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-   -   Iñaki, Cristina & the NOOS Corruption Investigation and Imprisonment (https://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f117/i-aki-cristina-and-the-noos-corruption-investigation-and-imprisonment-44246.html)

An Ard Ri 01-21-2018 04:40 PM

Iñaki, Cristina & the NOOS Corruption Investigation and Imprisonment
 
The Iñaki, Cristina and the NOOS Corruption Investigation and Imprisonment Part 3

January 2018

Time for part 2 of this thread, you can view the old thread here

https://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...5-a-37941.html

highpriestess 01-21-2018 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mbruno (Post 2065879)
JC's sisters, nephews/nieces and cousins are a special case because they were caught in the limbo between the republic and the restoration of the monarchy in the format it assumed in the constitution of 1978. Even if they were not in the line of succession, as former members of the Royal House (unlike JC's sisters for example), JC's daughters would always be potential targets. But, in any case, since they are in the line of succession (Elena is actually 3rd, which is pretty high IMHO, and Cristina is 6th), the need for state security is even more evident.

Let me just add that, in the unfortunate event (God forbid) that Felipe and Letizia might both pass while Leonor is still a minor, Elena would be regent under the constitution and, in her absence, the regency would be occupied by Cristina. They are too important then to be left unprotected.

Regency beyond the surviving parent (Letizia) isn't explicitly designated in the Constitution. It will have to be decided by the government and the parliament. I highly doubt Cristina will be appointed regent in any circumstances at this point.

Again, it's the Minister of Interior decides whom to protect and he has been very discreet about it.

Tatiana Maria 01-21-2018 05:28 PM

The Regency is designated in Article 59 of the Constitution.

Casa de Su Majestad el Rey de España - La Corona Hoy - El Orden de Sucesión
The Royal Household of His Majesty the King_ Welcome

Art. 59
1. In the event of the King being under age, the father or mother of the King or, in default thereof, the relative of legal age who is nearest in succession to the Crown, according to the order established in the Constitution, shall immediately assume the office of Regent, which he shall exercise during the King's minority.
2. If the King becomes incapacitated for the exercise of his authority, and this incapacity is recognized by the Cortes Generales, the Crown Prince shall immediately assume the powers of the Regency, if he is of age. If he is not, the procedure outlined in the foregoing clause shall be followed until the coming of age of the Crown Prince.
3. If there is no person entitled to assume the Regency, the latter shall consist of one, three or five persons.
4. In order to exercise the Regency, it is necessary to be Spanish and legally of age.
5. The Regency shall be exercised by constitutional mandate, and always on behalf of the King.



The Constitution also designates the line of succession for "successors" of Juan Carlos de Borbón, however, it does not explicitly limit it to his descendants.

Art. 57
1. The Crown of Spain shall inherited by the successors of H.M. Juan Carlos I de Borbon, the legitimate heir of the historic dynasty. Succession to the throne shall follow the regular order of primogeniture and representation, in the following order of precedence: the earlier shall precede the more distant; within the same degree, the male shall precede the female; and for the same sex, the older shall precede the younger.
2. The Crown Prince, from the time of his birth or the event conferring this position upon him, shall hold the title of Prince of Asturias and the other titles traditionally held by the heir to the Crown of Spain.
3. Should all the lines designated by law become extinct, the Cortes Generales shall provide for the succession to the Crown in the manner most suited to the interests of Spain.
4. Those persons with a right of succession to the Throne who marry against the express prohibition of the King and the Cortes Generales, shall be excluded from succession to the Crown, as shall their descendants.
5. Abdications and renunciations and any doubt concerning a fact or the law that may arise in connection with the succession to the Crown shall be resolved by an organic law.

LauraS3514 01-22-2018 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by highpriestess (Post 2065911)
Regency beyond the surviving parent (Letizia) isn't explicitly designated in the Constitution. It will have to be decided by the government and the parliament. I highly doubt Cristina will be appointed regent in any circumstances at this point.

What is the age of majority in regards to a regency? Felipe will be 20 in July and Victoria 18 in September. Wouldn't they come before Cristina?

An Ard Ri 02-05-2018 03:22 PM

The Supreme Court will review Iñaki Urdangarin's appeal regarding his conviction in the Nóos case on March 21st.

El Tribunal Supremo revisará el recurso de Iñaki Urdangarin respecto a su condena en el Caso Nóos el 21 de marzo - Bekia Actualidad

Translation

https://translate.google.com/transla...-text=&act=url

Mbruno 02-05-2018 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by highpriestess (Post 2065911)
Regency beyond the surviving parent (Letizia) isn't explicitly designated in the Constitution. It will have to be decided by the government and the parliament. I highly doubt Cristina will be appointed regent in any circumstances at this point.

Again, it's the Minister of Interior decides whom to protect and he has been very discreet about it.

If the successor is under 18 when the throne becomes vacant, the default regent is the surviving parent (in Leonor's case, it would be Letizia). If there are no surviving parents, then the default regent is the next person in the line of succession who is over 18. Again, in Leonor's case, it would be the Infanta Elena and, then, Felipe Froilán. Parliament would have to choose a regent only if there were no living adults in the line of succession.

eya 03-12-2018 08:42 AM

Inaki prepares for the three years jail time

https://elpais.com/elpais/2018/03/12...86_006822.html

Winnie 03-12-2018 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eya (Post 2080934)
Inaki prepares for the three years jail time

https://elpais.com/elpais/2018/03/12...86_006822.html

Very interesting article and view point. I imagine King Felipe and wife and children have no real option in public but to distant themselves so as not to look underhanded themselves and showing approval. They are in the position to put government and laws supreme in their lives. It is what they took an oath to do and it is a lifetime commitment. The rest of the immediate family must realize this and unless extremely selfish must understand. To me the biggest losers on this whole deal is the is the children. They are the innocents. I would like to think that Felipe and Letizia still send birthday and holiday gifts or money to Cristina and Inaki's 4 and that they talk to them on the phone. Like quite a lot of families all over the world, some member has caused tension either thru illegal dealings, drugs or alcoholism. It happens. It will take time but the children [cousins] will eventually fix. Shame it will all be headline news for the rest of their lives. Just not fair, but then life isn't.

princess gertrude 03-12-2018 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eya (Post 2080934)
Inaki prepares for the three years jail time

https://elpais.com/elpais/2018/03/12...86_006822.html

Thanks for sharing. The article is very nice and informative. I am a little surprised that they are staying in Switzerland and not moving to Portugal seeing that Christina has a job waiting on her there. Maybe the children are really liking it there, if so, good for them. Maybe she wants to stay as far away as possible. I can totally understand the King and Queen wanting to publicly keep their distance, I do hope they have communication with Christina's children though. They are absolutely the victims in all of this and shouldn't have to be punished any more than they already have been.

camelot23ca 03-12-2018 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by princess gertrude (Post 2081062)
Thanks for sharing. The article is very nice and informative. I am a little surprised that they are staying in Switzerland and not moving to Portugal seeing that Christina has a job waiting on her there. Maybe the children are really liking it there, if so, good for them. Maybe she wants to stay as far away as possible. I can totally understand the King and Queen wanting to publicly keep their distance, I do hope they have communication with Christina's children though. They are absolutely the victims in all of this and shouldn't have to be punished any more than they already have been.

Although I’m sure Cristina could potentially have a job waiting for her in Portugal if that’s where she wanted to go I’m not sure if I believe this is legitimate information or not. It seems to have started as a rumour when the Aga Khan Foundation bought property in Portugal.. whether there’s actually ever been any thought on Cristina’s part of a move has never been confirmed.

To me staying in Switzerland makes sense. It’s not like the children could see Inaki every day even if they moved next door to whatever prison he winds up in. The family has the resources to travel to visit him as much as is allowed. Cristina has a very good job already, and, if where the children go has been reported correctly, they attend a great school. They have the best of both worlds in Geneva - privileged lives in a cosmopolitan setting, without the unrelenting media presence they’d be subjected to in Spain or possibly even Portugal.

The Urdangarin children have grown up with the love and support of the majority of both sides of their family. As the grandchildren of JC and Sofia they’ll never lack for money, contacts, career prospects or support of any kind. I’m not as inclined as some to give Felipe the benefit of the doubt re: how he’s treated his sister’s children in public or private but we simply don’t know what’s going on behind closed doors. IF he doesn’t bother with them TBH it’s as much his loss as theirs.

kalnel 03-13-2018 09:21 PM

Just curious: Is it likely that will actually serve his full sentence? (Assuming he gets one.) Or, would he serve a few months or even a year, then be put on probation or something? Could he be sentenced to house arrest?

I don't know anything about the Spanish justice system, so I'm curious what the possible outcomes might be next week.

carlota 03-17-2018 04:29 AM

we should learn in the next month the decision of the tribunal on inaki going to prison or not.

Empieza la cuenta atrás para que Iñaki Urdangarin ingrese en prisión | Casa Real

Quote:

I would like to think that Felipe and Letizia still send birthday and holiday gifts or money to Cristina and Inaki's 4 and that they talk to them on the phone.
in my opinion, in normal families people will tend to even distance themselves from the children. even if the adults keep in touch with them, for example, texting them, that is always seen as a source of information to their parents, who will want to find out more. hence, the other adults in the question tend to either step away from contact to avoid leaking information or to maintain a very 'superficial' kind of relationship. so my guess is that they are not in touch that much, and if they are it certainly isn't as loving and fluid a relationship as it once was. but that will surely all change once years pass and they grow older, as it does in most families when they realise life is short for holding a grudge.

cepe 03-19-2018 08:05 PM

The Times (19/3) is reporting that the King has banned his sister from moving to Portugal - summary of the report:-

King Felipe VI of Spain has banned his sister from moving to Portugal from Switzerland so that she could be nearer her husband should he lose his appeal against a six-year jail sentence.

The king has judged that Princess Cristina and her husband, Iñaki Urdangarin, are so unpopular with the public nearby would be too embarrassing for the royal family.

The princess had been offered a house in Lisbon by the Aga Khan, an old friend of her father, King Juan Carlos I.

The reason is that it is thought that it would be easier for her to visit Urdangarin, 50, in a Spanish jail from there should he serve his sentence for fraud, tax evasion and embezzlement. He is beginning an appeal against the conviction tomorrow.

A royal source said: “Some royal assessors were sent to evaluate the idea but Felipe stopped it. He thought she would be an embarrassment.”

Another reason he balked at the prospect of Cristina living in Portugal Felipe felt that the presence of his sister would sully the neighbours’ good relations.

Prosecutors will ask judges at tomorrow’s hearing to increase Urdangarin’s jail term to ten years. A decision is expected before the summer.


https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/k...ugal-s6pdwxz73

rominet09 03-19-2018 08:21 PM

Has a King still the power to prevent her move ? The king has no power in Portugal I think. Has he ????

cepe 03-19-2018 08:40 PM

I think the only power Felipe has is as Head of the Royal House.

I suppose that he could exert power, via his government, on Portugal not to allow her to enter the country.

But this seems wrong to me. She no longer represents the Royal House so let her live her life, and if she decides to stand by her husband and visit him often then he shouldn't try to stop it.

I think that if this is true, it could backfire on him.

Moonmaiden23 03-19-2018 10:04 PM

:previous: I completely agree. I don't think this is a fair, let alone humane, way for the King to treat his embattled sister and it may indeed backfire on him.:sad:

Duke of Marmalade 03-19-2018 11:41 PM

Ridiculous, how can Felipe prevent his sister from living in Portugal? If she wanted she could move back to Spain and rent a house next to the prison to visit Inaki every day. Maybe this will be the main topic to discuss in the upcoming state visit from Portugal, how can we prevent Cristina from moving there lol ��

camelot23ca 03-19-2018 11:47 PM

The story about Felipe nixing Cristina’s move to Portugal has been doing the rounds in the Spanish press for many months now. It started right after the Aga Khan/the foundation bought property in Portugal and the initial stories based Cristina’s potential move on no more than that. The way the speculation has grown and mutated and is now accepted as fact has been an interesting phenomenon to follow!

It seems like nonsense to me - Felipe neither could nor likely would want to prevent his sister from moving wherever she wishes. He has no official power and his unofficial influence is certainly no greater than that of the Aga Khan, of all people, who would have to support Cristina’s theoretical move.

IMO the truth is likely quite boring in that, (I’m speculating), Cristina realizes she and especially her children have a good set up in Geneva and she’ll stay there at least until the youngest finishes school.

Countessmeout 03-20-2018 12:32 AM

I don't see how Felipe could stop her, even if he wanted to. Its not like the Portugese government is going to take orders from him to keep her out. Or the Aga Kahn would rescind the offer because of him. If he was going to listen to any it would be JC who is his good friend, and JC supports his daughter.

Felipe has distanced himself from the scandal publically. And honestly that is to be expected IMO. JC abdicated in the middle of scandals, so that Felipe could take over, and hopefully the monarchy could survive. It would do nothing for them for Felipe to envelop himself into it. We have no idea what happens behind closed doors, and how often he speaks to his sister or supports her.

The reality is that the kids are going to have huge changes if dad goes to prison. Even if they move to Portugal they wouldn't be able to see him all of the time. The kids having some stability in their life is important during this time. Uprooting them from their home, their school and their friends right now wouldn't be easy on the kids. And the press will likely be worse, even in Portugal. Allowing them to remain in Switzerland and maintain as much as their normal life as possible, is likely best. They can still visit dad and they will have the support of their family.

I am kind of surprised he has been free all of this time. I would have thought he'd be in prison, or at least house arrest, during appeal. I never realized how different Spanish system is.

Duke of Marmalade 03-20-2018 12:53 AM

It’s not surprising at all, in Germany it would be the same thing as well, he’d be free until appeal has been decided. We have the example of Uli Hoeneß, football president of Bayern Munich, who did time for massive tax evasion. although he did nit appeal he was free all the time until the verdict, then went to prison for little time, after that he only had to return at night, then he only got tagged. Half the time was suspended because of good behavior, solid family environment etc. I expect the same with Inkai who did not commit a capital crime either, no previous records, good prognosis for the future, he will do little time in prison, rest nights only/tagged/suspended.

Added: Felipe couldn’t be happier with Cristina in Switzerland with somebody else, likely parents and connections picking up the massive bill, would be the same thing in Portugal. Cristina could as well come back to Spain and talk to the press all day long about the SRF and have her picture taken in front of the prison, not sure anyone would like this better. As sister of the King she will be taken care of all her life since she has enough leverage on everybody and nobody can afford to let her become a really loose cannon.

kalnel 03-22-2018 02:10 PM

Any news yet? I thought the hearing was supposed to be yesterday.

An Ard Ri 03-23-2018 06:33 AM

Judges start deliberations over jail term for Spanish king’s brother-in-law

https://elpais.com/elpais/2018/03/21...65_297726.html

camelot23ca 03-26-2018 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade (Post 2083808)
Added: Felipe couldn’t be happier with Cristina in Switzerland with somebody else, likely parents and connections picking up the massive bill, would be the same thing in Portugal. Cristina could as well come back to Spain and talk to the press all day long about the SRF and have her picture taken in front of the prison, not sure anyone would like this better. As sister of the King she will be taken care of all her life since she has enough leverage on everybody and nobody can afford to let her become a really loose cannon.

While I’m sure Cristina could provide a lot of very interesting information about how “exemplary” the adult members of the current SRF really are or are not, I don’t think she’ll ever speak about it. They all sink or swim together: no matter how they may feel about each other as individuals, they all derive status from their connection to the institution of the Spanish monarchy. As much as some fervently wish it weren’t so, that still very much includes Cristina as an Infanta of Spain and daughter of a Spanish King. Cristina and her children benefit from a strong, well functioning monarchy just as much as her siblings and nieces and nephew do. If she weakened the institution by embarrassing her father or her brother and sister in law she’d be cutting off her nose to spite her face.

rominet09 03-26-2018 06:52 PM

If she weakened the institution by embarrassing her father or her brother and sister in law she’d be cutting off her nose to spite her face.
But they already did and not in a small way !

Mbruno 03-26-2018 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rominet09 (Post 2086116)
If she weakened the institution by embarrassing her father or her brother and sister in law she’d be cutting off her nose to spite her face.
But they already did and not in a small way !

Not quite. She was stripped of her personal title of Duchess of Lugo, but she is still an HRH and in the line of succession to the throne. If she had been really repudiated by the Royal House, she would have been forced to renounce her succession rights.

JR76 03-26-2018 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mbruno (Post 2086119)
Not quite. She was stripped of her personal title of Duchess of Lugo, but she is still an HRH and in the line of succession to the throne. If she had been really repudiated by the Royal House, she would have been forced to renounce her succession rights.

If I remember it correctly no one can force a Spanish dynast to renounce their place in the Line of Succession it's only something that they can do voluntarily. Rumour has it that Felipe and Juan-Carlos begged Christina to do that but she refused.

Somebody 03-26-2018 08:14 PM

Elena is the Duchess of Lugo. Cristina was the Duchess of Palma de Mallorca.

An Infanta of Spain can indeed not be forced to give up her style; and only contracting an unapproved marriage is a way to automatically loose dynastic rights.

camelot23ca 03-26-2018 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR76 (Post 2086123)
If I remember it correctly no one can force a Spanish dynast to renounce their place in the Line of Succession it's only something that they can do voluntarily. Rumour has it that Felipe and Juan-Carlos begged Christina to do that but she refused.

Cristina could renounce her succession rights to the throne but would still be an Infanta of Spain and the daughter of a (former) reigning King, of a monarchy that still exists. That alone will always count for a lot in certain circles and it will always get her and her children things, contacts, experiences, and so on that they otherwise wouldn’t have.

My point being, its better to be in the above position - with or without succession rights - than it is to be an Infanta of a republican Spain, or a Spain with a severely weakened monarchy. Which is one reason I think Cristina will never make public some of the no doubt very interesting things she knows. Maybe not the primary reason, but one reason.

eya 06-12-2018 04:52 AM

Five years and ten months prison for Inaki Urdangarín

https://www.larazon.es/espana/la-sen...nte-NJ18666964

First pictures of the Infanta Cristina after the verdict

https://www.vanitatis.elconfidencial...garin_1577590/

Duke of Marmalade 06-12-2018 05:00 AM

Thanks Eya, that's 5 months less than the original sentence.
We'll see if and how much of this time Inaki will actually spend inside prison walls.

An Ard Ri 06-12-2018 06:12 AM

I feel sorry for his mother and children it must be a terrible day for them.

https://www.thelocal.es/20180612/urd...w-loses-appeal

Mbruno 06-12-2018 06:38 AM

Just to clarify: an infanta or anyone else in the line of succession can renounce their rights to succeed to the Crown of Spain, but all renunciations , like any abdication of a monarch, has to be ratified by an organic law, which is a special type of act of parliament that requires, if I am not mistaken, an absolute majority in the Congress of Deputies to be passed.

In other words, Cristina could give up her succession rights, but the renunciation would have to be handled in the same way as her father’s abdication was.

On the issue of royal marriages, the Spanish monarchy is actually slightly different from its European counterparts. In other countries, succession rights are forefeited if a royal marries without consent., so a royal marriage has to be explicitly consented to after consent is asked. In Spain, it is not necessary to ask for and receive consent to a royal marriage; instead, it suffices that the King or the parliament do not explicit prohibit the intended marriage.

The relevant references for all of the points above, which are related to previous posts in this forum, is Art. 57 of the Soanish constitution.

rominet09 06-12-2018 07:02 AM

At last the end of this neverending story

Somebody 06-12-2018 07:17 AM

How does the sentencing system in Spain work: is 5 years and 10 months truly 5 years and 10 months or only half or two-thirds (as in the Netherlands)? So, had he been sentenced in the Netherlands, he would be released after 3 years, 10 months and a few weeks (so, early May 2022). The remainder would be 'on probation'.

Somebody 06-12-2018 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rominet09 (Post 2122050)
At last the end of this neverending story

Apparently he can still appeal to the constitutional court. Hopefully he doesn't as there is little reason to expect a different outcome.

Mbruno 06-12-2018 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somebody (Post 2122057)
How does the sentencing system in Spain work: is 5 years and 10 months truly 5 years and 10 months or only half or two-thirds (as in the Netherlands)?

I don’t know how it works in Spain, but most countries are like the Netherlands in that sense, I.e. people are generally freed before the end of their original sentence. There is nothing abnormal about that.

Somebody 06-12-2018 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade (Post 2122015)
Thanks Eya, that's 5 months less than the original sentence.
We'll see if and how much of this time Inaki will actually spend inside prison walls.

He was deemed not guilty of one of the charges (administrative fraud of official documents by an official - I'd say that was the part that was committed by the regional officials who were also sentenced); that's why the sentence was reduced by 5 months.

Duke of Marmalade 06-12-2018 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mbruno (Post 2122060)
I don’t know how it works in Spain, but most countries are like the Netherlands in that sense, I.e. people are generally freed before the end of their original sentence. There is nothing abnormal about that.

Yes, my guess is that he will only do half of the sentence if not less, he has no previous criminal record, a family and good prognosis.

I think after being full time in prison we will do nighttime only and then stay at home on house arrest / being tagged.

No way he'll be in prison for five years - as no other prisoner would be under similar circumstances.

An Ard Ri 06-12-2018 07:35 AM

When does the sentence kick in or is it immediate ? (my google translate is not working).

Somebody 06-12-2018 08:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by An Ard Ri (Post 2122067)
When does the sentence kick in or is it immediate ? (my google translate is not working).

The Supreme Court ordered the authorities on Mallorca ("La Audiencia de Palma de Mallorca) to take care of the execution of the sentence so they will summon Iñaki to show up and be incarcerated (probably in the next few days).

It's Cristina's birthday tomorrow...

lula 06-12-2018 09:14 AM

The Audience of Palma cites Iñaki Urdangarin, Diego Torres and Jaume Matas to deliver the orders of entry into prison

They will have to appear in court tomorrow, Wednesday between 9:00 am and 2:00 pm

C.G.P.J - Noticias Judiciales

Mbruno 06-12-2018 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somebody (Post 2122093)
The Supreme Court ordered the authorities on Mallorca ("La Audiencia de Palma de Mallorca) to take care of the execution of the sentence so they will summon Iñaki to show up and be incarcerated (probably in the next few days).

It's Cristina's birthday tomorrow...


How awful to see your husband being arrested on your birthday, but Iñaki brought it upon himself, so it's time to face the consequences of his bad decisions.

Marengo 06-12-2018 09:46 AM

I suppose they can also appeal while Inaki is already in prison. It seems that they can still have one appeal in Spain. And there may be the possibility to take it up to Strasbourg.

kalnel 06-12-2018 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lula (Post 2122106)
The Audience of Palma cites Iñaki Urdangarin, Diego Torres and Jaume Matas to deliver the orders of entry into prison

They will have to appear in court tomorrow, Wednesday between 9:00 am and 2:00 pm

C.G.P.J - Noticias Judiciales

I'm unclear about what this means. Will they have to surrender and enter prison tomorrow, or will they just find out when and where they need to report?

carlota 06-12-2018 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kalnel (Post 2122156)
I'm unclear about what this means. Will they have to surrender and enter prison tomorrow, or will they just find out when and where they need to report?

my guess is that they will just be officially told their prison time, and a date will be agreed / dictated. i do not expect him to enter prison right there and then.

Somebody 06-12-2018 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marengo (Post 2122118)
I suppose they can also appeal while Inaki is already in prison. It seems that they can still have one appeal in Spain. And there may be the possibility to take it up to Strasbourg.

That's indeed the case. According to an article in El Mundo when someone is sentenced for less than 5 years the constitutional court might decide to keep someone out of prison until a verdict is reached; over 5 years they will be incarcerated and might appeal from prison.

Somebody 06-12-2018 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carlota (Post 2122170)
my guess is that they will just be officially told their prison time, and a date will be agreed / dictated. i do not expect him to enter prison right there and then.

I read that normally a few days are given to arrange any personal issues that need to be dealt with; so probably end of this week or at the latest early next week? Not sure whether it will be discussed which prison they will enter. Iñaki probably will ask for a prison that is close to an airport with a direct connection to Geneva so his family can visit him more easily.

Missy- 06-12-2018 08:49 PM

Finally justice is served. I hope this is used as a cautionary tale to other royals regarding the misuse of their position for personal gain. My only sympathy is with the children, they are suffering horribly for their parents' poor judgement.

carlota 06-13-2018 03:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somebody (Post 2122256)
I read that normally a few days are given to arrange any personal issues that need to be dealt with; so probably end of this week or at the latest early next week? Not sure whether it will be discussed which prison they will enter. Iñaki probably will ask for a prison that is close to an airport with a direct connection to Geneva so his family can visit him more easily.

this article mentions that inaki is spending 'his last hours of freedom', so maybe he will indeed enter prison on the day or some days shortly after today.

Se hace justicia con Urdangarin | Opinion Home | EL MUNDO

yes, the prisons being considered (inaki can choose) are those that are easy for his family to get to. it may possibly be badajoz, close to lisbon, where the infanta could get a job with the aga khan foundation, who recently purchased property there for it (unknown whether linked at all with the infanta's need to move closer to spain, given by that time it was clear inaki would enter prison. the aga khan is also good friends with juan carlos, so it is not at all unfeasible that they worked together on this. portugal is also very welcoming to spanish royals who hold a good relationship with the country, juan carlos himself was an exile in estoril.

pedro horrach mentioned in the article below that according to law juan carlos would have had to declare and would have done so if he wasn't 'intouchable' - as much as i am impressed that this wasn't slipped under the covers to save inaki, clearly justice isn't the same for everyone.

https://www.elmundo.es/baleares/2018/...a448b46c9.html

lastly, i am glad this issue gets closure. it has been 7 years already and it was about time to make a decision and move on.

An Ard Ri 06-13-2018 05:25 AM

Has Inaki arrived in Court yet?

iceflower 06-13-2018 07:46 AM

:previous:

Yes, he has:


** gettyimages gallery: ESP: Inaki Urdangarin Attends Court In Palma de Mallorca **

An Ard Ri 06-13-2018 08:44 AM

Iñaki Urdangarin arriving to Court in Palma this morning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gx4LhdrI6M

Biri 06-13-2018 09:16 AM

And he will be taken from the Court directly to the prison?

lula 06-13-2018 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biri (Post 2122401)
And he will be taken from the Court directly to the prison?

He has 5 days to decide which prison he will enter

Osipi 06-13-2018 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lula (Post 2122405)
He has 5 days to decide which prison he will enter

Now that is what I call consideration for the sentenced person. No just hauling them off in handcuffs to the local penitentiary but given the choice which penitentiary he prefers. The location to family probably will figure big into this as well as a chance to become familiar with his choices and the reputation of the place he'll choose. Do prisons have star ratings? Amenities? Flat screen TVs in each cell? Are menus available?

But seriously, I like that Inaki has his choice of where he'll do his time at. Makes it a big easier for everyone all the way around.

loonytick 06-13-2018 10:03 AM

For those of you in Spain or familiar with the Spanish judicial system, is it normal for a person in his position to be given a choice of prisons?

carlota 06-13-2018 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 2122406)
Now that is what I call consideration for the sentenced person. No just hauling them off in handcuffs to the local penitentiary but given the choice which penitentiary he prefers. The location to family probably will figure big into this as well as a chance to become familiar with his choices and the reputation of the place he'll choose. Do prisons have star ratings? Amenities? Flat screen TVs in each cell? Are menus available?

But seriously, I like that Inaki has his choice of where he'll do his time at. Makes it a big easier for everyone all the way around.

joking aside, some reports mentioned he may favour a prison which was newly built, with not very many people and which had 'a sports ground and acclimatised pool'. made me think that justice in certain countries is an utter joke. acclimatised pool - seriously? the fact that taxpayers dollars pay for that kind of thing makes me sick. whoever thought there was a need for a pool in a prison? might as well make it a five star hotel whilst they are at it. :bang:

Osipi 06-13-2018 11:06 AM

I see where you're coming from Carlota and it does make a lot of sense. It seems at times that the prison systems are pandering to the inmates but I think there's a middle road somewhere along the line.

The days of being cooped up in a small cell and 3 rations of bread and water a day and otherwise forgotten are long gone. With people like Inaki that have committed what we call "white collar crimes", the period of incarceration isn't only a punishment, but its also a place of rehabilitation where inmates' health and welfare are considered (hence the sports area and the pool) and there's counseling services and even classes to help prepare for their release back into society when their time is served. Those that have drug or alcohol problems that wind them up in prison also have the option of recovery programs while they're serving time.

Anyway you look at it, prison is not a place that someone would choose to be.

An Ard Ri 06-13-2018 11:33 AM

Its making the news around the world

Spanish king's brother-in-law given five days to report to jail

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-44466383

https://www.hellomagazine.com/royalt...ison-sentence/

Moonmaiden23 06-13-2018 11:34 AM

I remember when Cristina and Inaki married. The wedding was beautiful, the bride and groom were fantastic and had amazing chemistry, and their children were simply adorable.

It all seemed such a fairy tale....and now this.

What a shame and a waste.:sad:

maria-olivia 06-13-2018 12:10 PM

You will remember also the King's tears during the wedding !

principessa 06-13-2018 01:54 PM

Just for me: Inaki has now 5 days to decide which prison he will choose. Does this mean that he has to go to this prison immediately or has he after his choice to wait for an okay?

Thanks for the answer.

Kataryn 06-13-2018 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 2122435)
The days of being cooped up in a small cell and 3 rations of bread and water a day and otherwise forgotten are long gone.


In countries whose consitution is taken seriously and which subscribes to protecting the basic human rights including human dignity, they are over. So in all EU countries.

I do not condone what Inaki did, but at least he will serve his due in a prison where he is treated like a human being, not an like a piece of garbage.

Somebody 06-13-2018 02:28 PM

This El Mundo article explains that Diego Torres also has been given 5 days. The third who needs to do time in prison is the former prime minister of the Baleares and he didn't show up as he already turned himself in today at the prison of Aranjuez (close to Madrid) for his second time in prison as he was convicted and served time earlier because of another case of abuse of power.

Iñaki is allowed to travel home to Geneva for a final few days with his family before turning himself in.

And to answer principessa, he has to turn himself in at a Spanish prison within those 5 days.

rominet09 06-13-2018 06:02 PM

I used to like him a lot.... what did he think.... couldn't he imagine being caught and the result for his children ?

An Ard Ri 06-13-2018 06:12 PM

Infanta Cristina turns 53 tomorrow I hope they all enjoy some final family time in Geneva.

HereditaryPrincess 06-13-2018 06:17 PM

:previous: Me too. It's a sad situation, and as Moonmaiden said - their once happy family life has all gone to waste. I remember looking at the old photos of them (I wasn't following the SRF at that point) from when the children were small and they seemed so cheerful and relaxed.
I hope that the children will also not be too badly affected and will still be able to enjoy their lives at school etc. We often forget how the family feel about their relatives going to prison; I remember watching a documentary about children who had parent/s in prison here in England, and many of them were negatively affected by it.

Somebody 06-13-2018 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by An Ard Ri (Post 2122583)
Infanta Cristina turns 53 tomorrow I hope they all enjoy some final family time in Geneva.

She turned 53 today; Iñaki spent most of his time in airports and airplanes; he left early and returned probably late afternoon.

So, 3 years ago she got an early birthday present from her brother (revoking her ducal title) and now her husband got his instructions to turn himself in on her birthday.

principessa 06-14-2018 03:56 AM

Do you think it will be announced when Inaki enters prison?

camelot23ca 06-14-2018 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HereditaryPrincess (Post 2122586)
:previous: Me too. It's a sad situation, and as Moonmaiden said - their once happy family life has all gone to waste. I remember looking at the old photos of them (I wasn't following the SRF at that point) from when the children were small and they seemed so cheerful and relaxed.
I hope that the children will also not be too badly affected and will still be able to enjoy their lives at school etc. We often forget how the family feel about their relatives going to prison; I remember watching a documentary about children who had parent/s in prison here in England, and many of them were negatively affected by it.

I think the children, (and Cristina), will be fine. When you think of what the children will have lived through in the last six or seven years.. the unknowns regarding their father’s final situation, the estrangement and public repudiation from part of their mother’s family, the parallel media trial with a press increasingly comfortable with reporting rumor and out right lies as facts, reporters camped outside their front door on a regular basis.. and yet they seem to be very well educated, well brought up children who, so far at least, have always behaved impeccably under a sometimes very harsh spotlight.

The separation from their father will be hard, no doubt, but at least now the waiting and uncertainty is over and they know what their new normal will be. Whatever else he’s done, Iñaki seems to have been a good father and IME good parents will find ways to keep the bond with their children strong even if they can’t be physically present on a daily basis.

HereditaryPrincess 06-14-2018 03:16 PM

:previous: A sensible outlook. You're right. I can imagine that given the length and difficulties the trial posed for the family they were aware that this would have been one of the outcomes. I'm sure they'll have as regular visits with their father as they can.

Somebody 06-14-2018 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by principessa (Post 2122659)
Do you think it will be announced when Inaki enters prison?

I don't think it will be announced by anyone in particular but surely the press will find out -at least after the fact, I guess the family will try to keep it private- , so it will surely be reported. The Spanish press already mentioned that the king and queen will be abroad when he enters prison, which is considered less of a humiliation for the king who sees not only his brother-in-law but also a former close friend being put behind bars.

carlota 06-16-2018 04:35 AM

an article below on the reception of the news on the prison decision by inaki and, particularly, for cristina:

En Ginebra y con visitas semanales a Urdangarin, así será la vida de la Infanta Cristina | Casa Real

they mention that cristina learnt about the prison decision at work. she had a breakdown when she got back home for dinner that evening. both inaki and cristina used psychological support.
cristina and kids will stay in geneva. regarding visits, apparently cristina wants to make all the weekly visits that are allowed but she is facing the issue of wanting to keep her kids privacy when they visit inaki.
a special unit will deal with the security needed for these visits.
inaki will need to spend at least 17 months in prison before he is allowed to ask for permissions to leave the prison and serve time partially there, partially outside. however, he won't be able to travel internationally.
talks between the royal household are taking place regarding cristina's status in the family. she may be able to regain access to the royal household for personal and family matters. she will not be reintroduced in the royal household for official representation.

Mbruno 06-16-2018 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somebody (Post 2122939)
I don't think it will be announced by anyone in particular but surely the press will find out -at least after the fact, I guess the family will try to keep it private- , so it will surely be reported. The Spanish press already mentioned that the king and queen will be abroad when he enters prison, which is considered less of a humiliation for the king who sees not only his brother-in-law but also a former close friend being put behind bars.


My impression watching the international channel of TVE (the Spanish public TV broadcaster) is that, rather than an embarrassment or a humilation, Iñaki's detention is a win for the King and the Royal House, as it reinforces the idea that everybody is equal before the law and nobody is above the law.

Having said that, public media reporting in Spain is usually deferential to the monarchy and sometimes even royalist, so it may be a biased view.

camelot23ca 06-16-2018 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carlota (Post 2123467)
an article below on the reception of the news on the prison decision by inaki and, particularly, for cristina:

En Ginebra y con visitas semanales a Urdangarin, así será la vida de la Infanta Cristina | Casa Real

they mention that cristina learnt about the prison decision at work. she had a breakdown when she got back home for dinner that evening. both inaki and cristina used psychological support.
cristina and kids will stay in geneva. regarding visits, apparently cristina wants to make all the weekly visits that are allowed but she is facing the issue of wanting to keep her kids privacy when they visit inaki.
a special unit will deal with the security needed for these visits.
inaki will need to spend at least 17 months in prison before he is allowed to ask for permissions to leave the prison and serve time partially there, partially outside. however, he won't be able to travel internationally.
talks between the royal household are taking place regarding cristina's status in the family. she may be able to regain access to the royal household for personal and family matters. she will not be reintroduced in the royal household for official representation.

Is there any indication that Cristina wants to regain access to the royal household for personal matters, as they put it? Cristina has always had access to the various resources her parents can provide, (including visiting them at Zarzuela and participating in family events). The stickler - so they say - has been Iñaki not being welcome. It will be interesting to see what happens at, for example, Sofia’s 80th birthday celebrations later this year, now that Inaki has been temporarily taken out of the equation.

Cristina has what sounds like a very interesting career in Geneva. I think she knows full well she can’t represent the royal house officially again and I think she can see the sorts of engagements Elena has been relegated to and realize she’s not missing much.

The “personal and family matters” the press is really talking about is normalizing the relationship with her brother. But if that personal relationship is as strained as has been reported for many years now, again, why would she bother? So she can spend a week at Marivent? Maybe not worth it, especially for a person with family and friends willing to provide her with equally nice, if not better, options.

Unless the personal relationship between the siblings isn’t as strained as the public has been led to believe and that’s what the royal household is actually trying to normalize.

Somebody 06-17-2018 07:17 PM

It's probably mainly queen Sofía and probably king Juan Carlos who would like the relationship to be normalized and Cristina being accepted back into family life. It's unlikely that initiative comes from queen Letizia and king Felipe might be torn by his position as king and feelings as brother.

camelot23ca 06-17-2018 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somebody (Post 2124020)
It's probably mainly queen Sofía and probably king Juan Carlos who would like the relationship to be normalized and Cristina being accepted back into family life. It's unlikely that initiative comes from queen Letizia and king Felipe might be torn by his position as king and feelings as brother.

But she pretty much is and always has been accepted in family life. On a personal level Felipe and Letizia are two members of a large family, and if it’s true they’ve not maintained a relationship with Cristina, (not sure I believe this), they’re the only ones - at least based on what we can see from public family interactions. There’s nothing more to be accepted into, except a private reconciliation with Felipe and Letizia and I think at this point it’s as likely she’s as finished with them as they are with her. Especially since not all the trouble between them was a result of the Noos case.

I can see how it would be sad for their parents to think the estrangement might be permanent, especially given that the siblings were always said to be close growing up.

COUNTESS 06-17-2018 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somebody (Post 2122605)
She turned 53 today; Iñaki spent most of his time in airports and airplanes; he left early and returned probably late afternoon.

So, 3 years ago she got an early birthday present from her brother (revoking her ducal title) and now her husband got his instructions to turn himself in on her birthday.



It has nothing to do with her birthday. These things are decided by the way the law works. He committed a crime and as he is the King's brother-in-law, he is going to jail, which many I am sure thought he would get away with.

Somebody 06-17-2018 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by COUNTESS (Post 2124046)
It has nothing to do with her birthday. These things are decided by the way the law works. He committed a crime and as he is the King's brother-in-law, he is going to jail, which many I am sure thought he would get away with.

Of course it doesn't but still it happened to be on her birthday and Felipe revoking her title could have been done in a different week, there was no law prescribing that for her birthday week.

I am quite sure very few people would be happy if he got away with it. While I rather not see anyone go to prison (as in the ideal world no crimes would be committed) that doesn't mean that justice shouldn't be equally applied. I mostly feel for his children but in the end it is their own father who did it to them. I do wonder however whether other people in the royal family or household knew about it and/or even profitted from it knowingly who now keep silent.

Winnie 06-17-2018 09:21 PM

I still have Cristina and Inaki's beautiful children on my church's Pray Warriors daily list since all this came to light. Don't care about parents, they knowingly made their beds and now must lay quietly in them. But, those children are 100% innocent. Knowing the media, this situation in their early lives will be brought up every single time their names are mentioned in news unless modern reporters develop class. I truly hope they remain strong and that their family ties remain loving.

carlota 06-18-2018 03:43 AM

INAKI ENTERED PRISON TODAY

Caso Nóos: Iñaki Urdangarin ingresa en la cárcel de Brieva en Ávila | España

Marengo 06-18-2018 04:52 AM

If I understand it correctly he is in the prison of Ávila, a 1 1/2 hour drive away from Madrid.

Somebody 06-18-2018 06:03 AM

Indeed, most interesting bit of information is that until his arrival this morning the prison only housed female prisoners, so he will be the only male prisinor, so lots of privacy.

Bine221 06-18-2018 07:15 AM

Wondering, HOW LONG he actually will stay in prison. I am convinced not the entire time.
How is the Spanish law, will he be pardoned after 2/3 of the time, if he behaved well?
BYe Bine

An Ard Ri 06-18-2018 07:52 AM

Can we stay on Topic and away from wild Divorce Speculations-Thank You!

maria-olivia 06-18-2018 09:50 AM

He is in Prison , a Brother in Law of the King. Terrible Situation.

carlota 06-18-2018 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bine221 (Post 2124174)
Wondering, HOW LONG he actually will stay in prison. I am convinced not the entire time.
How is the Spanish law, will he be pardoned after 2/3 of the time, if he behaved well?
BYe Bine

he will need to spend there at least 17 months. after that, i believe some permissions could be made. this was what was reported by the media, i am unsure of the details.

Somebody 06-18-2018 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bine221 (Post 2124174)
Wondering, HOW LONG he actually will stay in prison. I am convinced not the entire time.
How is the Spanish law, will he be pardoned after 2/3 of the time, if he behaved well?
BYe Bine

Quote:

Originally Posted by carlota (Post 2124259)
he will need to spend there at least 17 months. after that, i believe some permissions could be made. this was what was reported by the media, i am unsure of the details.

Not sure about the exact procedures either but like everyone else he is not expected to serve the full sentence (as nobody in Spain is). The first 1/4th (in his case 17 months) of the sentence he is not allowed to leave prison, after that initial period he can apply for permissions to leave the prison (but not country) for short durations of time as part of the resocialization process.

His case is high profile so I don't expect any leniency but it would be equally unfair if he had to stay longer just because of public opinion. They surely want to make sure that the official rules are followed.

Somebody 06-18-2018 03:02 PM

This page suggests that in Spain conditional release can be granted after 3/4 of the sentence served. Which is a rather long period compared to other European countries; in the case of first time offenders with a sentence of this length:
- 1/3rd: Belgium
- 1/2: UK, Luxembourg, Portugal, France, Italy, Poland
- 3/5th: Greece
- 2/3rd: The Netherlands, Sweden, Denmark, Germany
- 3/4er: Spain

Each country imposes different conditions on conditional release.

An Ard Ri 06-18-2018 03:13 PM

The prison in Avila


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4F7m960SbF8

Somebody 06-18-2018 03:41 PM

This article explains the 4 different regimes in the Spanish system. My interpretation is that unless a judge decides differently it is likely that Iñaki has to serve his sentence in prison for the first half of his sentence (as he is sentenced for more than 5 years), the third quarter he might serve in third category; meaning he has to report to prison 4 nights a week but can spend the weekend outside of prison walls and the final quarter he is most likely on parole.

principessa 06-18-2018 03:52 PM

Is he now in an isolation cell or does he have contact with other people? Or how is closed or maximum security regime to understand?

Somebody 06-18-2018 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by principessa (Post 2124381)
Is he now in an isolation cell or does he have contact with other people? Or how is closed or maximum security regime to understand?

He is not in an isolation cell. I am not even sure he is in maxumum security, he might be in ordinary confinement. He actually will have a full (small) wing to himself as he is the only male prisoner at this detention center. Today he had many different visits by a medical doctor, psychologist etc, he will stay at an 'entrance' cell tonight and only brought to his new 13m2 room tomorrow. According to the former male prisoner who stayed in this prison for 10 years being the only prisoner on your block is the hardest part.

BELTRANEJA 06-18-2018 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bine221 (Post 2124174)
Wondering, HOW LONG he actually will stay in prison. I am convinced not the entire time.
How is the Spanish law, will he be pardoned after 2/3 of the time, if he behaved well?
BYe Bine

About 2,5 years, he could asks for the called, third degree, it is, he should only go to sleep to prision or remain in the jail for 8 hours to day. About Three years in jail, he could request freedom without conditions, if he meets the requirements, the judge can grant it. he would be free.

Everything depends on the judicial authority, even a judge could change the times,

Osipi 06-18-2018 05:19 PM

This decision on the prison in a way makes sense to me and then again on another angle, it doesn't.

On one hand, he's in a place with an entire block to himself as its primarily a prison for women. On the other hand, to me, that's either going to be years of solitary confinement or if there is human interaction that every person does need, other than his wardens and caretakers and counselors, its going to be with women and for a healthy male, isn't that like dangling a carrot in front of the horse?

I just sincerely hope that Inaki has the strength and stamina and the support of all his loved ones to see him through this. Its not going to be easy by any means.

Somebody 06-18-2018 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 2124426)
This decision on the prison in a way makes sense to me and then again on another angle, it doesn't.

On one hand, he's in a place with an entire block to himself as its primarily a prison for women. On the other hand, to me, that's either going to be years of solitary confinement or if there is human interaction that every person does need, other than his wardens and caretakers and counselors, its going to be with women and for a healthy male, isn't that like dangling a carrot in front of the horse?

I just sincerely hope that Inaki has the strength and stamina and the support of all his loved ones to see him through this. Its not going to be easy by any means.

He isn't supposed to have a lot of interaction with the women based on the information the former male prisoner provided. In terms of security and privacy for a high profile inmate apparently this was the preferred arrangement and it's not likely that having him interact with female murderers on a regular basis is high on the list of anybody in the judicial system.

If I understand it correctly, next to the weekly 40 minutes conversation in person and a total of 50 minutes of phone conversations per week, he is allowed one private visit and one family visit a month.

An Ard Ri 06-18-2018 05:37 PM

Hopefully the children will holiday in Mallorca with queen Sofia and the Marichalar cousins it might take minds off this sorry state of affairs for them.

Osipi 06-18-2018 05:42 PM

I hope, too, that Inaki finds ways to use his internment (and what seems to be somewhat a solitary confinement) to his advantage. Catch up on reading books he's never had time for before, a physical workout regime or taking up an interest in an online course on a subject he's been interested in but didn't have the time to pursue (should he be allowed a laptop). The man is going to have serious alone time.

Somebody 06-18-2018 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Osipi (Post 2124435)
I hope, too, that Inaki finds ways to use his internment (and what seems to be somewhat a solitary confinement) to his advantage. Catch up on reading books he's never had time for before, a physical workout regime or taking up an interest in an online course on a subject he's been interested in but didn't have the time to pursue (should he be allowed a laptop). The man is going to have serious alone time.

He hasn't been working for about 6 years now, so he should have had time to pursue his interests. Chief among them seems to have been sports and there is a small gym for him to use - not sure how many hours a day he is allowed out of his cell to make use of that.

i am quite sure by now he learned the lesson he most had to learn which is did not even an infanta and her husband are above the law (only the king is).

King of the Jungle 06-18-2018 06:57 PM

Educating himself for a new career would be smart.
Having time to equip for a different type of future is a huge opportunity.


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