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Josefine 03-01-2003 04:50 PM

Princess Sibylla of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha (1908-1972) - King Carl XVI Gustaf's Mother
 
1 Attachment(s)
Princess Sibylla (Sibylla Calma Marie Alice Wettin) of Saxe-Coburg Gotha was born in 1908. Her parents were Prince Leopold (Leopold Charles Edward Wettin), Duke of Saxe-Coburg-Gotha (1884- ). The Prince was a grandson of Queen Victoria. His father was Prince Leopold. Her father did not fare well in World War I. He abdicated as Duke of Saxe-Coburg at the end of te War in 1918. His British titles (Duke of Albany, Earl of Clarence, and Baron Arklow were removed in 1919. Princess Sibylla's mother was Princess Schleswig-Holste Victoria Adelheid (1885- ). Princess Sibylla married Swedish Crown Prince Gustav Adolf (1906-47), the eldest son of future King Gustav VI and Princess Margaret Victoria Wettin (1882-1920). They were married in Coburg in 1932. The Crown Princess is seen here in a World War II era uniform (figure 1). They had five children: Margaretha Dérirée (1934- ), Birgitta Ingeborg (1937- ), Désirée Elizabeth (1938- ), Christina Louise Helen (1943- ), and Carl Gustav (1946- ). Gustav Adolf died in 1947 in a tragic airplane crash at the Copenhagen airport before his father assumed the throne. His son Carl Gustaf became Crown Prince when his grandfather, King Gustaf VI Adolf, acceded to the throne in 1950. Heinherited the throne when his grandfather died in 1973. The Riksdag in 1965 raised to 25 the age at which a king could begin his rule, and in 1971 it enacted legislation, effective at Gustav's death in 1973, stripping the monarchy of its most important political functions. The crown prince acceded to the largely ceremonial throne as Carl XVI Gustaf. He chose as his motto, "For Sweden in keeping with the times". The new king chose this motto to stress his desire to meet with the demands on a modern monarch.

text from
https://histclo.hispeed.com/royal/swe/royal...al-sweg6gas.htm

Josefine 03-01-2003 04:51 PM

1 Attachment(s)
picture from www.corbis.com

Prince Gustaf Adolf and Princess Sibylla
Original caption: Europe's Newest Royal Honeymooners. Coburg, Bavaria, Germany: Prince Gustaf Adolf, grandson of the King of Sweden, and his bride,Princess Sybilla von Coburg-Gotha, enjoying a stroll during their honeymoon here shortly after their marriage. The marriage marked the first royal nuptials to be held in Republican Germany. The couple are shown in the castle garden. October 27, 1932.

Josefine 03-01-2003 04:52 PM

1 Attachment(s)
picture from www.corbis.com

Princess Sibylle and Prince Gustav Adolf
Prince Gustav Adolf is the grandson of the King of Sweden.


Date Photographed October 19, 1932
Location Information Coburg, Bavaria, Germany

Josefine 03-01-2003 05:02 PM

1 Attachment(s)
picture from www.corbis.com

Swedish Royals at Outdoor Event
Original caption: Pretty Little Swedish Princess Carries Out First Official Duty. Preparing for the many official duties she will have to carry out when she gets older, pretty little Princess Margaretha, daughter of Prince Gustav Adolf and Princess Sibylla of Sweden, carried out her first official task when she presented the prizes at the Children's Day Flower Contest at the Skanson park. She was accompanied by her parents and her little sister. Prince Gustav and Princess Sibylla (on front bench) with their youngest daugher, and seated beside them Princess Margaretha and Birgitta. The latter is the daughter of Mr. Lennart Bernadotte, "Commander in Chief" of the Children's Day, who is seen behind. May 9, 1938.

Josefine 06-23-2003 04:20 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Prince Carl Gustav with His Mother Princess Sybilla

Josefine 06-23-2003 04:21 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Original caption: Quartette of Swedish Royal Beauties. Stockholm, Sweden: Princess Sibylla of Sweden, who will celebrate her 50th birthday tomorrow, January 18, poses with her three beautiful daughters, none of which is yet married, in the robes of their royalty. From left are Princess Margareta, Princess Sibylla, Princess Birgitta, and Princess Desiree. January 17, 1958.

www.corbis.com

Josefine 07-09-2003 02:44 PM

2 Attachment(s)
www.ibl.se

Josefine 09-10-2003 06:15 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Prinsessan Sibylla med sina barn, prinsessan Desirée, prinsessan Margaretha, prinsessan Birgitta och prinsessan Christina 1944

Josefine 09-10-2003 06:33 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Prinsessan Birgitta, prinsessan Desirée, prinsessan Christina, prins Carl Gustaf och prinsessan Sibylla på båtfärd med flytvästar, 1950-tal

Josefine 09-10-2003 06:42 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Prinsessan Sibylla med barnbarnen James Ambler, Edward Ambler, Carl Silfverschiöld, Sybilla Ambler och Tina Silfverschiöld 1970-tal

Josefine 09-10-2003 06:43 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Prinsessan Sibylla och prinsessan Christina 1966

Helen88 04-19-2004 12:05 PM

I once heard that Sibylla never learned to speak Swedish and the Swedish people didn´t like a very much. Is that true?

Dennism 04-19-2004 01:53 PM

A beautiful woman. In several photos, she has reminded me of Madeleine.

Dennism 04-28-2004 02:20 PM

Here is a photo with her and the King himself from circa 1949:

Photo

Josefine 09-15-2004 11:23 AM

what year and ate did the princess die
was she once a crown princess then when her husband died she became a princess

irishchic5 09-15-2004 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josefine
was she once a crown princess then when her husband died she became a princess

I'm pretty sure her husband died before he was ever Crown Prince, so she was never a Crown Princess either.

Josefine 09-19-2004 04:03 AM

I saw now that he was a prince in a article, thank you

does anyone know what date she was born

Josefine 02-05-2005 05:46 PM

1 Attachment(s)
a photo of the kings mother and father

GrandDuchess 03-08-2005 08:48 AM

Sibylla Calma Marie Alice Bathildis Feodora, Princess of Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha, Duchess of Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha, was born on 18 January 1908 at the Friedenstein Palace in Gotha.

She was the daughter of Charles Edward George Albert Leopold Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha, Duke of Sachsen-Coburg-Gotha, Duke of Albany, Earl of Clarence, Baron Arklow, and Viktoria Adelheid Helene Luise Marie Friedrike, Princess of Schleswig-Holstein-Sonderburg-Glücksborg.

Sibylla married Gustaf Adolf Oscar Fredrik Arthur Edmund, Prince of Sweden, in a civil wedding on 19 October 1932 in Coburg and a religious wedding on 20 October 1932 in Coburg.

Princess Sibylla died in Stockholm on 28 November 1972.

GrandDuchess 03-08-2005 08:51 AM

10 Attachment(s)
Princess Sibylla with her family

1: Carl Gustaf between Queen Louise and Princess Sibylla
2: Princess Sibylla with Carl Gustaf in 1949
3: Princess Sibylla in a carriage with King Gustav V, Gustaf (VI) Adolf and Carl Gustaf in her lap
4: Princess Sibylla with Carl Gustaf
5: Prince Gustaf Adolf and Princess Sibylla at the christening of Carl Gustaf on 7 June 1946
6: Princess Sibylla seated among her family at the Swedish Flag’s Day (what is today the National Day) in 1963
7: Princess Sibylla with Carl Gustaf at a dog show in 1949
8: Princess Sibylla with her daughters in December 1941
9: Prince Gustaf Adolf and Princess Sibylla with Princess Margaretha and Princess Birgitta on 22 March 1937
10: Prince Gustaf Adolf and Princess Sibylla with their family

GrandDuchess 03-08-2005 09:14 AM

3 Attachment(s)
The Princely Couple; Gustaf Adolf and Sibylla:

GrandDuchess 03-08-2005 09:15 AM

9 Attachment(s)
Princess Sibylla:

1: Princess Sibylla in her older years
2: Princess Sibylla in the Connaught Diamond Tiara
3: Out and about representing
4: As a regal older lady in the Leuchtenberg sapphires
5: Beautiful in black
6: Princess Sibylla in her Court dress
7: The Nobel Banquet in 1963
8: The Nobel Banquet in 1963
9 In her scout uniform

Josefine 03-24-2005 05:38 AM

do anyone know is she had any male partner after her husband died
and how old was she when he died
what i understand she never met Silvia but she know of her

GrandDuchess 06-25-2005 09:22 PM

https://img74.echo.cx/img74/6365/bokm...ylla3do.th.jpg
Princess Sibylla

Josefine 07-25-2006 10:17 AM

i love that last photo of her
is there any good book about the princess with photos of her?

magnik 07-25-2006 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josefine
do anyone know is she had any male partner after her husband died
and how old was she when he died
what i understand she never met Silvia but she know of her

Sibylla von Sachsen-Coburg und Gotha, Princess von Sachsen-Coburg und Gotha, Duchess von Sachsen (18. 01. 1908 - 28. 11. 1972)
married on 19. 10. 1932 to Gustaf Adolf Bernadotte, Prince of Sweden, Duke of Vasterbotten (22. 04. 1906 - 26. 01. 1947)
On the time of their wedding she was 24, he 26.
When he died she was 39 he 40 (nearly 41).

Silvia meet the Crown Prince Carl Gustav during Summer Olympics in Munich from 26 August to 11 September 1972. Than I think she could (but rather don't) meet Sibylla.

https://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sibylla...n-Coburg-Gotha

GrandDuchess 07-25-2006 02:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josefine
is there any good book about the princess with photos of her?

I haven't found one yet, so as far as I know there aren't any. But I'm constantly keeping an eye out for older royalty books, and if I ever find one on only Sibylla, I'll report it to you. The best chance to get pictures of her is to buy older books on the Swedish Royal Family, like the annual review books.

Princess Sibylla never met Silvia. She was ill with cancer at the time that Crown Prince Carl Gustaf met Silvia Sommerlath, and passed away only a short time later.

Furienna 07-25-2006 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josefine
The Prince was a grandson of Queen Victoria. His father was Prince Leopold.

So Sibylla was a great grandchild of Victoria just like her husband? Yikes! :eek: Still, they were only second cousins...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helen88
I once heard that Sibylla never learned to speak Swedish and the Swedish people didn´t like a very much. Is that true?

It is true. She was very German, too German for Sweden, and she's been described as a princess, who wasn't popular before she was old.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josefine
do anyone know is she had any male partner after her husband died

Probably not. She had to stay true to the memory of her husband the heir. Royal widows seldom re-marry. Just think of Elizabeth Bowes-Lyon, who lived as a queen dowager for almost fifty years!

Jose 07-28-2006 05:54 AM

Princess Sibylla was funeral 7 december on royal caste in Stockholm,Storkyrka. She was funeral all royal family: His death husband Gustav Adolfs father Gustaf Adolf born 1881-1973,his children:Princess Margaretha and Princess Birgitta,Princess Desiree,Princess Christina and crown prince is Carl Gustaf. Princess Sibyllas grandchildren was with farewell grandmother princess Sibyllas funeral 1972 7 december. Princess Sibyllas sister-in-law was Queen Ingrid with children and husband Henrik and Richard,Konstantin married to Queen Ingrids daughter farewell Princess Sibylla on funeral. One of oldest friends Princess Alice of Athlone was best oldest friend to old king Gustaf Adolf. Best oldest friend princess Alice of Athlone was much more royal family of Sweden many years. Princess Alice and Princess Sibylla was much good friends over 40 years.!!! Prince Lennart and Princess Sonja Bernadotte come to funeral. Prince Lennart was son to Prince Wilhelm death 1965. Prince Lennart was brotherchildren to old King Gustaf Adolf and cousin to death crown prince Gustav Adolf was married with princess Sibylla. King Olav and crown prince Albert of Belgium,Prince Bertil,Princess Caroline Mathilde of Denmark(married to prince Knud of Denmark),Princess Sibyllas cousin prince Peter of Schleswig-Holstein.Princess Sibyllas sisterdaughter mrs Victoria Huntington-Whiteley. Prince Carl of Bernadotte was brother to Princess Märtha of Norway married with king Olav. King Olav was with farewell princess Sibyllas funeral. Good friends Ingrid Björneberg was come to Princess Sibyllas funeral. Many guest come to Princess Sibyllas funeral. She was burial on Haga parken Norra Solna.

benbournane 03-24-2007 07:45 AM

Victoria Adelaide of Saxe Coburg Gotha
 
Any pics of Victoria Adelaide of SCG, princess sybilla 's mother, with her grandcgildren or great grandchildren?:rolleyes:

elenaris 03-24-2007 10:49 AM

saxe_coburg_gotha_carleduard

suztav 11-22-2007 10:21 AM

I'm curious as to why the King didn't name any one of his daughter's after his mother. Sybilla is a beautiful name. Any ideas?

Marengo 11-28-2007 12:27 PM

Perhaps because Princess Margaretha, Mrs. Ambler already has a daughter named after Sibylla, namely Sibylla Ambler, it can get confusing to have a lot of people with the same name around in one family, which I know from personal experience since half the women in my paternal family are called Marie and variations on that theme while on the maternal side it is all Anna and variations on it.

LadyFinn 12-02-2007 05:32 AM

A lovely photo, princess Sibylla with princess Margareta November 28th 1934
Photoshot
Photo of Princess Sibylla undergoing the driving test in Stockholm July 17th 1935
Photoshot
Nine-year-old Prince Carl Gustaf of Sweden shows his school report to his mother, Princess Sibylla, and sister, Princess Birgitta, during breaking-up ceremonies at the Broms school, where the young princ, is a pupil. The crown prince is dressed for a gymnastic exhibition.
ANP Beeldbank
At the solemn opening of the Swedish Parliament the royal persons appear in all their state. Left-right Queen Louise, King Gustaf VI Adolf and Princess Sibylla
ANP Beeldbank
Princess Sibylla and prince Gustav Adolf at their wedding day
SeegerPress
A lovely photo of princess Sibylla, taken in October 1914
SeegerPress
Duke Karl Eduard and Duchess Viktoria Adelheid of Sachsen - Coburg and Gotha with their Family, Children Hereditary Prince Johann Leopold, Princess Sibylla, Prince Hubertus and Princess Caroline Mathilde, taken Ist April 1914
SeegerPress
Duke Karl Eduard and Duchess Viktoria Adelheid of Sachsen - Coburg and Gotha with their Family, Children Hereditary Prince Johann Leopold, Princess Sibylla, Prince Hubertus, Princess Caroline Mathilde, Prinz Friedrich and Prince Friedrich Josias, taken 1st January 1923
SeegerPress

Some photos of princess Sibylla:
Princess Sibylla as a child
Sjöberg Bild
Sjöberg Bild
Princess Sibylla with one of her daughters
Sjöberg Bild
Princess Sibylla and crown prince Gustaf Adolf 1937
Sjöberg Bild

Furienna 12-02-2007 07:56 AM

Those are some lovely pictures!

rop81 12-16-2007 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LadyFinn (Post 705006)
Princess Sibylla and crown prince Gustaf Adolf 1937
Sjöberg Bild

God that´s two terrible outfits they got there! Esp the crownprince looks ridiculous imo....

Furienna 12-16-2007 07:23 AM

Ha ha... Yeah, that wasn't good.

Hanna Regina 12-16-2007 09:04 AM

Well, the description mentions scout uniforms, maybe that's how they looked back then. They sure aren't pretty in any case...
Prince (not Crown Prince) Gustav Adolf's hat is almoust as big as an umbrella!

Hanna Regina 12-16-2007 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by suztav (Post 696295)
I'm curious as to why the King didn't name any one of his daughter's after his mother. Sybilla is a beautiful name. Any ideas?

The Princesses have eight names together, so it shouldn't have been very difficult to squeeze in Sibylla there, even though the King's niece is named Sybilla.
He didn't choose Gustaf as one of his son's names either, and that was the name of his father, grandfather and great-grandfather as well as being his own name. Princess Christina's son is named Gustaf, and the King and Queen chose the more personal Edmund, which was the family's name for the King's father, but still.
Perhaps these names will show up in the next generation.:rolleyes:

LadyFinn 12-16-2007 01:41 PM

Princess Sibylla with prince Gustaf Adolf at their engagement day:
Sjöberg Bild
Sjöberg Bild
Princess Sibylla with prince Gustaf Adolf at the 1930´s
Sjöberg Bild
Sibylla, Gustaf Adolf and Gustav V at the 1940´s
Sjöberg Bild
Sibylla with princess Desiree at the 1960´s
Sjöberg Bild

Princess Sibylla was present when her three daughters, the Princesses Margaretha (left), Desiree (second from right), and Birgitta, (right) participated in the patrol competitions of the Girl Scouts of Stockholm 1948
Corbis

Jose 12-22-2007 01:27 PM

Princess Sibylla was good mother and grandmother to Princess Margarethas children and Princess Desirees children,Princess Birgittas children. Princess Sibylla was much near good friends with Ingrid Björneberg"Nenne". Ingrid was "grandmother" to king Carl Gustaf and Princess sisters Bernadotte. Princess Sibylla was near with his father-in-law Gustaf Adolf. Near Queen Louise death 1965 and King Gustaf Adolf was big sorry his wifes death. Princess Sibylla was support too father-in-law King Gustaf Adolf on Queen Louises funeral 1965 and many years! Princess Sibylla was often alone near his husband death 1947. Princess Sibylla often visit event and dress! Princess Sibylla was good daughter-in-law too King Gustaf Adolf. Princess Sibylla death 1972 after Ingrid Björneberg take over see more royal family Bernadotte. Ingrid Björneberg have often live his royal family Bernadotte from 1940-1990. Ingrid was "grandmother" more King Carl Gustaf with Queen Silvia,children. Princess Birgitta with family,Princess Desiree with family.Princess Christina with family,Princess Margaretha with family. Princess Sibylla was much grateful to left Ingrid Björneberg at royal family of Bernadotte. Ingrid Björneberg was born 1913-1994. She was death at royal palace Sweden.

Josefine 06-03-2008 04:07 PM

there has been a bokk written about her
has anyone seen it?
what did you think

grandlordbenji16 08-22-2009 03:29 AM

Oh my god when you look at her pictures with then prince carl gustav she look more like his grandmother she was only 43 and she had all the grey hair and people should look more into her life cause i dont think she was that cold to her children like so many royal women she just could not relate to her children. also the fact that her father was a nazi leaders and she bear four girls before she had a son { another version of alexandra feodorovna } but unlike the tsarina her father was blessed not to have inherit the dreadful disease which could have pass on to her children i wonder how she would react if she had live to see her son marry a commoner since it was with reluctant she accept her sons-in-laws but werent the king 26 and i believe when she died they should arrange a marriage for him with a princess i always like her even tough she wasnot popular

Soli Deo Gloria 09-04-2009 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hanna Regina (Post 705523)
The Princesses have eight names together, so it shouldn't have been very difficult to squeeze in Sibylla there, even though the King's niece is named Sybilla.
He didn't choose Gustaf as one of his son's names either, and that was the name of his father, grandfather and great-grandfather as well as being his own name. Princess Christina's son is named Gustaf, and the King and Queen chose the more personal Edmund, which was the family's name for the King's father, but still.
Perhaps these names will show up in the next generation.:rolleyes:

On the other hand, Sibyllas names was "Sibylla Calma Alice Wettin" and Victoria is named "Victoria Ingrid Alice Desirée" - so as you can see, they have "Alice" in common :smile: And Queen Silvias mother was called Alice... so I think its a v nice thing to give "Alice" to their first daughter :wub:

Fredrika-rouva 08-10-2013 04:39 AM

Did Sibylla and Gustav Adolf speak German or English together? According to Wikipedia, Sibylla had difficulties in learning Swedish. The following quote suggests that she wasn’t eager to discuss in English, either. But after all, her father was a British prince by birth.

In the book “Avoid boring people: Lessons from a Life in Science” Nobel Prize Winner James Watson tells about a dinner related to Nobel festivities in 1962: ”This time I was between the wife of the Swedish prime minister and Sibylla, the wife of the Crown Prince Gustav Adolf, who had died in a 1947 airplane crash when his daughters, the princesses, were still young girls. I found it easier to converse with the prime minister's wife than with Sibylla, whose native language was German. Sibylla ate practically nothing, perhaps imagining her still comely figure metamorphosing into the stereotypical one for royal consorts of the past century.”

An Ard Ri 08-10-2013 05:29 AM

Its such a pity that Sibylla did not live long enough to see her son become King.

Furienna 08-10-2013 05:35 AM

As I've understood it, Sibylla wasn't that popular. Germans were considered suspicious after WWII, and Sibylla also was considered very aloof, probably because she didn't speak Swedish that well. It was only after Queen Louise passed away in 1965, that she had a few years of a somewhat increased popularity. But she didn't live to see her son become king.

An Ard Ri 08-10-2013 05:38 AM

I wonder if we'll ever see a future Princess Sibylla in the future,or maybe the name will not be used again.

Furienna 08-10-2013 05:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by An Ard Ri (Post 1587239)
Its such a pity that Sibylla did not live long enough to see her son become King.

Indeed, but it would also have been funny to have a mother of a monarch, who "only" was a princess (and yeah, duchess of Västerbotten). But then again, Netherlands now has gotten their third ex-queen being styled princess.

Quote:

Originally Posted by An Ard Ri (Post 1587242)
I wonder if we'll ever see a future Princess Sibylla in the future,or maybe the name will not be used again.

I guess we'll have to wait and see.

An Ard Ri 08-10-2013 05:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Furienna (Post 1587243)
Indeed, but it would also have been funny to have a mother of a monarch, who "only" was a princess (and yeah, duchess of Västerbotten). But then again, Netherlands now has gotten their third ex-queen being styled princess.

The mother of King Juan Carlos of Spain was also only a Princess/Countess,so Sibylla if she had lived longer,wouldn't be alone :flowers:

LadyFinn 11-14-2013 02:05 PM

Two beautiful photos of princess Sibylla
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A lovely photo of princess Sibylla, signed by her mourning son.
https://www.autographs.se/mod%20eur/cxvig.jpg

Great photos of princess Sibylla in a scout uniform.
Lindebilder, Bilder över Lindesberg
https://www.lindebilder.se/details.p...ga8rgffskjici6

Princess Sibylla on magazine covers
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An Ard Ri 04-24-2014 02:50 PM

Christening of Princess Désirée in 1938

Royal Christening (1938) - YouTube

An Ard Ri 04-24-2014 02:56 PM

TRH Prince Prince Gustaf Adolf , Duke of Västerbotten & Princess Sibylla, Duchess of Västerbotten return home from honeymoon in 1932.



Home From The Honeymoon (1932) - YouTube

Meraude 05-11-2014 06:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by An Ard Ri (Post 1587242)
I wonder if we'll ever see a future Princess Sibylla in the future,or maybe the name will not be used again.

I doubt that a princess will be named Sibylla, at least not as a first name, because what most people in Sweden would associate the name Sibylla to will be fast food: Sibylla (fast food) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia The chain was named after princess Sibylla in the 1930:ies.

Furienna 05-11-2014 07:44 PM

Ah! It does make sense that the fast food chain was named after the princess. I just never knew that it was the case, even though I kind of suspected it. But I doubt that this association is enough to keep royals from giving their daughter that name.

Meraude 06-03-2014 02:42 PM

A biography about princess Sibylla was published in 2007, it was written by Roger Lundgren: Sibylla : en biografi - Roger Lundgren - bok(9789100111120) - fraktfritt | Adlibris Bokhandel

LadyFinn 01-09-2015 12:39 PM

Princess Sibylla on magazine covers
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Beautiful photo of princess Sibylla in 1957
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Princess Sibylla, as a model for a sculpture of Späth Begás.
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Furienna 01-09-2015 12:43 PM

I remember an article in some magazine, that described how Princess Madeleine was so much alike her grandmother Sibylla. And yeah, I think I can see a resemblance.

JR76 07-28-2015 05:36 AM


I've known for a long time that Sibylla had a much more up-to-date outlook on the monarchy than her father-in-law the King but I'm actually quite pleased that she, as I discovered a few weeks ago, supported equal rights of succession for men and women and also as seen in the headline of the last magazine would prefer her son to marry a Swede (which basically means a commoner)


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vkrish 07-28-2015 03:29 PM

given how misogynistic the king is, i dont think his mother had much influence on him...
and as for marrying a commoner, he hardly had a choice. Only option was anne, and people were wise enough not to push it, as it would be a marriage in hell, a 1000 times worse than c&d..

JR76 07-28-2015 08:12 PM

Princess Sibylla (1908-1972) - King Carl XVI Gustaf's Mother
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by vkrish (Post 1805379)
given how misogynistic the king is, i dont think his mother had much influence on him...
and as for marrying a commoner, he hardly had a choice. Only option was anne, and people were wise enough not to push it, as it would be a marriage in hell, a 1000 times worse than c&d..


Had he chosen to stick to the old rules concerning marriage there was countless ladies with the right descent to choose from at the time. Besides Anne there was princesses in Belgium, Luxembourg, Monaco and not to speak of many from the deposed or mediatised families (or as I saw them called somewhere "the breeding farms of Germany"). Had CXVIG wanted to there would've been many families to choose from.


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Mbruno 07-28-2015 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR76 (Post 1805246)
I've known for a long time that Sibylla had a much more up-to-date outlook on the monarchy than her father-in-law the King but I'm actually quite pleased that she, as I discovered a few weeks ago, supported equal rights of succession for men and women and also as seen in the headline of the last magazine would prefer her son to marry a Swede (which basically means a commoner)


Sent from my iPhone using The Royals Community mobile app

I can't help imagining how different the Swedish Royal Family would look like total if Princess Anne had married King Carl XVI Gustaf as Lord Mountbatten wanted.

Similarly, I also can't help thinking how a marriage between Princess Madeleine and Prince William would have looked like.

Mbruno 07-28-2015 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR76 (Post 1805446)
Had he chosen to stick to the old rules concerning marriage there was countless ladies with the right descent to choose from at the time. Besides Anne there was princesses in Belgium, Luxembourg, Monaco and not to speak of many from the deposed or mediatised families (or as I saw them called somewhere "the breeding farms of Germany"). Had CXVIG wanted to there would've been many families to choose from.
Sent from my iPhone using The Royals Community mobile app

Princesses in Belgium, Luxembourg and Monaco would be of course Catholic and, hence, not a good match for a Protestant king at a time when the Church of Sweden was still an established religion. Of course, there would be always the "breeding farms of Germany" to choose from, but the rumor was that both the British and Swedish royal courts were very much interested in matching the King with Princess Anne.

JR76 07-28-2015 10:00 PM

Princess Sibylla (1908-1972) - King Carl XVI Gustaf's Mother
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mbruno (Post 1805456)
Princesses in Belgium, Luxembourg and Monaco would be of course Catholic and, hence, not a good match for a Protestant king at a time when the Church of Sweden was still an established religion. Of course, there would be always the "breeding farms of Germany" to choose from, but the rumor was that both the British and Swedish royal courts were very much interested in matching the King with Princess Anne.


Well if Sweden managed to have to catholic queens in the 19th century I'm sure it wouldn't have been a problem in the 20th-21th especially since a ban on a marriage between CG and a foreign lady just because of her religion would have no support at all by a very secular population.

Had no idea (but not surprised) that Lord Mountbatten tried to get Anne and CG together. Of the monarchs of her generation I've always imagined Harald of Norway would've suited Anne best. I did read somewhere that Astrid of Belgium was seen as a suitable match by the two families but that both A and CG would have nothing of it.


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vkrish 07-29-2015 07:35 PM

there is no way anne could have lived that life.. Enduring a drunk philandering partying chauvunist husband courting every sort of shady persons..and still pasting a grin from ear to ear and giving a perfect picture in the name of duty..no thanks.. It may be worth a shot for a noble/lesser royal but not for an equally headstrong olympian daughter of the british monarch. I am so glad she didnt get stuck in this. Lucky for sweden and its monarchy, they found a much better person for that job

Mbruno 07-29-2015 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vkrish (Post 1805666)
there is no way anne could have lived that life.. Enduring a drunk philandering partying chauvunist husband courting every sort of shady persons..and still pasting a grin from ear to ear and giving a perfect picture in the name of duty..no thanks.. It may be worth a shot for a noble/lesser royal but not for an equally headstrong olympian daughter of the british monarch. I am so glad she didnt get stuck in this. Lucky for sweden and its monarchy, they found a much better person for that job

If the gossip is true, it was Carl Gustaf who turned Anne down, and not the other way around.

JR76 07-29-2015 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mbruno (Post 1805682)
If the gossip is true, it was Carl Gustaf who turned Anne down, and not the other way around.


Anne would've been a handful to much for CG...


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vkrish 07-30-2015 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mbruno (Post 1805682)
If the gossip is true, it was Carl Gustaf who turned Anne down, and not the other way around.

that is just an assumption. Anyway hen he was way smart enuf to choose the right woman. Pity charles didnt learn much from him..

Marengo 07-30-2015 12:41 PM

Let's move on. No need to insult the king of Sweden or to rehash old tabloid phantasies about the Princess Royal and the King in a thread that is dedicated to Princess Sibylla of Sweden. Further replies to these topics will be deleted.

Meraude 07-30-2015 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR76 (Post 1805246)
also as seen in the headline of the last magazine would prefer her son to marry a Swede (which basically means a commoner)

Princess Sibylla didn't have anything against a commoner daugher-in-law, but if my memory isn't wrong, the reason why she hoped for a Swedish DIL was that she wouldn't want her son to marry a German, as she feared a German woman/princess would be as badly received in Sweden as she had been during her years here.

Interestingly enough, if the Wikipedia article about her late husband is true, the couple spoke English and not German when together, as Sibylla's Swedish wasn't very good. It makes sense that English was their common language as both were grandchildren of queen Victoria, as well as English was the daily language of queen Louise and king Gustaf VI Adolf. Sibylla and Lilian Craig also had English as a common language, I remember having read somewhere (possibly in Lilian's autobiography) that Sibylla and Lilian became friends, and Lilian was the godmother of Hélène Silfverschöld.

Furienna 07-31-2015 02:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meraude (Post 1805845)
Princess Sibylla didn't have anything against a commoner daugher-in-law, but if my memory isn't wrong, the reason why she hoped for a Swedish DIL was that she wouldn't want her son to marry a German, as she feared a German woman/princess would be as badly received in Sweden as she had been during her years here.

That might be true, but I wonder if Sibylla hadn't also understood that it was time for the royals to start marrying outside their own circle. Five princes had been thrown out of the succession because of their marriages, and it was starting to look silly to expect every prince to only marry a princess. And we also know now that out of Sibylla's five own children, only Birgitta made an equal match.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Meraude
Interestingly enough, if the Wikipedia article about her late husband is true, the couple spoke English and not German when together, as Sibylla's Swedish wasn't very good. It makes sense that English was their common language as both were grandchildren of queen Victoria, as well as English was the daily language of queen Louise and king Gustaf VI Adolf. Sibylla and Lilian Craig also had English as a common language, I remember having read somewhere (possibly in Lilian's autobiography) that Sibylla and Lilian became friends, and Lilian was the godmother of Hélène Silfverschöld.

Correction: GA and Sibylla were both great grandchildren of Queen Victoria. But yes, we can sure assume that they had both had strong British influences during their childhoods. His mother and her father had both come from the UK, and I know that GA and his siblings also had British nannies when they were children.

An Ard Ri 07-31-2015 06:11 AM

Princess Sibylla's sister Caroline certainly led an interesting life that must have raised many a royal eyebrow!

JR76 07-31-2015 03:58 PM

I have no doubt that Sibyllas support for giving women succession rights was influenced both by the change of times and what must've been a horrendous amount of pressure on her and her husband to produce a male heir. It might be rumours but I've read that she cried of relief when she discovered shed finally given birth to a boy.


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vkrish 07-31-2015 04:59 PM

I wonder why the Swedes and Danes were so conservative while Dutch were very progressive for those times..with British in the centre.. Any social/political reasons?

LadyFinn 09-22-2015 07:14 AM

Christmas cards signed by princess Sibylla are at an auction at Bukowskis Market.
God jul…i september _ Bakom Kulisserna

An Ard Ri 09-22-2015 07:49 AM

I wonder which of her grandchildren are in this photo from 1967 which is my favourite.

https://bakomkulisserna.svenskdam.se/...9/julkort2.jpg

Tilia C. 09-22-2015 08:22 AM

Yes, that's a lovely picture of a very happy granny! If that pic was taken in summer 1967, then Charles Edward Ambler, born 14.07.1966, and Kristina-Louisa, baroness Silfverschiold, born 29.09.1966, would fit in age. The baby in blue seems the larger of the two, which would fit as Charles is a bit older than Kristina.

Thomasine 11-02-2015 04:54 PM

I have not seen this thread before or I would have contributed before.


I have actually met Princess Sibylla the year before she passed away. You could clearly see that she was unwell but at the time there had been no official announcement that she was ill. She was a very nice lady, polite and friendly but she gave the impression of suffering from shyness and I don't blame her with the reception she had received when arriving in Sweden.


I was a young and fairly new airline stewardess when assigned task of taking special care of the Princess.


My mother met her shortly after her arrival in Sweden in the 30s. My mother was a student at Marthaskolan, an exclusive and well known fashion and sewing academy in Stockholm and in her third year she was assigned to make a day dress for the Princess as a graduation task. Mum really liked her and always defended her when other people criticized her. Mum also made an evening gown for Crownprincess (later Queen) Louise, also a great lady.

Sarahbellar 11-02-2015 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomasine (Post 1835372)
I have not seen this thread before or I would have contributed before.


I have actually met Princess Sibylla the year before she passed away. You could clearly see that she was unwell but at the time there had been no official announcement that she was ill. She was a very nice lady, polite and friendly but she gave the impression of suffering from shyness and I don't blame her with the reception she had received when arriving in Sweden.


I was a young and fairly new airline stewardess when assigned task of taking special care of the Princess.


My mother met her shortly after her arrival in Sweden in the 30s. My mother was a student at Marthaskolan, an exclusive and well known fashion and sewing academy in Stockholm and in her third year she was assigned to make a day dress for the Princess as a graduation task. Mum really liked her and always defended her when other people criticized her. Mum also made an evening gown for Crownprincess (later Queen) Louise, also a great lady.

Fascinating! Thank you for sharing!

Thomasine 11-02-2015 05:18 PM

Thank you Sarahbellar!

Furienna 11-05-2015 03:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomasine (Post 1835372)
I have not seen this thread before or I would have contributed before.


I have actually met Princess Sibylla the year before she passed away. You could clearly see that she was unwell but at the time there had been no official announcement that she was ill. She was a very nice lady, polite and friendly but she gave the impression of suffering from shyness and I don't blame her with the reception she had received when arriving in Sweden.


I was a young and fairly new airline stewardess when assigned task of taking special care of the Princess.


My mother met her shortly after her arrival in Sweden in the 30s. My mother was a student at Marthaskolan, an exclusive and well known fashion and sewing academy in Stockholm and in her third year she was assigned to make a day dress for the Princess as a graduation task. Mum really liked her and always defended her when other people criticized her. Mum also made an evening gown for Crownprincess (later Queen) Louise, also a great lady.

Sibylla had the misfortune of being a German at a time, when it became a bad thing after the WWII. And I don't know how well-known it was in that her father became convicted of war crimes, but that sure can't have helped either. And yes, some people also felt that Sibylla was too aloof. So even though her children became the darlings of the people, Sibyllla had a hard time becoming well-liked. As I have understood it, it was only after Queen Louise had passed away, that Sibylla got another chance from the people.

eya 11-05-2015 03:35 AM

Thanks Thomasine for sharing your story.
I always wonder why people don't liked the Sibylla and thanks Furienna for this information.

LadyFinn 03-27-2016 01:49 AM

Some parts of Johan T Lindwall's article about princess Sibylla:
Sweden didn't receive their new princess with open arms. Germany's role in World War II brought hatred, and Sibylla with her German background was particularly vulnerable and beset because she didn't learn Swedish properly. Hatred was a while so strong that she received anonymous threatening letters.
- She was so young when she came here to a foreign country and she got stuck in a very intense family life. She gave birth incessantly, her deliveries were difficult and she felt bad for all pregnancies. She had the enormous pressure to herself at any cost give birth to an heir, a prince. And so it came only girls all the time!, Princess Christina told in an interview in Svenska Dagbladet.
Only when she gave birth to Carl Gustaf in 1946 the succession was secured and the little princesses could for a short time to enjoy the harmony with their baby brother at Haga Palace. Until that January day in 1947 when Prince Gustaf Adolf died. The plane crash turned the reality of the family upside down. The princess didn't talk with her children about that their father had died.
- She never told me that my father had died, and it took me five or six years to understand that I didn't have a father anymore. I feel no resentment or bitterness towards my mother, because I think I understand her. She was in despair herself and it was a terrible shock to her, Princess Christina told to Svenska Dagbladet.
- It was our mom's way of coping with the situation, be able to live her life. We wouldn't talk about the matter. So it was just like that. Of course it wasn't good for us children. It would have been much better to be able to talk about my father's death, Princess Birgitta said in an interview.
Sibylla spoke to journalist Margit Vinberg about longing for her husband: "When my husband died, I felt like the floor fell under my feet. Such a happiness in the accident that she isn't alone, she has her children, said the people around me when my husband died. Many said it also directly to me and of course it was meant as a kind of consolation. But I would have liked to shout out my loneliness."
For Haga princesses and Prince Carl Gustaf the distance to their mother was growing. They didn't even stay in the same apartment as Princess Sibylla. The rescue was nanny Ingrid "Nenne" Björnberg. At first she lived with the children in a special floor at Haga Palace. Sibylla isolated to the point that she only met her children once a day. At breakfast they got to go down to wish "good morning". In reality it was Nenne who took care of the siblings.
Princess Sibylla saw how the children came closer and closer to the nanny, and it bothered her:
"Our mother was sometimes terribly jealous of her, for it was to Nenne we went with our small and major concerns. This, however, had a perfectly natural explanation. Our mother was forced to spend much time on the court duties and was often away from home on different missions, princess Birgitta wrote in her memoirs.
- She was probably not so great just as a mother, Princess Birgitta told in an interview in Expressen in 1997 with Jonas Sima.
Her grandchildren didn't bring some tenderness to Sibylla. When Birgitta had children and visited the palace they were refused at first to sit at the dinner table.
- In this case, I take the kids with me and go home, I replied. Then mom gave in a little, Birgitta told.
The family left Haga Palace in 1950 and moved into the Royal Palace. There, the nightmare continued with Sibylla who came to feel more and more misunderstood in Sweden. She was mocked for her family ties with Nazi Germany and was at odds with the Swedish people. In her last interview before she passed away in 1972 in intestinal cancer, princess Sibylla said that she was not worried about the "death" but "how the Swedes would remember her."
Kungen övergavs av sin mamma prinsessan Sibylla _ Nyheter _ Expressen
Translation

Furienna 04-06-2016 06:40 PM

The more I learn about Princess Sibylla, the more I feel sorry for her. True, she might have come across as cold and aloof. But unless I am much mistaken, I believe that many princesses back then were raised to not show too many emotions. Neither would a princess have been expected to take care of her children. And when you think about what Sibylla had gone through, you can't really blame her for becoming depressed as the years went by. She had to go through five hard childbirths to give Sweden an heir to the throne. And she hardly had managed to do that before her husband died and her father was convicted of war crimes. Life was never too easy for Sibylla. It is telling though that Princess Madeleine, who has often been described as a copy of her paternal grandmother, also happens to be less popular and considered more haughty than Crown Princess Victoria and Prince Carl Philip.

CyrilVladisla 04-06-2016 10:09 PM

Princess Sibylla with the poet Giorgos Seferis

LadyFinn 06-04-2016 02:51 AM

Princess Sibylla in 1937
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And in 1963
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maria-olivia 06-04-2016 12:35 PM

Was her wedding a love wedding or an arranged one ?

There is a film of their wedding day and we can see and the end of the wedding how Ducky (Hesse/Romanov) passed before the Tsar of Bulgaria..

Furienna 06-11-2016 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by maria-olivia (Post 1895512)
Was her wedding a love wedding or an arranged one ?

As far as I can tell, they had chosen each other by themselves. But when you consider that royals were only allowed to consider another royal back then, it could at least partly still have been a marriage of convenience.

WreathOfLaurels 07-17-2016 02:10 AM

Sibella's sister Caroline Matilda accused their father Carl Edouard of sexually abusing her as a child and young woman, and i don't see any reason to doubt the allegations as one of CM and sibella's brothers has backed up the accusations. Since abuse does not occur in isolation it's possible that sibella was abused as a girl and young woman as well.

I found this in Karina Urbach Go Betweens for Hitler OUP 2015 (p178) which has a lot of info on Sibella's father (CGs grandfather)

Lee-Z 07-17-2016 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WreathOfLaurels (Post 1909900)
Sibella's sister Caroline Matilda accused their father Carl Edouard of sexually abusing her as a child and young woman, and i don't see any reason to doubt the allegations as one of CM and sibella's brothers has backed up the accusations. Since abuse does not occur in isolation it's possible that sibella was abused as a girl and young woman as well.

I found this in Karina Urbach Go Betweens for Hitler OUP 2015 (p178) which has a lot of info on Sibella's father (CGs grandfather)

imo that is a olympic-size-leap into speculation-land:
If Calma accused her father of sexual abuse as a child, you shouldn't just feel the liberty to assume that her fathere abused his other children as well, especially as they never openly mentioned it themselves
Königlicher Beobachter: Rezension: Hitlers Herzog: Carl Eduard von Sachsen-Coburg und Gotha - Die Biographie von Harald Sandner
This article mentions the allegations, but not if it was actually proven...and certainly not any other allegations concerning this crime

Colorful life bot father Carl-Edouard and daughter Calma had, by the way, but i assume there are seperate threads about them ;)

WreathOfLaurels 07-17-2016 04:00 PM

No it isn't. One of Sibella's brothers was convicted of incest later on and my comment about abuse in families is based on the fact that this is what most research into the topic shows - that it is rare for one child to be abused alone, that it runs in families, and that false accusations are very rare.

You mention Calma's failed marriages as evidence against her, I'd see that as evidence for. The review you posted mentions that Calma tried to "sue and blackmail" her father Over this (I'm running the article through google translate) so it sounds like some kind of investigation was launched. Ditto for Sibella's inability to relate to her children, not a main factor but certainly a possibility that has been overlooked.

Incest and sexual abuse were highly taboo topics for men and women of Sibella's generation which explains why nobody said anything until the 1980s and Sibella was long dead by this point. There's no way of proving anything now unless new evidence comes to light, but the possibility can't be excluded, and if it did turn out to be true than it would explain a great deal about this unhappy misunderstood princess.

Furienna 08-02-2016 04:08 PM

Well, it seems like there still is no evidence that Sibylla was sexually abused. So I don't how much can be said about this matter.

WreathOfLaurels 08-05-2016 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Furienna (Post 1913528)
Well, it seems like there still is no evidence that Sibylla was sexually abused. So I don't how much can be said about this matter.

Given the nature of these things and the fact all involved are dead or not saying much, we probably won't ever have any hard and fast proof, but I was raising the possibility based on the general pattern of how sexual abuse in families more often than not occurs, and the fact that sibella's family does fit in with this patten in a number of ways.

Denville 08-05-2016 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WreathOfLaurels (Post 1910020)
No it isn't. One of Sibella's brothers was convicted of incest later on unhappy misunderstood princess.

I have never heard of this. Can you provide something about it?

WreathOfLaurels 08-05-2016 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denville (Post 1914061)
I have never heard of this. Can you provide something about it?

Königlicher Beobachter: Rezension: Hitlers Herzog: Carl Eduard von Sachsen-Coburg und Gotha - Die Biographie von Harald Sandner

This link is to a review of a bio of CE in German and mentions the fact his son johann leopold was convicted (?) of incest with one of his daughters. Likewise Karina Urbach in the book gobetweens for hitler also talks about the allegations against CE by his daughter Calma.

As I said before we will probably never know for certain but given family history and the fact that a lot of it fits the pattern of abuse within families the possibility must be taken seriously - all of the factors I mentioned in previous posts are more than just coincidence

Denville 08-17-2016 10:46 AM

I can't read German, Where was he "convicted of Incest?" was he in prison for it?

Lee-Z 08-17-2016 11:13 AM

The article says he (Johann Leopold) was convicted (verurteilt) but doesn't specify the sentence..
In the case against Carl Eduard it says that his daughter Calma had accused and blackmailed her father and threatened to go public with his allegedly abusing her as a child (in german: Sie verklagt und erpresst ihren Vater Carl Eduard und droht damit öffentlich auszupacken, weil der sie angeblich als Kind missbraucht hat.)
The article does not state dat CE was convicted, and since it does mention JL's conviction i assume that had there been a conviction of CE it would have been mentioned...

by the way: Calma herself was accused, convicted and sentenced to 6 months in jail in 1956 on a different matter
https://www.dorsten-transparent.de/20...chtsgefangnis/
google translated

My opinion is still as it was on the previous page, that because JL was convicted doesn't prove his father CE was also guilty of incest, and i hope we still go by the statement "innocent until proven guilty"

Edited: on german wiki it says that JL was convicted to two years jail or workhouse (Zuchthaus) and his connections with his siblings were ended after the conviction, he didn't attend his father CE's funeral
https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joha...burg_und_Gotha
google translated

Furienna 08-17-2016 03:07 PM

But it sounds like Sibylla came from a dysfunctional family.

Lee-Z 08-18-2016 12:12 PM

Oh yes, very tumultuous and scandal-prone that family... probably not easy for P.Sibylla to have to deal with all that and then her husband dying so young and leaving her a widow with 5 kids...Not the fairytale princess life that we sometime think royals have..

LadyFinn 08-28-2016 11:43 PM

Princess Sibylla in 1932
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Princess Sibylla with her committee of Hagafesten in 1936. Photo from the photo archive of the City of Solna.
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Princess Sibylla at her summer house Hagaberg in Öland (close to Solliden), July 1967.
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Article about princess Sibylla at the newest issue of Kungliga Magasinet, written by editor-in-chief Roger Lundgren.
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