The Prince Andrew and Jeffrey Epstein Controversy 2: Sep 2022 -

[hereditarytitles]

Yeah, it's definitely the British slang for sex word, which is a gross way to speak about your own teenage daughter to anyone, let alone a man you *know* likes young girls. The fact that neither Andrew nor Sarah were more careful with their girls around Epstein is one of the more surprising things about this whole sordid saga. And you can see the same sort of thing with Mette-Marit's emails as well, no discretion about her kids.

I agree and thanks for the explanation of British slang, because I didn't know what it meant but was only guessing. Disgusting to talk in such a way about your own daughter to a any person, but especially to someone like Epstein . I never liked Sarah but this is .... I don't know what to say.

 

[sophie25]

I agree and thanks for the explanation of British slang, because I didn't know what it meant but was only guessing. Disgusting to talk in such a way about your own daughter to a any person, but especially to someone like Epstein . I never liked Sarah but this is .... I don't know what to say.

It was a vile thing to say about her own daughter to ANYONE, let alone him!

 

[Granada]

I'm guessing The British Intelligence Agencies became aware of the damaging photos and emails between Andrew & Sarah and Epstein sometime last year. Charles was informed and moved decisively to sideline Andrew ( and sidekick Fergie ) from ALL semblance of Royal life.
Home,Titles, Position...... everything gone. To try and mitigate damage affecting The Firm.

I still bet there is so much more out there regarding Andrews "quid pro quo" kickbacks as "Special Trade Envoy" and then his "Pitch at The Palace" Grift.

As an aside, as a Mother of a daughter, I find it so very "vulgar" that Fergie would refer to Eugenie's Weekend trip with her boyfriend (to Epstein of all People !) in such a demeaning way.
The Grey Men at the Palace certainly nailed her character from the get go too.
Vulgar. Vulgar. Vulgar.

 

[sophie25]

I'm guessing The British Intelligence Agencies became aware of the damaging photos and emails between Andrew & Sarah and Epstein sometime last year. Charles was informed and moved decisively to sideline Andrew ( and sidekick Fergie ) from ALL semblance of Royal life.
Home,Titles, Position...... everything gone. To try and mitigate damage affecting The Firm.

I still bet there is so much more out there regarding Andrews "quid pro quo" kickbacks as "Special Trade Envoy" and then his "Pitch at The Palace" Grift.

As an aside, as a Mother of a daughter, I find it so very "vulgar" that Fergie would refer to Eugenie's Weekend trip with her boyfriend (to Epstein of all People !) in such a demeaning way.
The Grey Men at the Palace certainly nailed her character from the get go too.
Vulgar. Vulgar. Vulgar.

I'm a mother of sons and I still wouldnt speak about them like that.

 

[Hallo girl]

I agree and thanks for the explanation of British slang, because I didn't know what it meant but was only guessing. Disgusting to talk in such a way about your own daughter to a any person, but especially to someone like Epstein . I never liked Sarah but this is .... I don't know what to say.

It is slang here in the UK, but a totally unacceptable word for anybody to use never mind a mother about her daughter. It is a vile horrible word, I wonder if she ever spoke in front of her daughters like that. If not they now know how she described them, vulgar vulgar woman.

 

[TLLK]

An article in DM describes further emails and contacts between Sarah Ferguson and Epstein. I'm sure that more explosive emails may come to light over time.

Ferguson told Epstein waiting for Eugenie to return 's****ing weekend'

The extraordinary exchange is contained in the tranche of three million documents released as part of The Epstein Files on Friday.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Poor Eugenie. This was her private life and only her business. (I know enough British slang to have figured out the missing letters.)

 

[TLLK]

I'm a mother of sons and I still wouldnt speak about them like that.

Nor would I speak about their private life in that manner.

 

[hereditarytitles]

Poor Eugenie. This was her private life and only her business. (I know enough British slang to have figured out the missing letters.)

Who knows, maybe that was the reason she has distanced herself from her mother, as was recently reported by some tabloids?

 

[Hallo girl]

I will put my hand up that I am one of those people they have made excuses for Sarah over the years, misunderstood, out of her depth, naive, silly. I have said them all to give her the benefit of the doubt. Prince Philip was right to refuse to be in the same room as her not even the same building.
Every time we think she cannot get any worse there she is popping up again.
This has to be the final red line.
Maybe that is why the girls cannot accommodate her.

 

[hereditarytitles]

I will put my hand up that I am one of those people they have made excuses for Sarah over the years, misunderstood, out of her depth, naive, silly. I have said them all to give her the benefit of the doubt. Prince Philip was right to refuse to be in the same room as her not even the same building.
Every time we think she cannot get any worse there she is popping up again.
This has to be the final red line.
Maybe that is why the girls cannot accommodate her.

I agree. I was always a great admirer of the late Prince Philip, a man with a lot of experience in life and not an easy life at all. And yes, he proved to be right about Sarah,

 

[sophie25]

I agree. I was always a great admirer of the late Prince Philip, a man with a lot of experience in life and not an easy life at all. And yes, he proved to be right about Sarah,

I agree, a lot of people thought he was too hard on Sarah, but he clearly could see right through her.

 

[Alison H]

Ugh. Why couldn't she just have said "Eugenie's away for the weekend", like anyone else would have done?

Prince Philip was dead right about her.

 

[Alison H]

There's quite a disparity in how different people are being treated by the media.

The chairman of the Los Angeles Olympics is being widely criticised for having sent Ghislaine Maxwell an e-mail saying that he'd like to see her in a tight leather outfit. Yes, it's very distasteful, but there's no mention of any connection whatsoever with Epstein, yet alone involvement in abuse.

A US Senator who was involved in the Northern Ireland peace process has had his name removed from a US-Irish scholarship programme because he exchanged e-mails with Epstein, although, again, there is no evidence or even allegation of involvement in his crimes.

Yet very little's being said about, for example, Bill Gates or Richard Branson, who are also mentioned.

 

[Tatiana Maria]

An article in DM describes further emails and contacts between Sarah Ferguson and Epstein. I'm sure that more explosive emails may come to light over time.

Ferguson told Epstein waiting for Eugenie to return 's****ing weekend'

The extraordinary exchange is contained in the tranche of three million documents released as part of The Epstein Files on Friday.

www.dailymail.co.uk

The newly published emails do, however, appear to support Sarah's account that she had reason to fear what Jeffrey Epstein might do to her (in the courts of law) if she did not mollify him. Mr. Epstein's (American) crisis manager was pressing him to sue her:

"But in March 2011 Epstein was 'enraged' after Sarah gave an interview to London's Evening Standard newspaper calling him a paedophile. He even considered suing her.

He hired Michael Sitrick, a high-powered New York crisis manager who wrote: 'Jeffrey, the Fergie retraction is critical. One of your good friends, a member of the Royal family, is calling you a paedophile.

'If gentle persuasion doesn't work it is my view that we need to turn up the heat to the point of sending her a draft defamation lawsuit. As I said yesterday, this would be a major turning point and be picked up everywhere.

'This is about your name and your reputation. You really can't worry about her, in my view you need to worry about you. She certainly isn't concerned about you or your reputation.'"​

 

[Moonmaiden23]

I will put my hand up that I am one of those people they have made excuses for Sarah over the years, misunderstood, out of her depth, naive, silly. I have said them all to give her the benefit of the doubt. Prince Philip was right to refuse to be in the same room as her not even the same building.
Every time we think she cannot get any worse there she is popping up again.
This has to be the final red line.
Maybe that is why the girls cannot accommodate her.

I defended her too. And the hill I was always willing to fight and die on was that she and Andrew were exemplary Royal parents who had kept their family unit safe and protected.

To say I got it all wrong is an understatement. Beatrice and Eugenie made it to secure adulthood in spite of their upbringing. Not because of it.

 

[Hallo girl]

I defended her too. And the hill I was always willing to fight and die on was that she and Andrew were exemplary Royal parents who had kept their family unit safe and protected.

To say I got it all wrong is an understatement. Beatrice and Eugenie made it to secure adulthood in spite of their upbringing. Not because of it.

I now wonder if the girls will step back from public life, offer to give up the titles, possibly after some persuasion from the palace.
How can Eugenie do her work with modern slavery.

 

[TLLK]

I will put my hand up that I am one of those people they have made excuses for Sarah over the years, misunderstood, out of her depth, naive, silly. I have said them all to give her the benefit of the doubt. Prince Philip was right to refuse to be in the same room as her not even the same building.
Every time we think she cannot get any worse there she is popping up again.
This has to be the final red line.
Maybe that is why the girls cannot accommodate her.

Add me to that list as well.

 

[TLLK]

I now wonder if the girls will step back from public life, offer to give up the titles, possibly after some persuasion from the palace.
How can Eugenie do her work with modern slavery.

I feel so badly for Princess Eugenie because IMO this is a patronage that she wants to represent and champion.

 

[TLLK]

I defended her too. And the hill I was always willing to fight and die on was that she and Andrew were exemplary Royal parents who had kept their family unit safe and protected.

To say I got it all wrong is an understatement. Beatrice and Eugenie made it to secure adulthood in spite of their upbringing. Not because of it.

I felt the same way and frequently argued that the Yorks had done an exceptional job in raising their girls together. Personally, I still give them a approval for finding the right school to accommodate Princess Beatrice's dyslexia.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

I now wonder if the girls will step back from public life, offer to give up the titles, possibly after some persuasion from the palace.
How can Eugenie do her work with modern slavery.

I still don't understand why they need to step back from public life and relinquish a thing?They have not only done nothing wrong, they might be needed in the near future.
I can definitely see Eugenie discussing the matter of her continued patronage with any human trafficking organizations that she works with. IF and only if they believe her association with them would be counter productive, Eugenie should resign.

 

[Leopoldine]

This was reported on GBNews:

"In another email from September 2009, Ms Ferguson appeared to suggest Epstein wed an unnamed woman with a "great body", adding: "Ok, well marry me, and then we will employ her."

Unbelievable.

 

[yukari]

There's quite a disparity in how different people are being treated by the media.

The chairman of the Los Angeles Olympics is being widely criticised for having sent Ghislaine Maxwell an e-mail saying that he'd like to see her in a tight leather outfit. Yes, it's very distasteful, but there's no mention of any connection whatsoever with Epstein, yet alone involvement in abuse.

A US Senator who was involved in the Northern Ireland peace process has had his name removed from a US-Irish scholarship programme because he exchanged e-mails with Epstein, although, again, there is no evidence or even allegation of involvement in his crimes.

Yet very little's being said about, for example, Bill Gates or Richard Branson, who are also mentioned.

Agree.
Andrew is a POS and I never like Sarah. But at this point, the way media (both British and American) keep harping on them start to feel like beating a dead horse (while the bigger horses are still prancing freely).

On another note, I'm surprised we haven't seen Juan Carlos being mentioned in Epstein file.

 

[blooms_rulers]

On another note, I'm surprised we haven't seen Juan Carlos being mentioned in Epstein file.

Why? What evidence has there ever been that Juan Carlos likes unwilling and/or underaged women? Juan Carlos was getting funded by Arab oil money, so Epstein's money wouldn't have been a factor, and he was cheating on his wife with middle-aged willing women. That I know of, there's never been any hint that he liked unwilling teenaged girls or trafficking victims young enough to be his granddaughter.

 

[yukari]

Why? What evidence has there ever been that Juan Carlos likes unwilling and/or underaged women? Juan Carlos was getting funded by Arab oil money, so Epstein's money wouldn't have been a factor, and he was cheating on his wife with middle-aged willing women. That I know of, there's never been any hint that he liked unwilling teenaged girls or trafficking victims young enough to be his granddaughter.

Well, Frederik was mentioned twice so are you suggesting he needed Epstein's money or has a hint of liking unwilling teenaged girls or trafficking unwilling victims?

New Epstein files include images, emails linked to former Prince Andrew

Andrew Mountbatten-Windsor invited Epstein to Buckingham Palace, local media claims - Anadolu Ajansı

www.aa.com.tr

Denmark's King Frederik, who was crown prince at the time, is also mentioned in the files.

According to the Danish daily Ekstra Bladet, he appeared in emails between Epstein and businessman Ian Osborne in March 2012.

He is mentioned again in July 2012 in connection with a private dinner attended by 22 people. It is unclear whether King Frederik attended any of these events.

I'm not suggesting anything about Frederik but considering JC's past exploits, I'm expecting to see his name in the files more than Frederik, so I'm surprised that we've seen Frederik's name (even in passing) but nothing about Juan Carlos.

 

[Hallo girl]

I still don't understand why they need to step back from public life and relinquish a thing?They have not only done nothing wrong, they might be needed in the near future.
I can definitely see Eugenie discussing the matter of her continued patronage with any human trafficking organizations that she works with. IF and only if they believe her association with them would be counter productive, Eugenie should resign.

I didn’t mean to infer that they needed to, I just wonder if that is how they will cope with the situation.

 

[Alison H]

Eugenie hasn't done anything wrong. Having embarrassing parents isn't a crime.

Attention here has, for once, switched away from Andrew, to Lord Mandelson, the former UK ambassador to the US. He has resigned from the Labour Party over allegations that he received $75,000 dollars from Epstein.

He denies it. I've got no idea what is and isn't true, but it does seem as if people are being hung out to dry over unproven allegations.

 

[hereditarytitles]

There's quite a disparity in how different people are being treated by the media.

The chairman of the Los Angeles Olympics is being widely criticised for having sent Ghislaine Maxwell an e-mail saying that he'd like to see her in a tight leather outfit. Yes, it's very distasteful, but there's no mention of any connection whatsoever with Epstein, yet alone involvement in abuse.

A US Senator who was involved in the Northern Ireland peace process has had his name removed from a US-Irish scholarship programme because he exchanged e-mails with Epstein, although, again, there is no evidence or even allegation of involvement in his crimes.

Yet very little's being said about, for example, Bill Gates or Richard Branson, who are also mentioned.

I think the difference in reporting is certainly due to the degree of fame of the individuals involved. Our newspapers have reported on Bill Gates and Richard Branson. But there have been no compromising photos so far. The impact of photos should not be underestimated. The other men were smart enough not to be photographed in suggestive poses, unlike Andrew, who was too careless or thought that no one would ever find out.
Added to this, at least in Germany, is the popularity of European royalty. Everything that happens there, whether positive or negative, is reported in the relevant newspapers. ZDF (public television) has its own editorial team for everything related to royalty and regularly broadcasts documentaries, which I must say are well done and mostly favourable towards european royalty. This also explains the great interest in the Epstein scandal and the upcoming trial of Marius Hoiby. As we know scandals are attractive to the popular press, which increases circulation.

 

[yukari]

I think the difference in reporting is certainly due to the degree of fame of the individuals involved. Our newspapers have reported on Bill Gates and Richard Branson. But there have been no compromising photos so far. The impact of photos should not be underestimated. The other men were smart enough not to be photographed in suggestive poses, unlike Andrew, who was too careless or thought that no one would ever find out.
(...)

I suspect he might consider those photos as some kind of trophy the way all those wildlife pleasure-hunters took photos with their preys.

 

[Ghost]

I think the difference in reporting is certainly due to the degree of fame of the individuals involved. Our newspapers have reported on Bill Gates and Richard Branson. But there have been no compromising photos so far. The impact of photos should not be underestimated. The other men were smart enough not to be photographed in suggestive poses, unlike Andrew, who was too careless or thought that no one would ever find out.
Added to this, at least in Germany, is the popularity of European royalty. Everything that happens there, whether positive or negative, is reported in the relevant newspapers. ZDF (public television) has its own editorial team for everything related to royalty and regularly broadcasts documentaries, which I must say are well done and mostly favourable towards european royalty. This also explains the great interest in the Epstein scandal and the upcoming trial of Marius Hoiby. As we know scandals are attractive to the popular press, which increases circulation.

I think it has more to do with media’s bias. It’s mentioned everywhere that Andrew is involved, that Trump appears so many times in the files.

Also, I think people need to cool down on accusing someone or some other person (and judge them) before they are judged in a court of law. Andrew, no matter how big a pig he is, paid such a price not because he did something illegal but because TBR relies on public good will.

 

[Mbruno]

I think it has more to do with media’s bias. It’s mentioned everywhere that Andrew is involved, that Trump appears so many times in the files. It’s crickets about the more than 1000 times Obama appears in the files.

Also, I think people need to cool down on accusing someone or some other person (and judge them) before they are judged in a court of law. Andrew, no matter how big a pig he is, paid such a price not because he did something illegal but because TBR relies on public good will.

It is no secret that Andrew enjoyed the company of "girls". There have been accounts from other sources that he had frequent calls, including at royal residences. Historically, he is not the first member of the BRF, much less the first man to indulge in such behavior.

His troubles began when he associated with Epstein and got involved once (or 3 times according to a different account) with Virginia Roberts, who was 17 at the time of their first encounter in London. He is now being villified by a new revelation that he had an encounter with a 26-year-old Russian woman brokered by Epstein. None of those acts is criminal per se in the UK, unless it can be proven that Andrew was somehow involved in or was enabling human trafficking, which , right now, is a weak case that has been dismissed by British police. So I think the repulsion to Andrew, especially in the UK or the US, in part for cultural reasons, stems more from a moral judgment of Andrew's behavior than a criminal case properly.

As for Sarah, her relationship with Epstein seems to have been motivated by money needs (she saw Epstein as a source of financing for her projects), but also later perhaps by intimidation/ fear or blackmail. I am not saying that Sarah also became a victim of Epstein in the end, but he did seem to have some hold on her, and the evidence supports that interpretation to some extent.