Bowing and Curtseying

[Princess Squirrel]

Thankyou! I’m so impressed by her. I wish her many happy years in our country and I hope she will feel at home.

I totally agree. She might feel a bit homesick at first. I know she spent a while in Canada but that was only for part of the year every year, and although maybe the American and Canadian forum members may hate me for saying this (and I admit I have never been to Canada), I don't think that it is as different to the US as the UK is.

My husband was extremely home sick when he first moved to London. But even he got there in the end (he hasn't been back to the States since 2011 now) despite the autism. Meghan strikes me as a really strong and confident person too, unlike my hubs. But in both their cases, I think having a hugely supportive spouse is key, which I think Harry will be.

Also unlike us, they'll probably have more chances to go back and visit Meghan's family, as money and time restraints won't apply like with us. Well money unlimited but I know they'll have time commitments too, but not like us ordinary working people.

Will be so good to prove all the nay-sayers wrong (as with Kate and Charlene lol).

 

[MaiaMia_53]

I didn’t see the curtsy sadly! Wish I had!

Here's a pretty good video of the royals entering and leaving the church. Scroll to about 2:54 to see the exact moment when Meghan and Kate curtsey, and William and Harry bow their heads, as the Queen departs in her vehicle.

 

[MARG]

I love the way Harry, William and Catherine worked to make Meghan's first public curtsey a 'family affair'. Charles and Camilla were also in on it and they way they teed up the shot was a masterpiece.

https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-pro...7382.jpg?crop=1xw:1xh;center,top&resize=768:*

And check out the look on Prince Philip's face. Awesome.

 

[Darnius]

I think I like her curtsey better than Kate's (in this photo).

http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Members+Royal+Family+Attend+St+Mary+Magdalene+Ot2byU_-ngPl.jpg

 

[Pranter]

Well it's kinda hard to compare them...Meghan was right up against the back of the step it looks like. Also Kate is slightly turned instead of straight on.

I couldn't tell much about Meghan's curtsey this time, except she did it and it went well. I figure we won't see another one until the wedding.


LaRae

 

[O-H Anglophile]

I think I like her curtsey better than Kate's (in this photo).

http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Members+Royal+Family+Attend+St+Mary+Magdalene+Ot2byU_-ngPl.jpg

Kate is also nearly 6 months pregnant, so bending and balance can be a challenge.

 

[irish_royalist]

I love the way Harry, William and Catherine worked to make Meghan's first public curtsey a 'family affair'. Charles and Camilla were also in on it and they way they teed up the shot was a masterpiece.

https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-pro...7382.jpg?crop=1xw:1xh;center,top&resize=768:*

And check out the look on Prince Philip's face. Awesome.

I think this is absolutely delightful - 2 handsome princes and their beautiful partners showing respect to their beloved Queen and, let's not forget, grandmother. Prince Philip looks so proud, and even the Princess Royal looks pleased!

 

[royal rob]

Can’t believe we are talking about who had the best curtsy etc. I really hope it doesn’t come to this

 

[M. Payton]

Guess it sure has come to that......wonder what is next, who hold the cup of tea better, right or left hand.....?

Either way, both ladies did their way and each was perfect in that!

 

[Osipi]

Lets put it this way. Everyone would be able to curtsy better than I can. For me, the definition of curtsy equals "eating the floor".

Its not how they do it or who does it better. Its *why* they do it.

 

[An Ard Ri]

The late Duchess of Alba curtsies to HRH The Infanta Elena at the Palacio Real in Madrid.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/ff/90/4f/ff904ff7c03f7a9a85d4b4159c6d0e55.jpg

 

[MARG]

Can’t believe we are talking about who had the best curtsy etc. I really hope it doesn’t come to this

Guess it sure has come to that......wonder what is next, who hold the cup of tea better, right or left hand.....?

Either way, both ladies did their way and each was perfect in that!

This thread is dedicated to Bowing and Curtseying, that people should comment on technique is a given and, should you care to check out the thread from the beginning I am sure you will find plenty to amuse and entertain you.

Being amazed at the depths Diana and Elena pulled off their curtseys textbook style or having a wee giggle about a wonky knee or bobbly head is almost mandatory. Sniping at other posters is not.

 

[M. Payton]

As I said......*Both ladies did it perfectly and their way*, that in itself was referring to the curtsy that they both did. Sometimes a little sense of humor goes a long way in life. ?

 

[XeniaCasaraghi]

The reason why I said it was controversial is that there is a widespread misconception in the US, which has been actually repeated many times before on TRF, that Americans do not (or should not) bow (or curtsy) to anybody. Ms Markle's curtsy to the Queen would symbolically signify that she is giving up her "American identity" and embracing her new status as a British subject.

Just to make it clear, I don't think that is the case, but I'm pretty sure many Americans would see it that way.

This American is well aware that Meghan has to curtsy because of who she is marrying; there is no controversy for me.

 

[Lisele]

Are you Catholic, Lisele? Here's what fisheaters.com has to say about genuflection:

Genuflection on Left Knee: [FONT=arial, helvetica, verdana, sans-serif]How: Kneel on your left knee for a moment, bringing the left knee all the way to the floor and keeping the back straight. Hold for a moment, then stand.[/FONT] When: [FONT=arial, helvetica, verdana, sans-serif]When greeting or leaving the Pope or other hierarchs with the rank of Bishop or above and who have jurisdiction over you (only when the Pope is not present) -- e.g., to the Bishop or Archbishop of your diocese, not of a neighboring diocese. During the left-knee genuflection, a kiss is given to the hierarch's ring. Then stand.

Genuflection on Right Knee: How: [/FONT][FONT=arial, helvetica, verdana, sans-serif][FONT=arial, helvetica, verdana, sans-serif]Looking at what you are genuflecting toward, kneel on your right knee for a moment in the manner of a man proposing to a woman, bringing the right knee all the way to the floor, close to the heel of the left foot, keeping the back and neck erect. Hold for a moment, then stand. When:
[/FONT][/FONT]

• [FONT=arial, helvetica, verdana, sans-serif]Genuflect toward the Tabernacle where the Blessed Sacrament is reserved, and each time you pass in front of it (except when you're in procession, such as standing in line for Communion, or returning to your seat afterward). While this should, on one level, be a matter of habit, it shouldn't be done thoughtlessly. Remind yourself when genuflecting toward the Tabernacle that you are kneeling before God. Praying mentally, "My Lord and My God" is a good habit to get into while genuflecting on the right knee. If the Tabernacle is not on the Altar, genuflect toward the Altar and the Altar Crucifix. [/FONT]
• [FONT=arial, helvetica, verdana, sans-serif]Before a relic of the True Cross when it is exposed for public adoration. [/FONT]
• [FONT=arial, helvetica, verdana, sans-serif]On Good Friday to Holy Saturday, after the ceremony of the Adoration of the Cross, genuflect when passing in front of the exposed Crucifix on the Altar.[/FONT]
• [FONT=arial, helvetica, verdana, sans-serif]Before entering or after exiting your pew at church.[/FONT]

[FONT=arial, helvetica, verdana, sans-serif]
[/FONT]

I am not (although my husband is Catholic) but my grandmother - may she rest in peace - was a very devout Catholic and insisted I learn to curtsey and genuflect. Thank you for this information

 

[Dman]

There’s a DF article on Meghan “wobbling” during her curtsy. I didn’t notice any wobble. She did just fine, IMO.

The Queen likes quick bobs. It’s the samething she did when she was Princess Elizabeth.

 

[Zonk]

I thought she did a pretty decent job considering that this was her first Public curtsy. I am sure it will become more natural the more she does it.

 

[W.Y.CII]

There’s a DF article on Meghan “wobbling” during her curtsy. I didn’t notice any wobble. She did just fine, IMO.

The Queen likes quick bobs. It’s the samething she did when she was Princess Elizabeth.

I don't see she is wobbling too, but even if she did, I think it's okay and normal. She is still new to this, and it's something that really needs practice

 

[M. Payton]

Goodness, this was the very first time she curtsied in public and before HM no less.Give her a break here. How would anyone at the DF perform that curtsy to HM....me, I would faint dead at her feet. I watched the video a couple of times and could see a bit of nervousness yet that is to be expected after all she is with the most famous family in history and marrying into such.

Catherine is a pro at this and I bet these to girls got together and Catherine showed her how to curtsy ...........this is girl talk here. These 2 young ladies are going to be very good friends I think.

 

[Stefanie]

Meghan's curtsy IMO was too short and not deep enough.
I have the feeling that she finds curtsying silly and therefore didn' t follow Kate' s possible training but decided on her own what is "enough".....

 

[O-H Anglophile]

Meghan's curtsy IMO was too short and not deep enough.
I have the feeling that she finds curtsying silly and therefore didn' t follow Kate' s possible training but decided on her own what is "enough".....

It didn't need to be deep or sustained, a bob would have been enough. It is a sign of respect, a courtesy, not a requirement.

 

[jacqui24]

This American is well aware that Meghan has to curtsy because of who she is marrying; there is no controversy for me.

I think a lot of the talk of controversy stemmed from when Barack Obama bowed to the Queen, which was unusual for a President. And technically, Meghan, still as an American, isn't required to do so. Although no one is really required to do so these days. However, I always expected that she would follow the same tradition as the Queen's grandchildren and other grandchildren-in-laws. I don't think I've seen any controversy surrounding this from Americans. Obama was a different situation on many levels.

Meghan's curtsy IMO was too short and not deep enough.
I have the feeling that she finds curtsying silly and therefore didn' t follow Kate' s possible training but decided on her own what is "enough".....

None of the curtsies are supposed to last long with the exception of some special occasions. Typically it would just be a quick dip. And there was a video of the curtsy, hers lasted about the same amount of time as Kate's and she was actually lowered about the same or slightly more. Her left foot just wasn't as far to the right.

Can’t believe we are talking about who had the best curtsy etc. I really hope it doesn’t come to this

We all know this was coming. And it's not even a simple style of minor different techniques (how far the foot goes back versus to the side), but of course it'd be who did it better. Next it'll be who shook hands better.

BTW, can someone clarify are they supposed to bow their head a little or not when they curtsy? I thought I read that's how it's supposed to be. But I do notice that doesn't always happen.

 

[loonytick]

I think photos give a skewed impression of difference between the two curtseys because Kate and Meghan weren't totally in sync (nor did they need to be). Meghan's happened a hair earlier than Kate's, so the still pictures that show both mid-curtsey are of Kate at her deepest point while Meghan is midway through straightening back up.

 

[Somebody]

Meghan's curtsy IMO was too short and not deep enough.
I have the feeling that she finds curtsying silly and therefore didn' t follow Kate' s possible training but decided on her own what is "enough".....

The princesses of the blood behind her didn't curtsey at all. So, they could have easily avoided it but didn't. So, to me it looks like a (practiced) sign of respect of the brothers and their wife/fiancée for their (future) grandmother the queen (and as Harry and Meghan stayed with William and Catherine they had lots of time to practice in between the playing with George and Charlotte - still Meghan seemed rather nervous). So, I see no reason at all to think that she finds it silly: she is clearly adopting all the different customs of her new life/family as well as she possibly can. It won't be perfect but she has years of fine-tuning ahead of her.

 

[jacqui24]

Yea, I don't see how she showed anything that seemed she thinks it's silly. When I watched the engagement interview, it was clear that she has a lot of respect, and dare I say in awe, of the Queen.

 

[W.Y.CII]

It may be too short, may be not deep enough (which I partially agree, and I even think Kate's curtsy is so-so too), because obviously she is doing it carefully, because she still doesn't fully adapt it. Come on, it is her first event that needs a curtsy in her whole life. I don't see how it can be interpreted as "she finds it's silly".

 

[O-H Anglophile]

The princesses of the blood behind her didn't curtsey at all.

Probably because they had already seen their mother/grandmother at Sandringham that morning. I believe the rule is you only need to curtsey/bow at your first meeting of the day. So this was the first time the Cambridges and Harry & Meghan had seen the Queen that day.

 

[Curbside]

I thought Meghan's curtsy looked like Kate's, although M's eyes were downcast during part of the curtsy. She looked pretty natural to me.

 

[jacqui24]

I just had a random question pop into my head. Has any of the older ladies in the BRF been waived from the curtsying yet? I imagine, at some point, age makes curtsying difficult for various reasons(joint issues, etc.).

 

[AdmirerUS]

I don't think we could ever know this. Because the ever gracious Elizabeth and her staff would feel no need to disclose this. It would border on demeaning, depending on who we were talking about. And we would have no way of knowing as long as they met first for the event in private.

From a practical POV, I am quite sure at some point the arm hug/curtsey move gets adjusted on both ends as one or the other person ages/gets less flexible. From a practical POV, I would not be be surprised to know there or older or sicker females who migrate to a head bow, eventually. Equally, I am sure there are elders who practice their curtsey just so that they can keep doing it for HM. And finally, anyone meeting the Queen in a wheelchair or abed (infirm) would of course not curtesy.