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kimebear 02-03-2009 12:53 PM

Christian Science Monitor article

Succession may not be an issue if this article has any merit to it: Japanese dare to ask: Do we really need an emperor? | csmonitor.com
.

HRHofNothing 02-03-2009 02:05 PM

Should Japan abolish the monarchy?
 
Should the Monarchy be abolished in Japan?

I say this not because the Japanese Imperial Family do not deserve to hold their exalted position but things (the article in the Christian Science Monitor quoted in the thread on Sucession Issues) seem to suggest that the Imperial Family is being held hostage by their position. In this situation abolishing the monarchy would more than likely be doing a favor to these "hostages" who seemed to have been deprived on basic human rights!

I would be interested in hering everyone's views on the topic.

ChiaraC 02-05-2009 12:06 PM

Those who have read more of my postings will not be surprised to hear that I am strongly in favour of giving the crown prince a chance to realize his plans and to try if he can make the monarchy important and meaningful again, also for the younger generation of Japanese, before abolishing it.

The odds are probably against him – he may be able to survive within this system on his own but it is certain that he will not be able to change it by himself. But as Shinji Yamas.hita says, not all the IHA executives share the same views. There was, for example, at the end of the nineties Sadame Kamakura, grand chamberlain of the kunaicho, who wanted to use Masakoīs popularity (that was enormous at the time) in order to build up a new image for the monarchy. Not surprisingly, empress Michiko was not fond of Kamakura, and although he very probably has had a great share in promoting IVF as solution for the childlessness of the crown princely couple which resulted in Aikoīs birth, in the end he had to leave without having gained his end. Maybe there are some executives like him who would be willing to support the crown princeīs plans because they are truly convinced by his ideas. And there must be, for sure, many more who will always support the reigning power.

So, it may happen that when the crown prince will be in a position where he has something to offer – which he has not presently – he may find himself suddenly – surprise! - not at all isolated any more but surrounded by many, many zealous helpers. I would hardly be amazed to see this. It is human nature all around the world to gather around the successful and mighty, hoping for personal profit.

It is impossible to know from the outside what the probabilities are in this case. But I definitely think it should be given a try. And I am sure that neither the crown prince nor the crown princess want to be “released” from their duties in the name of human rights. They only want to be given the chance to serve their country in a way that makes sense and that unifies the best elements of Japanese tradition and modern life.

Kotroman 02-05-2009 02:39 PM

Why abolish the monarchy? Isn't it easier to abolish IHA?

heathshire 02-05-2009 03:46 PM

I don't think abolish is the answer, they defiantly have to modernize.

Al_bina 02-05-2009 03:54 PM

My personal views on the matter ...
 
Well ... it is rather difficult for outsiders to give an accurate evaluation of the situation surrounding the Japanese Imperial family. I shall try ... It is worth noting that the situational context has been undergoing drastic changes. Thus, a rigid control, strange institutional taboos, and lack of openness make the current generation of Japanese question whether or not Japan needs its Imperial family.
The media outlets are prohibited to openly debate the past of the Imperial family, its current role, or the future. Basic questions such as "How much does the Royal family cost?", or "How exactly does Japan benefit from having the Imperial family?" are inappropriate for hard-core traditionalists as well as increase skepticism of the others. Taking a closer look, one may notice that human rights of the Japanese Imperial family are somewhat violated (i.e., they have got neither name nor passports; they have little or no say in how funds allocated to them are distributed and spent). I dare to presume that courtiers may take advantage of this unhealthy situation.
As for benefits the Imperial family brings to Japan, some point out Emperor's important diplomatic role as an ambassador, whereas others view Emperor as "spiritual core" that brings the nation together in times of crisis. Indeed, historically the Imperial family was a model for commoners to copy. However, the marital patterns and lifestyle have changed a lot. Needless to say, a fair number of marriages tends to occur late; divorces are not frowned upon; women opt for having fewer children and continue to work after marriage. This prompts men to participate in child rearing and housework. Under such circumstances, the Imperial family tends to look like a symbol of traditions, stability, and continuity that is devoid of content and almost artificially maintained. Namely this artificiality prompts people to question the existence of the royals. Ivan Hall described the Japan’s monarchy as the “ultimate linchpin of the myth of Japanese uniqueness and the lodestar for the most repressive ideas of racial superiority.” It may be presumed that the current generation of Japanese do not feel overly unique and racially superior to other nations. They realise there are commonalities between Japanese and gaijins as well as differences.
It is worth noting that the IHA is aware of lack of openness. However, it fears possible negative consequences attached to embracing the openness and high price paid by other royal houses (e.g., the British royals) for doing so. At the same time, the IHA goes too far protecting the mystery. Rehearsed press conferences with pre-approved questions from approved journalists make the institution look more out-of-date.
Having said that, I think that Crown Prince Naruhito has a full comprehension of the awkward situation surrounding the Imperial family. He may attempt to phase much-needed reforms in. Thus, I would give him a chance of becoming the people's Emperor, who will continue the 2,000-year-old institution.

Mermaid1962 02-05-2009 05:32 PM

I was surprised (shocked?) by the information that members of the Japanese Imperial Family don't have passports. Is this because they're considered to be above mere citizenry? Or is it more sinister--to keep them prisoners in their own country.

In any case, I agree with Al_bina and ChiaraC that Crown Prince Naruhito should have the opportunity to see what he can do with his birthright when the time comes.

Royal Fan 02-05-2009 05:38 PM

I am not in favor this action the Monarchy should stay

Jacknch 02-06-2009 04:32 AM

I certainly do not think that the monarchy in Japan should be abolished, but I agree with the posts above that there should be some measured changes that could take away much of the stress and difficulties sufferred by some members of the Imperial Family. Clearly the IHA sees itself as being some kind of protector for the tradition associated with the monarchy and to maintain a never changing image. It is interesting what Al bina says - that they fear the consequences for embracing openness and the price this has caused other royal houses (I agree no better example than the British Royal Family!). However, in the short period of time since I have taken an interest in the Japanese Imperial Family, I have watched many videos on-line of the way in which they - the Imperial Family - conduct themselves and have been so impressed with the dignity with which thay carry out their duties (particularly the Emperor and Empress). And so I do question whether such a stringent control is necessary on members of the family when they are clearly performing their duties excellently (and would no doubt do so whether or not the IHA existed).
From a "westerners" point of view, I always felt that each successive monarch would bring about his or her own personality or way of doing things whilst maintaining the standard traditions and expectation of the role. Perhaps things are different in Japan and when comparing like for like the Emperors of the past are indistinguishable from eachother personailty wise? I hope the current Emperor lives for a very long time (because I like him and his wife very much) but I do hope that Niruhito will be allowed to maintain the traditions associated with being the emperor whilst being able to be himself as much as is reasonably possible and to bring his personality through to the job as much as he can.
In my view the role of the IHA to ensure the well-being and happiness of the JIF, to maintain the imperial traditions associated with the monarchy and to ensure that the monarchy is relevant to the people of Japan. Clearly the way in which they are currently doing this is not the right way! :flowers: Edit: My references to traditions means primarily the ceremonies, rituals and "technical" parts!

lucien 02-09-2009 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HRHofNothing (Post 888175)
Should the Monarchy be abolished in Japan?

I say this not because the Japanese Imperial Family do not deserve to hold their exalted position but things (the article in the Christian Science Monitor quoted in the thread on Sucession Issues) seem to suggest that the Imperial Family is being held hostage by their position. In this situation abolishing the monarchy would more than likely be doing a favor to these "hostages" who seemed to have been deprived on basic human rights!

I would be interested in hering everyone's views on the topic.

No.The Christian Science monitor?....yeah,...pulleese

Just the Kumaicho has to be curtailed without any bruhaha,I would be good at that.
Just open the windows on time...

caster51 04-08-2009 12:20 AM

The emperor does not have a passport
he does not have a Japanese citizenship, either.

anyway, The emperor's existence is very big.

Quote:

In this situation abolishing the monarchy would more than likely be doing a favor to these "hostages" who seemed to have been deprived on basic human rights
He is doing the self-sacrifice to the Japanese ppl.
that is why we respect him.
Japan was not divided as support of the mind because he was there.
the power is always overthrown by new power.
However, Japanese monachy was not for more than 2000 years
I think Japan should register it as a world heritage
[youtube]EcJN4MNFAhM[/youtube]

Bones 05-03-2009 05:34 AM

I could not imagine Japan without an Emperor. It just would not be the same country, it would be unthinkable. I don't think I could sum up my feelings any other way; unthinkable. I would also like to see the Imperial Family more involved but I'm also not very trusting of the motives of those who want to "save" the monarch from the monarchy. The IHA seems to have a bad reputation around here, I certainly don't know enough about what their exact powers are to have an informed opinion on the subject, but I would just point out that by remaining somewhat distant and detached the Japanese Imperial Family has been spared the sort of tabloid scandals that seem to plague western royal families. Just something to consider, hardly any issue is black & white.
:japanflag: :japanstandard: :japanflag:

Prince of Chota 11-17-2009 05:15 AM

After 125 generations, I think it's a little late to abolish the Japanese monarchy. Japan has NEVER existed without the traditional rule of the Yamato clan, and even if the monarchy were outlawed, it would still exist de jure as it did during periods of cloistered rule. More importantly, Japan is unique among the community of nations for having the oldest continuous system of government and longest surviving ruling house. It's an emphatic "no" for abolition from me, folks.

Ian7514 06-08-2010 02:51 AM

I don't believe the imperial family should be abolished.

COUNTESS 06-08-2010 09:58 PM

Nobody needs an emperor. It is, obvious, that this is just a position made up by fudal lords a long time ago, who needed this base. That being said. It is up to the Japanese people to decide what they would like or not like. It is not for me or anyone who is not Japanese to decide. I have hopes that the Crown Prince will be able to do away with some of the useless, archaic traditions and bring his monarchy into the 21st Century. Remember, General MacArthur deemed it important enough to leave in place. We could have gotten rid of them in 1945.

RoyalistRiley 06-08-2010 11:42 PM

I agree that Japan without a monarchy would be like having a new Japan that has never existed before. I think that the monarchy is too deeply embedded into Japanese society - wasn't it forbiddent to look at the Emperor until 1945 ? Sure, the Japanese need to mould their monarchy to fit the 21st century like many other Royal and Imperial Houses, but it does not mean it should be abolished.

Lakshmi 06-09-2010 02:13 AM

I see no reason why would Japanese abolish their monarchy. I don't think that Japanese even widely discuss about it like e.g. Britons or Norwegians.
I also don't think that Japan's monarchy has to modernize no matter what. Politically it is not necessary, since it has no power anyway. Making it more open would make Imperial Family life more fun, but can be disastrous too. Tabloids would probably love more openness ;), but I don't think Japanese royals like to be chased by media. Nobody does.:smile:
So, abolishing: no, but modernizing: yes, although carefully.

Rascal 06-09-2010 07:44 AM

I believe the operational model of the IHA and its relationship to the Imperial Family is where the change needs to come. Most of us (at least in this thread) agree that the monarchy should remain in Japan. But it cannot function without a strong support system, which the IHA would say is its own function.
The problem however is that the IHA is supposed to be a support for the Imperial Family. In reality, it has become the exact opposite. The Imperial Family gives purpose, and very likely funding, to the IHA. I believe that is why the IHA seems so desparate to control everything.
The operational model is other monarchies is very similar, except the role is reversed. Specifically in Sweden, the Marshal of the Realm (along with his staff of managers) handles all the administrative tasks of running a royal court. But the King chooses/appoints/hires that person and can remove/fire them. In addition, while there are laws governing the royal family's freedoms that don't apply to other Swedish citizens (obtaining permission for marriage, for example), for the most part the Swedish royals can choose where they go, what they do, who they have as friends, etc.
Obviously there exists the potential for problems/embarassments/scandals, but at the same time, the Swedish monarchy is, like many other Western monarchies, almost a living thing shared by the citizens of the country. The Japanese monarchy is treated by the IHA almost like the now non-existent Chinese model of keeping them shut away on their island, very little contact with their people and certainly becoming less and less relevant and functional in terms of charity work and impacting directly on the public. That is a road map to extinction as has happened to the Chinese.
I don't know the solution because the financial structure is probably the most closely guarded, but I think the Emperor and his family should stage a coup on the IHA and then restructure it to better fit a modern, corporate structure so that they can function in a way that serves their country more effectively.

Rascal

David V 06-09-2010 10:11 AM

One thing to remember is that Japan, and Asia generally, has extremely conservative social norms, and many standards and values that are different from the West- even though there's things they find acceptable that we don't, and vice versa. And they see it right to keep it that way. How the monarchy relates to the people in Japan may well be determined by that.

Rascal 06-09-2010 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David V (Post 1091163)
One thing to remember is that Japan, and Asia generally, has extremely conservative social norms, and many standards and values that are different from the West- even though there's things they find acceptable that we don't, and vice versa. And they see it right to keep it that way. How the monarchy relates to the people in Japan may well be determined by that.

Hi, David. I agree about the different norms in different societies as far as acceptability. But I believe this is a different issue. As others have expressed, the Imperial Family of Japan live an existence that appears in violation of human rights laws that the majority of other countries recognize and attempt to enforce. Your point possibly speaks to the prevailing attitude of the Japanese population, which may view the living conditions of the Imperial Family as traditional, customary, and therefore, acceptable.

My point is that for many years, while there remains a level of respect for the Imperial Family, there has been a decreasing level of relevance to the extent that the general population seems uninterested in the fact that they even have an Imperial Family. This has been supported in many polls where the Japanese, especially the younger generation, cannot name the members of the Imperial Family and who are unaware of many of the discussions we have here in this forum.

That apathy toward the Imperial Family has existed for a while now. With the current global economic situation, that apathy can turn to annoyance and disregard when people, government, etc. recognize that the money spent on the Imperial Family (or the IHA's budget) could better serve the population in other ways. If you hired a PR firm (which is essentially the role of monarchs in parliamentary democracies and/or constitutional monarchies) and that PR firm was seldom heard from or seen, how long would you continue that firm's employment?

Rascal

David V 06-09-2010 12:02 PM

I would counter, that the Imperial Family serves as a unifying symbol to look up to, above the machinations of politics and business, and in challenging times for a country people always rally towards traditional and cherished institutions.

Lumutqueen 06-09-2010 12:25 PM

I do not think it should abolish the monarchy.
I couldn't imagine the country without the imperial family.

David V 06-09-2010 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lumutqueen (Post 1091228)
I do not think it should abolish the monarchy.
I couldn't imagine the country without the imperial family.

Amen. The same could be said for many other countries.

Rascal 06-09-2010 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David V (Post 1091217)
I would counter, that the Imperial Family serves as a unifying symbol to look up to, above the machinations of politics and business, and in challenging times for a country people always rally towards traditional and cherished institutions.

I definitely agree with you, David. My concern is that this is an ideal and limited to the older generation. As less and less of the people are acquainted with the Imperial Family, that family becomes a non-entity, making this function non-existent as well.

Obviously as part of this forum, I am in full support of the monarchy. I just feel that in regard to the Japanese, the Imperial Family needs to start making some decisions for themselves, rather than turning over all of their power, and-as I said before-I suspect a great deal of money to the IHA, who then have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo.

Your point is valid about what I believe to be the most important function of a monarchy. I hope the IHA recognizes that this function is not being met with the Imperial Family because of it's (IHA's) own restrictive and some would say oppressive behavior.

Al_bina 06-09-2010 01:28 PM

It has been interesting to read the discussion.
The Japanese culture and society is far more complex and sophisticated than anyone could imagine. It is not just about younger generations not knowing the members of the Imperial family. There were multiple occasions when the Japanese Imperial family could have been abolished and replaced with something more western modern, shall we say. Yet the Imperial family proved its usefulness of reviving the Japanese as a society and serving as a symbol of unity and traditions, which helped the country to become an industrial super-power. The IHA courtiers appear to be rigid in many aspects related to the Imperial family. However, they are no different than other courtiers that engage into playing open democratic monarchies in Europe, thereby keeping their subjects happy with an illusion of the democratic monarchy. Furthermore, I would say that Asian courtiers 1) do much better job of maintaining the prestige of and mystique surrounding the royal families and 2) will adapt to the spirit of times as it has been proven by Japan time and again. I am sure necessary changes will be introduced. The Japanese are adept at finely attuning any system and making it operate flawlessly.

Rascal 06-09-2010 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Al_bina (Post 1091256)
Furthermore, I would say that Asian courtiers 1) do much better job of maintaining the prestige of and mystique surrounding the royal families and 2) will adapt to the spirit of times as it has been proven by Japan time and again. I am sure necessary changes will be introduced. The Japanese are adept at finely attuning any system and making it operate flawlessly.

Overall I believe you are correct Al_bina, particularly with you last sentence. The statements prior that I quoted I believe were true in the previous generation as they had to make the transition of Hirohito from God-like status to human, deal with the first commoner to wed into the royal family and with Michiko's emotional adjustments. Perhaps there were more skilled members of the IHA then. We won't know because there is no public listing of who is in this organization, nor who is responsible for the decisions made by it.

The current IHA, IMHO has dropped the ball many times in protecting the prestige of the Imperial Family. Knowing the person Masako was before becoming Crown Princess and who she has become since is the best example to show how counterproductive and anti-progressive their methods and decisions are (I know...I know...Masako is probably a bit of a drama queen and difficult to handle, but again if you compare to before the wedding, these traits surfaced/developed from the restrictive IHA...much like her mother-in-law experience with the oppressive royal court).

In addition, their handling of the succession "crisis" was laughable in the amount of time it went on, the "convenient" pregnancy of Kiko (does anyone really think Hisahito isn't genetically engineered?), and the complete disregard for history (other Japanese empresses) and simple biology (males determining gender in offspring).

Finally, the choice of Naruhito to publicly criticize the IHA and the court for treatment of his wife, and the response from the court, IHA, Emperor and Akishino only served to scandalize the family more and bring the prestige even further down.

The only member of the Imperial Family that had not been touched by scandal was Princess Sayako, and - according to the progressive philosophy of the IHA - they followed the very progressive precedent of stripping her of her titles just because she married. But they were so kind to give her instructions on how to use appliances and go grocery shopping. VERY forward thinking on their part.

And as far as the "mystique" of the Imperial Family...it is something that is supposed to give you just enough to want to know more because you are curious or interested. Most people want to know more because it is so secretive and closed off that they speculate on the rigidity and oppressiveness. That isn't "mystique"...it is "isolation". Even with the Japanese people, they have lowered the amount of curiosity and respect for the Imperial Family. So I would have to disagree that they have done a good job. I think they have failed to recognize the amount of change in the world in the last 30-40 years and now they (the IHA-whoever they are) just look ridiculous.

Princejohnny25 06-09-2010 07:20 PM

I have to agree with nearly everything that Rascal said. I have complete apathy for the Japanese Imperial Family and the current monarchy. I love Japan, Modern Japan and its History. But If I were to go to Japan, which I really want to do, visiting the Palace or trying to see a member of the Imperial Family are not on my list of things to do. I just don't care enough about them. Like Rascal said, this apathy can turn to annoyance easily. The Imperial Family and IHA need to find a way to endear themselves to modern Japan otherwise a historical and national treasure will be lost.

So, no, I don't want the monarchy abolished but I may just happen and I'm not entirely sure I would care either way.

Hereditary Thane 06-09-2010 08:56 PM

The defeated Japanese elite asked only one thing of the victorious Americans: that they be allowed to keep their monarchy. The former emperor was reluctant to challenge the militarists, the present mikado is even less predisposed to tackling the inertia and arrogance of the IHA. Either the imperial family are of low inrellect, or as I believe, are quite comfortable and amenable in their ivory tower. As for the Japanese people; do not confuse respect and deference with affection.

RJ TAYLER 06-10-2010 07:20 AM

I will give probably a short and clear answer to the aforementioned question. NO!

Rascal 06-10-2010 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RJ TAYLER (Post 1091520)
I will give probably a short and clear answer to the aforementioned question. NO!

LOL RJ! :lol: Wish I had your brevity!

Al_bina 06-10-2010 01:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hereditary Thane (Post 1091416)
The defeated Japanese elite asked only one thing of the victorious Americans: that they be allowed to keep their monarchy. The former emperor was reluctant to challenge the militarists, the present mikado is even less predisposed to tackling the inertia and arrogance of the IHA. Either the imperial family are of low inrellect, or as I believe, are quite comfortable and amenable in their ivory tower. As for the Japanese people; do not confuse respect and deference with affection.

First and foremost, I strongly doubt the Japanese Imperial family are of low intellect. Furthermore, I dare to assume that all royal families are "quite comfortable and amenable in their ivory tower". When it comes to Asian courtiers, they tend to be highly effective in tackling issues they encounter.

RoyalistRiley 06-10-2010 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David V (Post 1091217)
I would counter, that the Imperial Family serves as a unifying symbol to look up to, above the machinations of politics and business, and in challenging times for a country people always rally towards traditional and cherished institutions.

And that is what makes monarchy special, regardless of whether it be in Japan or elsewhere.

White Princess 06-12-2010 03:14 AM

No, it shouldn't. For the same reason of all other monarchies: it is good to the country. But they should change succession laws to allow women to become reigning empress.

Kasumi 06-12-2010 03:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hereditary Thane (Post 1091416)
The former emperor was reluctant to challenge the militarists...

HIM Emperor Showa was not reluctant to stripe all imperial ranks from his own relatives. October 28th 1947 the families of 12 Imperial Princes and their families (122 persons in total) lost their titles and their rights of succession.
Princes yesterday, commoners today - from Corbis
Emperor Showa reserved the throne for himself and his immediate children only to avoid the military criminal trial for himself. The Emperor is impossible to jail or execute, but a private person is.
I am so sorry for all the Imperial Princesses who have lost their titles and rights because of Showa's unwise decision.

Kasumi 09-09-2010 03:20 PM

Democratic Party of Japan heavyweight Ichiro Ozawa held press conference ahead of Tuesday's DPJ presidential election.
Commenting on whether the now male-only Chrysanthemum Throne should be opened to females, Ozawa said: "It don't think it is unnatural for women to become the (reigning) empress. There is no need to restrict the succession to men." - Japan Times

RubyPrincess168 09-11-2010 03:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rascal (Post 1091249)
Obviously as part of this forum, I am in full support of the monarchy. I just feel that in regard to the Japanese, the Imperial Family needs to start making some decisions for themselves, rather than turning over all of their power, and-as I said before-I suspect a great deal of money to the IHA, who then have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo.

Your point is valid about what I believe to be the most important function of a monarchy. I hope the IHA recognizes that this function is not being met with the Imperial Family because of it's (IHA's) own restrictive and some would say oppressive behavior.

I don't think the monarchy should be abolished, but the IHA certainly can be! I don't understand the Imperial Family giving another person/agency the keys to lock you in a gilded cage/restricted lifestyle. Get rid of the IHA and start living a more normal or modern royal life.

iamtheoneandonly 11-08-2010 05:28 PM

IMO it will be up to the Japanese nationals upon whom the sovereignty of that country dwell. Yes, however, it will be good to bring about some reform in the IHA. The Japanese Imperial House had been imprisoned in Kyoto for such a long time until the Meiji era started that it is nothing new to them to be locked up inside their palace. Having said that, for their sake, it will be good if they can be given more freedom. 右翼団体 Uyoku dantai (right wing groups) are the ones who put people off from the Imperial House, I reckon. They are such horrid jingoistic thugs, no different from the Euronat, the BNP, Front National etc.. They always talk about the Yasukuni stuff and so xenophobic. This reminds me of the Yunohana Onsen incident in which white persons were refused their entry to this onsen (hot spring) in Otaru, Hokkaido.

I always think it is strange that in Japan those thugs are monarchist at the same time when they are ultra-nationalists. Here in the West, Danish, British or Spanish or whatever, we can be royalist without being xenophobic ultra-fascists but over there in Japan, for some reason, the ultra-nationalism and the monarchism go hand in hand. Oh, I do think those uyoku dantai spoil the image of the Japanese Imperial House.

Anyway, it seems as if the Japanese right want to keep the image of the Imperial Family according to their own version of what they should be like. Look at the members of the Japanese royalty. When you see Mary the Crown Princess of Denmark or Maxima of the Netherlands, then, you look at the Japanese royal women. Their fashion sense is just so awful. They could do with a very good stylist IMO. Michiko is the only person who looks reasonable, but, even her, she doesn't seem to get rid of her so-unfashionable small hats. Oh, and, the Japanese ladies-in-waiting wear such horrid dresses, too. They just look so dreadful. They don't have to be the dedicated followers of the Milan fashion week or the London collection but they could do with a bit of up-dating in what they wear.

LadyDiana 11-08-2010 10:25 PM

I was stationed in Japan for two years, and I never bothered to go to Tokyo, wish I would have. Didn't figure out til maybe a year in that they had an Imperial Family.

iamtheoneandonly 11-09-2010 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LadyDiana (Post 1157167)
I was stationed in Japan for two years, and I never bothered to go to Tokyo, wish I would have. Didn't figure out til maybe a year in that they had an Imperial Family.

Well, the Japanese Imperial Family are not as open as that of the UK (which is more closed in comparison with some of the European royal houses) and some of the royal families of Europe that one does not really see them on TV etc, I suppose.

Oh, is this really true that some American people just think that Japan is one of the American states because it is called the State of Japan ?

Blackadder 11-09-2010 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lumutqueen (Post 1091228)
I do not think it should abolish the monarchy.
I couldn't imagine the country without the imperial family.

I could very well imagine Japan without the Imperial family, but not the family living as commoners. Alas!

parklandgroupohio 11-16-2010 02:05 AM

I don't think it's a good idea to abolish the monarchy in Japan. The Japanese have a great respect for their emperor. The emperor is their symbol of stability. This is kinda similar to the still existing English monarchy.

Charlotte_Aster 11-16-2010 07:52 AM

Not the monarchy bu the abolishing of the Agency would be a better solution, IMO.

Kasumi 02-12-2011 08:39 AM

Japanese protestors have called for an end to the imperial system during the holiday celebrations of the Emperor's system and the Foundation of Nation's Day - Press TV

More on February 11th National Foundation Day - Wiki

WilhelmII 02-12-2011 12:50 PM

Modernization - YES !!! Abolishing the monarchy - HELL NO !!! God Save the Emperor !

Mariko 02-14-2011 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by parklandgroupohio (Post 1159648)
I don't think it's a good idea to abolish the monarchy in Japan. The Japanese have a great respect for their emperor. The emperor is their symbol of stability. This is kinda similar to the still existing English monarchy.

I agree so much. We have great respect towards our Emperor and the Empress. It is true that we know he cares about people in Japan very much together with the Empress and wishing us well being all the time.

But the story is little different with CP Naruhito and CP Masako. The people in Japan is really upset by their actions.

Our Royal Family had so much respect and so many people wish that the time can go back before the CP Naruhito's wedding to Ms. Masako Owada. We had peace and harmony between our royal family and people. Now we lost that and we can really feel the pain for that.

CP Naruhito's younger brother Prince Akishino and his family is working on their duty as much as they can with their position and supporting the Emperor and the Empress. The people in Japan now recognize this very much after CP Naruhito and his wife could not carry their duties at this point.

There must be huge pressure for Prince and Princess Akishino to do their duties without making CP Masako to get upset about it. We have not heard the CP Prince and Princess to be sorry about not able to carry their duties towards the people of Japan and that they are greatful towards Prince and Princess Akishino for their hard work as well as to their father and mother,
the Emperor and the Empress. Since CP Prince Naruhito cares for his ill family member above everything else so much, I just wish he would step down at this point to pass to his younger brother who is very healthy and doing his duty as the royal family. Rather than hold on to his position and causing hatred from the people of Japan towards the Royal Family and as well as to his family, if he think and care about the royal family of Japan and future of Japan.

I never heard such severe criticism towards the royal family member from people of Japan before. There used to be a harmony between them. The respect and cares. I never heard the people questioned of CP family's behavior and talked about it as they do now so much. I don't understand how this could happened, yet I know the feeling of the majority people in Japan by reading the comment from the Japanese articles.

The turning point started coming in with CP Masako's illness not being stated by her doctor at the press conference. The people in Japan is not sure what kind of illness she has now and her doctor never appeared in front of the people and never explain directly to us in person. In fact she decided not to mention his name at all yet most people know by now. The doctor was introduced through her sister. No 2nd opinion was given either. She is a public figure after all. And the people truly cared for her in the beginning. Now more than ever especially she takes her daughter to the school almost every day and stay all the time with her in the class room almost a year. Before that she was not able to carry her duty because her illness now her daughter's illness. Before that we closed our eyes to her questionable actions.

CP Masako made a statement through her office by condemning Aiko's class mate boys as well as the school in the eyes of public but the open press conference was never held by both CP Naruhito and CP Masako.

Now after almost 7 years of off royal duties in Japan due to her illness, she all of the sudden wants to go to the wedding of Prince William and Kate when she can not even meet the people coming to her door steps. Wow.
The Japanese people felt she did not care for people of her own country.

Hope the issues settle with the royal family of Japan to give a peace and harmony back to the people of Japan. We care and respect our royal family very much.

ortiz 02-16-2011 05:36 AM

I feel horribly for Crown Princess Masako, it seems like she can't catch a break either way...people want to see her go out more often, and just when it looks like she just might, the press then criticizes her for attempting to do so. I cringe when I think about how much worse the pressure will get when one day she becomes the Empress.

Mermaid1962 02-16-2011 11:59 AM

Perhaps the best thing would be if her doctors came out with a definite statement of precisely what her illness is and why she can do some things but not other things. If the best thing that she can do right now is go to school with Princess Aiko, that's fine with me. I think that being Crown Princess of Japan must be a terrible position to be in. First there's the pressure to have an heir. Then, after having a miscarriage, the child that's born is a girl. So right there, with her reproductive history, she knows that her husband won't have an heir to the throne, especially if his brother has a boy. Almost on cue, her brother-and-sister-in-law have a son. So not only has she not produced a male heir, but her sister-in-law has. That surely affects the relationships within the family. As far as a possible trip to London goes, she could actually do well there because she's used to being in Western surroundings. And isn't that part of the problem as well: she's perceived as being too Western. So if she travels to Europe, it reinforces the idea that she's not going to represent the Emperor and Japan and as a consort to her husband. Instead, she's seen as going for her own selfish reasons.


Quote:

Originally Posted by ortiz (Post 1205550)
I cringe when I think about how much worse the pressure will get when one day she becomes the Empress.


ortiz 02-17-2011 02:29 AM

:previous: You're right Mermaid, the Crown Princess has so much pressure on her from so many angles it seems...I applaud her husband for standing up for her and not forcing her to do a ton of things she just is not emotionally and/or physically comfortable with just for the sake of keeping up appearances. I think the two of them are really in love which is a rarity for royal marriages.

Mariko 02-18-2011 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ortiz (Post 1205550)
I feel horribly for Crown Princess Masako, it seems like she can't catch a break either way...people want to see her go out more often, and just when it looks like she just might, the press then criticizes her for attempting to do so. I cringe when I think about how much worse the pressure will get when one day she becomes the Empress.

Hi Ortiz,

I think people in Japan is confused at this point not knowing what is her real illness is...There was a doctor note but never signed by him, no conference. She was not able to carry most of her duty for last 7 years. Yet if you see her going to skiing with her family, can you ski if you are sick for hours at time? Now she can go to England but she was not able to meet the visitor at her house..There was never clear explanation of her condition from her nor CP prince. Only thing they asked us was "be patient for her" and we did for last 7 years then last year the issues with Princess Aiko came up. Again between the school and CP Masako had difference but there was never clear explanation again. Yet she took her daughter to the school and stayed at the school almost now whole year. Was she ill to do her duty or she wasn't...What really happening with her is not clear to the people of Japan and to her royal family. We just want the truth. Without that people start speculating and it is bad scene. After all she is the crown princess of Japan. She is a public figure. She does use that power for her presume now and the school for Aiko. So we wish she will open her mind. Japanese people still have care and respect for the royal family and want to keep that way. Some one to look up to.

Grandduchess24 03-21-2011 10:37 PM

Should they...I don't know but they should at some point maybe but I just don't know for how may more years the Japanese royal family will exist. IDK there also seem to be that problem of more princesses than princes to inherit the throne.

Grandduchess24 06-27-2011 07:09 PM

There also seems to be the problem of a 'pure bloodline' ending because seeing the present royals it seems like they will start having to marry their cousins if not the girls will marry commoners and lose their titles which leaves the boys to which There is only 1 male heir and boy does he inherit some weight on his shoulders

kathia_sophia 06-27-2011 07:16 PM

^thats right!!!
i can see in the future, something like Aiko and Hisahito being married despite being cousins. i know thats weird, but it can be possible!

Kasumi 07-24-2011 07:59 AM

The Emperor, a true symbol of national unity - Kuensel Online
[...]
A Japanese friend of this writer says, “The Emperial Family is like the pillar of the house, as long as there is the pillar the house is safe. That is why even then our enemies, the Americans, had to recognise him as the symbol of our national unity.”
When people have a wise and considerate King, the people remain united and strong, and in this way, in the 21st century, Bhutan, Japan, and Thailand are some of the most unique nations where there is social harmony and a strong emotional and traditional linkage of trust and respect between the people and their beloved “Pillars”.

wartenberg7 07-24-2011 08:46 AM

Why is this question being asked? Is there a serious discussion about the japanese monarchy going on?

Renata4711 07-24-2011 08:54 AM

I've been asking myself the same question for decades ....

You may shoot me down, but, compared to other monarchies worldwide, the Japanese version seems less "useful" and "practical" than the rest.

AristoCat 07-24-2011 09:57 AM

For all that the IHA is bashed all the time, at least they have prevented the Imperial Family from making fools of themselves and the nation (by default) via scandals in their personal lives. The Imperial Family has managed to avoid so many of the scandals that have bogged the Western monarchies, for the very reason that the Imperial Family even has the IHA. Second, each member has been carefully screened and also I wonder how well the Imperial Fmaily would do without the IHA.

As for intellect, the Imperial family's members are famous for their scientific interests and things they do to occupy their time.

wartenberg7 07-24-2011 04:33 PM

Still I donīt see whatīs the point of people from other countries to discuss if Japan should abolish its monarchy...?!
Isnīt that up to the Japanese? As far as I see thereīs no serious discussion IN JAPAN (!) about the monarchy right now - so what we do here is mingling into something thatīs not our business and has no affect on this matter whatsoever.

ChiaraC 07-24-2011 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wartenberg7 (Post 1291605)
Still I donīt see whatīs the point of people from other countries to discuss if Japan should abolish its monarchy...?!
Isnīt that up to the Japanese? As far as I see thereīs no serious discussion IN JAPAN (!) about the monarchy right now - so what we do here is mingling into something thatīs not our business and has no affect on this matter whatsoever.

You are absolutely right. :flowers: But do not you think that this whole royal forum is in general a lot about meddling with things that are really NONE of our business and that all those sometimes heated conversations that take place here have hardly EVER any effect on the matters discussed? ;)

Renata4711 07-24-2011 06:02 PM

As far as I can see, there is no "meddling" taking place.

What is taking place ? Intelligent conversation. Mental stimulation. Interesting discussion. And much more...

Tiberivs 07-24-2011 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wartenberg7 (Post 1291605)
Still I donīt see whatīs the point of people from other countries to discuss if Japan should abolish its monarchy...?!
Isnīt that up to the Japanese? As far as I see thereīs no serious discussion IN JAPAN (!) about the monarchy right now - so what we do here is mingling into something thatīs not our business and has no affect on this matter whatsoever.

Very observant of you, however you neglected to mention the reason for this. In affect the radical right would hurt anybody that would suggest abolishing the monarchy, hell even "disrespecting" the Imperial family by the neglecting to mention a member honorific title could get you stabbed.

Now, in that kind of atmosphere, do you really think Japan could have a open discussion about the necessity of the Emperor? I would think not.

Kasumi 07-24-2011 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiberivs (Post 1291673)
...

:previous:
The article at your link dates back to 2004. The boss of IHA nowadays is the Owadas' long term friend. What was your point, anyway?

XeniaCasaraghi 07-24-2011 11:31 PM

No, arent they one monarchy that actually serves a purpose?

AristoCat 07-25-2011 01:03 AM

I think they are. they have to be the only RF that isn't loaded with one scandal after another and in terms of wealth are actually quite poor.

Tiberivs 07-25-2011 04:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kasumi (Post 1291715)
:previous:
The article at your link dates back to 2004. The boss of IHA nowadays is the Owadas' long term friend. What was your point, anyway?

The IHA? I didn't wrote a word about the IHA. Please re-read my post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiberivs (Post 1291673)
Very observant of you, however you neglected to mention the reason for this. In affect the radical right would hurt anybody that would suggest abolishing the monarchy, hell even "disrespecting" the Imperial family by the neglecting to mention a member honorific title could get you stabbed.

Now, in that kind of atmosphere, do you really think Japan could have a open discussion about the necessity of the Emperor? I would think not.

And my point is that free discussion about the monarchy is suppressed by the radical right, usually when people need to resort to violence to repress free discussion its mean that the issue is far from being consensus among the people. So the point of about the lack of serious discussion about the abolishment of the monarchy is irrelevant.

Not to mention that the fact the Imperial family are the most imminent symbol to xenophobic, racist, militaristic and anti-democratic group is hardly a positive indication to them having a good influence in a democratic Japan.

ChiaraC 07-25-2011 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiberivs (Post 1291780)
Not to mention that the fact the Imperial family are the most imminent symbol to xenophobic, racist, militaristic and anti-democratic group is hardly a positive indication to them having a good influence in a democratic Japan.

As far as I am informed you are still right on this one. But IMO we have the paradoxical situation in Japan that the institution of the monarchy may be anti-democratic while its actual representatives are not. The situation reminds me to some degree of that of Spain after Franco. (Please do not take me wrong: there are, of course, many differences concerning history, background, political situation, continent...) But what we saw in Spain was that the individual that happens to be king (or emperor) can make an important difference in a certain historical situation. Juan Carlos was meant to be Francoīs heir (by Franco). According to his role, he should have supported the right-winger militarist forces.
But he did not. Instead, he saved the Spanish democracy. :D

For more details of my opininion (if anybody is interested) please see here:
Is Japan’s Monarchy Anti-Democratic? | The Royal Forums

Tiberivs 07-25-2011 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiaraC (Post 1291893)
As far as I am informed you are still right on this one. But IMO we have the paradoxical situation in Japan that the institution of the monarchy may be anti-democratic while its actual representatives are not. The situation reminds me to some degree of that of Spain after Franco. (Please do not take me wrong: there are, of course, many differences concerning history, background, political situation, continent...) But what we saw in Spain was that the individual that happens to be king (or emperor) can make an important difference in a certain historical situation. Juan Carlos was meant to be Francoīs heir (by Franco). According to his role, he should have supported the right-winger militarist forces.
But he did not. Instead, he saved the Spanish democracy. :D

For more details of my opininion (if anybody is interested) please see here:
Is Japan’s Monarchy Anti-Democratic? | The Royal Forums

Thanks for the link, I tend to agree with you that the present Emperor seem to be pretty decent guy who truly sorry for Japan's imperialist past and desire to have strong bonds of friends with Asian neighbors and former colonies, he for example refuse to visit the shrine where several war crimes were deified - the PM for example visit it.

The comparison to Spain is very interesting, the different to my view that while the Spanish King manage to reform the Royal establishment to be in tune with the democratic Spain the Japanese Emperor seem too weak to manage to do this.

wartenberg7 07-25-2011 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiberivs (Post 1291673)
Very observant of you, however you neglected to mention the reason for this. In affect the radical right would hurt anybody that would suggest abolishing the monarchy, hell even "disrespecting" the Imperial family by the neglecting to mention a member honorific title could get you stabbed.

Now, in that kind of atmosphere, do you really think Japan could have a open discussion about the necessity of the Emperor? I would think not.



Oh, and thatīs why it has to be discussed at a royal intenet forum...?!:whistling:

ChiaraC 07-25-2011 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiberivs (Post 1291944)
Thanks for the link, I tend to agree with you that the present Emperor seem to be pretty decent guy who truly sorry for Japan's imperialist past and desire to have strong bonds of friends with Asian neighbors and former colonies, he for example refuse to visit the shrine where several war crimes were deified - the PM for example visit it.

Yes, and in 2001 the emperor shocked the press by talking in detail about his Korean roots. :eek: (He said he had read in an eighth-century official history document that the mother of Emperor Kammu (736-806) was a descendant of Muryeong, the 25th king of Baekje, one of three ancient kingdoms on the peninsula.) The speech was front-page news in Korea whereas the huge majority of Japanese newspapers completely ignored it because they were afraid of the reaction from nationalists...:ermm:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tiberivs (Post 1291944)
The comparison to Spain is very interesting, the different to my view that while the Spanish King manage to reform the Royal establishment to be in tune with the democratic Spain the Japanese Emperor seem too weak to manage to do this.

I agree with you but it I think that it was also the special historical situation that gave this power to the Spanish king. There was an open conflict between militarists and democrats. And that in that situation the king took a clear stand and said: if you want to abolish the democracy I am the first you have to shoot, that was, IMO, the moment when he really changed history. He is a constitutional monarch, like Akihito, and nowadays does not have much political power.

There is no such situation in Japan that would give the emperor a chance to really have an impact on things. But if there ever were to be an open conflict in Japan between democrats and right-winger nationalists, I am rather sure which side the emperor (and even more the crown prince) would take. Of course, it is possible, that such a situation will never become reality - especially as the idea of an open conflict is rather un-Japanese in itself....

ChiaraC 07-25-2011 01:30 PM

It is legitimate (and interesting) to have a debate about how far the right-wing influence in Japan still goes today, if the racism that has undoubtedly played a part in Japanīs history has still a meaningful influence or has finally been reduced to the cranky pastime of some outdated relics.

I do not know what Tiberivs has read but he might, for example, have heard that Ivan Hall, a historian of Japan and former diplomat, calls Japan’s monarchy the “ultimate linchpin of the myth of Japanese uniqueness and the lodestar for the most repressive ideas of racial superiority.”

Al_bina 07-25-2011 02:24 PM

I do no think that Mr.Hall is an ultimate authority on the Japanese culture and history. Japanese Emperors are the linchpins of the nation during hard times. This makes them unique and irreplaceable.

ChiaraC 07-25-2011 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Al_bina (Post 1292014)
I do no think that Mr.Hall is an ultimate authority on the Japanese culture and history. Japanese Emperors are the linchpins of the nation during hard times. This makes them unique and irreplaceable.

Albina, my point here is not whether Mr. Hall is an ultimate authority on the Japanese culture and history or not. (Incidentally, I doubt that anybody could fairly be called an ULTIMATE authority on the Japanese culture and history. Who should that be?) My point is not even if I agree with him or not. Actually, I hope that those who have read some of my posts are aware that I am not in favour of abolishing the monarchy in Japan. (Not that I think that anybody would ask me.)

In quoting Ivan Hall I was answering to <a deleted post> who made it sound as if only somebody who had never read anything relevant on Japan could talk about a connection of racism and the institution of the monarchy in Japan. And that is simply not true. There are many experts on Japan who are discussing it. And it is also true that in the past there have been incidents that showed that persons who criticize the emperor might be physically attacked. Of course, one could fairly question whether this could still happen nowadays but it is IMO not so absurd as to tell a poster who claims that it could, that he simply has no clue. And even IF somebody feels the urgent and irrepressible need to say that, then I would prefer this to be expressed in a respectful way.

I hope it is clearer now...

ChristopherWales 07-31-2011 05:12 PM

It is up to the people of Japan. However, I do think they might be the baby out with bath water if they do abolish the monarchy.

Renata4711 07-31-2011 05:28 PM

Having re-read this thread, I think they have far more important problems to contend with, e.g. nuclear disasters, earth quakes etc.

Bones 08-20-2011 08:21 PM

Gracious! No!:eek: Absolutely, positively no! The Japanese monarchy is the most ancient reigning dynasty in the world, the oldest succession in human history. Getting rid of it would be a crime, not just for Japan but for world history. Think of everything in all those centuries of history that the monarchy has survived just to have them tossed aside now on a democratic whim because the people are bored or something? Unthinkable. I mean, the Emperor of Japan is the only person in the world who can look at the Queen of Denmark, the Queen of England or even the Pope and say, 'oh yeah, the "new" guys'. The people can give them power or take away their power, I don't care, but no one has the right to say someone is not who they are. Japan without an emperor wouldn't be Japan.

:japanstandard: :japanflag: :japanflag:

Kasumi 08-21-2011 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bones (Post 1305733)
... I mean, the Emperor of Japan is the only person in the world who can look at the Queen of Denmark, the Queen of England or even the Pope and say, 'oh yeah, the "new" guys'...

You are so funny!:smile:
You've made my day with your "new guys", thank you.

Grandduchess24 08-25-2011 04:31 PM

Everyone recognizes the Japanese emperor and the royal family and the people of japan must love and respect them but they will have issues in the future possibly and will eventually end unless who knows how much longer they will last.

XeniaCasaraghi 08-26-2011 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bones (Post 1305733)
I mean, the Emperor of Japan is the only person in the world who can look at the Queen of Denmark, the Queen of England or even the Pope and say, 'oh yeah, the "new" guys'.

LMAO! That is rich and hilarious. There we go case closed. If the English insist on keeping their monarchy because of history and tradition, then that works 10 fold for the Japanese monarchy.

Tuf Pic 07-05-2014 01:07 PM

Long live the yamato dynasty!!

Admiral Horthy 12-14-2014 01:47 PM

Japan needs to amend the American imposed constitution and make the Emperor the legal and rightful head of state and end his ambiguous position. He must be given a governmental role of some sort so that he is seen as a working monarch. He should be commander in chief of the defense force. The rest of the family should be given real jobs in the government, working as ambassadors or on trade missions or something.

The rule that imperial princesses must leave the family and lose their titles when getting married needs to be abolished. Imperial princesses should be allowed to start their own branches of the family, especially if they marry a member of the former aristocracy, which I believe one princess did. This could also be used to solve the succession problem. If a reigning emperor had no sons but one of his daughters did, that boy could inherit the throne. That way you respect tradition and reduce the pressure on the CP to produce an heir. And the pressure on poor Prince Hisahito.

It sounds like the IHA is too large and too powerful, the family should be given more so-say in their lives. Jobs in the IHA should also be more career oriented and less transitory. At one time employees of the IHA were life-long employees. The advantage to that is that they build a relationship with the family as well as become a contributing member of history and tradition, rather than just a temporary bureaucrat.

amaryllus 12-14-2014 02:11 PM

They don't amend that illogical out of date succession rule to at the very least allow princess's son's to inherit it's Russian roulette they are playing on the biggest scale... What happens if Hisahito dies young or has no children or just girls or if his son is just not suitable in some way.This child, mostly likely literally produced for this purpose, is what they are depending on will keep the oldest monarchy and the traditions of millennia alive? Really?

Admiral Horthy 12-14-2014 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amaryllus (Post 1731057)
They don't amend that illogical out of date succession rule to at the very least allow princess's son's to inherit it's Russian roulette they are playing on the biggest scale... What happens if Hisahito dies young or has no children or just girls or if his son is just not suitable in some way.This child, mostly likely literally produced for this purpose, is what they are depending on will keep the oldest monarchy and the traditions of millennia alive? Really?

A Imperial Princess's sons could inherit if she married an Imperial Prince! The Imperial Family is so small now that that isn't likely to happen, or even be a good idea. An Imperial Princess, if she so desires, should be allowed to retain her status and start a new branch of the family. A simple and practical solution.

amaryllus 12-14-2014 02:54 PM

Yeah,They got rid of the cadet royal and ancient noble families after the war which if course got rid of all the eligible prince's royal ladies would traditionally marry so part of the debacle right there.
What they should do and what they will are two totally different animals...To eventually save the monarchy they, the IHA and conservative PTB, will only go as far as they absolutely have to which, IMO, won't give the females an inch...their son's maybe. Heck, if they could I imagine a few would bring back concubine's if they could.

GracieGiraffe 12-14-2014 03:11 PM

I'd vote yes; the people may love their imperial house, but surely they must realize the heartache imposed on the family by all of the unreasonable restrictions they face.

Duc_et_Pair 12-14-2014 03:17 PM

Together with Sweden, the Japanese is the least politcal involved and utterly ceremonial monarchy. So it is what it is: a purely ceremonial symbol of Japan. And knowing how Japan loves its traditions and elaborate ceremonies, the country will be the very last to abolish the ancient monarchy, I think.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GracieGiraffe (Post 1731071)
I'd vote yes; the people may love their imperial house, but surely they must realize the heartache imposed on the family by all of the unreasonable restrictions they face.

They do not. It is totally ganz selbstverständlich in their culture, to use a German saying (totally natural). You only need to look at the known rites for marriage, funerals, traditional sports like sumo, takagari (falconry), kyudo (archery), aikido (martial arts), etc. to see how utterly deep-rooted these ceremonies and cultural standards are. Princess Akishino and Princess Kiko show that they are very modern and approachable royals by the way, without neglecting the traditions. Look at this fantastic picture: https://jto.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-conte...0111105a5a.jpg

amaryllus 12-14-2014 03:32 PM

For most all of Japanese history The emperor has been a puppet simply there for ceremonial purposes and so on and the various power holding samurai, warlords or governments could say they had the power of the Gods. He could conveniently be put aside by fair or fowl means if he got notions of power. The only difference now is that they aren't having dozens of sons to carry on.

Blog Real 12-14-2014 03:56 PM

Always monarchy.

I hope that the monarchy of Japan lasts forever. And the others, too. :flowers:

Viva monarchies. Alive traditions!!! :flowers:

amaryllus 12-14-2014 04:10 PM

Just imagine if the Portuguese, Russian, French, Chinese monarchies and all the rest were still around...Think of the discussions, the bling, the debates, the bling, the fashions, the bling we would have here.

Duc_et_Pair 12-14-2014 05:02 PM

Haha how busy we would be on the forum! :)

Al_bina 12-14-2014 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amaryllus (Post 1731079)
For most all of Japanese history The emperor has been a puppet simply there for ceremonial purposes and so on and the various power holding samurai, warlords or governments could say they had the power of the Gods. He could conveniently be put aside by fair or fowl means if he got notions of power. The only difference now is that they aren't having dozens of sons to carry on.

Presidents/Prime Ministers in the enlightened western regimes are puppets too. They front for money of rich industrialists and financiers/bankers.
I highly doubt that the Japanese will abolish the monarchy. Appropriate measure will be taken to continue the dynasty.

Nico 12-14-2014 05:23 PM

Is there such debate in Japan ?

MARG 12-15-2014 01:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amaryllus (Post 1731065)
Yeah,They got rid of the cadet royal and ancient noble families after the war which if course got rid of all the eligible prince's royal ladies would traditionally marry so part of the debacle right there.
What they should do and what they will are two totally different animals...To eventually save the monarchy they, the IHA and conservative PTB, will only go as far as they absolutely have to which, IMO, won't give the females an inch...their son's maybe. Heck, if they could I imagine a few would bring back concubine's if they could.

"They", aka the US, did get rid of the nobles and aristocracy post WWII, however, they can take away the title but the people, the families are still there and I would bet they are as "aristocratic" as ever whatever their names are. I am sure that those cadet royal and ancient noble titles could have had those titles restored if they so wished.

amaryllus 12-15-2014 02:29 AM

Yes, exactly! set one of those young Princes or Dukes up with Mako or Kako in an arranged but not too arranged marriage and you've got your much vaunted male babies...But it would be so much less trouble to just let the ladies have a right! in the past they had empresses and the throne even passed from mother to daughter once:bang:.

ROYAL NORWAY 12-15-2014 03:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nico (Post 1731142)
Is there such debate in Japan ?

No, there is no debate in Japan to abolish the monarchy. The only chance that Japan becomes a republic, is if the monarchy dies out.

ChiaraC know more about this, but she sadly doesn't post here anymore.

Moonmaiden23 12-15-2014 03:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Al_bina (Post 1731138)
Presidents/Prime Ministers in the enlightened western regimes are puppets too. They front for money of rich industrialists and financiers/bankers.
I highly doubt that the Japanese will abolish the monarchy. Appropriate measure will be taken to continue the dynasty.

AMEN to that. You speak the truth!:sad:

Blog Real 06-04-2016 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROYAL NORWAY (Post 1731232)
No, there is no debate in Japan to abolish the monarchy. The only chance that Japan becomes a republic, is if the monarchy dies out.

ChiaraC know more about this, but she sadly doesn't post here anymore.

What is the only chance to become Republic?

The Emperor is the brand image of Japan. The Japanese monarchy should be the safest of all.

Al_bina 06-04-2016 11:20 PM

:previous:
Tenno (Emperor) is the highest priest of the Shinto religion, who deals with important heavenly affairs. The Windsors in the UK or any other European royal family can be viewed as a brand image.

Blog Real 06-04-2016 11:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Al_bina (Post 1895614)
:previous:
Tenno (Emperor) is the highest priest of the Shinto religion, who deals with important heavenly affairs. The Windsors in the UK or any other European royal family can be viewed as a brand image.

In the United Kingdom, the Queen is head of the Anglican Church. Are roles alike.

All monarchs are hallmarks that must be preserved. In my opinion.

Al_bina 06-04-2016 11:33 PM

:previous:
Unlike English sovereigns, Emperors of Japan are said to be the direct descendants of the sun-goddess Amaterasu. The Japanese usually call the Emperor "Tennō", which means "heavenly sovereign".

Rulers of the British Isles were Roman Catholic. Then Henry VIII decided to form his own church to get a divorce. It is up to Europeans to preserve or change their lacklustre brand images.

Blog Real 08-05-2016 06:55 AM

Next Monday the Emperor abdicated, this could damage the image of the monarchy?

Duc_et_Pair 08-05-2016 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blog Real (Post 1914053)
Next Monday the Emperor abdicated, this could damage the image of the monarchy?

No, then his son Naruhito will become the new Emperor and revive the monarchy. Did the abdications of King Juan Carlos of Spain, King Albert II of the Belgians, Queen Beatrix of the Netherlands, Pope Benedictus XVI or Grand-Duke Jean of Luxembourg damage their monarchies?


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