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-   -   Death and Funeral of HRH The Infanta Pilar,Duchess of Badajoz. January 2020 (https://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f21/death-and-funeral-of-hrh-the-infanta-pilar-duchess-of-badajoz-january-2020-a-47070.html)

Duke of Marmalade 02-01-2020 05:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somebody (Post 2289775)
However, it's great to see that several fellow royals made the trip to Spain (or attended while living in Spain) to pay their respects at the service in honor of the infanta.

Unfortunately, it again shows the extreme coldness (close to hatred) between the sisters-in-law. They truly cannot stand each other; I don't get the same vibe from their brother.


Letizia looks super uncomfortable as soon as she is confronted with the sisters who on most occasions appear with the Emeritus Kings.
It's clear who has sided with whom.

And Felipe between a rock and a hard place.

donnaK 02-01-2020 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade (Post 2289838)
Letizia looks super uncomfortable as soon as she is confronted with the sisters who on most occasions appear with the Emeritus Kings.
It's clear who has sided with whom.

And Felipe between a rock and a hard place.

Maybe in the old days when JC was still the King. Now I don't see her being uncomfortable with the presence of the sister-in-law, just didn't 'give a damn'.
Elena and Christina are not the members of the royal family anymore. It's not a protocol violation when the Kings didn't greet them. Of course the Kings could choose to greet them (if Elena were alone, they probably would do it), but for obvious reasons they didn't want to.
The family arguments over years centered Christina and Inaki have been over after Inaki went to jail. Now each person is put in their own place. Each does things what they want/need to. The sisters-in-law don't get along well, sure, but no need to over analyze everything.

Somebody 02-01-2020 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by donnaK (Post 2289955)
Maybe in the old days when JC was still the King. Now I don't see her being uncomfortable with the presence of the sister-in-law, just didn't 'give a damn'.
Elena and Christina are not the members of the royal family anymore. It's not a protocol violation when the Kings didn't greet them. Of course the Kings could choose to greet them (if Elena were alone, they probably would do it), but for obvious reasons they didn't want to.
The family arguments over years centered Christina and Inaki have been over after Inaki went to jail. Now each person is put in their own place. Each does things what they want/need to. The sisters-in-law don't get along well, sure, but no need to over analyze everything.

If she didn't care, she would have behaved very differently (this time and before). She 'spotted' them with her eyes (see pictures of her irises in the corner of her eyes) when walking in and then purposefully and somewhat haughtily ignored them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moonmaiden23 (Post 2289798)
I understand that the Spanish Royal Family observes the strictest protocol, and they execute it flawlessly.

But I love to see united and close families convey some hint of warmth even in the midst of a ceremonial occasions and there was absolutely absolutely zero to see of it at La Almudena.

I can remember when Cristina and Felipe were the closest, most complicit of Royal siblings.

They appeared now as they sadly are...irretrievably estranged.

While yes, they seem pretty strict on protocol, still greeting your parents (with queen Sofia needing to bend forward quite a bit to even make that possible) and princess Beatrix with 3 kisses doesn't look like strict protocol to me (a more formal greeting would); neither does having infanta Margarita sit with the family of Infanta Pilar instead of with the other infantas. So, at times they are able to make adjustments...

Mbruno 02-01-2020 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somebody (Post 2289971)
While yes, they seem pretty strict on protocol, still greeting your parents (with queen Sofia needing to bend forward quite a bit to even make that possible) and princess Beatrix with 3 kisses doesn't look like strict protocol to me (a more formal greeting would); neither does having infanta Margarita sit with the family of Infanta Pilar instead of with the other infantas. So, at times they are able to make adjustments...


I have seen many royal funerals, many of them with other monarchs in attendance, and the monarch of the host country usually enters the church and takes his/her place without stopping to greet anyone.



I think greeting his parents and kissing Princess Beatrix was strictly personal and had nothing to do with protocol. It was not a state funeral anyway.

donnaK 02-01-2020 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somebody (Post 2289969)
If she didn't care, she would have behaved very differently (this time and before). She 'spotted' them with her eyes (see pictures of her irises in the corner of her eyes) when walking in and then purposefully and somewhat haughtily ignored them.

It was a split second gesture, obvious media wanted to look for a story. Vice Versa with Cristina. The relation between the Kings and his sister are cold, anything new ? Felipe didn't greet his sisters first, what else could Letizia do other than following her husband, the King ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mbruno (Post 2289973)
I have seen many royal funerals, many of them with other monarchs in attendance, and the monarch of the host country usually enters the church and takes his/her place without stopping to greet anyone.



I think greeting his parents and kissing Princess Beatrix was strictly personal and had nothing to do with protocol. It was not a state funeral anyway.

Completely agree. It's out of respect and appreciation for the older generation monarchies, there is no need to do the same for the same generation infantas.
The relation is indeed cold. Cristina has always been an extremely proud person, after Felipe revoked her title after being told many times to resign, what else could be expected ?

camelot23ca 02-01-2020 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by donnaK (Post 2289955)
Maybe in the old days when JC was still the King. Now I don't see her being uncomfortable with the presence of the sister-in-law, just didn't 'give a damn'.
Elena and Christina are not the members of the royal family anymore. It's not a protocol violation when the Kings didn't greet them. Of course the Kings could choose to greet them (if Elena were alone, they probably would do it), but for obvious reasons they didn't want to.
The family arguments over years centered Christina and Inaki have been over after Inaki went to jail. Now each person is put in their own place. Each does things what they want/need to. The sisters-in-law don't get along well, sure, but no need to over analyze everything.


How do you know that the family arguments have stopped? I would hope they'd stop at some point, but I've seen no change in behaviour or in reporting that would indicate anything has changed. And there's sometimes a difference between public position and position in family power politics. Elena and Cristina's "place" is that of Infantas of Spain, daughters of a King, and well loved members of the extended family and the long time social circle of which Felipe is still a part. Let's not pretend they couldn't be formidable adversaries behind the scenes if they so chose.

Also, let's review: Cristina faced a judge determined to send her to trial no matter what, (the same judge who then sat for many hours with a journalist to discuss the case, including talking about "feelings" he had about Cristina but just couldn't prove), the entire Spanish media drumming up a witch hunt that involved leaked personal emails, the prosecutor's office going through mountains of documents and advising she not be brought to trial due to lack of evidence, and finally a panel of well respected judges who found her not guilty of any crime. Inaki was found guilty and is now paying his debt to society. She is attending her aunt's funeral with the rest of her family. They are in a church. Felipe is His Most CATHOLIC Majesty of Spain. She is his sister. And you're saying that he stood within a foot of her and deliberately ignored her? If that's true, IMO, that would make Felipe small minded, petty and cowardly. Not qualities that tend to make a good man, let alone one deserving of his position as King. So, I'm going to stick with blaming it on protocol. The alternative you present makes him look too pathetic.

donnaK 02-01-2020 09:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by camelot23ca (Post 2289986)
How do you know that the family arguments have stopped? I would hope they'd stop at some point, but I've seen no change in behaviour or in reporting that would indicate anything has changed. And there's sometimes a difference between public position and position in family power politics. Elena and Cristina's "place" is that of Infantas of Spain, daughters of a King, and well loved members of the extended family and the long time social circle of which Felipe is still a part. Let's not pretend they couldn't be formidable adversaries behind the scenes if they so chose.

Also, let's review: Cristina faced a judge determined to send her to trial no matter what, (the same judge who then sat for many hours with a journalist to discuss the case, including talking about "feelings" he had about Cristina but just couldn't prove), the entire Spanish media drumming up a witch hunt that involved leaked personal emails, the prosecutor's office going through mountains of documents and advising she not be brought to trial due to lack of evidence, and finally a panel of well respected judges who found her not guilty of any crime. Inaki was found guilty and is now paying his debt to society. She is attending her aunt's funeral with the rest of her family. They are in a church. Felipe is His Most CATHOLIC Majesty of Spain. She is his sister. And you're saying that he stood within a foot of her and deliberately ignored her? If that's true, IMO, that would make Felipe small minded, petty and cowardly. Not qualities that tend to make a good man, let alone one deserving of his position as King. So, I'm going to stick with blaming it on protocol. The alternative you present makes him look too pathetic.

Over the years Sofia pretty much insisted that Inaki was innocent (didn't her Greek family publicly defended the innocence of Inaki ?), her insistence of depending her daughter and son-in-law, rehabilitating their image added lots of pressure on Felipe. That's what I meant on the family arguments, which was over after Inaki went to jail. Yes, media did do the witch hunt on them (that's the type of media in Spain), but it's also the fact that her Daddy and then PM Rajoy did all they could to save her, but that's another topic.

I don't know there is a protocol for the King to greet own family members or friends at a state (or formal) funeral, but protocol can be broken for good intentions. I think Felipe did the greeting to his parents and Beatrice out of respect and appreciation for the elderly monarchies. He didn't go out of his way to greet his sisters, don't see anything wrong with it.

An Ard Ri 02-03-2020 04:10 PM

With the death of HRH The Infanta Pilar ,her personal duchy that of Badajoz which was for life only reverted to the Crown,the Infanta having held the title since 1967.

HereditaryPrincess 02-04-2020 04:17 PM

:previous: Thanks for mentioning Pilar's title - I was wondering what would happen to the duchy now that she is no longer with us. It'll be interesting to see if/when it will next be used and Badajoz will have another royal representative.

An Ard Ri 02-04-2020 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HereditaryPrincess (Post 2290738)
:previous: Thanks for mentioning Pilar's title - I was wondering what would happen to the duchy now that she is no longer with us. It'll be interesting to see if/when it will next be used and Badajoz will have another royal representative.

Infanta Pilar was also Dowager Viscountess de la Torre since her husband death in 1991 ,her eldest son Don Juan Gómez-Acebo is now the 3rd Viscount de La Torre.

Livia 02-04-2020 06:54 PM

Letizia has been the enemy and the evil witch for a long rime but it was Felipe the one who cut all ties with his sister, it was very very very very grave the things his brother in law made and he is not an idiot, her sister has been exonerated but only because who she is, and in Spain nobody believe she didn't know anything about her husband affairs. I think the big problem is they don't regret anything, they think they are innocent even if there are proofs and proofs against them (or Urdangarin) and they don't beg for perdon and show any kind of regretting, no, they are very proud of themselves forgetting their children and the difficult live they are having to have because their father actions, in school other children can be so cruel.

For Felipe must to be very painful, after all she is his sister. We don't know how is their relationship, one thing is show in public, where there are cameras everywhere and there are a protocol to follow, and another and totally different thing is your private life, but they, Felipe and Letizia, care about they nephews and nieces, Irene attended to Sofía first communion for example and Victoria has a very good relation with Letizia. I really think their private relation is good, not as used to be a few years ago but tolerable. It said Juan Carlos is very disappointment with his daughter, he tried to help her of course but she and her husband also were the ones who took away his crown.

And I don't want to say anything else, this is the place to remember an extraordinary woman as HRH Infanta Pilar de Borbón.

An Ard Ri 02-05-2020 02:30 PM

Almost a week late but Casareal managed to release footage of the Funeral of the kings aunt at Real Monasterio de San Lorenzo de El Escorial.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0ItW2k5Qaw

iceflower 02-08-2020 03:11 PM

There will be another mass for Infanta Pilar, this time organized by the Nuevo Futuro association, Infanta Pilar has been President of Honor of.

The mass will be held on February 14 at 20 pm in the Parish Madrileña San Francisco de Borja.



** hola article **

An Ard Ri 02-08-2020 04:02 PM

The Nuevo Futuro had a special place in Infanta Pilars heart it will be very strange not to see her at the 2020 Madrid charity market.

The Mass is a nice idea from the charity to its late Honorary President.

HereditaryPrincess 02-08-2020 05:50 PM

It's great that the Nuevo Futuro is organising the mass for Pilar; you can tell they both meant a lot to each other. It will indeed be strange not to see her there.

eya 02-15-2020 03:30 AM

Indanta Pilar Mass At at Parroquia San Francisco de Borja in Madrid on 14 February

https://www.gettyimages.es/search/2/...this_event_adp

iceflower 02-15-2020 02:35 PM

Here are some more photos of family and friends at the mass organized by the Nuevo Futuro association yesterday:



** hola: Familiares y amigos de doña Pilar le dan un último adiós en el funeral organizado por el rastrillo 'Nuevo Futuro' **

An Ard Ri 02-15-2020 02:53 PM

There was a good turn out at the Memorial Mass ,I spotted Beatriz d'Orléans in attendance with members of the Spanish nobility.

theroyalfly 05-31-2020 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by camelot23ca (Post 2289986)
Felipe is His Most CATHOLIC Majesty of Spain. She is his sister. And you're saying that he stood within a foot of her and deliberately ignored her? If that's true, IMO, that would make Felipe small minded, petty and cowardly. Not qualities that tend to make a good man, let alone one deserving of his position as King. So, I'm going to stick with blaming it on protocol. The alternative you present makes him look too pathetic.

I know this is quite late but I don't think the King and Queen deliberately ignored the Duchess of Lugo and Infanta Cristina. We both don't know much about royal protocols as protocols vary in every country but what I know is that Spanish Royal Family is a stiff one, it's not as lax as other countries.

I happen to see this video. During the funeral of Infanta Alicia of Spain, Duchess of Calabria as you can see, had King Emeritus Juan Carlos not see Infanta Cristina he would have just walked past her. The King and Queen of Spain did the same thing as that of the Duchess of Badajoz's funeral.

Infanta Alicia died in March 2017.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7z8LJ0mHyQw

An Ard Ri 01-01-2021 01:35 PM

Its hard to believe that in a weeks time it will mark the 1st anniversary of the passing of the Infanta Pilar.


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