The Death and Funeral of Pope Francis


If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
See posts with no answers
Yes the public seem to move around a wooden barrier to view the Pope but dignitaries and other special visitors go beyond that up to a red rope.
 
According to Sky News, it's the Argentinian delegation, then the Italian delegation, then royalty, then politicians in alphabetical order of country name (fortunately using French, which means that Etats-Unis will be well away from Ukraine!). Hopefully the late Pope's relatives will also be at the front.
 
Alison H said:
According to Sky News, it's the Argentinian delegation, then the Italian delegation, then royalty, then politicians in alphabetical order of country name (fortunately using French, which means that Etats-Unis will be well away from Ukraine!). Hopefully the late Pope's relatives will also be at the front.
Click to expand...

I wonder why they are following the alphabetical order iin Frenxh. Is Frenxh the Vatican’s official diplomatic language?

It is also interesting that royalty is given precedence over the heads of state of the republics.

Will the British or Swedish prime ministers sit with the politicians separarely from the royal delegation?
 
Last edited:
Mbruno said:
I wonder why they are following the alphabetical order iin Frenxh. Is Frenxh the Vatican’a official diplomatic language?
Click to expand...
The Holy See uses Latin as its official language and Italian as its main working language, but French is also used as a diplomatic language.

Mbruno said:
It is also interesting that royalty is given precedence over the heads of state of the republics.
Click to expand...
It's only natural, Vatican City is an absolute elective monarchy.
 
Mbruno said:
I wonder why they are following the alphabetical order iin Frenxh. Is Frenxh the Vatican’s official diplomatic language?

It is also interesting that royalty is given precedence over the heads of state of the republics.

Will the British or Swedish prime ministers sit with the politicians separarely from the royal delegation?
Click to expand...
At John Paul II' s State funeral, I saw President and Mrs Bush seated behind the Royals. There were no complaints from them.

But I will not be surprised if history doesn't repeat itself on Saturday.🤔

ETA: I love seeing the warm welcome that Felipe and Letizia received!
 
Last edited:
The official list of international delegations that will be present at the funeral has been released:
es.zenit.org

Estas son las delegaciones presentes en el funeral del Papa - ZENIT - Espanol

Lista de delegaciones oficiales provisoria que asistirán al funeral del Papa Francisco
es.zenit.org es.zenit.org

The list of royals who will be present at the funeral according to this list are:
  • Belgium: King Philippe and Queen Mathilde
  • Denmark: Queen Mary
  • Spain: King Felipe VI and Queen Letizia
  • Jordan: King Abdullah II and Queen Rania
  • Lesotho: King Letsie III
  • Liechtenstein: Hereditary Prince Alois and Hereditary Princess Sophie
  • Luxembourg: Grand Duke Henri and Grand Duchess Maria Teresa
  • Monaco: Prince Albert II and Princess Charlene
  • Sweden: King Carl XVI Gustaf and Queen Silvia
  • Norway: Crown Prince Haakon and Crown Princess Mette-Marit
  • United Kingdom: Prince of Wales
  • Qatar: Shaikh Mohammed bin Abdulrahman Al-Thani

The Coffin of Pope Francis has been sealed.
www.vaticannews.va

Pope Francis’ coffin to be sealed in rite on Friday evening - Vatican News

Pope Francis’ coffin will be sealed during a liturgical rite held in St. Peter’s Basilica on Friday, April 25, at 8:00 PM.
www.vaticannews.va www.vaticannews.va

https://twitter.com/x/status/1915868745328726243

 
Will royal orders be worn tomorrow as its a state occasion
 
It s a pity no Dutch royal will attend. I d like to see Princess Margriet or Beatrix
 
I
Blog Real said:
The official list of international delegations that will be present at the funeral has been released:
es.zenit.org

Estas son las delegaciones presentes en el funeral del Papa - ZENIT - Espanol

Lista de delegaciones oficiales provisoria que asistirán al funeral del Papa Francisco
es.zenit.org es.zenit.org

The list of royals who will be present at the funeral according to this list are:
  • Belgium: King Philippe and Queen Mathilde
  • Denmark: Queen Mary
  • Spain: King Felipe VI and Queen Letizia
  • Jordan: King Abdullah II and Queen Rania
  • Lesotho: King Letsie III
  • Liechtenstein: Hereditary Prince Alois and Hereditary Princess Sophie
  • Luxembourg: Grand Duke Henri and Grand Duchess Maria Teresa
  • Monaco: Prince Albert II and Princess Charlene
  • Sweden: King Carl XVI Gustaf and Queen Silvia
  • Norway: Crown Prince Haakon and Crown Princess Mette-Marit
  • United Kingdom: Prince of Wales
  • Qatar: Shaikh Mohammed bin Abdulrahman Al-Thani
Click to expand...
It appears that the hereditary princes such as the Prince of Wales and CP Haakon will be accorded lower precedence than all heads of state (including presidents), so they will be seated further to the back.

Tatiana Maria said:
Programs of the funeral ceremonies and other official information about the death of Pope Francis can be found here:

Vacancy of the Apostolic See 2025

www.vatican.va www.vatican.va
Click to expand...
Based on the booklet, the First Lession (Reading) will be delivered in English and the Second in Spanish. The Reading from the Gospel will be in Latin. The Prayers of the Faithful will be in French, Portuguese, Polish, German, and Mandarin. The Order of the Mass itself is primarily in Latin of course.

At the end of Mass, following the commendation in the Latin rite, the Patriarchs of the Eastern Churches in communion with Rome will deliver funeral prayers in Greek according to the Byzantine rite.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
article on how the seating plan will work.

Argentian delegation, Italian delegation, royals, then remaining heads of state, etc. They will be seated by French alphabetical order.

Not sure a link to the delegations attending ...here is the full chart and how each is identified and listed.

es.zenit.org

Estas son las delegaciones presentes en el funeral del Papa - ZENIT - Espanol

Lista de delegaciones oficiales provisoria que asistirán al funeral del Papa Francisco
es.zenit.org es.zenit.org
 
Izzie said:
article on how the seating plan will work.

Argentian delegation, Italian delegation, royals, then remaining heads of state, etc. They will be seated by French alphabetical order.
Click to expand...
As mentioned before, CP Haakon and Prince William will be seated after all the heads of state apparently, so they will not be seated together with the other royals. They are listed as #66 and 67 respectively in the order of precedence.

Queen Mary, however, will be accorded the same precedence as her husband's even though she is attending the funeral alone.

So only sovereign monarchs and their consorts will outrank the heads of state of the republics.

The monarchs will be also seated in alphabetical order based on the names (in French) of their respective countries, rather than seniority.
 
Last edited:
Mbruno said:
I wonder why they are following the alphabetical order iin Frenxh. Is Frenxh the Vatican’s official diplomatic language?
Click to expand...

Yes, why French? From this 2010 news article, it doesn't seem like French has any special status in Vatican diplomatic business.

"Vatican officials usually write (and speak) to each other in Italian. When writing to bishops in other countries, they’ll often use the language of that country—French for France, English for the United States, etc. Latin is generally reserved for letters that are especially important or official as opposed to casual correspondence."​

Are there some awkward seating juxtapositions that would result from applying Italian or Latin alphabetical order?
 
Tatiana Maria said:
Yes, why French? From this 2010 news article, it doesn't seem like French has any special status in Vatican diplomatic business.

"Vatican officials usually write (and speak) to each other in Italian. When writing to bishops in other countries, they’ll often use the language of that country—French for France, English for the United States, etc. Latin is generally reserved for letters that are especially important or official as opposed to casual correspondence."​

Are there some awkward seating juxtapositions that would result from applying Italian or Latin alphabetical order?
Click to expand...
If in English, Ukraine and United States comes to mind..... :sneaky:
 
Tatiana Maria said:
Yes, why French? From this 2010 news article, it doesn't seem like French has any special status in Vatican diplomatic business.

"Vatican officials usually write (and speak) to each other in Italian. When writing to bishops in other countries, they’ll often use the language of that country—French for France, English for the United States, etc. Latin is generally reserved for letters that are especially important or official as opposed to casual correspondence."​

Are there some awkward seating juxtapositions that would result from applying Italian or Latin alphabetical order?
Click to expand...
Also, members of non-reigning royal houses such as Savoy or Bourbon-Parma do not seem to be listed in the official seating plan, so I assume they are attending the funeral as ordinary citizens only as I suspected.

President Macron was placed in the seating plan as President of the French Republic, ignoring that he is also Co-Prince of Andorra. Bishop Joan-Enric Vives Sicilia (the other Co-Prince of Andorra) will occupy seat #1 among the monarchs based on the French alphabetical order. He will be followed by King Philippe on seat #2.

EDIT: I have just noticed that Hereditary Prince Alois will be seated, however, with the sovereign monarchs and is listed as "Capo di Stato". Apparently a Regent like Alois, and Governors General like Sam Mostyn of Australia and Mary May Simon of Canada are being accorded the same precedence as heads of state.
 
Last edited:
Alison H said:
According to Sky News, it's the Argentinian delegation, then the Italian delegation, then royalty, then politicians in alphabetical order of country name (fortunately using French, which means that Etats-Unis will be well away from Ukraine!). Hopefully the late Pope's relatives will also be at the front.
Click to expand...
The Argentine delegation includes a sizeable amount of Francis's family. The TV cameras panned over to them inside St. Peter's Basilica last night. One of the young women(a niece? ) was weeping. 🙁
 
Mbruno said:
As mentioned before, CP Haakon and Prince William will be seated after all the heads of state apparently, so they will not be seated together with the other royals. They are listed as #66 and 67 respectively in the order of precedence.

Queen Mary, however, will be accorded the same precedence as her husband's even though she is attending the funeral alone.
Click to expand...

I can't understand why Queen Mary is listed under "Reigning Sovereigns" while Crown Prince Haakon and Prince William are not. If the logic is that Queen Mary is representing the Reigning Sovereign of Denmark, then surely the same applies to Haakon and William vis-a-vis Norway and Great Britain.
 
Last edited:
 
Last edited:
The sitting arrangements from Reuters doesn't exist. It appears to be Heads of State by French alphabetical order. The king and queen of Sweden are sitting behind Zelensky and Trump and Melania are in the first row close to Felipe and Letizia.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Alondra said:
The sitting arrangements from Reuters doesn't exist. It appears to be Heads of State by French alphabetical order. The king and queen of Sweden are sitting behind Zelensky and Trump and Melania are in the first row close to Felipe and Letizia.
Click to expand...
Indeed, apparently monarchs have not been given precedence. Shameful to see the King of Sweden, dean of European royalty and the longest-serving head of state present, seated in the backrows.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Ista
Conclave to Select a New Pope
6 7 8
Replies
216
Views
11K
Somebody
Somebody
Marengo
The Duke and Duchess of Bragança and Family 3: March 2025 -
Replies
17
Views
2K
Blog Real
Blog Real
Marengo
Princess Isabella of Denmark Jewels 1: April 2025 -
2
Replies
45
Views
4K
Noble Consort Ming
N
Marengo
  • Sticky
Infanta Sofía of Spain Jewels 1: April 2025 -
Replies
0
Views
314
Marengo
Marengo
Marengo
Princess Ariane of the Netherlands Jewels 1: April 2025 -
Replies
2
Views
430
PrincessofEurope
PrincessofEurope

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom