Catholic Royals

[An Ard Ri]

But since her mother was Brazilian, and she did live in Brazil as a child, it's not hard to imagine, that she's "half Catholic". But if you say that's not the case, I believe you.

As per Wikipedia Alice Sommerlath father was a descendant of Afonso III of Portugal,so she might well have some Roman Catholic blood.

 

[Kit]

No,not necessarily so.They can opt for the children to choose themselves once they grow older.A wise thing.Or,they can have the baptisms performed by both a minister and a priest,as has happened here as we have several of our protestant House who married Catholics.But then we here are advanced in the way we experience Faith and put it into practice.It is increasingly of this day and age,instead of medieval times
Yes, they must. You can read it in the Catechism

No they must NOT. Lucien is right! The catechism has been changed and adapted many times, the last time in 1992. The rule that they must raise their children catholic only applies in theory. The catholic church can not force all of their members to raise their children catholic, they have simply not the power nor the legal rights to do so. Times most definitely have changed.

 

[Furienna]

As per Wikipedia Alice Sommerlath father was a descendant of Afonso III of Portugal,so she might well have some Roman Catholic blood.

So our first commoner queen for four hundred years has some royal blood after all?

 

[Kit]

yes of course Queen Silvia has some royal blood. It is a well known-fact in Austria and Germany, though apparently not in Sweden.

 

[Meraude]

But since her mother was Brazilian, and she did live in Brazil as a child, it's not hard to imagine, that she's "half Catholic". But if you say that's not the case, I believe you.

That she was familiar with the Catholic church and its rituals doesn't make a person "half Catholic" if there is such a thing, it's whether she has been baptized and brought up in the Catholic or Lutheran faith.

If she had been a Catholic there wouldn't have been any reason for her to change her faith, as Sweden have already had two Catholic Bernadotte queens, Desirée and Joséphine, and one queen of the Dutch Reformed Church, Louise. The only persons who have to be of Lutheran faith in the royal family is the monarch and his/her heirs.

 

[An Ard Ri]

So our first commoner queen for four hundred years has some royal blood after all?

Yes but it came via the King's mistress, Maria Peres de Enxara.

Queen Silvia's mother was born Alice Soares de Toledo,you can read more here.

Alice Sommerlath - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Furienna]

That she was familiar with the Catholic church and its rituals doesn't make a person "half Catholic" if there is such a thing, it's whether she has been baptized and brought up in the Catholic or Lutheran faith.

If she had been a Catholic there wouldn't have been any reason for her to change her faith, as Sweden have already had two Catholic Bernadotte queens, Desirée and Joséphine, and one queen of the Dutch Reformed Church, Louise. The only persons who have to be of Lutheran faith in the royal family is the monarch and his/her heirs.

But haven't many people been raised into two different religious traditions, because their parents come from two different faiths? It's not so hard to imagine, that Silvia and her brothers were more than familiar with the Catholic faith, when their mother was Brazilian and they also lived in Brazil for many years. But if that's totally incorrect, I admit my mistake.

As for whether or not she had to convert, when she became queen of Sweden, maybe she didn't have to. But the historical experience with Desirée and Josephine, who both were allowed to keep their Catholic faith, wouldn't have helped at all. From our 21rst century perspective, it seems very good, that they weren't forced to convert. But us having two Catholic queens in a row wasn't all that popular back then. For example, the Norwegian archbishop refused to coronate Josephine because of her Catholic faith. So even if Louise was Reformed rather than Lutheran, she was a Protestant, which was a relief for many people.

 

[Furienna]

Yes but it came via the King's mistress, Maria Peres de Enxara.

Queen Silvia's mother was born Alice Soares de Toledo,you can read more here.

Alice Sommerlath - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I see. And it also appears that Alfonso III lived in the 13th century, so the royal ancestry is very distant. It's still cool to find out about this though, because I've never heard about it before.

 

[Meraude]

But haven't many people been raised into two different religious traditions, because their parents come from two different faiths? It's not so hard to imagine, that Silvia and her brothers were more than familiar with the Catholic faith, when their mother was Brazilian and they also lived in Brazil for many years. But if that's totally incorrect, I admit my mistake.

Just to have two parents with different religious traditions doesn't mean that they are raised into two different faiths, and to be familiar with a different faith doesn't make you "half-x". I would say that whatever faith Siliva have depends on what religion she has been confirmed into, and it's very possible that it was the Lutheran faith as her uncle was a Lutheran theolog.

Even if the Reformed Dutch Church is Protestant, as well as the Anglican Church (crown princess Margareta and probably queen Louise), that doesn't make their beliefs and rituals identical, so having a parent who practised an different Protestant faith would also influence their children when it comes to religious matters.

 

[Kit]

or maybe, just maybe she doesn't believe in God at all .... she could very well be an atheist for all we know.

 

[Meraude]

or maybe, just maybe she doesn't believe in God at all .... she could very well be an atheist for all we know.

Queen Silvia is not an atheist, she has sponsored a prayer book for the Church of Sweden and there is a prayer in it that she wrote when she was eleven years old. And according to this article, Drottningen ger ut bönbok | Kultur | SvD , while her mother was a Catholic, Silvia, her brothers and father was Lutherans.

 

[Kit]

well as I said it could be. But if you say she is a Lutheran I believe you ;-)

 

[IslandDweller]

Empress Michiko has been widely reported to have been raised Catholic, but this has been hotly contested elsewhere on this forum.

 

[An Ard Ri]

Empress Michiko has been widely reported to have been raised Catholic, but this has been hotly contested elsewhere on this forum.

I knew she had a Catholic education but I never knew that,must do a bit of research.

 

[NotHRH]

Read recently that Queen Letizia of Spain was baptized Catholic, but had never taken part in the sacraments (1st communion, confirmation, etc.) while growing up. She had to play catch-up before marrying Felipe. She was and still is agnostic - unofficially; this is why her 1st marriage was done civilly, and not religiously also. She basically plays the part of a Catholic since marrying Felipe and becoming part of the SRF. I don't understand why she will not own up to her beliefs, instead of misrepresenting them to the public. If she doesn't believe in a higher power, then that is her right, but lying to the citizens of the country in which she is queen is unacceptable IMO.

 

[Furienna]

It is most likely because people in Spain still expect their royals to be faithful Catholics, so it seems like Letizia simply had to downplay her agnosticism.

 

[NotHRH]

It is most likely because people in Spain still expect their royals to be faithful Catholics, so it seems like Letizia simply had to downplay her agnosticism.

Really? I hear Spain is in shambles these days...well so is the rest of the world...just sayin.'

 

[Moonmaiden23]

Exactly. IF Letizia is indeed only going through the motions she is far from alone. She is among the norm, not the exception unfortunately.

 

[Meraude]

<snip> She was and still is agnostic - unofficially; <snip> If she doesn't believe in a higher power, then that is her right, but lying to the citizens of the country in which she is queen is unacceptable IMO.

The difference between an agnostic and an atheist is that while the atheist denies there is a higher power, the agnostic says that she/he doesn't know if there is a higher power or not. So if Letizia is agnostic it's not as if she's lying, just that she doesn't know if there is a God or not. I would think that she isn't the only royal who doesn't have a personal belief in if there is a god/divine power or not, who go to church and follow the rituals as that's what is expected from them.

 

[Countessmeout]

Not attending church does not necessarily make one agnostic, nor does getting married in a civil ceremony. I was baptized catholic but my parents didn't like church so I only went to church with my grandparents, or when a move forced us to attend catholic school. I never had my first communion, confirmation and so on. Didn't mean I didn't believe in God, and in my adult years I have started attending church more often.

Her choice to marry civilly may have been for any number of reasons, including her ex husband and his beliefs.

 

[Meraude]

Nor does being confirmed or getting married in a church or attending church because it's expected of you indicate that you believe in God, so we can't know for sure what Letizia (or any other person) believes in unless they publicly says so.

 

[julia garcia roch]

Read recently that Queen Letizia of Spain was baptized Catholic, but had never taken part in the sacraments (1st communion, confirmation, etc.) while growing up. She had to play catch-up before marrying Felipe. She was and still is agnostic - unofficially; this is why her 1st marriage was done civilly, and not religiously also. She basically plays the part of a Catholic since marrying Felipe and becoming part of the SRF. I don't understand why she will not own up to her beliefs, instead of misrepresenting them to the public. If she doesn't believe in a higher power, then that is her right, but lying to the citizens of the country in which she is queen is unacceptable IMO.

I am sorry. Letizia and her sisters did their first communion.

 

[An Ard Ri]

Queen Letizia made her 1st Holy Communion in 1981 in Oviedo.

https://s1.yimg.com/bt/api/res/1.2/IHkaouWqY5i56exuwUHJeA--/YXBwaWQ9eW5ld3M7Zmk9aW5zZXQ7aD00NjU7aWw9cGxhbmU7cT03NTt3PTYwMA--/http://media.zenfs.com/es-ES/News/Semana/letizia374.jpg

 

[leidi]

Letizia was always pretty outspoken in her agnostic/feminist views (re: abortion and birth control for example) when she was a journalist, and I don't really think she is the kind who goes to mass every Sunday like the church dictates.

She did her confirmation because that was the only way she could have married Felipe, whether she did it out of love or out of necessity, that's for her to know and deal with.

My own mother is not Spanish and grew up in a different christian denomination, converted to catholicism after marrying my father, basically out of convenience because that was Franco's time and it was much easier to live as a catholic, so I can't really judge Letizia for that, although the circumstances are completely different.

 

[TLLK]

And people's views have been known to evolve over time. The beliefs that you embraced as a child, turned away from as a teen/young adult and then upon marrying or having your first child become meaningful again.

Letizia's beliefs and relationship with God are IMHO her business and not mine.

 

[An Ard Ri]

And lets leave it at that and keep the thread on topic

 

[leidi]

I think the most "catholic" or at least the families that you see more at Catholic services and observing traditions are the Belgian-Luxembourg-Lichtenstein-Austria group, who are all related amongst themselves; Spanish, Monegasque and Italian royals seem to be far much more relaxed about it.

 

[MARG]

I don't know about anyone else, but I feel distinctly uncomfortable with the ease with which so many seem to feel they know the intimate details of Queen Letizia's soul and claim she is not a "real Christian", (whatever that is) having been baptised into the RC Church, taking First Communion and then lapsing. Her subsequent Confirmation speaks for itself.

The state of a person's soul is known only to God and any attempt to judge someone and find them wanting is supreme arrogance. Princess Charlene was in a similar situation to Letizia in that she was brought up "not a Roman Catholic". Whether she was a practicing Protestant Christian I do not know, but what I do know is that she made an open and honest decision to convert to Roman Catholicism and is reported to be very devout.

In an open and forward-thinking nation, Queen Maxima is able to continue to practice her RC faith and I would never dream of stating an opinion as to the honesty of her religious practice, just as I would never pass judgment on Queen Mathilde, GD Maria Therese or HGD Stephanie. The same goes for each and every one of their spouses. That is between them and their God.

That being said, why is Queen Letizia allowed to be attacked over her faith on this thread and on this forum? It seems the very antithesis of what TRF is all about/

 

[Marty91charmed]

I agree with what has been said in the previous posts. I think that religion is a private and so intimate part of a person, that has many facets and we will never know everything about it.

 

[NotHRH]

Just stating something I read; just wanted feedback, that's all.