There is nothing wrong with an arranged union. It is possible that Prince Guillaume and Countess Stephanie enter the union with clear understanding of what is required and mutual respect for each other. It is not bad foundation for the marriage.
Al Bina, I agree that there isn't strong evidence that love provides a better foundation for a lasting marriage than an "arrangement." Some arranged marriages work very well indeed.

However, perhaps one reason that arranged marriages have gotten a negative connotation in the west is because they have traditionally been made with complete disregard for the wishes - and the wellbeing - of the young woman in question. Sometimes the groom, especially if he is a powerful man, gets to say if he "likes" the bride (i.e., finds her attractive), but the woman is given no voice at all. She could be forced to marry someone she finds completely repulsive. In many places her marriage could result in very brutal abuse, and yet she has no right to determine the course of her own life. So I can't agree when you say that "there is nothing wrong with an arranged marriage."
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  #255  
Old 04-28-2012, 05:53 PM
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This is all very amusing. For the last decade people have moaned and groaned about princes, and princesses, falling in love and marrying commoners. Some even suggested that these royal heirs should have put their duty to their dynasties ahead of emotions like love and married a girl/boy from a proper royal/noble background and hope that affection developed later. Now we have a prince, who says it was love at first sight, becoming engaged to an attractive young lady from an aristocratic family and some people now say it can't possibly be a love match and it must have been arranged. It would appear that no matter who an heir decides to marry there will always be those who second guess the reasons and claim to know better than the couples involved. Sad really.
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  #256  
Old 04-28-2012, 05:56 PM
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They are engaged , it was the first time Stephanie was seen in public . I am looking forward their wedding day to see the royals or the heirs of their Houses in the Cathedral of Luxembourg. I am really happy for Grand Duke Jean and for the reigning Grand dukes Henri and MT.
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  #257  
Old 04-28-2012, 06:28 PM
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I'm not sure what prompted your comment, which you presented as a response to mine. I didn't say that she was fluent in Russian; I said only that she had studied Russian language & literature in Russia. This is still true, no?
I didn't point my post on you especially, I just was discussing the languages thing, because I read somewhere that she's fluent and almost a specialist in russian culture and language, which makes me quit laughing, sorry If I didn't quot the right posts...

I quoted your post because you said she studied litterature, which is quit evident that's impossible, she only made the preparatory year of russian as foreign language...it's really for beginners, but it's a beginning, it will serve her in her future duties.
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  #258  
Old 04-28-2012, 06:31 PM
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  #259  
Old 04-28-2012, 06:38 PM
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A very gracious, happy couple. Thank you, Magmil.
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  #260  
Old 04-28-2012, 06:41 PM
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This is all very amusing. For the last decade people have moaned and groaned about princes, and princesses, falling in love and marrying commoners. Some even suggested that these royal heirs should have put their duty to their dynasties ahead of emotions like love and married a girl/boy from a proper royal/noble background and hope that affection developed later. Now we have a prince, who says it was love at first sight, becoming engaged to an attractive young lady from an aristocratic family and some people now say it can't possibly be a love match and it must have been arranged. It would appear that no matter who an heir decides to marry there will always be those who second guess the reasons and claim to know better than the couples involved. Sad really.
Yes! My sentiments exactly. Thank you for expressing them so well, NGalitzine.

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I quoted your post because you said she studied litterature, which is quit evident that's impossible, she only made the preparatory year of russian as foreign language...it's really for beginners, but it's a beginning, it will serve her in her future duties.
Ah! Thank you for helping me to understand, Sephora. That makes sense.
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