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-   -   The Duke & Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 4: April-June 2021 (https://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f166/the-duke-and-duchess-of-sussex-and-family-news-and-events-4-april-june-2021-a-48523.html)

Erin9 05-22-2021 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Betsypaige (Post 2401538)
It’s the N.Y. Post, but still, this reporter gets it just right. I could comment on any and all of this, but I’ll specifically do so on the part I bolded. Harry blathers on about how Meghan has been mistreated, but she was invited to stay at Sandringham even though she and H weren’t engaged. Charles stepped in for Thomas and walked M down the aisle, something that meant a great deal to H and M. This is a family that warmly welcomed M and, in fact, at least early on, she embraced them. She even encouraged H to bond with his father. Something went wrong - and I believe it’s that both Harry and Meghan couldn’t deal with the fact that, as loved and cared about and valued as they were, they were on a different plane than the Cambridges.



.



https://nypost.com/2021/05/22/prince...mpression=true



This is a good article. All of it. This is indeed an “epic temper tantrum” IMO.

I certainly agree that the RF’s carefully crafted image of him was far superior to the one he’s given us now.


“Most shockingly, Harry offers more details about Meghan’s suicidal ideations while pregnant with Archie — with no thought to how this will surely affect his son. “

I’ve mentioned a couple of times how shocking it was that Harry stated the above, but I’m glad to see some media picking up on how wrong it was to say this publicly.

“Yet Harry tells us that four years of counseling has made him all better! Harry is therapized, Americanized and ready to go, becoming one of our specialties — a self-help guru who’s really only in it to sate his narcissism.”

Narcissism is a word I’m starting to see applied to both of them- in the media and in my own conversations. Not a good look.

US Royal Watcher 05-22-2021 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 (Post 2401458)
So....if Charles had caved to Harry's demands for financial support none of this "truth" would have ever seen the light of day? I wonder if Harry at least warned "Pa" ahead of time about the consequences of saying NO to him.....:ermm:

I think Harry truly has unresolved issues with Charles but I don't think he would have gone public if Charles had given him as much money as he wanted. IIRC, the comment about his father letting him down was made while discussing the family cutting him off financially.

I disagree with those who think their appeal will wear off soon. It will taper off but both very good looking and no matter how much people deny it, there is interest in the British royal family. The companies they are dealing with will help keep them in the spotlight.

When the Queen passes, there will be a huge spike in interest and he will be be the son of the King. When Charles passes on there will be another renewal of interest, but I think that will be the last gasp. Presumably William's children, as well as Harry's, will be the beautiful young, interesting adults.

Sandy345 05-22-2021 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moran (Post 2401233)
I'm thinking of the children in my extended family and the thought of kissing up to someone who is in any way involved in mocking them is simply unconceivable. It's sad to see that a beloved prince, a HRH of the UK is forced into name-dropping but the Prince George element is simply unforgivable, given the fact that Harry and Meghan sued someone who had pictured what, the back of their own son's head? It's different with your own child and your nephew, of course, but still, it isn't any child from the street. George isn't old enough to show his jealousy over Harry's successes. Harry just doesn't give a fig about this child of his own blood, his privacy and his confidence. That's one of the reasons I agree with Muhler that funny Harry with his heart on his sleeve likely never existed, he was just an ELF creation. It's his own nephew but kissing up to real Hollywood prince was more important. Compassionate? I don't think Harry knows what the word means.

Harry loves his nephew. He spoke about him many times. Supposedly, before the exit, he was invited less by the Cambridges to see the children.

Denville 05-22-2021 01:59 PM

He has an odd way of showing love... No doubt he loves his son, but he and Meghan have talked about her possibly committing suicide when she was carrying Archie.. that's not going to be very easy for Arch to hear about when he is old enough to understand. and it seems he's been palling around with this guy who is in the cartoon about George.. If he were doing a carttoon on Archie, the Sussexes would problaby be kicking up

Moran 05-22-2021 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandy345 (Post 2401554)
Harry loves his nephew. He spoke about him many times. Supposedly, before the exit, he was invited less by the Cambridges to see the children.

Harry said many things that he has been contradicting with his current talks and behavior. Having said that he loves his nephew doesn't mean a thing when he's palling around with the man parodying him while kicking an allmighty fuss about the back of his own son's head being photographed (with Meghan beaming at the camera, no less). He has different concepts of privacy and respect for his son and nephew, just like for himself and his former family. The one he effectively sacked and then tried to rip apart in every media that would have him.

ACO 05-22-2021 02:10 PM

That cartoon is by a man who has trashed Meghan for years. She (and the rest of the royals) are all on the show that has been "postponed". He not hanging out with Orlando Bloom. His own wife is an ambassador for the Prince Trust, IIRC. I remember something with her and Prince Charles not that long ago. Anyways. It seems they are part of a community watch, which isn't all that surprising in a community like that.

As for Archie and his sister knowing the royals? Time will tell. I have no doubt they will explain plenty to them when they are old enough. Not like they will have to look very far to see and hear why the family fell out. I am sure Archie will have lots of questions about a lot of things regarding his family.

No one can say one way or another how interest in the Sussexes will fair. As pointed about... Harry will still be the son and then the brother of the next kings. Who knows how successful Archewell and their new life will be. It is all unknowns.

And the kids will inevitably take the spotlight but if Archie and his sister are attractive and even remotely interesting they will be right up there with their other royals cousins grabbing interest by the media.

It really is the same old stuff.

Royalist.in.NC 05-22-2021 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kataryn (Post 2401328)
Well worth the read, especially as the Guardian is not normally much interested in the RFbut for their social and societal influences:
https://www.theguardian.com/commenti...-bbc-scapegoat

This is a really good and honest article, I think! Thanks for sharing

Sunnystar 05-22-2021 02:22 PM

Another thing that strikes me... If Harry had all this anger bottled up inside him and a fight with Meghan, at some point fairly early on in their relationship since he's been in therapy thanks to her for the last four years... Before she started dating him, she asked her friend "Is he kind?" If this is the "kind" Harry she got to know, helped get into therapy, I question her understanding of the word at all.

Denville 05-22-2021 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunnystar (Post 2401564)
Another thing that strikes me... If Harry had all this anger bottled up inside him and a fight with Meghan, at some point fairly early on in their relationship since he's been in therapy thanks to her for the last four years... Before she started dating him, she asked her friend "Is he kind?" If this is the "kind" Harry she got to know, helped get into therapy, I question her understanding of the word at all.

well until this outburst of Harry in a rage, that we've had the last 2 months, I would have said that Harry was a kind person...

ACO 05-22-2021 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denville (Post 2401561)
how will Archie take the spotlight? HIs parents claimed repeatedly that hes not a publlc figure, that they dont want him photographed or to appear in any public way...he wont be using any title I presume.. so how will he be noticed any more than a lot of rich kids in California?

I didn't say Archie will take the spotlight. That will be the Cambridge kids who will grab the attention once they are teens and the media can start shaping narratives about them. That said if Archie and his sister are good looking and interesting, then yes people likely will be curious in them. That is just the way life is.

Denville 05-22-2021 02:31 PM

I dont see why. Archie and his sister will be just cousins of hte RF, who are not well known.. Surely Meg and Harry wont want them to be well known. They will be rich California kids of whom there are many,...

UglyAmerican 05-22-2021 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by US Royal Watcher (Post 2401553)
I think Harry truly has unresolved issues with Charles but I don't think he would have gone public if Charles had given him as much money as he wanted. IIRC, the comment about his father letting him down was made while discussing the family cutting him off financially.

I have to disagree with you here. I think it would have taken longer and maybe been more of a gradual process, but I don't think it would have been too terribly long before Harry (perhaps with some 'assistance' from Meghan) realized that whatever amount they'd agreed to wasn't sufficient for the lifestyle he wanted, and then they'd be back to square one arguing about an increase. If Charles gave in the first time, it would have happened over and over again, until Charles finally either put his foot down or ran out of money. And once that happened, the situation would be the same as it is now.

Plus, they seem to be mad about a whole lot of other things, with money being the least of them. I don't think either would have been content to stay silent forever rather than "speaking their truth."

Osipi 05-22-2021 02:33 PM

One thing that bothers me is Harry's thinking that he's admitted to that he was/is honestly afraid of losing the woman that he wants to spend the rest of his life with. I'm sincerely starting to wonder if the Harry we're seeing right now is the Harry he feels he needs to be to hold onto the relationship he has. It's not uncommon for someone to feel that in order to be attractive and worthy in someone else's eyes, they have to be the kind of person that they think the other person wants. In the process of doing this, they lose all sense of themselves and who they really are.

It stands out to me that there is a Harry before Meghan and a Harry after Meghan. What we don't know and it comfuzzles us is who is the real Harry.

Denville 05-22-2021 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 2401572)
One thing that bothers me is Harry's thinking that he's admitted to that he was/is honestly afraid of losing the woman that he wants to spend the rest of his life with. I'm sincerely starting to wonder if the Harry we're seeing right now is the Harry he feels he needs to be to hold onto the relationship he has. It's not uncommon for someone to feel that in order to be attractive and worthy in someone else's eyes, they have to be the kind of person that they think the other person wants. In the process of doing this, they lose all sense of themselves and who they really are.

It stands out to me that there is a Harry before Meghan and a Harry after Meghan. What we don't know and it comfuzzles us is who is the real Harry.

True i remember the first year of their marriage, there was a huge change in Harry. I didn't really follow him.. and I wasn't a big fan.. but what began to emerge was this strange, very emotional odd guy who seemed noting like the cheerful warm guy he had been. And I wondered which was the real Harry. Now it seems like the real Harry (?) is a very angry bitter volatile man with a real problem in working out the truth....

US Royal Watcher 05-22-2021 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UglyAmerican (Post 2401570)
I have to disagree with you here. I think it would have taken longer and maybe been more of a gradual process, but I don't think it would have been too terribly long before Harry (perhaps with some 'assistance' from Meghan) realized that whatever amount they'd agreed to wasn't sufficient for the lifestyle he wanted, and then they'd be back to square one arguing about an increase. If Charles gave in the first time, it would have happened over and over again, until Charles finally either put his foot down or ran out of money. And once that happened, the situation would be the same as it is now.

Plus, they seem to be mad about a whole lot of other things, with money being the least of them. I don't think either would have been content to stay silent forever rather than "speaking their truth."

I agree with you about increasing demands. What I was trying to say is we wouldn't have the current spate tell-all interviews if Charles had given them more money last year. Harry was also royally upset when he lost his military ceremonial positions but I don't think that alone would have prompted the need for revenge.

However, as you point out, I don't know that any amount of money will be enough for them. When someone who is worth millions of dollars complains that his family cut him off, it reveals that he is greedy to the core.

Somebody 05-22-2021 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 2401572)
One thing that bothers me is Harry's thinking that he's admitted to that he was/is honestly afraid of losing the woman that he wants to spend the rest of his life with. I'm sincerely starting to wonder if the Harry we're seeing right now is the Harry he feels he needs to be to hold onto the relationship he has. It's not uncommon for someone to feel that in order to be attractive and worthy in someone else's eyes, they have to be the kind of person that they think the other person wants. In the process of doing this, they lose all sense of themselves and who they really are.

It stands out to me that there is a Harry before Meghan and a Harry after Meghan. What we don't know and it comfuzzles us is who is the real Harry.

Great point. That's probably the deeper issue regarding my wondering whether Harry is mainly trying to convince himself of this new narrative...

Betsypaige 05-22-2021 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erin9 (Post 2401552)
This is a good article. All of it. This is indeed an “epic temper tantrum” IMO.

I certainly agree that the RF’s carefully crafted image of him was far superior to the one he’s given us now.


“Most shockingly, Harry offers more details about Meghan’s suicidal ideations while pregnant with Archie — with no thought to how this will surely affect his son. “

I’ve mentioned a couple of times how shocking it was that Harry stated the above, but I’m glad to see some media picking up on how wrong it was to say this publicly.

“Yet Harry tells us that four years of counseling has made him all better! Harry is therapized, Americanized and ready to go, becoming one of our specialties — a self-help guru who’s really only in it to sate his narcissism.”

Narcissism is a word I’m starting to see applied to both of them- in the media and in my own conversations. Not a good look.

Harry and Meghan apparently think that if they think something is a truth, it must be said...they don’t understand that some things are better left unsaid. They were so concerned about privacy that they refused to release any information about Archie’s godparents, yet here they are referring to him in extremely personal stories. It’s interesting that he doesn’t mind invading his family’s privacy, but he sure as heck minds if others “invade” his, M’s and A’s.

Another thing that bothers me is his constantly mentioning Diana - and not in a healthy way. All he has to do is refer to her and he’s got automatic support from those in America who passionately love her and loathe Charles. He’s been systematically laying the groundwork for these interviews - constantly referring to himself as Diana’s son or my mother’s son, especially on the Archewell site. There’s been an erasure of Charles from Harry’s life in a positive way, like in Back to the Future, where Marty’s family disappears from the photo after he’s changed history. This erasure has lead up to the attacks on Charles, and I imagine they’ll continue.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denville (Post 2401569)
I dont see why. Archie and his sister will be just cousins of hte RF, who are not well known.. Surely Meg and Harry wont want them to be well known. They will be rich California kids of whom there are many,...

I agree. Some may be interested, but only a tiny percentage of the 330 million Americans....H and M are barely covered by mainstream media here, and I mean barely; their daughter will get some publicity when she’s born, and that’s it

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 2401572)
One thing that bothers me is Harry's thinking that he's admitted to that he was/is honestly afraid of losing the woman that he wants to spend the rest of his life with. I'm sincerely starting to wonder if the Harry we're seeing right now is the Harry he feels he needs to be to hold onto the relationship he has. It's not uncommon for someone to feel that in order to be attractive and worthy in someone else's eyes, they have to be the kind of person that they think the other person wants. In the process of doing this, they lose all sense of themselves and who they really are.

It stands out to me that there is a Harry before Meghan and a Harry after Meghan. What we don't know and it comfuzzles us is who is the real Harry.

I was concerned when FF indicated that he was “obsessed” with Meghan early on, so yes I think you make excellent points.

Meghan, to me, is not a warm person, and she has a harsh way of dealing with people (family, too) who displease her or are no longer of value. That sounds like Harry now.

Royalist.in.NC 05-22-2021 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 2401530)
It's not the diminishing returns that is striking a bit of fear in my heart for Harry but a sinking feeling that once the attention and the adulation and the sense that people are agog to hear him tell his stories that it'll be then he will hit what is called "rock bottom". This is when he'll really need someone to listen to him and a good support system. Sometimes though it takes hitting a rock bottom to realize that the only way from there is up and changes start to be made. I also have a problem somewhat with references to Harry's addiction. Using alcohol and drugs to "escape" doesn't necessarily mean an addiction but a crutch. The only person that can claim an addiction is the addict themselves. No one else makes that diagnosis for him. Only Harry knows how much of a problem alcohol or drugs have been in his life. Addiction is a serious problem all by itself and it doesn't necessarily point to poor mental health either but can be a symptom of poor mental health. It's a tricky area left to professionals.

As far as Harry's programs that have already aired so far, I noticed yesterday that there was someone on Facebook that asked the question "Am I the only one that didn't watch the Harry and Meghan interview?" The responses (a lot of them) surprised me. No, they didn't watch the actual interview but knew what was in it and what was said because it was impossible to miss the feedback after the interview aired and none of the opinions given were in favor of the Sussexes.

Now, perhaps we're going to have a period of quiet from Harry and Meghan. Until their daughter is born and then to find out just how Harry chooses to handle the unveiling of Diana's statue at KP on July 1st.

And maybe he will need to hit rock bottom before he can heal. I hope the EMDR will truly help him. I’m not trained to do this but colleagues who are say that it is amazing how the intensity of the trauma dissipates. I hope that Harry will continue until this is true for him as well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Betsypaige (Post 2401538)
It’s the N.Y. Post, but still, this reporter gets it just right. I could comment on any and all of this, but I’ll specifically do so on the part I bolded. Harry blathers on about how Meghan has been mistreated, but she was invited to stay at Sandringham even though she and H weren’t engaged. Charles stepped in for Thomas and walked M down the aisle, something that meant a great deal to H and M. This is a family that warmly welcomed M and, in fact, at least early on, she embraced them. She even encouraged H to bond with his father. Something went wrong - and I believe it’s that both Harry and Meghan couldn’t deal with the fact that, as loved and cared about and valued as they were, they were on a different plane than the Cambridges.

.

https://nypost.com/2021/05/22/prince...mpression=true

Wow, thanks for sharing this. Can’t get past their paywall. Maybe I am being too cynical, but I have to agree that there seems to be some “we’re just as important as the Cambridge’s so treat us the same”. In all the research Meg said she didn’t do, it’s a shame she didn’t read more about the hierarchical nature of the RF.

Heavs 05-22-2021 03:07 PM

I had EMDR last year and I was hugely sceptical but it really helped. So I hope it is helping Harry but I'm not sure any therapist would recommend continuing to publicly blame everyone else around you for what went wrong and seeming to wallow in your anger and create new narratives out of it.

A thing that srikes me is that if Harry is actually telling some version of the truth that his drink and drug taking increased 2012-2016 then William was even more correct to encourage Harry to take things very slowly with Meghan.

Can you imagine someone who is heavily using or has just stopped heavily using and doesn't know who they are without substances getting into an intense relationship that quickly lead to marriage with the whole world watching and right after that a baby and everything else? It's a huge amount even for someone who's mentally well and by their own admission this couple were not.

Betsypaige 05-22-2021 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royalist.in.NC (Post 2401591)
Wow, thanks for sharing this. Can’t get past their paywall. Maybe I am being too cynical, but I have to agree that there seems to be some “we’re just as important as the Cambridge’s so treat us the same”. In all the research Meg said she didn’t do, it’s a shame she didn’t read more about the hierarchical nature of the RF.

The NY Post doesn’t have a paywall.... You’re welcome !

That’s true about Meghan, but Harry should have known that William’s importance does not mean that H is loved or valued any less. If he was concerned about that, he should have spoken to his father...but if he kept that all inside, that’s in him; people can’t help if they don’t know what’s wrong. So H and M request their own court - HM says no, C supports her. Then C finally stops the money drain. Now H, having built up all this resentment, attacks his father, the family and the Monarchy. No wonder the BRF are dumbfounded as to where this anger has come from, if H never expressed his concerns about feeling devalued and less loved than W.


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