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sgl 06-10-2009 10:32 PM

Titled Danish Gentry and Nobles
 
I couldn't find a thread that really covered this, so I thought that I would create this thread to discuss this article in the Copenhagen Post:

Titled gentry increasing plenty

It says that the numbers of barons, counts, and nobles are increasing in Denmark. There are now 7500. They have the privilege of carrying a title, but that is the extent of it. Interestingly, the authors used Facebook to track down some of these nobles.

alex001 06-13-2009 08:23 AM

I didn't realise there were so many! I wonder how that compares to other countries, it could just be that it sounds a lot but isn't really...

sgl 06-13-2009 10:55 AM

I thought the same thing! I didn't realize that there were so many. I would imagine that the number of Danish nobles is comparable to or greater than that of their neighbors. Belgium seems to have a lot, and so does Germany. I think that Denmark has more nobles than the Netherlands.

alex001 06-13-2009 01:24 PM

Oh, I didn't know Belgium had a lot - although, then again, I don't have a clue how many there are even in my own country :whistling:.

maria-olivia 06-13-2009 01:42 PM

Which noble danish family gave their farm/castle to Prince Joachim ?

alex001 06-13-2009 02:31 PM

It's actually changed hands several times; it originally belonged to the Bishops of Ribe, when it was known as Møgeltønderhus and was then given to the King after the Reformation. After that, in 1661, the castle was transferred to General Hans Schack as a thanks for his service in the war against the Swedish. It came back into royal hands in 1978 and was given to Prince Joachim in 1993.

marmi 06-13-2009 04:35 PM

I find it interesting that they used facebook as tool in their research.

ashelen 06-13-2009 06:18 PM

yes how do you do th reserchin facebook, i wonder?

sgl 06-13-2009 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marmi (Post 952350)
I find it interesting that they used facebook as tool in their research.

I know. In my opinion, it kind of sounds questionable. I could state that I'm a noble on my Facebook page, and there really wouldn't be a way to verify that 1. I was truly a noble, and 2. that I was the person I was claiming to be. For example, if I wanted to, I could set up a Facebook page as Crown Princess Mary, and it wouldn't be an issue unless the Danish government demanded that I remove the page. I could also make claims of being a descendant of Noble XYZ, and unless one really dug deep into Noble XYZ's family tree, I could get away with it (on the internet, at least).

marmi 06-13-2009 08:34 PM

Thats exactly what I was thinking. Do you think they maybe used Facebook to make contact then did some more heavy duty research?

sgl 06-13-2009 09:27 PM

That would have been the ethical thing to do, but I would be surprised if they did that for all of the people that they located on Facebook. That sounds cynical, but I would have thought that if they did do painstaking research, they would have stated that in their article to try to firm up their credibility.

I will give them the benefit of the doubt, though.

marmi 06-13-2009 09:41 PM

I thinki we can safely say it would have taken a very long time. Do you know if the researchers published an academic article using the research? You're right they'd have been likely to have explaimed in the research methods

sgl 06-13-2009 10:07 PM

It does sound like they published an academic article. It was collected by something called the "Institute of History and Civlisation", which sounds official, but a representative of this institute said directly in the article that they used Facebook for their research. Very strange, IMO.

Lilla 06-14-2009 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgl (Post 952507)
It does sound like they published an academic article. It was collected by something called the "Institute of History and Civlisation", which sounds official.

It is. According to the article it is a research made by the University of Southern Denmark which is a very acknowledged University.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgl (Post 952507)
but a representative of this institute said directly in the article that they used Facebook for their research. Very strange, IMO.

I don't think so as Facebook was used to get into contact with the nobles not only living in Denmark.

In the article it is written, that many of the ‘newly accounted’ nobles (about 2000) were descendants of Danes who emigrated from Denmark to the US, Canada and Argentina in the nineteenth and early twentieth centuries and that they, although retaining rights to their titles - according to the 1849 constitution - don't have any special rights and social privileges associated with the titles.

BryanCornett 06-15-2009 02:59 PM

My family was a former royal family of Denmark too. The Canute family came to America in 1727 and later changed their name to Cornett. The Cornett Family of America Is a descendent of King Canute the Great.

sgl 08-04-2009 11:34 AM

Countess Marina of Rosenborg has a new boyfriend:
https://www.billedbladet.dk/Kongelige...en%20frem.aspx

His name is Christian Mellentin, and they made their first public appearance as a couple at the christening of Prince Henrik. Marina's mother was Princess Benedikte's LIW.

sgl 08-14-2009 09:53 AM

Baroness Helle Reedz-Thott, a stylish Baroness:
Billed-Bladet - Helle Reedtz-Thott - en stilfuld baronesse

Keystone 11-07-2010 12:11 PM

Danish noblity
 
Hello Denmark!

Can anyone point the way to an index of Danish nobility? I'm curious as to the divisions of Danish nobility and whether or not it too follows absolute cognatic primogeniture for succession to their titles.


Thank you!

PS. The Danish royal family is one of my "favorites" :)

Benedikte 01-18-2011 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgl (Post 975392)
Countess Marina of Rosenborg has a new boyfriend:
Billed-Bladet - Komtesse Marina viste kæresten frem

His name is Christian Mellentin, and they made their first public appearance as a couple at the christening of Prince Henrik. Marina's mother was Princess Benedikte's LIW.

The article states that they are both scientist. The field they are studying and researching is unfortunately not mentioned.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sgl (Post 979707)
Baroness Helle Reedz-Thott, a stylish Baroness:
Billed-Bladet - Helle Reedtz-Thott - en stilfuld baronesse

Helle is a commoner married to Baron Otto Reedtz-Thott.

He is twize her senior.

She has studied law and eventually worked as a lawyer.

She is now working with the estate brewing beer etc.

Otto has been a playboy but also very into tv.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keystone (Post 1156544)
Hello Denmark!

Can anyone point the way to an index of Danish nobility? I'm curious as to the divisions of Danish nobility and whether or not it too follows absolute cognatic primogeniture for succession to their titles.


Thank you!

PS. The Danish royal family is one of my "favorites" :)

Danske adelsslægter - Wikipedia, den frie encyklopædi

There are two main lists of Danish nobility:

Denmark Adel Yearbook
Adel Danish Yearbook (DAA) have been published since 1884 and published by the Danish nobility Association. It contains comprehensive overviews of all the family around. 725 Danish nobility. Each volume contains pedigree charts and summaries of contemporary members of approx. 200 noble families.

Danish nobility Calendar
Ferdinand von Krogh, Danish nobility Calendar, Copenhagen 1878, is a second major survey, which lists only those at that time flourishing nobility.

Lord Sosnowitz 11-24-2011 05:35 AM

Queen can confern any title?
 
Hello,

The Danish monarch can confer any title to non-member of the Royal Family?

KR,

LS:cool:

nwinther 11-24-2011 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord Sosnowitz (Post 1340463)
Hello,

The Danish monarch can confer any title to non-member of the Royal Family?

KR,

LS:cool:

Not sure, but I don't think so.

Would be cool, though.

dbarn67 07-24-2012 10:30 PM

I have a general question about Denmark. Is there a titled nobility/aristocracy in Denmark? In England, Belgium, Germany and in Spain, there are Sir/Ladies to Dukes (Dons in Spain) but I don't know whether such thing exists in other monarchies.

Not sure this the proper thread for this question mods.

Muhler 07-25-2012 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbarn67 (Post 1444692)
I have a general question about Denmark. Is there a titled nobility/aristocracy in Denmark? In England, Belgium, Germany and in Spain, there are Sir/Ladies to Dukes (Dons in Spain) but I don't know whether such thing exists in other monarchies.

Not sure this the proper thread for this question mods.

There is a titled aristocracy here in DK, but they rarely use their titles as there are no privileges connected to being a noble.
The Monarch is the only one who can ennoble anyone but that is extremely rare. Alexandra is an example and that title is personal and cannot be inherited.

The aristocratic titles in use here in DK are: baron and count (greve). There are no earls or dukes, nor prinzen or fürsten as in the German sense.

The title of say Knight of the Order of Dannebrog, is just that, an honorary title. There is nothing equivalent to Sir, OBE or MBE in connection with your name here.
It may be mentioned in your biography, obituary or in the magazines that you have a particular order or because you wear your Knights Cross or whatever at special occasions. Apart from that there is nothing to distinguish you from everybody else.

dbarn67 07-25-2012 05:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muhler (Post 1444725)
There is a titled aristocracy here in DK, but they rarely use their titles as there are no privileges connected to being a noble.
The Monarch is the only one who can ennoble anyone but that is extremely rare. Alexandra is an example and that title is personal and cannot be inherited.

The aristocratic titles in use here in DK are: baron and count (greve). There are no earls or dukes, nor prinzen or fürsten as in the German sense.

The title of say Knight of the Order of Dannebrog, is just that, an honorary title. There is nothing equivalent to Sir, OBE or MBE in connection with your name here.
It may be mentioned in your biography, obituary or in the magazines that you have a particular order or because you wear your Knights Cross or whatever at special occasions. Apart from that there is nothing to distinguish you from everybody else.

Thanks Muhler, I knew you'd have the answer:flowers:

Somebody 08-06-2019 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR76 (Post 2244782)
A Danish komtesse (daughter of a count) looses her title upon marriage and after that she carries the title of her husband. If he doesn't have one then neither does she. If a female member of the nobility marries a commoner she looses her status as a noble and won't get it back after a divorce.
The three Rosenborg sisters got the Queen's permission to keep their names when they married, but not their titles. In spite of this they still go by their birth title in the tabloids (where some of them are frequently mentioned) and other media.

So, what about Alexandra; did she loose her title as princess of S-W-B when she married count Jefferson or did she loose it now she married the Danish count Michael? Or is she considered royal and do these rules (female member of nobility looses her own titles/status and confirms to her husband's) only apply to nobles? Or does it not apply because it's not a Danish title even though she is a Danish citizen (I assume).

Mbruno 08-06-2019 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Somebody (Post 2244788)
So, what about Alexandra; did she loose her title as princess of S-W-B when she married count Jefferson or did she loose it now she married the Danish count Michael? Or is she considered royal and do these rules (female member of nobility looses her own titles/status and confirms to her husband's) only apply to nobles? Or this it not apply because it's not a Danish title even though she is a Danish citizen (I assume).

Her title is German , so I am not sure Danish rules are relevant in this case.

It should be noted also that Alexandra is not a princess of Denmark as she ( controversially) is not in the line of succession to the Danish throne.

Mbruno 03-19-2021 04:05 PM

The wife of a Danish count ( “greve”) is called “ grevinde” whereas the unmarried daughter of a Danish count is called “ komtesse”.

What are the Danish words for the wife and the unmarried daughter of a Danish baron ( “ friherre”) ?

Thanks.

Muhler 03-19-2021 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mbruno (Post 2382933)
The wife of a Danish count ( “greve”) is called “ grevinde” whereas the unmarried daughter of a Danish count is called “ komtesse”.

What are the Danish words for the wife and the unmarried daughter of a Danish baron ( “ friherre”) ?

Thanks.

Baronesse or friherreinde. It also applies to both a wife and daughters.
To distinguish you use Mrs. Baronesse or Miss Baronesse.

- That is in accordance to a tradition that existed basically into my childhood, where a wife was often known and addressed by the title of her husband.
Example: a director (manager) would in Danish often be addressed as Fru Direktør Olsen. = Mrs. Director Olsen. If she was a director in her own right, she would be Direktørinde, using the now archaic female addition "inde" (or "esse") = directress.
Or a the wife of a master carpenter: Fru tømrermester Olsen = Mrs. Master Carpenter Olsen.
It even went down to workman (unskilled): Fru Arbejdsmand Olsen = Mrs. Workman Olsen.
It wasn't just snobbery but had a practical application as well. As late as around 1990, wives were filed under their husband's name and social security number in the municipalities. Her papers were even placed in her husband's folder.

Try check how the rules are in Germany, the Danish titles regarding counts and barons follow the German tradition.


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