Prince Joachim of Belgium, News & Events Part 1 (July 2017 - )

[Tatiana Maria]

It is indeed interesting how anonymously Princess Astrid's children live in comparison to most of their peers who hold a corresponding position in other European royal houses: the Marichalars, the Behns, the Monpezats, Eloise van Oranje and her siblings, the Yorks and Phillipses.

I'd say it's by choice. The Yorks aside all the families you mention has at least one member that's either no stranger to talking to the press or have chosen a profession that requires living in the public eye. Most often both.
The Estes have chosen to live largely private lives as has the York girls. The attention the latter get are mostly the result of the unfortunate choices of their two parents.

Excellent point. It hadn't occurred to me at all, but you are quite correct.

I wonder whether it makes a diffrence that their father is royal as well - and from a non-reigning family; his family is used to mingle in royal and noble circles without seeking media attention.

You might be correct about that too. They also occasionally socialise in noble and royal circles who generally prefer discretion. Lorenz’s branch of the Habsburg's are more private and discreet and certainly haven’t abused their connections unlike some of the families listed by Tatiana Maria.

I'm inclined to think that is not part of it; some of the other aforementioned families also have noble ancestry on both sides (and the Marichalars' grandfather even belonged to official nobility, in contrast to the Autriche-Este line who are only pretenders to a defunct throne), and there are certainly plenty of members and descendants of other deposed royal families who do seek out or find themselves in the media spotlight.


I apologize for sidetracking Prince Joachim's current events thread. If anyone wishes to continue this discussion about the Astrid branch's anonymity, may I suggest we move it to Princess Astrid's family's general questions thread?

https://www.theroyalforums.com/foru...orenz-and-family-general-questions-26425.html

 

[coninja]

Excellent point. It hadn't occurred to me at all, but you are quite correct.

I'm inclined to think that is not part of it; some of the other aforementioned families also have noble ancestry on both sides (and the Marichalars' grandfather even belonged to official nobility, in contrast to the Autriche-Este line who are only pretenders to a defunct throne), and there are certainly plenty of members and descendants of other deposed royal families who do seek out or find themselves in the media spotlight.

I apologize for sidetracking Prince Joachim's current events thread. If anyone wishes to continue this discussion about the Astrid branch's anonymity, may I suggest we move it to Princess Astrid's family's general questions thread?

https://www.theroyalforums.com/foru...orenz-and-family-general-questions-26425.html

Why do you think they live so privately? It seems quite strange considering the Belgian monarchy granted Joachim and his siblings certain titles. Princess Astrid shouldn't be the only one working for Belgium all the time.

You might be correct about that too. They also occasionally socialise in noble and royal circles who generally prefer discretion. Lorenz’s branch of the Habsburg's are more private and discreet and certainly haven’t abused their connections unlike some of the families listed by Tatiana Maria.

Although some members of other royal houses did this, it seems like a misuse of status and titles for Astrid's children to be shrouded in secrecy instead of being more involved with the monarchy, the King, and their other royal houses through their father's side.

Do you think the King will follow the steps of the Danish Queen and strip them of titles?

I wonder whether it makes a difference that their father is royal as well - and from a non-reigning family; his family is used to mingle in royal and noble circles without seeking media attention.

It could be a mix of things. The media has to be interested in them too. There are many royal family members who do not court the press but are constantly hounded by the press.

Prince Joachim at Archduke Alexander's wedding. He looks more and more like his father.
https://www.imago-images.com/st/0306466123

Lovely photo. Is it known if he brought a date with him to this celebration?

Maria Laura has some features of Archduke Lorenz’s father, Archduke Robert.

She looks a lot more like her mother.

They also do not abuse their titles or connections to the Belgian royal family to make money unlike some in other families, titled or untitled. Plus they don’t do royal duties. I’d add that the Belgian media doesn’t bother them too.

Is it confirmed that Joachim and his siblings do not do royal duties? They probably received funds from the monarchy due to being princes and princesses, as well as their parents, so you would assume they are required to work for the tax payers that support them.

I personally think he does have a job in the banking world like his father and elder brother, but he simply decided to keep it private, unlike all his sibilings, whose current jobs/studies are publicly known. I don't think somebody as well-connected as Joachim (and who did excellent studies in prestigious universities) would have much trouble to find employment, regardless of his breach of the quarantine law in Spain a few years ago.
It's true that Astrid's children live very anonymously if compared to other nephews/nieces of European sovereigns. I think it's mostly due to the fact that they decided to live abroad, and they always lead a quite private lifestyle. They all have private social media accounts and never seemed interested to become influencers/models, to participate in reality shows or anything like that. And I think also their cousins, Prince Laurent's children, are living rather privately if compared to others in the same position. Only Prince Aymeric has a public Instagram account, but he doesn't post often, he shared pictures in the past where he was with his close friends, Maria Carolina and Maria Chiara of Bourbon-Two Sicilies, but nothing really significant

Why do you think they live this way? Do they receive funds from the Belgian tax payers? The King could certainly use their help in continuing the monarchy, considering his children are still young and finding their way in life.

I'd say it's by choice. The Yorks aside all the families you mention has at least one member that's either no stranger to talking to the press or have chosen a profession that requires living in the public eye. Most often both.
The Estes have chosen to live largely private lives as has the York girls. The attention the latter get are mostly the result of the unfortunate choices of their two parents.

The York siblings also do not receive tax payer funds. It is unclear as to what kind of funds they receive from the monarchy.

 

[Somebody]

Why do you think they live so privately? It seems quite strange considering the Belgian monarchy granted Joachim and his siblings certain titles. Princess Astrid shouldn't be the only one working for Belgium all the time.

They received the titles at a time when there were no other grandchildren... It seems king Baudouin mainly wanted to be sure that if Philippe didn't end up having children, the crown wouldn't go to Laurent but to Astrid (and her descendants). Since about 10 years later the future queen, Elisabeth, was born, in the end there was no need for Astrid's children to become involved in royal activities.

Although some members of other royal houses did this, it seems like a misuse of status and titles for Astrid's children to be shrouded in secrecy instead of being more involved with the monarchy, the King, and their other royal houses through their father's side.

Do you think the King will follow the steps of the Danish Queen and strip them of titles?

I don't think Philippe wants his nephews and nieces to be more involved - and given their discrete use of their titles, there is no reason to strip them off them (in which case they would revert back to using their Austrian titles) - even less so, since less than 10 years ago changes were made as to whom is entitled to which title. There is no relation to being involved in royal activity.

It could be a mix of things. The media has to be interested in them too. There are many royal family members who do not court the press but are constantly hounded by the press.

True but in many cases it is going both ways. If certain members of a royal family do not court the media (or need the media for their causes), the media will at some point seize their interest normally. For example, in the Netherlands, there is a lot of interest in one of the king's nieces who has an active social media profile but not in his other nieces and nephew.

Is it confirmed that Joachim and his siblings do not do royal duties? They probably received funds from the monarchy due to being princes and princesses, as well as their parents, so you would assume they are required to work for the tax payers that support them.

There is no relationship between being titled and receiving a dotation. The dotation is reserved for a very small number of family members. Currently, the king's siblings do receive a dotation but the future queen's siblings do and will not. So, it is even further curtailed.

Why do you think they live this way? Do they receive funds from the Belgian tax payers? The King could certainly use their help in continuing the monarchy, considering his children are still young and finding their way in life.


The York siblings also do not receive tax payer funds. It is unclear as to what kind of funds they receive from the monarchy.

Why would the king need help? He's got a wife and siblings to help out (and there isn't really that much to do for his siblings; let alone for their children). His children at times help out as well. I don't think anyone in Belgium feels the need to expand the pool of royal workers.

 

[maria-olivia]

Please remain in Belgium.
Princess Astrid always wanted privacy for her Children.
They studied abroad and are living abroad.
Prince Lorenz is working in Banks and provided work to his Sons.
Prince Joachim did a big mistake during Covid , he asked to go to Spain for work but it was a for a party with many guests. He paid 5000 euros !
They don't receive funds from we taxpayers and have not royal duties.
Amen

 

[Tatiana Maria]

and given their discrete use of their titles, there is no reason to strip them off them (in which case they would revert back to using their Austrian titles)

I fully agree that discretion is the best possible way for non-working royals to handle being titled.

A minor clarification : The royal court did not refer to Amedeo and Maria Laura by their paternal family's pretended Austrian titles before they were created Prince and Princess of Belgium.

They received the titles at a time when there were no other grandchildren... It seems king Baudouin mainly wanted to be sure that if Philippe didn't end up having children, the crown wouldn't go to Laurent but to Astrid (and her descendants).

For King Baudouin and the Government, the publicly known reason for reforming the succession to the crown in 1991 was that they wanted to end the sex discrimination. See the information here:

Belgian Abdication, Succession and Constitutional Issues

Prince Laurent has indeed stated he believes King Baudouin's real motive was to ensure the crown would never reach Laurent, and there are royal experts who share his opinion. But the accusation is unproven and King Albert II has denied it.

The dotation is reserved for a very small number of family members. Currently, the king's siblings do receive a dotation but the future queen's siblings do and will not. So, it is even further curtailed.

That's exactly right. For anyone interested, here is the royal court's simple explanation of the current legislation (since 2014) dictating who in the Royal Family can and cannot receive taxpayer funds:

https://www.monarchie.be/en/information/contact

I don't think Philippe wants his nephews and nieces to be more involved -

I second this. I am afraid I haven't saved the reports, but I remember media reports on several occasions (discussed here on TRF at least once) which alleged that Princess Astrid and Prince Laurent were hurt and upset as they had been sidelined by King Philippe and he did not acknowledge (e.g. in official reports) all of their work events. The reports were not denied, if I recall, and they were consistent with the low profile that King Philippe has assigned to his siblings (Astrid is less prominent on the court's website and its social media compared to Gabriel, for example).

With Philippe's seeming reluctance to allow Astrid a prominent role, I cannot imagine him permitting her children to take on working royal duties. (And, as you said, there is no public demand for having so many working royals.)

Please remain in Belgium.

What do you mean by that?

 

[coninja]

Please remain in Belgium.
Princess Astrid always wanted privacy for her Children.
They studied abroad and are living abroad.
Prince Lorenz is working in Banks and provided work to his Sons.
Prince Joachim did a big mistake during Covid , he asked to go to Spain for work but it was a for a party with many guests. He paid 5000 euros !
They don't receive funds from we taxpayers and have not royal duties.
Amen

Why do you think Princess Astrid wants this for her children ? They are royals, they have protection so it is strange for them to live somewhere other than Belgium.
Prince Lorenz helping his sons with their careers is good, and they are lucky to have that opportunity.
Prince Joachim's COVID scandal is strange- what did he do? There was a lot of speculation at the time but nothing was said about it afterwards.
It is hard to believe that Princess Astrid, Prince Lorenz and their children do not receive tax payer funds, when it is said that Prince Laurent does. There is a reason why they do not have royal duties, but they won't tell the public.

I fully agree that discretion is the best possible way for non-working royals to handle being titled.

A minor clarification : The royal court did not refer to Amedeo and Maria Laura by their paternal family's pretended Austrian titles before they were created Prince and Princess of Belgium.




For King Baudouin and the Government, the publicly known reason for reforming the succession to the crown in 1991 was that they wanted to end the sex discrimination. See the information here:

Belgian Abdication, Succession and Constitutional Issues

Prince Laurent has indeed stated he believes King Baudouin's real motive was to ensure the crown would never reach Laurent, and there are royal experts who share his opinion. But the accusation is unproven and King Albert II has denied it.




That's exactly right. For anyone interested, here is the royal court's simple explanation of the current legislation (since 2014) dictating who in the Royal Family can and cannot receive taxpayer funds:

Emoluments | The Belgian Monarchy




I second this. I am afraid I haven't saved the reports, but I remember media reports on several occasions (discussed here on TRF at least once) which alleged that Princess Astrid and Prince Laurent were hurt and upset as they had been sidelined by King Philippe and he did not acknowledge (e.g. in official reports) all of their work events. The reports were not denied, if I recall, and they were consistent with the low profile that King Philippe has assigned to his siblings (Astrid is less prominent on the court's website and its social media compared to Gabriel, for example).

With Philippe's seeming reluctance to allow Astrid a prominent role, I cannot imagine him permitting her children to take on working royal duties. (And, as you said, there is no public demand for having so many working royals.)




What do you mean by that?

Their Austrian titles are fake? I don't see how that is "pretended" but I agree with you that they have a right to be out of the spotlight even though they have titles.
That is good that the sex discrimination was ended in 1991, a lot of major changes in the world was made that year.

It is not shocking that Astrid and Laurent are upset about being sidelined. They are royals too, and should be given opportunities to represent the Belgian monarchy on a more official level as well as their children. Most of the monarchies around the world do not sideline blood royals.
Do you think this is what King Phillipe wants, or is there a different reason ?

Prince Mateen of Brunei just married, and it was stated that he will be given a counselor of state role. Mateen is not heir to the throne. Why doesn't the Belgian monarchy give the king's siblings and their children similar roles that help represent the monarchy ? Can they be at least ambassadors of Belgium ? Denying blood royals opportunities to elevate the monarchy seems counterproductive.

 

[Blog Real]

I saw on Linkedin that Joachim works at the company Innesto Partner in Brussels, Belgium.

 

[Somebody]

Why do you think Princess Astrid wants this for her children ? They are royals, they have protection so it is strange for them to live somewhere other than Belgium.
Prince Lorenz helping his sons with their careers is good, and they are lucky to have that opportunity.
Prince Joachim's COVID scandal is strange- what did he do? There was a lot of speculation at the time but nothing was said about it afterwards.
It is hard to believe that Princess Astrid, Prince Lorenz and their children do not receive tax payer funds, when it is said that Prince Laurent does. There is a reason why they do not have royal duties, but they won't tell the public.

Astrid does receive a rotation, just like her brother. Only in between the children being included in the line of succession and the birth of princess Elisabeth was there a real chance of Amedeo becoming king in the future and thus occupying a royal role. Once Philippe was married and had Elisabeth (and Gabriel) it was clear there would not be a royal role for him nor his siblings. In general, European royal families do not include cousins or nephews and nieces in a public royal role - especially for the younger generations. They might be included in some larger family events but that’s about it. Even siblings are more and more sidelined.

I don’t see what else needed to be said about Joachim’s unfortunate Covid violation.

Their Austrian titles are fake? I don't see how that is "pretended" but I agree with you that they have a right to be out of the spotlight even though they have titles.
That is good that the sex discrimination was ended in 1991, a lot of major changes in the world was made that year.

It is not shocking that Astrid and Laurent are upset about being sidelined. They are royals too, and should be given opportunities to represent the Belgian monarchy on a more official level as well as their children. Most of the monarchies around the world do not sideline blood royals.
Do you think this is what King Phillipe wants, or is there a different reason ?

Prince Mateen of Brunei just married, and it was stated that he will be given a counselor of state role. Mateen is not heir to the throne. Why doesn't the Belgian monarchy give the king's siblings and their children similar roles that help represent the monarchy ? Can they be at least ambassadors of Belgium ? Denying blood royals opportunities to elevate the monarchy seems counterproductive.

Making royals ambassadors (or governor generals) is a relic from the past. In the exceptional case a royal is given that role it is based on their own merit (prince Jaime de Bourbon de Parme comes to mind).

As stated above, the general trend in Europe is to reduce the number of family members working full-time for the monarchy. There is limited appetite for siblings let alone cousins or nieces and nephews such as Joachim and his siblings. What would 8 additional royals (5 children by Astrid and 3 by Laurent) and their (future) spouses need to do on a daily basis? In addition to Elisabeth’s 3 siblings (and future spouses). And who would want to pay for that? It would amount to about 1 royal per 400.000 Belgians (30 active royals for close to 12 million inhabitants).

 

[Linda_26]

I saw on Linkedin that Joachim works at the company Innesto Partner in Brussels, Belgium.

It seems he moved back to Belgium indeed. He is the managing partner of Innesto Partners (and also the founder of the company):

Joachim de Belgique

He goes by "de Belgique" in his professional life, like all his sibilings

 

[Marengo]

It must be a start-up?
They were founded in september 2023, as per an announcement in the Staatsblad.
I can not find an office though the company is registered in Uccle, Brussels, in what seems to be an unremarkable apartment building from the 1980s.

 

[An Ard Ri]

The Prince is very like his father!

 

[Stefan]

The Prince is very like his father!

Only that he has blonde hair etc.

 

[Linda_26]

Some more info about Innesto Partners, the search fund established by Prince Joachim, who is now the President and managing partner of the company:
OUR APPROACH

At this link, also some videos by Joachim, who explains Innesto's origins and shows how they operate. His sister Princess Luisa works for Innesto Partners as well, she's the Vice-President. Both Joachim and Luisa are now based in Brussels, according to their LindekIn profiles.

 

[Tatiana Maria]

Some more info about Innesto Partners, the search fund established by Prince Joachim, who is now the President and managing partner of the company:
OUR APPROACH

At this link, also some videos by Joachim, who explains Innesto's origins and shows how they operate. His sister Princess Luisa works for Innesto Partners as well, she's the Vice-President. Both Joachim and Luisa are now based in Brussels, according to their LindekIn profiles.

How wonderful that the siblings are close enough to go into business together, and that they are now based in Belgium. (The tradition of European royalty living away from their realms is ancient, but this is an area where I agree with the new "modern" idea that if one includes "of Country" as part of one's name or title, one should mainly live in and take into account the interests of said country unless there are compelling reasons otherwise.)

 

[maria-olivia]

In Belgium we know nothing about them and where they are living.

 

[Linda_26]

In Belgium we know nothing about them and where they are living.

I had seen articles about Joachim's new business in the Belgian press as well, last year. And since their LinkedIn profiles are public, it's rather easy to know where they're living. Joachim and Luisa are the only two of the sibilings who currently live in Belgium: Amedeo lives in Basel, Laura in London and Laetitia is studying History at UCL London (she's expected to graduate later this year).

 

[Marengo]

The investment firm he is heading with his business partner and where his sister Luisa is vice president has increased its value in 1 1/2 years to 14,5 million EUR.

Prins Joachim en prinses Luisa hebben geen dotatie nodig. Het ‘gouden duo’ beheert een fonds van 14,5 miljoen euro

Nu de volgende generatie royals geen dotatie meer krijgt, moeten ze zelf voor hun inkomen zorgen. Hoe de drie jongste kinderen van koning Filip en koningin Mathilde dat precies gaan doen, is nog afwachten, maar ze kunnen zeker wat leren van hun nichten en neven. Vooral prins Joachim en prinses...

www.hln.be

 

[coninja]

The investment firm he is heading with his business partner and where his sister Luisa is vice president has increased its value in 1 1/2 years to 14,5 million EUR.

Prins Joachim en prinses Luisa hebben geen dotatie nodig. Het ‘gouden duo’ beheert een fonds van 14,5 miljoen euro

Nu de volgende generatie royals geen dotatie meer krijgt, moeten ze zelf voor hun inkomen zorgen. Hoe de drie jongste kinderen van koning Filip en koningin Mathilde dat precies gaan doen, is nog afwachten, maar ze kunnen zeker wat leren van hun nichten en neven. Vooral prins Joachim en prinses...

www.hln.be

This is a peculiar achievement for such a new firm. I wonder if they built connections over the years while working in hopes of launching this venture.

In Belgium we know nothing about them and where they are living.

Why is this so? The neighboring monarchy seems to cover the activities of its royal family members.

Some more info about Innesto Partners, the search fund established by Prince Joachim, who is now the President and managing partner of the company:
OUR APPROACH

At this link, also some videos by Joachim, who explains Innesto's origins and shows how they operate. His sister Princess Luisa works for Innesto Partners as well, she's the Vice-President. Both Joachim and Luisa are now based in Brussels, according to their LindekIn profiles.

This is a very odd pairing, but it seems to work for the company?

Off topic, but there are rumors circulating that Victoria Ortiz is engaged to a Spanish polo player from Jerez. Any truth to that?

 

[Linda_26]

Off topic, but there are rumors circulating that Victoria Ortiz is engaged to a Spanish polo player from Jerez. Any truth to that?

Yes, it's true. I've seen Victoria's IG stories about the engagement, some days ago. There are articles about it in the Spanish and Belgian press (I've shared an article by Vanitatis in another thread)

Why is this so? The neighboring monarchy seems to cover the activities of its royal family members

As it has already been said, unlike others in the same position, Joachim and his siblings live in a discreet way and don't attract much media attention, good for them!
In any case, it's not entirely true that nothing is known about them: they have LinkedIn profiles which are public, so it's easy to know what they are doing/where they live. And when there's some major news about them, they do feature in the Belgian press (see Amedeo and Maria Laura's weddings and births of their children: both of them also shared pictures of their newborn children, which isn't a given in the collateral lines of some other royal families).

 

[Blog Real]

Prince Joachim, through his spokesperson, denied the rumors about his marriage:

"Prince Joachim didn't receive an invitation to his own wedding. He doesn't even know the woman being presented as his future wife", Hervé Verhoosel, a family spokesperson, jokingly told HLN. "The prince finds it funny, but to be clear, it's all a lie".

Prins Joachim reageert op bizarre aankondiging dat hij gaat trouwen: “Hij kent zijn ‘verloofde’ niet eens”

Prins Joachim (34) gaat trouwen, zo suggereert een website over zijn ‘huwelijk’ op het internet. Maar de zoon van prinses Astrid ontkent het ‘nieuws’ via zijn woordvoerder. “Hij kent de vrouw niet eens met wie hij zogezegd zou trouwen.”

www.hln.be

 

[Marengo]

We decided to delete the posts on this matter as it seemed the poster involved was having a campaign of their own. It is not the first time we have a fantasist here and usually we manage to see through the sharade very quickly, as was the case here.

 

[MarleneKoenig]

I wrote my original report at about 1 am and tweeted it out to Wim and two others ... woked to see Wim had a story with a quote - and obvious the original source was my article .... Prince Joachim of Belgium to marry? Er .... No!!

 

[Marengo]

We had a poster -possibly K.B. herself- spreading claims about this issue several days ago, starting with a link to an obscure online cross word puzzle where the 'relationship' supposedly was mentioned. This triggered a member discussion and research. The wedding invitation and gift register was easy to find and posted here too. The TRF mod. team decided to delete this yesterday -still before your blog post or Mr. Dehandschutters article - exactly to avoid the spread of false rumours and the press drama there is now and which you seem to be proud of. And also because whomever posted this / made these websites, is clearly not in their right mind and, if anything, needs help and not this sort of attention or glee.

I do not know what your original source for the article was as you do not reveal it. You may not realise it was mentioned here. But it seems odd and audacious that you are fishing for credits here and claim to be the original source while at TRF the story was discussed days before your blog post.

 

[maria-olivia]

No luck for the Prince. During Covid he asked the Minister to go to Spain for business. But it was for a girfriend birthday wit 30 persons. He paid the 5000 euros asked for it.

 

[QuestionableTitles]

It was pretty obvious from the start this was fake. I wouldn’t be too surprised if the one person defending her last week was Kimberly herself.

It looks like Prince Joachim has a stalker. Kimberly has not only created a detailed wedding website without any proof of an engagement, let alone a relationship with Joachim, but she as of now, is posting photos of him on her public Instagram. As an outsider following this embarrassing situation unfold, it also makes me uncomfortable and to be honest, worried for Joachim’s safety and that of any future relationships.

I hope Kimberly gets the help she needs.

 

[aliocha]

This video features Prince Joachim of Belgium speaking about his academic and professional journey as an MBA Scholar in 2021.
He reflects on his international background, his motivation for pursuing an MBA, and the way higher education has shaped his professional outlook.


The video was produced in the context of his scholarship with the Boustany Foundation, which supports outstanding students in leading international programmes. Joachim also mentions a professional internship in Monaco, illustrating his interest in finance, entrepreneurship, and international business.


Overall, the video offers a rare and personal insight into Prince Joachim’s profile beyond royal life, highlighting his commitment to education, merit-based achievement, and a career built on professional experience rather than royal status.

 

[aliocha]

Here is an article found on lalibre.be.
(...)

Joachim de Belgique, fils d'Astrid et cofondateur d'Innesto Partners : "Ma valeur ajoutée pour les PME, c'est de travailler dur, pas mon titre royal"

Joachim de Belgique a cofondé le fonds belge Innesto Partners. Doté de moyens à hauteur de 35 millions d'euros, il accompagne les...

www.lalibre.be

 

[iceflower]

Prince Joachim in his role as Co-founder of Innesto Partners has been interviewed for a French business show:

https://twitter.com/x/status/2024114857721643134

 

[aliocha]

You can watch the replay here:
BFM Entreprise - Jeudi 19 février

The interview focuses on investment, European innovation and the role of long-term capital.

 

[maria-olivia]

We don't know where he is living , his parents home ?