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-   -   Scottish Independence And The Windsors (https://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f23/scottish-independence-and-the-windsors-32596.html)

EIIR 06-11-2012 06:35 AM

The problem is Scots think they subsidise the English (with 'their' oil) and the English think they subsidise the Scots (thanks to the Barnett formula).

I feel I can say this as a Northern Irishwoman with Scottish ancestry; to me the issue of Scottish independence comes down to an enormous inferiority complex on the part of the Scots. England is much bigger than them, more influential, more successful in the arts (singers, actors, literature) and that annoys some Scots. They dislike the fact that the BBC has more English presenters and newsreaders that Scottish ones; but that's simply because the vast majority of people in the UK are English.

The SNP play into that by trying to 'out-Scottish' all the other parties. Saying you want Scotland to remain in the Union is translated by the SNP as saying you think Scotland can't succeed on their own; you're 'doing down Scotland'. That's why the campaign to maintain the Union needs to be a positive one; instead of saying Scotland can't make it alone, we need to reinforce the many and varied benefits and advantages to Scots of retaining the link with the rest of the UK.

Cory 06-11-2012 06:45 AM

The Duke Franz of Bavaria is the Catholic Heir to the Throne of Scotland.

RoyalistRiley 06-11-2012 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EIIR (Post 1428930)
The problem is Scots think they subsidise the English (with 'their' oil) and the English think they subsidise the Scots (thanks to the Barnett formula).

The SNP play into that by trying to 'out-Scottish' all the other parties. Saying you want Scotland to remain in the Union is translated by the SNP as saying you think Scotland can't succeed on their own; you're 'doing down Scotland'. That's why the campaign to maintain the Union needs to be a positive one; instead of saying Scotland can't make it alone, we need to reinforce the many and varied benefits and advantages to Scots of retaining the link with the rest of the UK.

That seems to be the feeling I get from living afar and talking to Scots. But we'll just have to wait and see what happens.

Kataryn 06-11-2012 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cory (Post 1428932)
The Duke Franz of Bavaria is the Catholic Heir to the Throne of Scotland.

He is more than that if we only count relations: he is the senior line heir as the senior line was deposed in favour of the (senior) protestant line. But it is not clear if the English and Scottish princess he is descended of (Henrietta Ann) has not rightfully given up her rights to the Brtish thrones on her marriage. For if she had a son instead of only two daughters, this son would have been the Head of the Orleans-line of Bourbons, so very close to the French throne. I personally doubt the parliaments of England and Scotland would have accepted a marriage so close to the kingship of France without enforcing a forfeit of her inheritance rights (which was quite custumary at that time when princesses from houses who had a female inheritance possibility married).

So I'm not convinced at the moment that this isn't a reality.
Then we come to Elizabeth of Bohemia, daughter of James I./VI. If she forfeited her rights, too, then there is no other claimant than the currant queen (for her right goes back to an Act of parliament accepting her ancestoress Elizabteh' right to the succession for her descendants).
If we believe Elizabeth did never give up her claims, then her first son would have been her heir. He left two children from his first and official marriage: a childless son and a daughter who married the widower of her cousin Henrietta Ann and bore him a son. Thus the Head of the House of Orleans would be next. But the duchess of Orleans herself gave up her rights to her inheritance (which was revoked by France at a later moment, but still..) If her line is out, the children of the second marriage of the Prince-Elector might have a claim. This marriage was considered by German Law as a marriage to the left hand, so that the children could not inherit the Palatinate. - a fact which the British don't see. IMHO they could well have inherited a de jure right to the thrones of Scotland and England.

Then the line according to the British traditions of succession goes via Lady Frederica Schomburg to Charles Pelham, the 8th (and current) Earl of Yarborough. So why not ask him to become king of Scotland according to his senior descent from Elizabeth Stuart?

RoyalistRiley 06-11-2012 07:39 AM

:previous:I strongly doubt that the Duke would be under serious consideration for King of Scotland in the event of independence. He is even more foreign that the Windsor's supposedly are.

Artemisia 06-11-2012 08:54 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by RoyalistRiley (Post 1428921)
Personally, I cannot imagine Scotland leaving the Union and a very good Scottish friend of mine doubts it will happen as Scotland enjoys a huge number of financial benefits that people elsewhere in the UK don't receive and would probably lose if independence was gained. He thinks its the SNP playing politics, which I think is very dangerous.

Well, if the unthinkable were to happen and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland ceased to exist, than the flag of the United Kingdom of England, Wales and Northern Ireland could look like this (provided, of course, that the Scottish blue is removed from the flag).

Brazilian_Empress 06-15-2012 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kataryn (Post 1370095)
It is sad that there is no Stuart descendant with a better claim to Mary Queen of Scots and James VI. Crown (of which there are thousends: all Habsburgs, all Wittelsbach, lots and lots of other Royals) who are of Scottish (that is: at the moment of British nationality). So besides the Windsors there is no Royal claimant who has any ancient but still existing relationship to
Scotland.

Okay, there were the illegitimate sons of Charles II. Has there be any illegitimate buit legalized birth in Scotland's Royal House of the Stuarts which led to a successful claim to the throne?

Otherwise they could offer the Crown of Scotland to Harry.... That has happened in 1905 when Norway became independant of Sweden and they offered the Crown first to the second son of their former ruler and only when he declinded gave it to a Danish prince with Norwegian Royal ancestry and close links to the Bernadotte dynasty of Sweden).

Or the Jacobites.


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